A 4th Ballon D'Or for Cristiano Ronaldo

Arghus

Andersonisgod wrote: »

You're just jealous because you aren't part of our super group :cool:

I'd call you more a cover-band of hipster football cliches.

The Golden Miller

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Well put my friend, and now I will retreat to my study, where I will read some books.

And a well deserved break at that

Corholio

The Golden Miller wrote: »

So for example, you don't think Ronaldo (Brazilian) would have similar returns had he played in this era of La Liga. Funny how all of a sudden Suarez is knocking in ridiculous goal returns too

Wow, so one brilliant player would have had similar returns of another brilliant player? Enlightening. Would he have come in this season too? Since that was the point being made.

dfx-

adox wrote: »

Clicked on thread hoping for the best.

Turns in to the predictable one poster circus again.

Honestly, anyone with any semblance of sense and impartiality wouldn't begrudge Ronaldo, Messi or Suarez winning it. Could split hairs over the ins and outs but that's about it.

Anyway well done Ronaldo. Amazing career.

I don't agree with most of this post. It's not even close, Suarez is the deserved winner of any of these individual awards this year and probably last year too and Messi would be a distant third or lower for me this year.

The constant immediate placement of Ronaldo or Messi as automatic one two (in whichever order) is the real circus everywhere and it goes beyond one poster into a general media narrative.

kfallon

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Well put my friend, and now I will retreat to my study, where I will read some books.

You mean you will retreat to your TV room where you'll get all excited about oiled up grown men in spandex grappling to a pre-determined storyline of who gets to win the 'bout'......

The_Kew_Tour

It's a pity threads like this are getting ruined every single time by the one posten.

And to think I stood up for that poster at beginning.

bucketybuck

Although he fully deserves the award for being the best player in the world yet again, it must also be noted that unlike his rivals Ronaldo is hitting these heights without resorting to any supplements like drugs or human flesh, he deserves even more credit for that.

enzo roco

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

It's a pity threads like this are getting ruined every single time by the one posten.

And to think I stood up for that poster at beginning.

Who Mick???
Cause that poster just trolls constantly.

Knex*

People getting upset because a man who scored 50 goals, won both the Euros and The Champions League, has won the Ballon D'Or.

Dear Jesus.

I don't think football fans of this era understand quite how spoiled they are with Messi and Ronaldo, in all honesty. When you see people acting like Ronaldo is an unworthy winner after his achievements this year, you have to shake your head a bit.

So you thought Messi should have won it. He's won plenty of times before, and will likely win it again. Relax. Enjoy the spectacle.

gucci

bucketybuck wrote: »

Although he fully deserves the award for being the best player in the world yet again, it must also be noted that unlike his rivals Ronaldo is hitting these heights without resorting to any supplements like drugs or human flesh, he deserves even more credit for that.

Here's hoping.....

Andersonisgod

kfallon wrote: »

You mean you will retreat to your TV room where you'll get all excited about oiled up grown men in spandex grappling to a pre-determined storyline of who gets to win the 'bout'......

That's for later.

Flint Fredstone

enzo roco wrote: »

Who Mick???
Cause that poster just trolls constantly.

There's a difference between trolling and slagging. The amount of people here that don't realise this is staggering.

GreNoLi

GreNoLi wrote: »

Should've been Kante.

Was he listed at all?
A title winning season he had for sure

enzo roco

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

There's a difference between trolling and slagging. The amount of people here that don't realise this is staggering.

Ha good one Fred. And do you know the difference between slagging and bullying???
Utd fans in this thread are disgraceful. Why not just win the debate???

Flint Fredstone

enzo roco wrote: »

Ha good one Fred. And do you know the difference between slagging and bullying???
Utd fans in this thread are disgraceful. Why not just win the debate???

What are you on about bullying? And what are these disgraceful things United fans are doing?

StringerBell

Not even sure what United fans have to do with it, fans from multiple clubs (including Liverpool) have come together to recognise the talents of the man. What exactly can United fans have done to be labelled disgraceful?

