Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402340#Comment_118402340

Unless they are in a round of heineken zero!

dubrov

I think ultimately it comes down to whether people believe the government should aim to reduce alcohol consumption.

Less consumption will lead to less alcohol-related issues.

However, many things in life have downsides and people should be free to make that call.

If you made a can of beer €20 tomorrow, I would obviously drink less which may be good for my health but takes away my free choice.

You would be sure kids would find cheaper alternatives to get their kicks. Any that did drink would definitely not develop a healthy relationship with alcohol

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402539#Comment_118402539

If you made a can of beer €20 tomorrow, I would obviously drink less which may be good for my health but takes away my free choice.

But it doesn't take away your free choice.

You are still free to decide if you want to spend that money on alcohol.

Just as you are free to decide if you want to spend money on a TV, a holiday, chocolate, garden furniture etc.

If there was a prohibition on the purchase of alcohol, that would take away your free choice, but there isn't and it doesn't.

dubrov

It is a step on the road to prohibition and does restrict choice by artificially inflating prices.

I'll probably end up drinking slightly less which would be beneficial to my health but I'm a big boy and know the risks already.

If petrol prices were doubled, I'd probably drive less and be at less risk of an accident but doesn't mean it is beneficial to me.

MUP makes no sense when there is already a mountain of evidence that removing sponsorship/advertising is a much more effective way of reducing demand. Price increases did nothing to reduce demand for smoking.

lalababa

From the website...Cheapest ipa in lidl has gone up 20c. Bustards...was 1.79 now 1.99.

Used to get the cream can of wiessbeir for 95 c then it went up to like 1.27. Wonder what it ill be now ..was 5% aswell I think.

They have 3 cheap larger/blondes aswell all around the euro that weren't offensive.

MakersMark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118401950#Comment_118401950

Unlike you, I don't live off 50c cans of high alcohol wife beater lager.

Quality drinks won't be affected by this anti-degenerate pricing policy.

Try buying Quality for once my friend and open your eyes.

Kermit.de.frog

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

I'm broadly supportive of the price hikes and hopefully it will have some positive results.

There is a lot of denial in Ireland about this country's chronic relationship with alcohol and it's in everyone's interests that anything be done that can help band aid it within the bounds of reasonable which is what this is.

The main thing is it has a positive impact but it will be some time before evidence shows or not.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402579#Comment_118402579

In fairness TVs, holidays, chocolate and garden furniture are delivered to us by the market, taxes paid and all upfront.

The problem with MUP is that it introduces a false floor to the market for drinks which means we pay more than the market rate.

This leads to a normal couple drinking 6 cans of beer and a bottle of wine per week between them paying an extra €364 per annum.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402717#Comment_118402717

Wife beater? Anti degenerate? You are unable to defend your nonsense so have to resort to pathetic insults.

You dont have a clue if you think only 50c cans are affected.

You dont have a clue about what is quality and what is muck if your only indicator is price. You are a sucker.

You know nothing about drinks and value and quality.

Obviously you enjoy being ripped off and dont even the cop on to realise when you are being ripped off! Ignorance is bliss they say and some fools are happy in a state of pig ignorance.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402643#Comment_118402643

How can it be a step on the road to prohibition when it's supposed to be a FG sop to the publicans ?

And I don't believe you can say with any authority that price increases did nothing to reduce demand for smoking.

If you can prove otherwise please do so.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402717#Comment_118402717

Errr this is certainly a take...."anti degenerate"....christ....

The issue at least for me....is that prices will go up pretty much across the board...do you not see that?

The more premium stuff will not be priced at the same level.

I drink maybe once a week, maybe a decent whiskey or a nice craft beer, but they will likely all cost more.

Newry will do very well out of it for the next while!

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402579#Comment_118402579

But it doesn't take away your free choice.

You are still free to decide if you want to spend that money on alcohol.

What is the point of MUP then? If it isn't a beginning of removing peoples choice to drink, then what is it?

The whole point of MUP is to price the less wealthy out of them being able to buy alcohol on a whim. If they have a shopping list of items, they won't be able or will less likely be able to add a drink to sit and relax with at the end of the week, without it impacting their savings or shopping list. I would imagine their list would be already budget items.

The alcoholics that are homeless or struggling, will still find alcohol to drink, only now they might not be able to eat.

HBC08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118401757#Comment_118401757

Ah look,there's a lot of issues there and MUP is the answer to none of them.

HBC08

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118401862#Comment_118401862

It often happens that an 8-9 euro wine is reduced by a supermarket in a special offer, for a few days, to 6 euro, and many responsible people buy at the 6 euro offer price.

That will be impossible under MUP.

I don't agree with you "cheap muck" comment.

