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Nightmare lodger stealing

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  • 09-12-2016 12:05am
    #1
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭


    Hello I need some help please.

    I'm renting a house where originally it was two friends, my girlfriend and myself. My two friends had to leave, one to find work the other to travel. The landlord said we could rent out the rooms, she doesn't live in Ireland but if anything goes wrong in the house we just email her and we fix/replace the item and send her the receipt and taking it off the rent. Works fine for all involved.(her idea)

    It's a four bed house with currently my girlfriend and I and three housemates. Two of them are perfect then there is the nightmare. They all signed licensee agreements, with rent collected monthly and one months notice for us to give or receive. It says no smoking in the house, pay bills within 7 days notice, guests over 2 nights a week and no noise after 11.

    Originally he was working and seemed nice, food started going missing and he denied it was him and blamed the newest guy who moved in. Then he started smoking in his room and soon started having loud arguments over the phone at midnight and more food started going missing.

    He no longer works, bills are a pain in the arse to get of him, he does pay rent on time though. We were going to have a group meeting but gave his notice that he's leaving on the 30th. Now his girlfriend is living there and there screaming at each other every night. My girlfriends medication has recently went missing, first one xanex, now a full blister (this is pretty dangerous in the wrong hands). The second time this was taking he was the only one in the house not that we thought it was the other two guys. I told him he has 48 hours to leave but he just started screaming and threatening to burn my car and house and said he won't leave until he wants.

    What next, he's a licensee not a tenant. He's on drugs, so is his girlfriend and the rest of us get woken by them going to the toilet every 20min at night (seriously it's not an exaggeration)


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    #2
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,360 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    kick them out onto Street.


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    #3
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    mickdw wrote: »
    kick them out onto Street.

    He won't go and how if I touch him he'll probably try sue my for assault.


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    #4
    CPTM
    Registered Users Posts: 1,321 ✭✭✭CPTM


    If he's on drugs could you call the gards and explain? Or maybe threaten him with the idea?


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    #5
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    CPTM wrote: »
    If he's on drugs could you call the gards and explain? Or maybe threaten him with the idea?

    Already told him he just left the house and came back at two in the morning. He definitely smokes weed but I don't know what else he does or doesn't do so will they even do anything.

    Also can he just be thrown out even though the licensee agreement says thirty days?


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    #6
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Get yourself a new lock for the door and someone in the house will have to stay there at all times to watch when they leave! dole day would be the best! then change the locks and throw their stuff out into the garden in black bags! Before this all happens drop into the local Garda station and let them know the situation and that he has no right to remain there once you have told him to leave as he is not a tenant and neither is his girlfriend, the Gardai might be helpful but may just tell you to call them if there is problem with them leaving.


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    #7
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Lodgerfromhell wrote: »
    Already told him he just left the house and came back at two in the morning. He definitely smokes weed but I don't know what else he does or doesn't do so will they even do anything.

    Also can he just be thrown out even though the licensee agreement says thirty days?

    He can be thrown out(not physically) at any time! he and his girlfriend are your guests, they are not tenants and have none of the rights of a tenancy!


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    #8
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    He can be thrown out(not physically) at any time! he and his girlfriend are your guests, they are not tenants and have none of the rights of a tenancy!

    Do I give him the remainder of this month's rent and his deposit? Can I actually touch his stuff? I'm going into the gardai tomorrow. Thanks


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    #9
    daRobot
    Registered Users Posts: 2,380 ✭✭✭daRobot


    Don't do any of the above. He has legal rights in the house.

    A hasty move here and you'll end up screwing yourself.


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    #10
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    daRobot wrote: »
    Don't do any of the above. He has legal rights in the house.

    A hasty move here and you'll end up screwing yourself.

    Going into my room and going through my stuff is creepy and then to actually steal. I have shared houses for 3 years and normally none of us lock doors.


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    #11
    screamer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,153 ✭✭✭screamer


    Have you contacted your landlady? I think you need to. Get her to increase his rent to an unaffordable amount and boot him out.
    BTW, you're very lucky you've never had to lock doors in rented accommodation.