Bridge93

It's amazing a few posters here know so much more about the real Ronaldo than the professional journalists, players and managers who keep voting for him and lauding him as one of the best in the world.
You guys aren't fooled easy, it's obviously just a worldwide conspiracy by literally everyone in the football business to pretend he's a genius.

enzo roco

enzo roco wrote: »

Ha good one Fred. And do you know the difference between slagging and bullying???
Utd fans in this thread are disgraceful. Why not just win the debate???

I find it quite sad you have seem to have an issue with me, an anonymous poster on an internet forum

Never once did I say anything in here bar a discussion on Ronaldo
If a poster tells me that Ronaldo shouldn't be in the top ten that I'm going to call him / her on that ****e
And to rub it in I'm told I can't hold an opinion because I don't head to the Bernabéu every weekend

I just think you are having a little meltdown and it's embarrassing

The Golden Miller

Knex. wrote: »

I don't think football fans of this era understand quite how spoiled they are with Messi and Ronaldo, in all honesty.

As opposed to great players from any other era? Oh wait, are you trying to imply these are the two best ever because of the inflated goal returns of the modern era, particularly in La Liga? Messi is up there with the best ever, and not because of his goals, because of his all round game. Want to tell us what Ronaldo brings to the table, that say Gerd Muller didn't for example?

I love these sort of phrases that tell us how lucky we are because we are around to see Messi AND Ronaldo. They tend to come from people who would favour Ronaldo as a better player. It's a nice little ploy they have going. They think they look impartial, objective and reasoned by saying "aren't they both great players", and anyone who disagrees with Ronaldo's standing in the pantheon of greats must therefore by biased and wrong. It's clever way of shoehorning Ronaldo onto a level he's clearly not on

Bridge93 wrote: »

It's amazing a few posters here know so much more about the real Ronaldo than the professional journalists, players and managers who keep voting for him and lauding him as one of the best in the world.
You guys aren't fooled easy, it's obviously just a worldwide conspiracy by literally everyone in the football business to pretend he's a genius.

Want to tell us in your own words what makes him so special and a genius, since this is well known to everyone in the world? Bearing in mind great goal scorers of the past have had better ratio's under harder circumstances yet weren't lauded with 4 world player of the year awards. Want to tell us what else Ronaldo brings to the table that separates him from these other goalscorers that makes him a genius and one of the very best ever?

Bridge93

The Golden Miller wrote: »

As opposed to great players from any other era? Oh wait, are you trying to imply these are the two best ever because of the inflated goal returns of the modern era, particularly in La Liga? Messi is up there with the best ever, and not because of his goals, because of his all round game. Want to tell us what Ronaldo brings to the table, that say Gerd Muller didn't for example?

I love these sort of phrases that tell us how lucky we are because we are around to see Messi AND Ronaldo. They tend to come from people who would favour Ronaldo as a better player. It's a nice little ploy they have going. They think they look impartial, objective and reasoned by saying "aren't they both great players", and anyone who disagrees with Ronaldo's standing in the pantheon of greats must therefore by biased and wrong. It's clever way of shoehorning Ronaldo onto a level he's clearly not on



Want to tell us in your own words what makes him so special and a genius, since this is well known to everyone in the world? Bearing in mind great goal scorers of the past have had better ratio's under harder circumstances yet weren't lauded with 4 world player of the year awards. Want to tell us what else Ronaldo brings to the table that separates him from these other goalscorers that makes him a genius and one of the very best ever?

No I don't. Because it's all been said before and you don't listen so why bother my breath being the next to try? It's pretty clear over his career what he brings and those who care to see it do. Thankfully that's 99.9% of people.

The Golden Miller

Bridge93 wrote: »

No I don't. Because it's all been said before and you don't listen so why bother my breath being the next to try? It's pretty clear over his career what he brings and those who care to see it do. Thankfully that's 99.9% of people.

This is the problem. Apparently I never listen, but all I ever hear is people unable to tell me what he actually brings to the table that seperates him from other great goal scorers, and then reel off some goal stats to show his "genius". Yet they can never actually explain what he is doing that warrants him such high praise that the likes of Gerd Muller never done? So want to actually have a go at enlightening us all on the genius of Ronaldo, without needing to mention stats or what individual trophy's he's won, just like we don't have to do for the other greats?

