Carmakers plan European EV fast-charging network

Conba

"A consortium of major carmakers is planning a high-powered fast-charging network for electric vehicles in Europe. BMW Group, Daimler AG, Ford Motor Company, Volkswagen Group, Audi and Porsche are targeting an initial 400 sites with chargers of up to 350 kW.

The 350-kW chargers rolled out will be based on the Combined Charging System quick charging standard that can be used by any car brand."

http://newatlas.com/high-powered-fast-charging-ev-network-europe/46672/

I could see it working here if it meant the ESB were in control of the chargers, otherwise I can hear them say, "sorry no power available on site" .

350 Kw, at least some forward thinking. 45 Kw chargers won't be good enough for 60 Kwh+ batteries. Then again I suppose you'd be better off getting the charge you need and moving on, 60 Kwh will give a lot of range to start out with in the first place.

n97 mini

And all those "free" 3.3kw home charge points will be a lot less effective when 60kw batteries are commonplace. If only they were 6.6kw, an overnight charge would brim it, allowing ventures into places barren of public CPs.

n97 mini

n97 mini wrote: »

And all those "free" 3.3kw home charge points will be a lot less effective when 60kw batteries are commonplace. If only they were 6.6kw, an overnight charge would brim it, allowing ventures into places barren of public CPs.

3.3 Kw will do the job if you need it, very few people will drive 350 kms in a day so most likely have 250 kms and more range in the car daily so getting the full 60 Kwh will not be a huge issue at all.

I will use 24-28 Kwh for a 135 kms commute, 28 Kwh would be driving quiet hard, so If I plug in at night I will need 28 Kwh to get me to 60 Kwh taking 8.5 hrs at 3.5 Kw. So it's more than do-a-ble.

Chances are the new Leaf will be more efficient needing less energy to travel the same distance.

Even if you have to use some Kwh on peak rate for the odd time it's not going to be a big issue.

Having a 32 amp charge point would be useful though. The one in the pic below is the one I have and it is capable of 32 amps with a software mod and when I move house soon I will be upgrading it.

If this is the one you have then there is a chance it will be switchable to 32 amps, but the cable and RCBO will also need to be upgraded.

n97 mini

Our driving habits (and opinions!) on this are quite different. Factoring in a return trip means you can only get to a destination that's half your range if you don't have charging at the destination. One of my wife's family members lives slightly off the beaten track, with no charge points at the destination. With a 60kw car, if brimmed, we could make it there and back on one charge. Being able to brim it overnight would make that possible 100% of the time. P1ssing around with trickle charging it to brim it would be too inconvenient. Just take the ICE instead.

Anyway what works for you may not work for others, but my point still stands: lack of future proofing. In 3-4-5 years I expect a lot of 3.3kw CPs will end up in recycle centres as they'll be heading for worthless. It's just a pity that right now 6.6kw home charging is here, costs very little extra but is much more future proof, yet ESB are still installing 2011-era 3.3kw CPs.

KCross

n97 mini wrote: »

It's just a pity that right now 6.6kw home charging is here, costs very little extra but is much more future proof, yet ESB are still installing 2011-era 3.3kw CPs.

They simply installed the 16A chargers because it can be done without having to look at all the other wiring in the house. They were providing/installing them for free so upgrading your distribution board to handle it wasnt an overhead they wanted to take on. Those 2000 free units are close to drying up anyway.

You can, without issue, install a 32A charger if you wish and ESB wont stop or object to you doing that but you have to manage that yourself and ensure that you dont blow fuses or burn the house down when the 9kW electric shower and 7kW car charger come on together!

I dont blame ESB for that. It made sense for something they were providing for free.

Actually no, the real reason is that the ESB do not want too many people plugging in at 6-7 Kw blowing the local substation, any competent electrician can easily determine whether 6.6 or 3.3 Kw load is going to be any issue and you can always upgrade your single phase supply.

People don't seem to remember the time the ESB were pleading with people not to install so many Christmas lights in the good O'l days of incandescent bulbs which were causing blackouts !!!

And I can tell that things have not changed all that much except that our consumption may have considerably rocketed but , in work , part of our production has to be taken off grid at certain peak times and they forced to fire up diesel generators.

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

Actually no, the real reason is that the ESB do not want too many people plugging in at 6-7 Kw blowing the local substation, any competent electrician can easily determine whether 6.6 or 3.3 Kw load is going to be any issue and you can always upgrade your single phase supply.

People don't seem to remember the time the ESB were pleading with people not to install so many Christmas lights in the good O'l days of incandescent bulbs which were causing blackouts !!!

And I can tell that things have not changed all that much except that our consumption may have considerably rocketed but , in work , part of our production has to be taken off grid at certain peak times and they forced to fire up diesel generators.

That doesn't make sense. Anyone can install and run a 9kW electric shower!!!! So what difference is a 7kW car to the substation.

You're reading into it too much. They were providing free chargers and they didn't want to be assessing 2000 houses and having to negotiate upgrades and priority switches etc.

