The 10th Annual PW Draft 2017 Discussion Thread

beakerjoe

Oh he was, nothing stopping him. Most likely over looked as he has been on NJPW cards

Lord TSC

Yeah, but I didn't draft him (or look for a partner for many guys) early on cause I wanted to wait and use the 5 tag team limit to fill out my undercard.

Which draws me too...

The Tag Team limit rule is now cut - The take team limit per roster was 5 tag teams per roster. Now you may draft more as that limit is lifted. So if you already drafted 5 tag teams..... its ok now as you may draft some more if you wish.

Not complaining or kicking up a fuss, but I do feel thats kind of punishing people who opted not to take tag teams early on in case they needed the numbers down the road If I had known that limit would have been cut later, there's one or two picks I'd have made differently....I definitely would have grabbed someone with Xavier, as the relevant example...

Mr.Nice Guy

I don't think it's a good idea to cut the tag team and intergender tag team rule for future rounds.

Cutting it for round ten, fair enough; but carrying it beyond that just means the rest of the game is going to be littered with people taking an extra name to become nothing more than roster fodder. This is what those rules were brought in to stop. It also eliminates the tactical element of having to choose your tag picks carefully.

beakerjoe

My reasoning behind said rules was to open the draft up a bit so more could be drafted. I dont want to make the draft unfair in anyway, so if the general consensus is to the rules removed for this round rather than all rounds then so be it. What does everyone else think?

Personally I don't mind either way.

campo

beakerjoe wrote: »

My reasoning behind said rules was to open the draft up a bit so more could be drafted. I dont want to make the draft unfair in anyway, so if the general consensus is to the rules removed for this round rather than all rounds then so be it. What does everyone else think?

Personally I don't mind either way.

Personally I like the stips, for me the draft should be expect the unexpected, I for one vote to keep the stips

daithi1989

Maybe raise the limit to 8/9 tag teams, that way it is still somewhat restrictive, but doesnt punish people who didnt pick tag teams?

Aint gonna lie, I had missed this rule! Didnt realise it was max 5! Still learning as I go along here as a newbie!

Mr.Nice Guy

If we take the example of thebostoncrab, he acknowledged recently that he'd decided to use up his fifth and final tag pick by taking Kendrick and Low Ki. Those were the tactics he had decided upon - get the tag picks done early. Others decided to wait until later in the game to make tag picks. That's the beauty of the game imo: the different strategies.

If we're now saying that the tag limit rule doesn't count from here on, then essentially it disadvantages rosters who decided to ration out their tag picks. It basically says, your tactics were wrong - through no fault of your own.

Also do we really want to go back to the days of superfluous picks? "I'll draft my star name - plus a chap he tagged with in Smoky Mountain Wrestling who no one else has heard of. Why? Well, it''s another body to use."

I'll go with what the majority want (no electoral college here alas ) but I think applying these rules for the rest of the game will make for a poorer experience, and I would find that a shame as I think the rules so far have pretty much struck the perfect tone.

campo

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

If we take the example of thebostoncrab, he acknowledged recently that he'd decided to use up his fifth and final tag pick by taking Kendrick and Low Ki. Those were the tactics he had decided upon - get the tag picks done early. Others decided to wait until later in the game to make tag picks. That's the beauty of the game imo: the different strategies.

If we're now saying that the tag limit rule doesn't count from here on, then essentially it disadvantages rosters who decided to ration out their tag picks. It basically says, your tactics were wrong - through no fault of your own.

Also do we really want to go back to the days of superfluous picks? "I'll draft my star name - plus a chap he tagged with in Smoky Mountain Wrestling who no one else has heard of. Why? Well, it''s another body to use."

I'll go with what the majority want (no electoral college here alas ) but I think applying these rules for the rest of the game will make for a poorer experience, and I would find that a shame as I think the rules so far have pretty much struck the perfect tone.

It was same for me when the 1970 rule was abolished, I took Piper in the 1st round because I believed it was my best chance to get him if I had know the 1970 rule was going to be abolished I would have went for a bigger name but alas the draft king caught me on the hop but I didnt mind all part of the fun IMHO

daithi1989

It does state in Post 1 in picks thread that rules may alter, so I take it from that, to expect changes.
As a new player to get game, I dont have any issues one way or another.. A happy medium may be to go with what I suggested in previous post, to increase instead of abolishment?

