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"It's what you do next that counts"
Comments
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I was so tired this morning after last nights effort. I decided to take on my hilly route and aim for 11.5 miles to bring my weeks total mileage to 50. The wind always seemed to be in my face making for a very slow pace but I didn't mind, HR remained fairly low which I was happy about, saw loads of runners out this morning mainly in Marlay park.
So 11.46 miles in total at a nice easy pace, now after 4 tough weeks it's time for an easy week.
Average HR 66%
Week number|Total weekly miles|Weight|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|0|||
6|0|||
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Always wondered about you keeping your HR% so low. Are your figures based off max HR?
11 miles at 66% max seems very low. For example, I do my recovery at about 74%, and longish runs pushing into the 80s. This morning was 14 miles at 82% max, but strong headwind meant I was pushing harder than normal.0 -
Always wondered about you keeping your HR% so low. Are your figures based off max HR?
11 miles at 66% max seems very low. For example, I do my recovery at about 74%, and longish runs pushing into the 80s. This morning was 14 miles at 82% max, but strong headwind meant I was pushing harder than normal.
It does seem low and normally they would be in and around 70-72% but this morning the HR just couldn't get high, the 66% is based on an average HR of 152, my max is 205 but the excel log I use calculate the % using your resting heart rate also. I'm taking todays HR as a good sign, an increase in fitness, I didn't really want to go much quicker as although my HR was in good shape my legs were knackered from last night.
In races I normally get the HR up to about 90% and last nights fast tempo sections averaged at 81%0 -
What time are you targeting for Rotterdam Woddle?0
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What time are you targeting for Rotterdam Woddle?
To be honest I havn't a clue and I don't really want to think about it. This year I felt I put myself under far too much pressure by calling a time out and not even getting close to it. I'll make my mind up in March and then keep it to myself0 -
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I got out late again for this one 9pm but it had to be done, I was a bold boy and had a chipper for dinner, the reason being I was too lazy to make dinner having helped my uncle to wall paper my sitting room and I can honestly say I hate wall papering and we still have half the room left. I got out for just over 5 at a very easy pace and I had a stitch for the first 2 miles of this run and then it went away, I couldn't really get my HR up for this, I probably needed to run faster but legs were tired, I think it's a definite sign of my improved fitness?
Anyway I came home to find out my sister had a healthy baby boy and all is well and I'm now an uncle for the first time
Average HR 66%
Week number|Total weekly miles|Weight|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|5.33||
6|0|||
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5k tonight at an easy pace, garmin still acting up, very annoying.
Average HR 70%
I took Tuesday off as a rest day but stupidly took Wednesday aswell, pure laziness but it has cleared up a few of my niggles and I felt fresh tonight which means I should be fresh for tomorrows fitness test.
So it's still 29 runs from 33 days. Looking forward to kicking it all off again next week with another 4 weeks hard again and hopefully bringing the mileage up to 60, tis the plan anyway.
Oh and I've decided no more racing this year.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Weight|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|8.43||
6|0|||
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Fair play to you woddle, your getting lots of miles in. Good luck with the test. Nice to take a test when all you have to do is turn up to pass. I know it'll be tough but you know what I mean. Looking forward to hearing how that goes. Well done on the weight too.....a nice bonus.0
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Well I had my fitness test today and it went quite well. I had a skinfold test aswell and to my shock horror my scales is obviously wrong as theirs has me at 78.6kg :eek: my height is 175.6 cm and I'll know exactly how fat I am next week
Then it was on to the main event,LT test, a warm up first, then I started running at 10kmph for 3 mins ten got my blood taken, then 11km for 3 mins and then blood taken again, they increased it by a km every 3 mins and I got up to 15km but halfway through that they stopped the test so obviously they could see the tipping point. I was told beforehand that the test would be stopped at some point between 85 and 90% effort. I had a mask on and hated it I found it hard to take deep breaths with it and I also wanted to spit at times but couldn't.