Dirty Dingus McGee

The Golden Miller wrote: »

This is the problem. Apparently I never listen, but all I ever hear is people unable to tell me what he actually brings to the table that seperates him from other great goal scorers, and then reel off some goal stats to show his "genius". Yet they can never actually explain what he is doing that warrants him such high praise that the likes of Gerd Muller never done? So want to actually have a go at enlightening us all on the genius of Ronaldo, without needing to mention stats or what individual trophy's he's won, just like we don't have to do for the other greats?

But Gerd Muller is widely lauded as one of the all time greats by everyone in the game. Beckenbauer said he was the reason Bayern and Germany won so much.

The Golden Miller

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

But Gerd Muller is widely lauded as one of the all time greats by everyone in the game. Beckenbauer said he was the reason Bayern and Germany won so much.

So you reckon Muller warranted at least 4 world player of the year titles then? No one else seems to think so, yet most seem to think Ronaldo is worthy of his 4. What does Ronaldo bring that has him seemingly ahead of Muller in the pantheon of greats? Muller is known as one of the best goals scorers ever, but never put up on a pedestal with your Maradona's and Cruyff's. But we are told that Ronaldo is a genius and one of the two best players ever by many, not just a great goal scorer. See the difference? Now why is this? What does he do that warrants him such high praise by many, that many top goal scorers before him didn't do?

Andersonisgod

The Golden Miller wrote: »

As opposed to great players from any other era? Oh wait, are you trying to imply these are the two best ever because of the inflated goal returns of the modern era, particularly in La Liga? Messi is up there with the best ever, and not because of his goals, because of his all round game. Want to tell us what Ronaldo brings to the table, that say Gerd Muller didn't for example?

I love these sort of phrases that tell us how lucky we are because we are around to see Messi AND Ronaldo. They tend to come from people who would favour Ronaldo as a better player. It's a nice little ploy they have going. They think they look impartial, objective and reasoned by saying "aren't they both great players", and anyone who disagrees with Ronaldo's standing in the pantheon of greats must therefore by biased and wrong. It's clever way of shoehorning Ronaldo onto a level he's clearly not on



Want to tell us in your own words what makes him so special and a genius, since this is well known to everyone in the world? Bearing in mind great goal scorers of the past have had better ratio's under harder circumstances yet weren't lauded with 4 world player of the year awards. Want to tell us what else Ronaldo brings to the table that separates him from these other goalscorers that makes him a genius and one of the very best ever?

I've been trying to put those words you just used in that sequence combined with that same tone of righteous indignation and yet here you've done exactly that. Supreme.

The Golden Miller

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I've been trying to put those words you just used in that sequence combined with that same tone of righteous indignation and yet here you've done exactly that. Supreme.

And yet, we still have no one able to explain what it is that separates Ronaldo from the other great goal scorers, which makes one of the two greatest players ever

StringerBell

You have actually had that explained to you countless times over the years, nobody gives a **** enough to properly engage with you or your other persona in any meaningful manner anymore simply because it is like banging your head off a brick wall.

bucketybuck

Does anybody think that Ronaldo will continue to dominate the game next year, or will somebody like Griezmann or Pogba step up and challenge him for the honour?

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

Does anybody think that Ronaldo will continue to dominate the game next year, or will somebody like Griezmann or Pogba step up and challenge him for the honour?

This guy will be the next Ronaldo / Messi IMO

Arghus

I never realised that scoring bundles and bundles of goals was something that seems to actually count against a players greatness.

Rayne Wooney

Hard to see how Messi is clearly a level above when Ronaldo has been voted better by their peers 4 of the last 9 seasons.

Even saying Suarez was better last year Ronaldo still scored more match winning goals than him, plus the winning penalty in a CL final and he did very well for Portugal.

Ronaldo deserves it, I think it could be someone new next year though.

StringerBell

M!Ck^ wrote: »

This guy will be the next Ronaldo / Messi IMO

Dunno what it is about him but I don't think he will quite hit that kind of high.

I think Suarez would certainly be close, Neymar will be up in the mix soon surely.

bucketybuck

M!Ck^ wrote: »

This guy will be the next Ronaldo / Messi IMO

I don't think anybody will be the next Ronaldo any time soon. There will be players who have great seasons here and there but nobody will match what he has produced for nearly 15 seasons now. That level of quality matched with that level of consistency is just astounding.

