General sheep thread

Birdnuts

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I'm in favour of herbal leys and reducing chemical nitrogen use, but I have seen the opposite of what you state here.

We reseeded 4 acres over the past 3 years: 2 with perennial rye grass in 2018 and 2 with a 4-year-mix of herbal ley seeds in 2020. The PRG is as clean now as it was when it emerged first, but admittedly it's not getting any slurry and very little chemical fertiliser. In the herbal ley, the docks emerged with the other grass species. I'm managing it with spot-spraying (yes, I get the irony) and topping but it's certainly tempered my enthusiasm.

Only time will tell which works out better for us.

Nothing wrong with spot spraying during establishment. No 2 fields are alike and it might be usefull to test both for N levels since excessive N will continue to encourage dock/nettle growth post reseeding until the legume element kicks in

Lano Lynn

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

Maybe this is being Devils Advocate - but what is the reason for the Sheep Welfare scheme?
Like, what's the point of it?

Is there any way to see if there is enough money to cover the 2020 census numbers?

the sws is an poor apology for screwing over sheep sector relative to cattle at the time of fixing the single farm payment valuations 2002 ,
we the sheep sector were not getting extensevication premiums etc. the value of the ewe premium was cut to 22euro if i remember correctly Avril Doyle MEP fought hard to get 30 euro...
Joe walsh hated sheep and
bertie aherne was too busy offering to fly out to sort out a critical national emergency in saipan
but thats all history and we still have the value of our income stuck in the past
:mad:

MIKEKC

Lano Lynn wrote: »

the sws is an poor apology for screwing over sheep sector relative to cattle at the time of fixing the single farm payment valuations 2002 ,
we the sheep sector were not getting extensevication premiums etc. the value of the ewe premium was cut to 22euro if i remember correctly Avril Doyle MEP fought hard to get 30 euro...
Joe walsh hated sheep and
bertie aherne was too busy offering to fly out to sort out a critical national emergency in saipan
but thats all history and we still have the value of our income stuck in the past
:mad:

E22 per ewe, stocking rate 5 ewes per acre . This gives a sub of e110 per acre . Not bad money before profit from sheep are added.

Westernrock

Kevhog1988 wrote: »

Whats needed for a support?. Is there a support they sell similar to a scaffold jack?. or would it need to be a concrete support?.

No you’d need concrete beam that their supports sit on or a galvanised RSJ. This concrete slat or beam would sit across the tank perpendicular to the fibreglass underneath it then the fibreglass every 800mm and the slats clip onto the fibreglass beams then. Be sure to galvanise if your using steel supports we had one shed with mesh sheep slats sitting on painted 7x4 RSJ, rusted right through the 7inch web in 10-12 years and had to be replaced.

wrangler

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I'm in favour of herbal leys and reducing chemical nitrogen use, but I have seen the opposite of what you state here.

We reseeded 4 acres over the past 3 years: 2 with perennial rye grass in 2018 and 2 with a 4-year-mix of herbal ley seeds in 2020. The PRG is as clean now as it was when it emerged first, but admittedly it's not getting any slurry and very little chemical fertiliser. In the herbal ley, the docks emerged with the other grass species. I'm managing it with spot-spraying (yes, I get the irony) and topping but it's certainly tempered my enthusiasm.

Only time will tell which works out better for us.

I had to spot spray two acres in our hobby farm after reseeding to preserve the clover, had to walk it four times to spray for recurring nettles, there were thousands in what was, as I said, a clean sheep pasture.
Imagine if it was in a 20 acre field of herbal weeds

sandman30

Westernrock wrote: »

No you’d need concrete beam that their supports sit on or a galvanised RSJ. This concrete slat or beam would sit across the tank perpendicular to the fibreglass underneath it then the fibreglass every 800mm and the slats clip onto the fibreglass beams then. Be sure to galvanise if your using steel supports we had one shed with mesh sheep slats sitting on painted 7x4 RSJ, rusted right through the 7inch web in 10-12 years and had to be replaced.

Heard of galvanized supports for plastic slatss rotting very quickly in a piggery. Very dangerous as you can't see the rot as it's under the slats. Slurry is very corrosive, better with fibreglass. Have fibreglass supports here about 10 years, still perfect

Kevhog1988

sandman30 wrote: »

Heard of galvanized supports for plastic slatss rotting very quickly in a piggery. Very dangerous as you can't see the rot as it's under the slats. Slurry is very corrosive, better with fibreglass. Have fibreglass supports here about 10 years, still perfect

would you have a pic of one so i can understand how they work?

gazahayes

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

Interesting...
Where did you get them Gaza?

