Rent increase - allowed?

MissBoop

Hi, I'm totally confused with the new legislation and hoping to get some clarity. I'm renting an apartment since April 2013. Rent started at €1200, then 12 months later, in April 2014 we signed a new lease for €1270.

In March 2015, we received another lease and an increase to €1300, effective the 1st May

On the 10th Nov 2016, we received a rent review notice, taking effect on the 10th March 2017, to €1600. It was accompanied by similar properties, market rent disclosure statement etc.

Is this allowed? We are so reluctant to cause issue as we love the apartment and we are very happy, but also don't want to be taken advantage of.

Could anyone shed any light?

Thanks!!

cherryghost

10th Nov is too early. Notification can be 90 days FOLLOWING 1st May 2017, 2 years since your last price increase. Open to correction on that though.

MissBoop

cherryghost wrote: »

10th Nov is too early. Notification can be 90 days before 1st May 2017, 2 years since your last price increase. Open to correction on that though.

That's what I thought too. Do you happen to know if the amount is OK, or will the landlord be bound by the 4%p.a.?

Thanks for your help

cherryghost

Again, as far as I know, and open to correction again.... since the rent increase review is invalid, the Landlord cannot review rent increase again for another 2 years. So 4% pa after that

MissBoop

cherryghost wrote: »

Again, as far as I know, and open to correction again.... since the rent increase review is invalid, the Landlord cannot review rent increase again for another 2 years. So 4% pa after that

Oh! OK. Wasn't expecting that answer. Will go and see if I can find some information online surrounding that, as that is something I hadn't considered nor known. Thank you so much! fingers crossed ...

cherryghost

No bother. I'm sure someone else will hop in here and give more info. I'm just taking the interpretations at face value, ie the landlord sorta screwed himself/herself over.

Sarn

The LL can conduct the review in March 2017 to come into effect 90 days later, at least based on one of the RTB examples.

I'm not so sure about the invalid notice resulting in the LL being locked out of issuing a valid notice. Given how the legislation is so open to interpretation the LL could find themselves unable to change the rent due to minor technicalities. Which IMO would be unfair.

mjp

I'm in similar position to you. Rent last increased 1st April 2015 and due up for review next April but landlord panicked tur morning once it was mentioned on news and sent us notification of increase from 1300 to 1500 in April and said he was giving us 90 days notice but was giving it to us early as didn't want to " ruin our new years eve"... Pure bull that is !!! He also provided us with copies of similar rents in area which are all 1700+ so were currently well below average in this area. Having spoken to prtb they say he's not allowed issue us any review till April next year and come into effect 90 days later.

Were in similar position as above poster in that we don't want to pay higher rent if we don't have to but we also don't want to p*ss off landlord and where he gives us notice in April that he wants apt for daughter/niece and then we're rightly stuck as we won't get anything for less than 1800 in area. We haven't responded to him yet since he text us and posted copies of increase letter. I'm thinking that he's realised since that he hasn't a leg to stand on with notification as he thought he was being smart first getting I'm before the bill was announced first at lunchtime on Tuesday

runawaybishop

cherryghost wrote: »

Again, as far as I know, and open to correction again.... since the rent increase review is invalid, the Landlord cannot review rent increase again for another 2 years. So 4% pa after that

It's an invalid review, that doesn't reset the clock on reviews.

MissBoop

cherryghost wrote: »

No bother. I'm sure someone else will hop in here and give more info. I'm just taking the interpretations at face value, ie the landlord sorta screwed himself/herself over.

Sarn wrote: »

The LL can conduct the review in March 2017 to come into effect 90 days later, at least based on one of the RTB examples.

I'm not so sure about the invalid notice resulting in the LL being locked out of issuing a valid notice. Given how the legislation is so open to interpretation the LL could find themselves unable to change the rent due to minor technicalities. Which IMO would be unfair.

mjp wrote: »

I'm in similar position to you. Rent last increased 1st April 2015 and due up for review next April but landlord panicked tur morning once it was mentioned on news and sent us notification of increase from 1300 to 1500 in April and said he was giving us 90 days notice but was giving it to us early as didn't want to " ruin our new years eve"... Pure bull that is !!! He also provided us with copies of similar rents in area which are all 1700+ so were currently well below average in this area. Having spoken to prtb they say he's not allowed issue us any review till April next year and come into effect 90 days later.