I rested up for a few minutes and had a cup of water before it was time for the VO2 max test, mask was put back on, no blood would be taken. We started at 10km again for a minute and then after every minute the speed was increased by 1kmph, I got up to 17kmph and managed to finish it but then I gave up, I was annoyed because I reckon I had another minute in me.
So I'll be sent the full details next week but for now I've been told that my LT pace is 14kmph which I've worked out to be approx 6:53 per mile and to improve my VO2 max I need to run at paces in or around 5:40 per mile. I was also told that my max HR was 194 (I think, can't remember) which is 11 bpm less than what I've been using, so I'm very eager to get the full results back next week. I've already learned alot today and on top of that I was told I need to lose weight and that I have slightly high blood pressure.
I really enjoyed the test and a big thanks to Romain and Ciara, Romain is a runner himself with a PB in the marathon of 2'37, the only problem is that he's frenchdamn you Henry, I'm still not over it.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Weight|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00||
6|0|||
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Hey Woddle, Interesting stuff there. Hope you don't mind me asking but where did you get this done and how much is it?
Cheers,
rigal0 -
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Hey Woddle, Interesting stuff there. Hope you don't mind me asking but where did you get this done and how much is it?
Cheers,
rigal
Hi Rigal, I got it done in UCD institute of sports, it cost 110 euro and I was there for about 2 and a half hours, I thought it was great value for money, I know trinity do it for cheaper but not too sure whats involved in their testing, I'll put the results up here when I get them, I'm expecting book loads of infoand as I said before he's a runner himself and I liked that fact.
And just to add they will do a discount for groups and I know theres a few other boardsies who have expressed an interest.0 -
Did you record the distance ran in your log?
I don't get too hung up on the sciences around running, but I can't help being interested in the results of this. Any idea of how they came to the figure of 5:40 per mile to increase your VO2 max is a percentage of your LT? Looking forward to hearing more.
I might even start up another log soon!0 -
Did you record the distance ran in your log?
I don't get too hung up on the sciences around running, but I can't help being interested in the results of this. Any idea of how they came to the figure of 5:40 per mile to increase your VO2 max is a percentage of your LT? Looking forward to hearing more.
I might even start up another log soon!
Hi Ike, I'll know the proper paces next week but the 5:40 was based on me running at my max which was 17kmph which converts to 5:40 a mile pace, now thats me doing the conversion not him as he wants to wait till next week when he goes over the data so he can give me proper paces but that 5:40 is the pace that you would do 400 meters at.
Your a dark horse now with no log, I have no idea how your doing, you probably going to whip me by a huge margin in our next race0 -
Interesting stuff. Pretty shocked about your weight-you don't look a pick over 78kg:D, seriously though, weight can fluctate masively through the day depending on hydration levels. The body fat results will be more important anyway...
All sounds v.interesting and I look forward to the results. I may consider doing this too. Why do they take blood/how much do they take?
edit. Just reading back there....are you definately out for the jingle bells 5k/aware 10k then?0 -
. The body fat results will be more important anyway.... All sounds v.interesting and I look forward to the results. I may consider doing this too. Why do they take blood/how much do they take?. edit. Just reading back there....are you definately out for the jingle bells 5k/aware 10k then?
Yep def out of these and am targeting a PB for new years day0 -
Well I had my fitness test today and it went quite well. I had a skinfold test aswell and to my shock horror my scales is obviously wrong as theirs has me at 78.6kg :eek: my height is 175.6 cm and I'll know exactly how fat I am next week
Then it was on to the main event,LT test, a warm up first, then I started running at 10kmph for 3 mins ten got my blood taken, then 11km for 3 mins and then blood taken again, they increased it by a km every 3 mins and I got up to 15km but halfway through that they stopped the test so obviously they could see the tipping point. I was told beforehand that the test would be stopped at some point between 85 and 90% effort. I had a mask on and hated it I found it hard to take deep breaths with it and I also wanted to spit at times but couldn't.