Its only when we are back to mere mortals peaking at 30/40 goals for a few seasons that we will really start to appreciate just how great Ronaldo and Messi actually are.

StringerBell

StringerBell wrote: »

Dunno what it is about him but I don't think he will quite hit that kind of high.

I think Suarez would certainly be close, Neymar will be up in the mix soon surely.

I personally think he creates and scores at will. I have been watching him for the last three years whenever I get a chance. He's a special player.
Being greedy it's somebody who I would love Utd to get

To note: He won the Golden boot and player of the tournament at the Euros

And has been a stand out performer in the last 3 years in the CL

Stats don't lie, this doesn't include assists

The_Kew_Tour

The Golden Miller wrote: »

So you reckon Muller warranted at least 4 world player of the year titles then? No one else seems to think so, yet most seem to think Ronaldo is worthy of his 4. What does Ronaldo bring that has him seemingly ahead of Muller in the pantheon of greats? Muller is known as one of the best goals scorers ever, but never put up on a pedestal with your Maradona's and Cruyff's. But we are told that Ronaldo is a genius and one of the two best players ever by many, not just a great goal scorer. See the difference? Now why is this? What does he do that warrants him such high praise by many, that many top goal scorers before him didn't do?

Not only are you moving the goalposts but you're going back and forth too with it. Some going.

The Golden Miller

StringerBell wrote: »

You have actually had that explained to you countless times over the years.

It actually hasn't. Once we got some half-hearted stuff mentioning other facets of his play like dribbling or a youtube video of him doing a few passes. But once it was pointed out he was no playmaker and that every player can do a few passes and that his dribbling and beating men is actually quite poor, it was back to bringing up his stats. Also, isn't it funny how no other great player is only discussed in terms of his stats alone?

But something no one has ever been able to answer is the comparison with Gerd Muller. What does Ronaldo bring to the game that Muller never did, that warrants Ronaldo 4 world player of the year awards and often regarded as one of the best 2 players ever, while Muller is seen only as a great goalscorer?

The Golden Miller

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Not only are you moving the goalposts but you're going back and forth too with it. Some going.

Moving the goalposts?

The Golden Miller

Arghus wrote: »

I never realised that scoring bundles and bundles of goals was something that seems to actually count against a players greatness.

No one said it does. Point is many players scored buckets of goals, often with better ratio's, less games and in harder era's. Yet what makes Ronaldo so special that he's worthy of 4 world player of the year awards and a consideration by many that he's one of the top 2 ever when he's a goal scorer alone?

Corholio

The Golden Miller wrote: »

So you reckon Muller warranted at least 4 world player of the year titles then? No one else seems to think so, yet most seem to think Ronaldo is worthy of his 4. What does Ronaldo bring that has him seemingly ahead of Muller in the pantheon of greats? Muller is known as one of the best goals scorers ever, but never put up on a pedestal with your Maradona's and Cruyff's. But we are told that Ronaldo is a genius and one of the two best players ever by many, not just a great goal scorer. See the difference? Now why is this? What does he do that warrants him such high praise by many, that many top goal scorers before him didn't do?

No one else seems to think so? Are you arguing against yourself now? Muller was a true great of course, but he was unlucky in that he was outshone by Beckenbauer in that team, and also by other countries teams in that era (Brazil, Holland) Eras in football always divide opinions and are pretty tough to judge, Ronaldo is one of the 2 best players in the world for the past few years, hence his nominations and wins for Wold Player of the Year, Muller wasn't nominated unfortunately. Muller was never one of the top 2 best players in is era, like anything it's arguable but I don't believe he was. He wasn't as good as Maradona, Pele, Cryuff or indeed Messi. I don't think Ronaldo is one of the 2 best players ever, but if he's 'just' a goalscorer are you saying he shouldn't have won any World Player awards so?

sReq | uTeK

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Probably not the best time to use Ronaldo's tax record as something to laud him about.

You're understanding of the law is as good as your understanding if football. Aka not very.