Local co-op here stocks them centenary

Fertility issues at tullamore demo farm.....could give a good insight into practical issues arising,if they can get to bottom of it

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/what-caused-the-dip-in-tullamore-farm-sheep-scanning-performance-597326

Westernrock

Kevhog1988 wrote: »

would you have a pic of one so i can understand how they work?

Photos aren’t great but in the close up you can see the fibreglass (white) sitting on the concrete that runs across the tank

Nekarsulm

sandman30 wrote: »

Heard of galvanized supports for plastic slatss rotting very quickly in a piggery. Very dangerous as you can't see the rot as it's under the slats. Slurry is very corrosive, better with fibreglass. Have fibreglass supports here about 10 years, still perfect

Would be a lot more salt and ammonia in pig slurry though,

farawaygrass

I’m gonna post this here for sheep farmers opinions.
I have been concentrating on sheep for the last few years but the whole dairy thing keeps niggling at the back of my mind. One week there’s no way I would go at it and the next it looks very tempting. It’s not just the money, I could give up the job and have a better family lifestyle, and wouldn’t mind the milkings.
Wrangler, I saw you said if any lad had a decent block of land he should think about dairying.
I read just there then that Ken and Brian matthews, who if I remember correctly you know, said they can make €850/ha gross margin. Now I understand they are the tops but it give something to aim for.
I’d have 40 ha in one block, although it’s narrow around the yard and opens up at the back.
I’m increasing sheep slowly but if I was to go to say 400 ewes I’d need a new shed, preferably slatted the way things are going with straw.
See the likes of that shed on Agriland today up north. House 300 ewes, shed cost €110k iirc.
If I was to do that would I be as well on to put it into dairy housing and parlour?
We’d have a few sheds as is, a three bay round roof shed with lean tos of each side, a three bay a roofed shed and a three bay back to back slatted shed for cattle in another yard.
With the dry bedded sheds as is I could house about 250 but that would be loose and letting them outside to feed meal.
Suppose I was always a bit cautious about investing so much in dairying and thought the bubble might burst, but it still seems to be going from strength to strength. Haven’t talked to anyone yet that regretted going into dairying either.
I’m rambling now, typing as I think I suppose. Any opinions would be very welcome.

Westernrock

Westernrock wrote: »

Photos aren’t great but in the close up you can see the fibreglass (white) sitting on the concrete that runs across the tank

Sorry photos didn’t load properly earlier

wrangler

farawaygrass wrote: »

I’m gonna post this here for sheep farmers opinions.
I have been concentrating on sheep for the last few years but the whole dairy thing keeps niggling at the back of my mind. One week there’s no way I would go at it and the next it looks very tempting. It’s not just the money, I could give up the job and have a better family lifestyle, and wouldn’t mind the milkings.
Wrangler, I saw you said if any lad had a decent block of land he should think about dairying.
I read just there then that Ken and Brian matthews, who if I remember correctly you know, said they can make €850/ha gross margin. Now I understand they are the tops but it give something to aim for.
I’d have 40 ha in one block, although it’s narrow around the yard and opens up at the back.
I’m increasing sheep slowly but if I was to go to say 400 ewes I’d need a new shed, preferably slatted the way things are going with straw.
See the likes of that shed on Agriland today up north. House 300 ewes, shed cost €110k iirc.
If I was to do that would I be as well on to put it into dairy housing and parlour?
We’d have a few sheds as is, a three bay round roof shed with lean tos of each side, a three bay a roofed shed and a three bay back to back slatted shed for cattle in another yard.
With the dry bedded sheds as is I could house about 250 but that would be loose and letting them outside to feed meal.
Suppose I was always a bit cautious about investing so much in dairying and thought the bubble might burst, but it still seems to be going from strength to strength. Haven’t talked to anyone yet that regretted going into dairying either.
I’m rambling now, typing as I think I suppose. Any opinions would be very welcome.