And it's not necessarily easy to upgrade your supply. It can require running new cables from the meter to the distribution board.

BoatMad

KCross wrote: »

That doesn't make sense. Anyone can install and run a 9kW electric shower!!!! So what difference is a 7kW car to the substation.

You're reading into it too much. They were providing free chargers and they didn't want to be assessing 2000 houses and having to negotiate upgrades and priority switches etc.

And it's not necessarily easy to upgrade your supply. It can require running new cables from the meter to the distribution board.

Correct kcross, and nothing to do wth mad _lads " mad " idea , the esb approved installer opinion was exactly the same as yours. The esb did t want to deal with issues and costs around priority switching and or the standard of existing wiring

josip

They'll have to speed up their charging network roll out plans if other European cities follow suit for 2025.

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38170794

Perfect timing for us.
Our diesel will be 10 years old then and owe us nothing by which time EVs should have improved to the point whereby viable options for us are available.

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

They'll have to speed up their charging network roll out plans if other European cities follow suit for 2025.

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38170794

Perfect timing for us.
Our diesel will be 10 years old then and owe us nothing by which time EVs should have improved to the point whereby viable options for us are available.

other then of course the incase in diesel fuel as the Government changes both the fuel tax gap and modifies the motor Tax regime to punish diesels

Id say you'll be getting rid of it well before then

josip

BoatMad wrote: »

other then of course the incase in diesel fuel as the Government changes both the fuel tax gap and modifies the motor Tax regime to punish diesels

Id say you'll be getting rid of it well before then

I wouldn't mind changing before then if I could get an EV with Octavia boot space, for 120% of the Octavia price, with 60% of the Octavia range and the same performance (2.0 TDi).
I can't see that happening before 2021.

Water John

That's the type of push needed for environment. Many cities will join this.
Would anyone consider buying a new diesel in these cities after today even.
Its the diesel not the EV that will be subject to rapid fall in value.

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

I wouldn't mind changing before then if I could get an EV with Octavia boot space, for 120% of the Octavia price, with 60% of the Octavia range and the same performance (2.0 TDi).
I can't see that happening before 2021.

performance is easy, thats there today
we will see larger EVs , some soon
range is a very misleading arbiter, usually spoken by people that dont understand electric car usage and over complicate the issue

josip

BoatMad wrote: »

performance is easy, thats there today
we will see larger EVs , some soon
range is a very misleading arbiter, usually spoken by people that dont understand electric car usage and over complicate the issue

• Is the performance there today at that price point?
• We don't need anything bigger than mid size, just need a big boot.
• As regards range, we drive 50,000km per year. 10 of those days are 1000km+ days. Is that over complicating the issue?

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

• Is the performance there today at that price point?
• We don't need anything bigger than mid size, just need a big boot.
• As regards range, we drive 50,000km per year. 10 of those days are 1000km+ days. Is that over complicating the issue?

performance i3 , well its a good bit faster then the octavia in real life
boot space, Leaf is very good, Hyundai is good , no estate petrol

I am at 38,000 km after 9 months in the Leaf,

Id love to know where you do 1000km in one day in ireland, !! by greatest ever trip was 1200km towing a boat to Nice, and that was two days

josip

BoatMad wrote: »

performance i3 , well its a good bit faster then the octavia in real life
boot space, Leaf is very good, Hyundai is good , no estate petrol

I am at 38,000 km after 9 months in the Leaf,

Id love to know where you do 1000km in one day in ireland, !! by greatest ever trip was 1200km towing a boat to Nice, and that was two days

Maybe we could do a cut and shut between the i3 and the Leaf to get what we want
But the Leaf's 370l is a little shy of the Octavia's 570l.

Yes, we get off the island for the summer to do those kms.
Which is why we need plenty of boot space.
A different route every year, but we always end up in Greece.

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

Maybe we could do a cut and shut between the i3 and the Leaf to get what we want
But the Leaf's 370l is a little shy of the Octavia's 570l.

Yes, we get off the island for the summer to do those kms.
Which is why we need plenty of boot space.
A different route every year, but we always end up in Greece.

We invented the jet aircraft for that !!!!

josip

BoatMad wrote: »

We invented the jet aircraft for that !!!!

Taking the Gulfstream would be a very expensive way to travel around Europe for 2 months. I'd have to hire additional pilots for a start.

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

Taking the Gulfstream would be a very expensive way to travel around Europe for 2 months. I'd have to hire additional pilots for a start.

and thats why we invented O'Leary Air , :cool:

cros13

I do 50-60,000km a year in an i3.

My commute is 187km door to door to door.

I've also done a number of long trips in both the i3 and Leafs, including to Berlin (4000km round trip), Amsterdam and the UK.

I haven't had a problem.

Believe it or not, I'm not even one of the top two highest mileage i3 owners in Ireland. One is doing almost 80,000km/year.

Water John

EU looks like pursuing countries that have left VW and dieselgate off the hook.
This could be a slow burner, no pun intended.
Could have a major impact over time.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/dec/08/dieselgate-ec-legal-action-eu-uk-germany-spain-emissions