DM_7

The change in allowed tag numbers was used before? I was expecting it along with abolishment of the eligible promotions late in the draft.

But I think round 10 is a bit soon.

Its potentially an extra 6 tag teams. It is a better stip for round 14 or 15 imo.

Edit: when i read the rule amendments I was fine with them. I am still fine with them and only say the above within the context of the discussion found when reading this thread.

A Brad Maddox Guy

I much prefer restrictive stips so when one comes in that abolishes 3 rules for 6 rounds with previous rules being abolished earlier then I'm pretty much always going to be against it. So far I'm loving the high standard of names available late on, it's added an extra toughness to choosing picks (it took me an hour to decide on my latest one and even now I'm not sure I made the right decision) and I would fear/assume that this will not be the case for much longer with the loss of the World Title rule & Tag Team limits.

In saying all that I think BH did similar last year and it still worked out fine so it's not a huge issue, it won't ruin the game by any stretch of the imagination but I'd be lying if I said I liked the stip, or to be more accurate, the loss of stips. (Also worth noting Joe might have restrictive stips coming up for future rounds to counteract this).

Anywho, I mentioned earlier that I probably wouldn't take a celeb once Mayweather was gone but couldn't fight the temptation to draft Rourke. After a quick search of the forum I only found him being picked a few times but couldn't find any write-ups involving him. I have an idea for him, naturally it involves The Wrestler but I'm not 100% sure how it's going to play out beyond bulletpoints. I just watched the film for only the 2nd time and it really is brilliant, Rourke's performance was worth an Oscar imo though it's hard to begrudge Sean Penn for winning with Milk.

Bounty Hunter

DM_7 wrote: »

The change in allowed tag numbers was used before? I was expecting it along with abolishment of the eligible promotions late in the draft.

But I think round 10 is a bit soon.

I did use the removal of the rule last year but can't recall off hand if it was in a later round but it may seem that way as it wasn't the only rule removed this time and so wouldn't have been as big last time.

Personally I don't like the 5 tag team limit as it is just that a limit on your creativity when picking / rosters potential. I also see the benefit of having it then removing it later as if people don't know it will be removed then maybe they don't hoover up lots of big plus 1s early on but can instead add handy for storyline purposes extras late on. That said in later year it might either have to be abolished all together or just removed later as peole might expect it and plan for it (or not worry about the limit as they will know it will be gone).

Either way I kinda like it being removed especially when you add in how I once again have a big wait to pick (from no.3 to 30 in the following round) and need more options to pick from.

All the celebs take I could legit see in matches this year except maybe Trump but that lad has so many other upsides to being drafted (he's the freaking president now). Jay Lethal is also great value at this stage

LeeJM

Speaking as somebody who has used all 5 tag picks already the rule change really isnt gonna alter my plans. Im not now all of a sudden gonna be drafting a raft of Memphis Wrestling tag team champions just because I can. I might take 1 more team if they last till round 14 but I expected the tag rule to be abolished by then anyway.

I dont think anybody is now gonna be just drafting teams to get guys to use as fodder. IMO its a mark against you if everybody you draft isnt used on your big PPV/last event.

I will go along with whatever the majority decide but dont see the big deal in abolishing the rule now.

Necro

I can certainly see both sides to the argument but the rule changes (abolitions) really wouldn't affect my plans in any way. I have a list (along with back ups) of who I want to draft and would probably be fairly rigid with that list from now on as there are certain types of characters I need to fill out my roster. I haven't used up my quota of tag teams and probably won't before the end of the draft - as Lee said I'd prefer to have some form of involvement of each and every guy/gal I drafted on my main card so filling it up with tag teams would present a serious problem in doing so.
However I can see the point that other people may have been saving their tag picks for a later date and this essentially means they needn't have done so.
The only thing I'm wondering about is the intergender rule - is the criteria the same as a normal tag team? I can think of lots of pairings in the past but not too many that would actually qualify as a tag pick due to lack of matches together. Maybe I'm wrong, and showing my lack of knowledge outside of the major companies...

I'm happy to go with the majority either way though, as said before it probably won't affect me too much whatever the decision is.

Bounty Hunter

There only are a handfull of inter gender tag teams alright but it still opens up more possible picks. Having run this before, we always have mixed reactions with some stips but if you feel strongly remember it for the end of the draft / start of next one (most here have done multiple drafts) and next year we can avoid that stip / amend it.