I rested up for a few minutes and had a cup of water before it was time for the VO2 max test, mask was put back on, no blood would be taken. We started at 10km again for a minute and then after every minute the speed was increased by 1kmph, I got up to 17kmph and managed to finish it but then I gave up, I was annoyed because I reckon I had another minute in me.
So I'll be sent the full details next week but for now I've been told that my LT pace is 14kmph which I've worked out to be approx 6:53 per mile and to improve my VO2 max I need to run at paces in or around 5:40 per mile. I was also told that my max HR was 194 (I think, can't remember) which is 11 bpm less than what I've been using, so I'm very eager to get the full results back next week. I've already learned alot today and on top of that I was told I need to lose weight and that I have slightly high blood pressure.
I really enjoyed the test and a big thanks to Romain and Ciara, Romain is a runner himself with a PB in the marathon of 2'37, the only problem is that he's frenchdamn you Henry, I'm still not over it.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Weight|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00||
6|0|||
Very interesting reading there woddle.
One thing I find very interesting is your VO2 max pace. That seems huge to me!
I would be absolutely killed doing 1000's at 5:40 pace. Did they go into more detail on this or will that come in the report?
Also did you take your previous max HR from your Garmin? How did they measure it? I reckon getting an accurate measure of your max HR is worth the price of admission alone.0 -
Running Bing wrote: »Very interesting reading there woddle.
One thing I find very interesting is your VO2 max pace. That seems huge to me!
I would be absolutely killed doing 1000's at 5:40 pace. Did they go into more detail on this or will that come in the report?
Also did you take your previous max HR from your Garmin? How did they measure it? I reckon getting an accurate measure of your max HR is worth the price of admission alone.
Hi RB
As regards 1000s at 5:40 a mile pace he did say 400s but he didn't go into much detail, he said it'll all be in the report which I'll stick up here. I'll be very interested in the VO2 max aswell cause I did give it loads which is unlike me cause normally I don't dig in.
, it's out by 11 ish beats because I kind of did the last part wrong. I had to stay on the treadmill for a minute at each kmph and when I got to 17kmph I just wanted to finish that but I didn't want to be moved up to 18, so they counted down 5,4,3,2,1 to say I had finished my 1 minute at 17kmph but after the countdown I just jumped off but in fact I should have kept going. So they have a max of 192 or 194 can't remember but I reckon it would have gone higher, I had previously based my maxHR on my garmin data which has given me highs of 203 and 205. The max I achieved today I've actually gone beyond on numerous occasions. I'll be doing the test again in mid February and I'll know what to expect, it was a bit of nerves and lack of concentration kicking in.0 -
Well after a near perfect Novembers training I went and ruined it last week by only running 3 days of the week, it was an easy week but still. Anyway it's still 158 miles for the month, my highest total since Feb.
Tonight was a treadmill run and I managed 5.5 miles but I ran 3 of them at my new lactate turnpoint pace 6:54, average HR was 175 and my max was 182 and I was aiming for 180-183 so not bad, It was only that it took me so long on the first interval to get the HR up but after that it was fine. While I'm still in base building mode I'm going to be doing cruise intervals and not tempo runs, so mile on, 3 mins recovery jog and go again. I should probably add that I've been doing this since week 3 but I had been doing a mile recovery but thats too long.
I'm going to aim for 10 weeks of base building before I start the real hard stuff.
Aim for this week 50 miles, same as week 4.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Weight|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00||
6|5.5|||
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This is just for my own records. There is another thread here with alot more info here http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055741913
Maximum oxygen uptake (VO2max):
. When expressed relative to your body weight your VO2max is 57
mlO2.kg-1.min-1. This value is excellent compared to untrained individuals of the same
age (3).