Weissbier at 1.49 in ALDI or Lidl are perfectly drinkable.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402340#Comment_118402340

It's not a victim complex, it's an observation about how assumptions are made about non drinkers, and your replies only confirm that people make such assumptions.

It's time to stop making assumptions about non drinkers and treating them differently.

Now a days non alcoholic drinks are more than soft drinks, the big brand have non alcoholic options and many are a expensive as the original, so the non drinker is will cost the round buyer just as much and should be expected to buy their share also.

Dub.

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Talked about this with my SF voting dad earlier. He wants to know why his solitary weekend bottle of Tesco vodka is being increased by 10 euro when his pension only went up by a fiver. He thinks this is an attack on the poor and was shocked when i said SF supported it.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118403902#Comment_118403902

It absolutely is an attack on the poor, im honestly baffled at SFs vocal support for it considering it will negatively affect their voter base far more than FGs or FFs, they easily could have just voted for it and kept quiet but they like everyone else in the dail actively supported it.

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118402579#Comment_118402579

For the Nth time doesn't affect the price of major brand names. It's only people who can't afford brand names that will be affected.

And it's not a free choice. For people on the bread line they may have to forgo other 'luxuries' like fresh food or getting new clothes as frequently, trips to the pub etc.

It's like saying that for rich people who aren't employees that obeying laws where a custodial sentence is unlikely is a free choice because they can simply pay the fine if they ignore those laws. Obeying the laws isn't a free choice for those of us who would find employment opportunities affected by a criminal record or can't afford the fines because it has immediate and lasting consequences.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405393#Comment_118405393

And it's not a free choice. For people on the bread line they may have to forgo other 'luxuries' like fresh food or getting new clothes as frequently, trips to the pub etc.

If people on the bread line forgo food or clothes in favour of booze then they have a problem and need help.

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405429#Comment_118405429

If people on the bread line forgo food or clothes in favour of booze then they have a problem and need help.

You do realise you have just gone full circle with that statement?

That is agreeing that MUP likely won't work. You also seem to neglect what was pointed out, that is a choice forced upon them. If less wealthy family have alcoholic parents, I don't think it's the alcohol that will be suffering.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405137#Comment_118405137

It appears that SF along with the rest of the parties bought the health line without thinking about people like Dubs dad who will end up paying an extra €520 per annum for his weekly purchase.

That's two weeks pension he will be paying, supposedly to help other people overcome their drink problem.

Meanwhile those who drink in the Dail bar write him off as collateral damage.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405429#Comment_118405429

So you admit you have no comprehension of alcoholism or how addiction in general works? The families of alcoholics who are already in incredibly vulnerable situations are going to be impacted even more so by this and your solution is well alcoholics should get help?

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405479#Comment_118405479

Of course there are situations where MUP will not work, where people will continue to favour alcohol, but the majority won't.

Increasing price will for the most part reduce consumption, and reduced alcohol consumption is good.

Plus a higher price floor will make consumption less viable for young people, thus in the long term uses will decline.

If you are not willing to accept any of those basic economic ideas then there is no use talking to you.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405539#Comment_118405539

But the majority of poor families are not alcoholics and will reduce consumption with MUP.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405429#Comment_118405429

People like those in the example I quoted yesterday or Dub's dad will be paying hundreds of euro extra each year for enjoying a modest few drinks at home in their own houses.

None of that money will be directed to help problem drinkers.

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405599#Comment_118405599

It's not targeting those people!

I'm not sure how you're not seeing this. It is targeting the poor/less wealthy.

In your own words, the people who are going to be affected most, are the people who don't have a problem, and now find themselve unable to have a bottle of wine or whatever their choice is, at the end of the week.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405622#Comment_118405622

Dubs dad has a choice to make.

He can either pay the extra and forgo something else or cut down on his consumption.

I have a similar choice to make after the 4th.

I can either find the money to pay e40 for that slab of Bud I enjoyed over Christmas that only cost me e15 at the time, or I can buy less or not buy any Bud at all.

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405591#Comment_118405591

I believe it is yourself that has difficulty grasping anything.

As has been pointed out many times before, the middle class teenagers are unlikely to be affected. Those with less money will likely turn to a cheaper high.

Increasing price will for the most part reduce consumption, and reduced alcohol consumption is good.

You seem to be talking in general, which is nonsense and doesn't actually help anyone. But which also exasperates the nanny state argument by pointing out increasing the price of anything will mean less of it is purchased.

Again, the teenagers are not really the target here. They will learn to live with the prices and adapt or leave as they get older and find living here to expensive in general with no outlet for stress or whatever reason.

Suckit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118405681#Comment_118405681

I have a similar choice to make after the 4th.

You again are not comparing like for like, and to use your own words, if you are not able to grasp the basics, then there is no point in talking to you about it.