I've had no issues with any stips or rules this year anyway but the rules change every year like with the 70s rule, IWGP rule etc

Necro

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

There only are a handfull of inter gender tag teams alright but it still opens up more possible picks. Having run this before, we always have mixed reactions with some stips but if you feel strongly remember it for the end of the draft / start of next one (most here have done multiple drafts) and next year we can avoid that stip / amend it.

I've had no issues with any stips or rules this year anyway but the rules change every year like with the 70s rule, IWGP rule etc

No, I'd have to agree for sure, have had no issues with any stips this year myself.
One rule I'd really love to see implemented in future years, and I've said this before - is the women's championship being treated the same as the men's at the beginning in terms of tag picks. I know people don't draft women straight away but with the calibre of female picks available, tightening this up would ensure most people can get at least 2 quality women onto their roster if they so choose. It could be removed at a later date much like the men's title rule, tag picks etc.

Bounty Hunter

Necrominus wrote: »

No, I'd have to agree for sure, have had no issues with any stips this year myself.
One rule I'd really love to see implemented in future years, and I've said this before - is the women's championship being treated the same as the men's at the beginning in terms of tag picks. I know people don't draft women straight away but with the calibre of female picks available, tightening this up would ensure most people can get at least 2 quality women onto their roster if they so choose. It could be removed at a later date much like the men's title rule, tag picks etc.

Yeah I would like the idea of the women's rule for the first 8ish rounds then allow it so that we dont actually stop people from picking women and instead just mean that the big ones like Lita this time and in the future i'd imagine people like Charlotte etc would be taken would not be taken with tag partners of the same level. Great picks when made but i'd like to see em spread around. it'd be interesting to see what titles though, just WWE I guess although that'd mean i'd still be able to take my Manami Toyota & Aja Kong pick again.

Necro

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Yeah I would like the idea of the women's rule for the first 8ish rounds then allow it so that we dont actually stop people from picking women and instead just mean that the big ones like Lita this time and in the future i'd imagine people like Charlotte etc would be taken would not be taken with tag partners of the same level. Great picks when made but i'd like to see em spread around. it'd be interesting to see what titles though, just WWE I guess although that'd mean i'd still be able to take my Manami Toyota & Aja Kong pick again.

That's exactly what I was thinking myself. Would probably be hard to justify including any other titles apart from WWE but it's something for the future I guess.

beakerjoe

Firstly, we have had no picks and no closer to round 10 yet, so I will not make a decision yet and wait for others to weigh in on the debate.

Secondly to those (like me) who want to go with the majority, you are no help to me at all in this debate :pac: (I joke I joke)

My thinking is that I want to make the draft different from previous years to a degree without going too radical and I dont want to lessen the experience for anyone, esp those who have played the game plenty over the last 10 years.

Like Campo said earlier, there is a certain degree of expect the unexpected or as the WWF but it in the ninties, anything can happen in the PW Boards draft! I had no idea that people would feel so against these stips but I do see exactly where people are coming from with their gripes.

In relation to the world change / intergender rules being abolished, my aim here was to do things a little differently from previous years here. With not too many intergender teams and only a couple of handful world champion left, my aim here was to make some picks that havent previously gone more entycing and attractive.

My thinking behind the tag limit, is that it was simply done last year at round 10 also and it added to my cut theme of the round by having an extra rule cut. No one complained last year to my knowledge so I assumed everyone was ok with the rule. Last year I dont belive anyone scooped up 5/6 tag teams from round 10 onwards, myself I only grabbed 2 and I wasnt at the limit myself, though again I do see the downside to some who have planned, but again its the draft and my thinking was plans can go out the window early depending on stips and round order.

But thats my 2 cents and again I dont feel that strongly on any of teh stips except I loved my simpsons cut round

Again, I will leave the topic open for debate before deciding and will let you all know before round 10 begins or the end of the day (whichever comes first)

Necro

I don't think anyone had any problems with the simpsons cut round stips to be honest Joe, it was moreover that the rules were dropped for the rounds following that as well.

For what it's worth I'll get off the fence and say I'd be in favour of not changing anything and sticking with the way Joe has laid things out. As I said before I'm not really too worried about the tag pick rule, or indeed the other rules that are abolished.

thebostoncrab

The issue I always have is I think 15 rounds is too little. As each year passes, more and more credible wrestlers become available and it's a shame to see some great wrestlers not get drafted (especially now that NJPW is part of the fold). So when I saw that the tag rule is to be removed I got excited because it meant more wrestlers (and more rewards for doing research!), so I welcome it as a really nice surprise.