As VO2max is a good predictor of endurance performance and aerobic fitness, any
increase in this variable would likely enhance your performance. In order to improve
your VO2max you should consider eliciting VO2max during short term (~ 30 to 60 sec.)
speed sessions (running at 17 km.h-1 or 190+ beats per min. in your case). On the
other hand, since your VO2max is already high it is likely that any improvement in
aerobic fitness will be mainly represented by a significant shift towards higher speeds
in your lactate threshold and turnpoint and/or your running economy rather than a
great increase in VO2max.
Lactate threshold:
Blood lactate concentration ([La]) changes during VO2max tests is a measure
commonly used to set training intensities and monitor improvements 2.
In this report, lactate threshold is defined as a 1mmol.L-1 increase in [La] above the
value measured at rest. In your case, lactate threshold occurred at 11 km.h-1 (158-162
beats per min.). Lactate threshold is the transition between easy- to moderate-intensity
running exercises. In other words, it is the pace that you can sustain for a longduration
exercise. Exercising at this intensity constitutes the basis of your training
plan; it is often used as a recovery session (e.g, recovery between hard work-out at the
gym or high intensity running sessions). This is a pace that you should train at (or
slightly below) as a recovery session.
Lactate turnpoint:
Lactate turnpoint is defined as the second further increase or discontinuity in [La]
profile. This turnpoint generally occurs at about 4 mmol.L-1. In your case, your lactate
turnpoint has been observed at 14 km.h-1 (180-183 beats per min.).
Lastly, your [La] reached a maximum of 14.3 mmol.L-1, post-maximal test.
At your lactate turnpoint pace, you reach a non-steady state, corresponding to the
heavy-intensity domain. At this pace, an anaerobiosis takes place (i.e., a mismatch
between the oxygen demand and supply) leading to a metabolic acidosis (decrease in
pH, sub-products accumulation). At this point, in response to an increase in blood
lactate concentration, a pulmonary ventilation increase occurs to neutralise the
accumulated lactate (i.e., respiratory compensation for metabolic acidosis) (4).
Training at this intensity is helpful to: (i) develop your ability to sustain a high
percentage of VO2max (endurance concept), (ii) provoke a shift of your lactate
turnpoint corresponding working intensity to higher values and (iii) enable your body
to buffer (neutralise) the accumulated lactate and tolerate a higher metabolic acidosis.
In other words, it will be easier (not easy) for you to maintain your race pace.
In general, the lactate threshold and turnpoint paces match or are very close to the
aerobic and anaerobic threshold paces.
Training zones
Intensities Heart rate (Bpm) Running speed (Km.h-1)
Easy < 154 10
Steady 158-162 11
Heavy 180-183 14
Maximal 190+ 17
Intensities Heart rate (Bpm) Pace (Min per km)
Easy < 154 6’
Steady 158-162 5’27’’
Heavy 180-183 4’17’’
Maximal 190+ 3’32’’
Intensities Heart rate (Bpm) Pace (Min per mile)
Easy < 154 9’37’’
Steady 158-162 8’43’’
Heavy 180-183 6’51’’
Maximal 190+ 5’39’’
Institute for Sport and Health
Table 1. Physical and Physiological data
Age (y) 30
Weight (kg) 78.6
Height (cm) 175
O V &
2max (mlO2.kg-1.min-1) 57
Running speed at L threshold (km.h-1) 11
Heart rate at L threshold (beats.min-1) 158-162
Running speed at L turnpoint (km.h-1) 14
Heart rate at L turnpoint (beats.min-1) 180-183
Take home message.
_ Always listen to what your body says (e.g., “how do you respond to a new
type of exercise or a new way of training”).
_ Planning your training will avoid training “hard” everyday pushing the body
beyond its ability to adapt and leading to overtraining.
_ You should consider high intensity training, short 30-40 sec. runs and also
tempo training (training at lactate turnpoint pace) to develop your ability to
sustain a high percentage of VO2max (see Wednesday and Sunday sessions).
_ Since VO2max is affected by body composition (i.e., body fat and muscle mass),
you should consider decreasing your body fat.0 -
Fascinating stats Woddle.