Were in similar position as above poster in that we don't want to pay higher rent if we don't have to but we also don't want to p*ss off landlord and where he gives us notice in April that he wants apt for daughter/niece and then we're rightly stuck as we won't get anything for less than 1800 in area. We haven't responded to him yet since he text us and posted copies of increase letter. I'm thinking that he's realised since that he hasn't a leg to stand on with notification as he thought he was being smart first getting I'm before the bill was announced first at lunchtime on Tuesday

runawaybishop wrote: »

It's an invalid review, that doesn't reset the clock on reviews.

You're all so helpful, thanks a mill so, what i think I'm reading is that our next rent review can take place in March 2017, with an increase possible 90 days after that.

If that's the case, what about the amount? I would agree that €1300 is a little low for the area, but a €350 jump is huge. Are they bound by the 4% p.a increase? Or is increasing to market rent allowed if they can substantiate it (which, to be fair, they have). Also, is there anything stopping us negotiating with them, for example meeting them halfway? What I mean by that is that if we were prepared to pay more than the 8% but less than the €1600...say €1450, how would that leave both parties in light of the legislation?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm just super confused here!

davindub

MissBoop wrote: »

You're all so helpful, thanks a mill so, what i think I'm reading is that our next rent review can take place in March 2017, with an increase possible 90 days after that.

If that's the case, what about the amount? I would agree that €1300 is a little low for the area, but a €350 jump is huge. Are they bound by the 4% p.a increase? Or is increasing to market rent allowed if they can substantiate it (which, to be fair, they have). Also, is there anything stopping us negotiating with them, for example meeting them halfway? What I mean by that is that if we were prepared to pay more than the 8% but less than the €1600...say €1450, how would that leave both parties in light of the legislation?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm just super confused here!

You need to actually refer this to the prtb, the ll will have to review the rent under the rules in place at the time of the review. But a couple of cases determined that a invalid rent review counted as a review in terms of time. So ask the prtb to determine when the next review can take place.

MissBoop

davindub wrote: »

You need to actually refer this to the prtb, the ll will have to review the rent under the rules in place at the time of the review. But a couple of cases determined that a invalid rent review counted as a review in terms of time. So ask the prtb to determine when the next review can take place.

You're right, going to give them a ring on Monday, I hope we can come to an agreement that suits everyone, and am sure we aren't the only ones in this position! Thanks a mill

utmbuilder

the prtb might not be the people to call , threshold may be better, threshold answer the questions, the prtb are the people you complain to.

From the information provided the landlord can't up your rent now, when your 2 years is up from your last review he can only increase it by 4% , he wont be a happy man, call threshold to get all valid information.

Then sit back and contemplate a way to gage this to your landlord without soaring the relationship with him. It might even be better to let this new legislation settle in for a while to contact the landlord to be honest, might be less of a knee jerk reaction from him.

utmbuilder

utmbuilder wrote: »

threshold answer the questions, the prtb are the people you complain to.

They answer questions alright, but I wouldn't trust them as far as I'd throw them. Their advance can go as far as being downright illegal.

runawaybishop

Just tell him he can't increase the rent until 2 years have passed and then 90 days notice from then. No need to ring anyone. See what he says to that first. By then the legislation should have passed limiting the increase to 4% assuming you are in a pressure area.

davindub

MissBoop wrote: »

You're right, going to give them a ring on Monday, I hope we can come to an agreement that suits everyone, and am sure we aren't the only ones in this position! Thanks a mill

Sorry didn't mean ring, just fill out an application form and start the ball rolling. You can ask threshold for advice, but a case only costs 15/ 25 euros and the LL is looking to breach your rights. The first stage will be mediation if both parties are agreeable. I know you might see it as drastic but its actually what the process is there for.

MissBoop

Thanks a mill, all.

Am going to ring the LL and see what they say. Am reluctant to open a case with the PRTB as a first point of contact, as we have a good relationship and I don't want to break that down if it can be avoided. Will give them the option to say it was a 'mistake' and see if we can come to an agreement without anyone else getting involved. At least I know that I'm technically correct, and I can involve the PRTB as backup if need be.

I hate this stuff, as they have the potential to make your life so miserable!!

I might also wait until after Christmas, emotions can run run high in December, and I'm not stressed about it as such any more, so waiting may be better, as mentioned above.

April 73

That review is in valid as he jumped the gun & issued it too early. Hold fire until after Christmas & see what actually in the legislation that is passed. He will be governed by that next year.
Then have a chat when you know what the new laws state.