What ronaldo did is perfectly legal and within the boundaries of corporate and personal tax loop holes used by millions. What Messi did was not.

Arghus

The Golden Miller wrote: »

No one said it does. Point is many players scored buckets of goals, often with better ratio's, less games and in harder era's. Yet what makes Ronaldo so special that he's worthy of 4 world player of the year awards and a consideration by many that he's one of the top 2 ever when he's a goal scorer alone?

I can't speak for the many. I wouldn't be entirely certain myself that he's one of the top 2 of all time; I've no way of legitimately judging that. Much the same way I couldn't be entirely certain that Messi is the out and out greatest ever either, you have to compare players across eras to make such a claim and I don't think, with that in mind, such an assertion can be a cast-iron certainty.

However, I do think Ronaldo is an amzing player and deserves to be regarded as one of the greatest for numerous reasons: consistent achievement at a high level for both club and country, for a very long time; maximum achievement in different football cultures; excelling in different positions as his career has progressed - on the wing, as an attacking midfielder, as a forward. Honestly, what more does he have to do? I think it's, quite frankly, idiotic to say he isn't one of the greats.

I'd also like to add that this reductive argument that Real's champions league triumph this year owes nothing to Ronaldo, simply because of the formailty that he put the decisive penalty away, is a total nonsense. Clearly it mattered. And clearly it's difficult; Messi couldn't put his one away in the Copa, after all. I thought they were supposed to be easy? Please, also, bear in mind that I think Messi is the superior footballer. But that doesn't stop me giving Ronaldo the credit he deserves.

If that does stop you - then, basically, you're a fool.


And on the somewhat strawman argument about Gerd Muller - doesn't everyone agree that he was both a great goalscorer AND a great player?The two terms aren't mutually exclusive.

SlickRic

Ronaldo, in the last couple of seasons, has yes, primarily been a goalscorer. A supreme one. On a par with Gerd Muller.

If you think all he's ever done is score goals, you're utterly ignorant. Nothing more, nothing less.

He has less dribbles than earlier in his career. His pace has deteriorated. Therefore he physically can't do what he used to. I find it mental that the fact he's altered his game to become a goalscorer on a par with Muller (at least) is seen by anyone as a strike against him. It's pathetic.

He was not 'just a goalscorer' up until a couple of years ago. He could fly past people. He could dribble as well as anyone. That's literally the only thing that's being held against him. And if you think that before he became 29 years old or so he was 'just a goalscorer', your opinion is invalid, because you're obviously blinded by bitterness.

Those who begrudge him his standing in the game just cannot handle that there is another way to play the game other than the 'Messi way' or the 'Barcelona way'. That's all it is. It's a dogmatic stance on the way they believe the game should he played. It's like a form of religious fundamentalism. 'There is no other way apart from our way.'

I say all this believing Messi is the better player. You can believe that both players are in the pantheon of greats.

eagle eye

The reasons people don't want to rate him are all to do with his personality rather than his football skill. He did a lot of diving when he was in the Premier league which annoyed people, he has been petulant for his whole career too. He is not a likeable person, I think it's even hard for his teammates tbh but he is a great player and one of the best of all time.

The fact that he has been able to succeed while losing his pace is something that he should be admired for imo.

The Golden Miller

Corholio wrote: »

No one else seems to think so? Are you arguing against yourself now? Muller was a true great of course, but he was unlucky in that he was outshone by Beckenbauer in that team, and also by other countries teams in that era (Brazil, Holland) Eras in football always divide opinions and are pretty tough to judge, Ronaldo is one of the 2 best players in the world for the past few years, hence his nominations and wins for Wold Player of the Year, Muller wasn't nominated unfortunately. Muller was never one of the top 2 best players in is era, like anything it's arguable but I don't believe he was. He wasn't as good as Maradona, Pele, Cryuff or indeed Messi. I don't think Ronaldo is one of the 2 best players ever, but if he's 'just' a goalscorer are you saying he shouldn't have won any World Player awards so?

No one seems to think he was worth 4 world player of the year awards, as you yourself allude to in the part in bold. This is the point, Muller was over shone by other great players, despite having more goals and better stats. Yet Ronaldo is considered arguably the best of his generation/ever simply because he has the most goals and stats in his era etc. Can you really not see the contradiction here?