One question I have is in relation to the suggested VO2 max sessions. The report recommends short term sessions - 30 to 60 secs. From what little I've learned I was of the opinion that you were better to get VO2 max reps beyond 2 mins. I assume the short sessions advised would have an equal recovery to start and as fitness develops you could drop that down to 75% or 50% of interval time - or am I way off the mark?
I'm a little surprised at the suggested 8'43 for your steady running. I'm guessing from your log that a session that averaged out at 160 would have you closer to 8 min miling than 8'43 miling.
I see your lactate threshold pace is at 180-183, which adds up pretty well with your own max HR figure (of over 200).
I'd say you can't wait to get stuck into some sessions based on those figures.0 -
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Fascinating stats Woddle.
One question I have is in relation to the suggested VO2 max sessions. The report recommends short term sessions - 30 to 60 secs. From what little I've learned I was of the opinion that you were better to get VO2 max reps beyond 2 mins. I assume the short sessions advised would have an equal recovery to start and as fitness develops you could drop that down to 75% or 50% of interval time - or am I way off the mark?
.
Thanks getfit and I was of the same understanding as yourself, my stance is based from info given by the book advanced marathoning, in the book they suggest intervals between 2 mins and 6 mins, I think the reason for 2 mins is that it takes at least that long for your heart rate to get in the zone.
Tonight I was going to do an easy run and try and stay at a constant HR of 150, I managed this for 5 miles at an average of 149 and the average pace equates to 9 min pace so 37 seconds faster than whats recommended but I'm not too bothered I knew this pace and the steady pace would be off but at least I have the suggested HR zones.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Cumulative Weight loss|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00|-2lb|
6|10.5|||
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Another 5 mile plus run, I feel I've yet to get going this week but the week is still young. Again I was hoping to do 1 mile LT reps with 1/2 mile easy jog for recovery but I gave up on the second one after about 3/4 of a mile so decided to change the session to run fast when you want and take as long as you like to recover, I still stayed aware of my target zone 180-183 and I managed an average HR of 175 with a max of 183 for a combined total of 2.5 miles @6'57 pace. The reason for changing the session was a late dinner that was still in the system.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Cumulative Weight loss|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00|-2lb|
6|16.00|||
7||||
8||||
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A nice 7 mile run with a few LT reps thrown in, this week was about practice, I tried the reps on the treadmill Mon and Wed and to hit my zones I paid alot of attention to the watch but todays run outside I didn't look at the watch and I went by feel and when I got home and checked it out on the PC I was glad to see that I hit the zones on feel alone.
I got a PM a few days ago commenting on my poor week last week, they reckon that jumping straight up to 50 from 40 might have tired me a little and I agree so I took yesterday off and the new plan is 40 for this week.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Cumulative Weight loss|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00|-2lb|
6|23.00|||
7||||
8||||
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A nice 7 mile run with a few LT reps thrown in, this week was about practice, I tried the reps on the treadmill Mon and Wed and to hit my zones I paid alot of attention to the watch but todays run outside I didn't look at the watch and I went by feel and when I got home and checked it out on the PC I was glad to see that I hit the zones on feel alone.
I got a PM a few days ago commenting on my poor week last week, they reckon that jumping straight up to 50 from 40 might have tired me a little and I agree so I took yesterday off and the new plan is 40 for this week.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Cumulative Weight loss|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00|-2lb|
6|23.00|||
7||||
8||||
It was a big jump alright.
I know a lot of people go by the 10% rule but I like to increase mileage every three weeks by the number of sessions Im doing....so if I run 6 times a week I'll increase mileage by 6 miles every three weeks.
Yes its a slow and gradual build up but it really lets you adjust to the increases and I can honestly say doing it that way I never feel like I'm struggling or pushing it mileage wise.0 -
Sat 5th
Just 3 miles easy.
I'm a little annoyed about this week as 26 miles makes it seem like a bad week but it wasn't, if I had done my lsr on the Sunday it would have been a great week but I just could not get out of bed, which is fairly unlike me.