As others have said, you should always be prepared for the unexpected with the draft and be ready for what ever the game throws at you. It makes it more interesting in my eyes and causes you to be always be ready for new plans.

daithi1989

If the rule change has happened in the past, then I dont see why it can't happen this time.

I would be in favour of keeping the new rule. Just my 2 cents.

ShagNastii

I'm not pushed either way.

TBH I think the world champion stip is in place to make sure no roster is too heavily weighted with five star early on. Example being somebody picking the Two Man Power Trip or HBK/Cena. Now that all the top top draw is gone this shouldn't be too earth moving getting rid of it. Wouldn't say there are too many world champs are left.

Five tag teams is more than enough for people to develop a pool or decent tag division. I'd echo what tbc said the prospect of the tag draw opening up is pleasing from a sense of amassing a deeper roster. Wouldn't be against one final 16th round as there will be talent to pick from and at that stage people generally go for a "gimme" pick I.e somebody that nobody else wants that would fit their roster perfectly. (Example being someone like a Fenchy Martin being picked to go with Dino Bravo)

Use these as they are two I believe won't be drafted.

campo

The only thing I would add is no matter who is drafted a rule should be added saying they must appear in your PPV

thebostoncrab

campo wrote: »

The only thing I would add is no matter who is drafted a rule should be added saying they must appear in your PPV

This. A million times this. If I can figure out a way to work Nicole Bass into a storyline that actually has me excited then anyone can figure out a way to use everything on their roster!

daithi1989

campo wrote: »

The only thing I would add is no matter who is drafted a rule should be added saying they must appear in your PPV

I would have thought this was a given tbh? Everyone I have drafted, has been with a plan in mind.

ShagNastii

I'm not sure if you mean the whole roster but I wouldn't be supportive of any measure forcing people to have a PPV with ALL whom they drafted.

Play it to the storyline. For arguments sake let's say I take a leaf out of WWE's books and do a "who done it" or something akin to that?

My first show I have somebody hitting Regal with a car (ala Stone Cold that time) I'd be gutted if I was tied to have him show up/ be involved at the PPV.

Necro

The only exception for me would be if I had a planned injury angle in mind - giving a character motivation for an upcoming match. If there were allowances in regards to this then that's fine. I know you could still toss them in a backstage segment or something but if an angle someone has written keeps someone off the main card then I'd be ok with that to be honest.

Necro

ShagNastii wrote: »

I'm not sure if you mean the whole roster but I wouldn't be supportive of any measure forcing people to have a PPV with ALL whom they drafted.

Play it to the storyline. For arguments sake let's say I take a leaf out of WWE's books and do a "who done it" or something akin to that?

My first show I have somebody hitting Regal with a car (ala Stone Cold that time) I'd be gutted if I was tied to have him show up/ be involved at the PPV.

Yep, Shag pretty much nailed my concerns in one.

beakerjoe

After listening to some for and some against the stips, I believe I see both sides and their reasoning.

Firstly thats a great idea about the "must appear on the PPV" however as others have said it restricts too much for my liking. Last year for example I used a relative of my main eventer, a round 15 pick, for one show only and he got taken out of action there and then and was never gonna appear on my PPV. He served his place to further a storyline and if such a rule existed then, I would be shoehorning him in for the sake of it. So I wont be making that rule, though its a great sugestion and one that is much appreciated.

Regarding the round 10-15 rules as per the round 10 stip, my suggestion is a simple compromise.

In relation to the tag rule being abolished, it now will not be abolished rather it shall be raised from 5 team limit to a 7 team limit. I think this is a fair enough way to resolve the issue while opening things up while not resticting too much.

In relation to the world title rule / intergender rules being abolished, it shall run for this round ten only. Rules shall revert to how they were at round 9 once round ten is over. I feel I may have added this too hasty for six rounds.

Again Id like to stress, the stips/ rule removal was designed to make things a little different from previous years and wasnt designed to hinder others previous round drafting stategy. I hope this appeases everyone and makes the game fair for everyone. Above all I love you all, a great bunch of lads, each one of you and I want each of you to love the game as much as I do.