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    #12
    RagsOBrien
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭RagsOBrien


    He has agreed to leave on the 30th. I think forcibly removing his stuff onto the street might be illegal or I don't think you would be within rights to do that as you don't own the property. I don't think the Gardai will evict him as it's a civil matter.

    Have you told the Landlord about this?

    I'd bide your time and start locking your room until he moves out. Not a great situation but be careful as well- obviously you don't want to get assaulted. If he threatens assault again, then report it.


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    #13
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    screamer wrote: »
    Have you contacted your landlady? I think you need to. Get her to increase his rent to an unaffordable amount and boot him out.
    BTW, you're very lucky you've never had to lock doors in rented accommodation.

    She's in the UK. She said we can let out the rooms and I'm responsible for the rent. She has nothing to do with the licensees.


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    #14
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    daRobot wrote: »
    Don't do any of the above. He has legal rights in the house.

    A hasty move here and you'll end up screwing yourself.
    He is NOT A TENANT, he has no real rights. If he wants a deposit returned he must go through the small claims court and has no recourse to the RTB
    Lodgerfromhell wrote: »
    She's in the UK. She said we can let out the rooms and I'm responsible for the rent. She has nothing to do with the licensees.
    Proving that they are not tenants and have no more rights than an invited guest!

    when they are both out of the house change the locks and pack their bags for them and under no circumstances allow them to re-enter the premises because it would be illegal to physically remove them.

    If you call the Gardai tell them that these people are not tenants but licensees who have been stealing and have been told to leave.

    Have you definitely told them to leave? because of their behaviour you are not required to give them notice beyond what is reasonable to give a guest who steals from you and takes drugs in your home!


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    #15
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    Told him twice he would be kicked out for smoking in his room and being loud at night but today I said you've to be gone by 6 on Saturday.

    He's gotten arrogant since his girlfriend arrived and when asked why his girlfriend is here since friday he says she'll be gone tomorrow that her house has plumbing problem. Thing is tomorrow never comes.


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    #16
    B.A._Baracus
    Registered Users Posts: 11,192 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    Sorry to hear the situation man.
    It's one of those awkward situations where you don't know what to do. You can't grab him and throw him out as you'll be done for assault (and probably bloody sued you know yourself) but at the same time you can't just bend over and take it.

    I'm in the process of trying to move in with my girlfriend in a house share too. Reading your problems just makes me doubt and rethink the whole share bit.


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    #17
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Lodgerfromhell wrote: »
    Told him twice he would be kicked out for smoking in his room and being loud at night but today I said you've to be gone by 6 on Saturday.

    He's gotten arrogant since his girlfriend arrived and when asked why his girlfriend is here since friday he says she'll be gone tomorrow that her house has plumbing problem. Thing is tomorrow never comes.

    Change the locks and lock them out tomorrow if you can as he may kick off on Saturday.

    Call the Gardai and tell them what is going on and tell them about the threats to burn your car and any other threats he made.


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    #18
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    Sorry to hear the situation man.
    It's one of those awkward situations where you don't know what to do. You can't grab him and throw him out as you'll be done for assault (and probably bloody sued you know yourself) but at the same time you can't just bend over and take it.

    I'm in the process of trying to move in with my girlfriend in a house share too. Reading your problems just makes me doubt and rethink the whole share bit.

    I don't think you should be put off, you only hear the horror stories. Met some great people over the last couple of years, most of us go out or get takeaways and watch movies play PlayStation etc. But every so often there's an absolute p***K to ruin it all


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    #19
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    Foggy_lad thanks for all your advice, I had thought he had limited rights but wasn't sure how fast I could get rid of him. Since it was on the lease to not smoke do I keep part of his deposit or just give it all back and hopefully never hear from him again


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    #20
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 29,492 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    get rid of these people straight away, tomorrow straight away! this will just keep escalating. some really good advice here already. best of luck


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    #21
    newacc2015
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭newacc2015


    daRobot wrote: »
    Don't do any of the above. He has legal rights in the house.

    A hasty move here and you'll end up screwing yourself.

    This is completely incorrect. He is not a tenant. He is a licensee and has zero rights under the law. The guy has no recourse for getting kicked unless OP doesnt give back his deposit and then he go to small claims court to get it back.