Then on Monday I was all set to go out when the wife got in from work but the wife had the day from hell in work and asked me not to go, so I obliged. The good news is though due to this bad day in work she has now started her maternity leave early and theres no more excuses for me
Tue 8th
7.27 miles in 67'30 with Ultraman, very enjoyable and nice and easy
Wed 9th
7.27 miles in 57'04, same route as the day before but at a nice steady pace
Thur 10th
8.94 miles in 69'10, I feel a little indifferent about this run, a friend wanted to break 56 mins for his 8 mile route, quite a tough route. So I thought I would give it a blast with him, he ran 3'29 in DM so would be a nice tester for me. We started off far too quick with miles in 6'42 and 6'48, my garmin then turned off so I started messing with it and when I looked up my mate was getting away, I caught up but in the end told him to go on. I felt the pace was too fast and felt he would come back to me.
We got to a crossroads and he went through it 25 seconds ahead of me, he was lucky though, I wasn't as I couldn't get by, I got stuck for well over half a minute (Terenure cross road). I had never done this route before and when I did cross the road he was out of sight and what happened next was I got lost and ended up running an extra mile.
He finished his 8 miles in 55 and with that time on that course I don't think I ever would have caught him but for the next time, I think I'll taperand not have a late dinner. While being lost I started to lose motivation and when I hit 5 miles in 36 mins I just slowed down to a trot but I was still happy to hit that in 36 and I reckon if I had a 5 mile race this week I would run close to 33 so things are still looking up.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Cumulative Weight loss|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00|-2lb|
6|26.00||
7|23.47||
8|||
My stupid garmin is still acting up and now the HR is taking the plss0 -
You could use tonights runner as your tempo runner. Do a 2 mile warm before you meet him and then stay with him as long as you can.
Easier the day before though as that wouldnt have helped.
I see an improvement so keep it up.0 -
village runner wrote: »You could use tonights runner as your tempo runner. Do a 2 mile warm before you meet him and then stay with him as long as you can.
Easier the day before though as that wouldnt have helped.
I see an improvement so keep it up.
Your spot on VR, I was so lazy though, I could have warmed up by jogging to his house but just didn't fancy it, I certainly felt the last 3 miles of yesterdays run in the legs as they were done at good clip, lessons learned
I hope he's reading this as I'm fairly certain he's goin down next time, oh how I love the thrash talk0 -
Your spot on VR, I was so lazy though, I could have warmed up by jogging to his house but just didn't fancy it, I certainly felt the last 3 miles of yesterdays run in the legs as they were done at good clip, lessons learned
I hope he's reading this as I'm fairly certain he's goin down next time, oh how I love the thrash talk
I couldnt run 8 miles at 30 seconds faster a mile that my marathon pb and then go hard hard the following night. You done well to keep up as long as you did.
Keep up the good work. Nice to see you putting your times back on show. People reading the log have something to go on and you can then see it in black and white oyurself.0 -
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My legs were in bits yesterday so I decided to have a day off. Todays plan was 7 but after about 2 miles I needed the toilet so I stopped into my uncles house he wasn't there so I said I'd go to the pub around the corner but when I got there I didn't fancy sitting on a dirty pub toilet, so I cut the run short and started to head home, I was about half a mile from my house when I saw an attractive runner coming my way, so in went the belly and I said hello as I always do
, 2 seconds pass and I hear a shout she's calling my name so I turn back and it's a very old friend from about 9 years ago, now the problem was I still had to go to the toilet but for some strange reason I joined her for a bit instead of heading home to the toilet. The pain was torture, so when I left her I'd say I looked a right mess, the closer I got to my house the worse it got, nightmare. So it turned out to be 6.42 miles at an easy pace.
Week number|Total weekly miles|Cumulative Weight loss|
1|40.10|-1lb|
2|41.33|-1lb|
3|40.08|-2lb|
4|50.10|-3lb|
5|13.00|-2lb|
6|26.00||
7|29.89||
8|||
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