Arghus wrote: »

I can't speak for the many. I wouldn't be entirely certain myself that he's one of the top 2 of all time; I've no way of legitimately judging that. Much the same way I couldn't be entirely certain that Messi is the out and out greatest ever either, you have to compare players across eras to make such a claim and I don't think, with that in mind, such an assertion can be a cast-iron certainty.

However, I do think Ronaldo is an amzing player and deserves to be regarded as one of the greatest for numerous reasons: consistent achievement at a high level for both club and country, for a very long time; maximum achievement in different football cultures; excelling in different positions as his career has progressed - on the wing, as an attacking midfielder, as a forward. Honestly, what more does he have to do? I think it's, quite frankly, idiotic to say he isn't one of the greats.

I'd also like to add that this reductive argument that Real's champions league triumph this year owes nothing to Ronaldo, simply because of the formailty that he put the decisive penalty away, is a total nonsense. Clearly it mattered. And clearly it's difficult; Messi couldn't put his one away in the Copa, after all. I thought they were supposed to be easy? Please, also, bear in mind that I think Messi is the superior footballer. But that doesn't stop me giving Ronaldo the credit he deserves.

If that does stop you - then, basically, you're a fool.


And on the somewhat strawman argument about Gerd Muller - doesn't everyone agree that he was both a great goalscorer AND a great player?The two terms aren't mutually exclusive.

No, I don't think Muller is held in the same esteem by the general masses as Ronaldo, despite Ronaldo being a lesser player/striker than Muller. You hear this "aren't we lucky to be alive to see the two best ever players" nonsense all the time. Ronaldo is a great goal scorer, I've always said that. People seem to take point with this, trying to twist it to make out that I'm calling him a bog standard player, yet can't qualify why he is anything other than just a goalscorer. What other facets of the game did he excel at to a world class level? He excels in what he's good at, just as many other goalscorers did, but none have been placed on the same pedestal as Ronaldo

SlickRic wrote: »

Ronaldo, in the last couple of seasons, has yes, primarily been a goalscorer. A supreme one. On a par with Gerd Muller.

If you think all he's ever done is score goals, you're utterly ignorant. Nothing more, nothing less.

He has less dribbles than earlier in his career. His pace has deteriorated. Therefore he physically can't do what he used to. I find it mental that the fact he's altered his game to become a goalscorer on a par with Muller (at least) is seen by anyone as a strike against him. It's pathetic.

He was not 'just a goalscorer' up until a couple of years ago. He could fly past people. He could dribble as well as anyone. That's literally the only thing that's being held against him. And if you think that before he became 29 years old or so he was 'just a goalscorer', your opinion is invalid, because you're obviously blinded by bitterness.

Ok, well you should have no problem pointing us to a few great Ronaldo performances where he was instrumental in general play against a top team. Well considering he displayed other facets to his game to a world class level before the last few years? You know, like the way Kaka tore up the Champions League in 07? Or even the way a young Messi played against United in 08, despite the fact he was in a Barca team in transition and just back from a 6 week injury yet didn't score but was so impressive and pulled all the strings for Barca in midfield that he got MOTM in both legs? Or the way the Brazilian Ronaldo would tear through the top defenses on a regular basis in the Champions League and leave people in awe etc etc etc? There is no truly memorable Ronaldo performances where he dominated a game for 90 minutes. He is lethargic in general play most of the time. He is simply a goalscorer. But one who seems to garner plaudits as arguably the best ever in many quarters, despite players in previous era's with the most goals and best stats being overlooked as the true greats from their era's.

MD1990

The Golden Miller wrote: »

No one seems to think he was worth 4 world player of the year awards, as you yourself allude to in the part in bold. This is the point, Muller was over shone by other great players, despite having more goals and better stats. Yet Ronaldo is considered arguably the best of his generation/ever simply because he has the most goals and stats in his era etc. Can you really not see the contradiction here?