I used to straw bed ewes in a slatted shed, cleaned it out with a micro digger, have you included that and maybe convert to sheep slats as money becomes available.
We were consistently making 40 -50 profit per ewe ewe here so it's a numbers game , a neighbour has started sheep near here a few years now and is doing very well, but not the sort to divulge his profit but he's buillding a shed for 250 ewes this year.
While €850/ha or €85/ewe gross margin looks a good figure , you could have 50 +/ewe fixed costs

Siamsa Sessions

farawaygrass wrote: »

I’m gonna post this here for sheep farmers opinions.
I have been concentrating on sheep for the last few years but the whole dairy thing keeps niggling at the back of my mind. One week there’s no way I would go at it and the next it looks very tempting. It’s not just the money, I could give up the job and have a better family lifestyle, and wouldn’t mind the milkings.
Wrangler, I saw you said if any lad had a decent block of land he should think about dairying.
I read just there then that Ken and Brian matthews, who if I remember correctly you know, said they can make €850/ha gross margin. Now I understand they are the tops but it give something to aim for.
I’d have 40 ha in one block, although it’s narrow around the yard and opens up at the back.
I’m increasing sheep slowly but if I was to go to say 400 ewes I’d need a new shed, preferably slatted the way things are going with straw.
See the likes of that shed on Agriland today up north. House 300 ewes, shed cost €110k iirc.
If I was to do that would I be as well on to put it into dairy housing and parlour?
We’d have a few sheds as is, a three bay round roof shed with lean tos of each side, a three bay a roofed shed and a three bay back to back slatted shed for cattle in another yard.
With the dry bedded sheds as is I could house about 250 but that would be loose and letting them outside to feed meal.
Suppose I was always a bit cautious about investing so much in dairying and thought the bubble might burst, but it still seems to be going from strength to strength. Haven’t talked to anyone yet that regretted going into dairying either.
I’m rambling now, typing as I think I suppose. Any opinions would be very welcome.

I spent the last few months looking into converting to dairy (or re-converting in the case of our farm) and am 99% sure at this stage that I won't be going ahead.

Send me a PM and I'll give you my phone number if you want a chat.

There's a load of advice and cliches you'll hear but to really get a sense of it, you should try to:

(1) See if its feasible - look around the farm and see where the parlour will go, how paddocks will be set up, etc. Then do up a budget and see if the bank or Credit Union will loan you the money.

(2) If you "pass" the above stage, then imagine what a day in the life of a dairy farmer is like. What time will you milk in the morning? What time will you finish in the evening? Who will you ring to milk the cows if you're delayed someplace and won't be back til late? etc.

I put together this little website to help tease out different questions: https://sites.google.com/view/dairyconversion/home

It's not linked with any organisation and is completely anonymous. I just thought it might help others.

And as I said above, feel free to PM me and we can have a chat if you like.

Dickie10

farawaygrass wrote: »

I’m gonna post this here for sheep farmers opinions.
I have been concentrating on sheep for the last few years but the whole dairy thing keeps niggling at the back of my mind. One week there’s no way I would go at it and the next it looks very tempting. It’s not just the money, I could give up the job and have a better family lifestyle, and wouldn’t mind the milkings.
Wrangler, I saw you said if any lad had a decent block of land he should think about dairying.
I read just there then that Ken and Brian matthews, who if I remember correctly you know, said they can make €850/ha gross margin. Now I understand they are the tops but it give something to aim for.
I’d have 40 ha in one block, although it’s narrow around the yard and opens up at the back.
I’m increasing sheep slowly but if I was to go to say 400 ewes I’d need a new shed, preferably slatted the way things are going with straw.
See the likes of that shed on Agriland today up north. House 300 ewes, shed cost €110k iirc.
If I was to do that would I be as well on to put it into dairy housing and parlour?
We’d have a few sheds as is, a three bay round roof shed with lean tos of each side, a three bay a roofed shed and a three bay back to back slatted shed for cattle in another yard.
With the dry bedded sheds as is I could house about 250 but that would be loose and letting them outside to feed meal.
Suppose I was always a bit cautious about investing so much in dairying and thought the bubble might burst, but it still seems to be going from strength to strength. Haven’t talked to anyone yet that regretted going into dairying either.
I’m rambling now, typing as I think I suppose. Any opinions would be very welcome.

Depends on what your off farm job is ? If its pulling in big money with pensions etc wrapped up in it. You would be mad, if its a part time thing or a trade where your on raod at 6 am and dont really have passion for it then maybe through in your lot dairying. Think about your weekends away or matches in croke park or sun holidays , with drystock its easy set things up and your not tied to be there every evening. If you live for these days like i do then its abig commitment to have.
I have a block suitable for dairying but wouldnt dream of it. i love my off farm job too much, actually miss not being at it these days. plus i know nothing about dairying and am doing well in drystock at minute. so everyone is differeent

roosky

As wrangler said the figure of gross margin can be misleading and can give you a sense of false hope. When you include insurance, machinery and building repairs, machinery and building depreciation, casual labor, electricity and farm vehicle (car/jeep).....you would do very well to clear €50 a ewe....and I would be advising you to have that as your basis for working out how feasible the farm would be in sheep v dairy