    OP I would go to a locksmith tomorrow and get a new set of locks. They are easy to change yourself. I would put all his stuff and leave it on the kerb. IMO I dont think you trust him to leave civilly on Saturday. I dont think it is a risk you can take

    FYI are you withholding 20% of your rent to give to Revenue as a withholding tax for your landlord being non-resident?


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    #22
    Lodgerfromhell
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Lodgerfromhell


    newacc2015 wrote: »

    FYI are you withholding 20% of your rent to give to Revenue as a withholding tax for your landlord being non-resident?

    No. She's Irish and it's lodged into her Irish aib account and the house was registered with ptrb. I thought everything was above board


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    #23
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Lodgerfromhell wrote: »
    No. She's Irish and it's lodged into her Irish aib account and the house was registered with ptrb. I thought everything was above board

    Not if she is abroad you are required to withold tax


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    #24
    Kristopherus
    Registered Users Posts: 11,907 ✭✭✭✭Kristopherus


    Stheno wrote: »
    Not if she is abroad you are required to withold tax

    So tenants are now expected to be tax-gatherers as well. Do you honestly believe that tenants such as the OP are willing to do that?


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    #25
    athtrasna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,420 ✭✭✭✭athtrasna


    Kristopherus wrote: »
    So tenants are now expected to be tax-gatherers as well. Do you honestly believe that tenants such as the OP are willing to do that?

    It is the law unless the landlord appoints an Irish based collection agent. The landlord is the one putting the responsibility on the tenant if they don't appoint an agent


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    #26
    jackofalltrades
    Registered Users Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭jackofalltrades


    So he's threatened to set fire to your car and the house you live in.
    Yeah I'd be getting this lad out of the house immediately don't wait till the deadline, which he has no intention of honouring anyway.


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    #27
    road_high
    Registered Users Posts: 19,414 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Second everyone's else's advice here to pack his stuff, kick him out and change the locks. The only reason these s***bags get away with this crap is because they are allowed to under the umbrella of so-called "rights" (that he doesn't have). You've been more than reasonable with this thug.


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    #28
    newacc2015
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭newacc2015


    Kristopherus wrote: »
    So tenants are now expected to be tax-gatherers as well. Do you honestly believe that tenants such as the OP are willing to do that?

    It is the law. It is not a case if OP is willing to do it, they have to it. It is not that difficult to do.

    If OP doesnt want to do it, they can ask their landlord to get a designated agent for ensuring the rental is tax compliant.


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    #29
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    newacc2015 wrote: »
    It is the law. It is not a case if OP is willing to do it, they have to it. It is not that difficult to do.

    If OP doesnt want to do it, they can ask their landlord to get a designated agent for ensuring the rental is tax compliant.

    The OP has been asked to collect and send the rent to the LL. He does that. It's not his place to ensure his LL is tax compliant. Legally the LL should be tax complaint, but there is no onus, legally or otherwise, on the OP to ensure this or even speak to the LL on this.


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    #30
    HS3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 405 ✭✭HS3


    How did he tell you he was leaving? Was it verbally or have you anything in writing?

    He's paying his rent so I would think everything else is rule breaking that's a matter of working out between you. If you can grin and bear it until the 30th and then he's gone. I would absolutely lock my bedroom door though. You may never have needed to before, but I would with this guy.

    I would think the main thing is acknowledging in writing that he's given his notice and his licence terminates on the 30th December and making sure you don't accept any rent from him after that. Have you someone lined up to take the room?


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    #31
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,336 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Lodgerfromhell wrote: »
    Foggy_lad thanks for all your advice, I had thought he had limited rights but wasn't sure how fast I could get rid of him. Since it was on the lease to not smoke do I keep part of his deposit or just give it all back and hopefully never hear from him again

    How long has he been in the house? If he has been there more than 6 months as a licensee of a tenant then he is entitled to be treated as a tenant by the landlord with part 4 rights. These are rights against the landlord not you as head tenant. If I were you, I would focus on eviction on the grounds of anti social behaviour rather than asserting that he has no security of tenure.


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