No, I don't think Muller is held in the same esteem by the general masses as Ronaldo, despite Ronaldo being a lesser player/striker than Muller. You hear this "aren't we lucky to be alive to see the two best ever players" nonsense all the time. Ronaldo is a great goal scorer, I've always said that. People seem to take point with this, trying to twist it to make out that I'm calling him a bog standard player, yet can't qualify why he is anything other than just a goalscorer. What other facets of the game did he excel at to a world class level? He excels in what he's good at, just as many other goalscorers did, but none have been placed on the same pedestal as Ronaldo



Ok, well you should have no problem pointing us to a few great Ronaldo performances where he was instrumental in general play against a top team. Well considering he displayed other facets to his game to a world class level before the last few years? You know, like the way Kaka tore up the Champions League in 07? Or even the way a young Messi played against United in 08, despite the fact he was in a Barca team in transition and just back from a 6 week injury yet didn't score but was so impressive and pulled all the strings for Barca in midfield that he got MOTM in both legs? Or the way the Brazilian Ronaldo would tear through the top defenses on a regular basis in the Champions League and leave people in awe etc etc etc? No, there is not truly memorable Ronaldo performances where he dominated a game for 90 minutes.

Ronaldo vs Arsenal 09 CL Semi at the Emirates is one.
Also against Sweden in the play off for the World Cup.
He was very good in the 2008 CL Final.
Against Holland at Euro 2012.
2012 vs Atletico where he scored a hatrick.
Has scored regularly against Barca in the last 6 years too.

The Golden Miller

MD1990 wrote: »

Ronaldo vs Arsenal 09 CL Semi at the Emirates is one.
Also against Sweden in the play off for the World Cup.
He was very good in the 2008 CL Final.
2012 vs Atletico where he scored a hatrick.
Has scored regularly against Barca in the last 6 years too.

Obviously missed the point. Yes yes, goals that he scored. I've said he's a goalscorer. Now want to point to any games where he has been instrumental for 90 minutes of a game against a big team, one where he doesn't disappear in and out between scoring goals? You know, the way all the great players have dominated games? Or is Ronaldo's greatest just due to his goals? If so then that proves my point, doesn't it?

Nalz

What bollox. "Lethargic in general play". Maybe nowadays but fûck me that remark smells of bias jealous wañk.

SlickRic

This 'general play' shít that gets used as a stick to beat Ronaldo is exactly what I'm talking about. Such nonsense in an attempt to make the goalposts suit the way Messi plays football.

Football is a team game. Lots of players, with lots of skillsets. Messi is intricate and a pure footballer. Ronaldo is explosive and direct.

Both brilliant.
Both geniuses.
Both play the game differently.

It's why football is a glorious game. Plenty of ways to skin the cat.

The Golden Miller

Nalz wrote: »

What bollox. "Lethargic in general play". Maybe nowadays but fûck me that remark smells of bias jealous wañk.

Well point to a 90 minute world class performance that Ronaldo put in against a top team at any point in his career?

The Golden Miller

SlickRic wrote: »

This 'general play' shít that gets used as a stick to beat Ronaldo is exactly what I'm talking about. Such nonsense in an attempt to make the goalposts suit the way Messi plays football.

Football is a team game. Lots of players, with lots of skillsets. Messi is intricate and a pure footballer. Ronaldo is explosive and direct.

Both brilliant.
Both geniuses.
Both play the game differently.

It's why football is a glorious game. Plenty of ways to skin the cat.

Yes, being decidedly average to downright awful in the last few years in general play is the hallmark of all the true greats, isn't it? Did Ronaldo skin a cat better than Gerd Muller? No, so why is Muller not heralded as the best ever? His stats are better than Maradona and Cruyff, right? You'll have this great performance any minute I assume?

SlickRic

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Yes, being decidedly average to downright awful in the last few years in general play is the hallmark of all the true greats, isn't it? Did Ronaldo skin a cat better than Gerd Muller? No, so why is Muller not heralded as the best ever? His stats are better than Maradona and Cruyff, right? You'll have this great performance any minute I assume?

Muller is heralded as one of the best ever.

He's not heralded as THE best as he was always just a goalscorer. That's not the case with Ronaldo. He is mainly that now, but as I said earlier (but you're ignoring out of ignorance I assume) he's only been that since maybe 2013.

None of this matters though because your dogma won't allow you see past your pathetically narrow definition of great.