OneMan37

A friend of mine always says the only time he was making real money in farming (outside REPS/GLAS) was when he was milking 20 odd head of dairy cattle. He now has dry stock, his land was broken and as the back roads became busier in the 00’s with cars 🚗 he got out. The monthly or weekly payment is tempting. If it gives you more family time and helps you leave a job you’ll not mad about, it’s at least wise to evaluate. Maybe you’re not a praying man, but my advice is to ponder this in prayer, God is a great silent friend with decisions like this, and He has never once led me on the incorrect path, when I’ve given Him the time to lead. He already knows where you and your family will be in 20 years time, all you have to do is reflect upon what He tells you in the depths of your heart.

weatherbyfoxer

roosky wrote: »

As wrangler said the figure of gross margin can be misleading and can give you a sense of false hope. When you include insurance, machinery and building repairs, machinery and building depreciation, casual labor, electricity and farm vehicle (car/jeep).....you would do very well to clear €50 a ewe....and I would be advising you to have that as your basis for working out how feasible the farm would be in sheep v dairy

i often wonder when people talk about the comparative average industrial wage do the include the same expenses the farm cover? take a car or maybe 2,house insurance,esb,vhi or whatever..€200 per week in these costs seems to be average in most peoples cases i have discussed it with.Now my understanding is average industrial wage is €600 per week after tax or €35k per year... take your fixed costs off that as mentioned..on 40 ha of decent owned ground with 400 ewe with €50 profit per ewe your looking at €20k with a modest glas/reps,sws,bps leaving €10k...just food for thought

have been thinking of the dairy route here myself..could milk 70 cows in a block beside the yard easily enough..would cost me in the region of €150k to convert half of which the selling off of current stock on the farm should more than cover and being in my early 30s id should have many years of farming left once the remain amount is paid off...all sounded good till i took a look at another angle...labour or relief milkers are near impossible to get around here and alot of relief milkers prefer bigger herds due to the fact of more cows miked per milking more money..another issue is what if you break a bone or get sick and have to lay low for a few weeks?..hard done with milking if you haven't farmily members involved...i think dairy is ideal for a setup of a father winding down son winding up on a farm or a family who are all involved on it but a mainly 1 man show with little support im not so sure

farawaygrass

wrangler wrote: »

I used to straw bed ewes in a slatted shed, cleaned it out with a micro digger, have you included that and maybe convert to sheep slats as money becomes available.
We were consistently making 40 -50 profit per ewe ewe here so it's a numbers game , a neighbour has started sheep near here a few years now and is doing very well, but not the sort to divulge his profit but he's buillding a shed for 250 ewes this year.
While €850/ha or €85/ewe gross margin looks a good figure , you could have 50 +/ewe fixed costs[/quote
At €50 profit per ewe and stocked 10 ewes/ha, that’s €500 profit per acre. Take dairying at say 7c/l profit @ 5500l/annum, @ 2.5 cows/ha, that’s €962.5/ha. I don’t think my figures are crazy there, and 7c/l would be modest enough the last few years from looking at profit monitors, average figures not the top.
Big difference there. To get the same profit of €500/ha as the sheep above but in milk, it would only require 3.6c/l profit.
On paper it seems to be a no brainer but am I missing something or anything.
The only people who seem to be constantly calling the dairy demise are people who non dairy farmers, or disgruntled beef men.
But at the same time if is a scenario that would need to be factored in. Environmental regulations are the big one and they will never be a real issue on sheep farms.
Prospects look good in dairying for the short to medium term too.

farawaygrass

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I spent the last few months looking into converting to dairy (or re-converting in the case of our farm) and am 99% sure at this stage that I won't be going ahead.

Send me a PM and I'll give you my phone number if you want a chat.

There's a load of advice and cliches you'll hear but to really get a sense of it, you should try to:

(1) See if its feasible - look around the farm and see where the parlour will go, how paddocks will be set up, etc. Then do up a budget and see if the bank or Credit Union will loan you the money.

(2) If you "pass" the above stage, then imagine what a day in the life of a dairy farmer is like. What time will you milk in the morning? What time will you finish in the evening? Who will you ring to milk the cows if you're delayed someplace and won't be back til late? etc.

I put together this little website to help tease out different questions: https://sites.google.com/view/dairyconversion/home

It's not linked with any organisation and is completely anonymous. I just thought it might help others.

And as I said above, feel free to PM me and we can have a chat if you like.

I did your survey. Great tool.
I’ll pm you

farawaygrass

Dickie10 wrote: »

Depends on what your off farm job is ? If its pulling in big money with pensions etc wrapped up in it. You would be mad, if its a part time thing or a trade where your on raod at 6 am and dont really have passion for it then maybe through in your lot dairying. Think about your weekends away or matches in croke park or sun holidays , with drystock its easy set things up and your not tied to be there every evening. If you live for these days like i do then its abig commitment to have.
I have a block suitable for dairying but wouldnt dream of it. i love my off farm job too much, actually miss not being at it these days. plus i know nothing about dairying and am doing well in drystock at minute. so everyone is differeent

I was of the opinion of not wanting to be tied to the farm either a few years ago, but it seems when all feeding, odd jobs are done, nearly every weekend Is accounted for, plus I have a full time job on the side which is grossing 600 a week, which I would love to drop as I’m constantly under time pressure. Have a young family too and maybe it’s a pipe dream but would love to spend more time with them on the the farm. Especially as they get older.
If milking I could be finished by 5.30 say so still have summer matches to go to etc. Not big on overnight stays as it as, but I know where you are coming from. I feel with sheep and beef you are committed to the farm daily for 6 months.

farawaygrass

OneMan37 wrote: »

A friend of mine always says the only time he was making real money in farming (outside REPS/GLAS) was when he was milking 20 odd head of dairy cattle. He now has dry stock, his land was broken and as the back roads became busier in the 00’s with cars 🚗 he got out. The monthly or weekly payment is tempting. If it gives you more family time and helps you leave a job you’ll not mad about, it’s at least wise to evaluate. Maybe you’re not a praying man, but my advice is to ponder this in prayer, God is a great silent friend with decisions like this, and He has never once led me on the incorrect path, when I’ve given Him the time to lead. He already knows where you and your family will be in 20 years time, all you have to do is reflect upon what He tells you in the depths of your heart.

I would have a great belief in the big Man above having a grand plan for us, and it’s comforting to take this view too. Thank you

farawaygrass

weatherbyfoxer wrote: »

i often wonder when people talk about the comparative average industrial wage do the include the same expenses the farm cover? take a car or maybe 2,house insurance,esb,vhi or whatever..€200 per week in these costs seems to be average in most peoples cases i have discussed it with.Now my understanding is average industrial wage is €600 per week after tax or €35k per year... take your fixed costs off that as mentioned..on 40 ha of decent owned ground with 400 ewe with €50 profit per ewe your looking at €20k with a modest glas/reps,sws,bps leaving €10k...just food for thought

have been thinking of the dairy route here myself..could milk 70 cows in a block beside the yard easily enough..would cost me in the region of €150k to convert half of which the selling off of current stock on the farm should more than cover and being in my early 30s id should have many years of farming left once the remain amount is paid off...all sounded good till i took a look at another angle...labour or relief milkers are near impossible to get around here and alot of relief milkers prefer bigger herds due to the fact of more cows miked per milking more money..another issue is what if you break a bone or get sick and have to lay low for a few weeks?..hard done with milking if you haven't farmily members involved...i think dairy is ideal for a setup of a father winding down son winding up on a farm or a family who are all involved on it but a mainly 1 man show with little support im not so sure

Good point. I would be mid 30’s myself, no father or siblings to help out, wife is working in the public sector (not teaching unfortunately!!!) but have 3 young children, 7 and under.
I see a lot of younger college guys, that kinda age, and they are mad for relief milking. It would be nice to build a relationship with some though. 100 cows would definitely need help at times.
I hear what you are saying about the 10k the farm would leave at 400 ewes, but that’s still a lot of work on top of a full time job, even say for ten months of the year. Don’t want to be missing kids matches etc either. Hard to find a balance every way I suppose. But I do like sheep , have a gra for them, and was brought up with them. Love the technical side of dairying too and how everything is measured and evaluated.

Siamsa Sessions

Odd case here this morning

Ewes are due to start lambing on 11-Feb and a few are stating to show little dugs but none are starting to swell up. So, just going thru the routine now feeding them.

But this morning I noticed a hogget with her water blister out. Fed them as normal in the yard and then put her in a pen and handled her. The blister was now after breaking.

I couldn’t swear to it but I’m fairly sure her cervix was still closed when I put my hand in. I could get my hand/arm in a bit and move it around but I couldn’t feel a leg or head anyplace. I didn’t push too hard obviously but I had a good feel around all the same.

She’s not a big hogget herself and isn’t too big with the lambs either.

I marked her and left her into the main pen with the rest of them again. And I’ll check her again in an hour.

Anyone come across this in a ewe that’s at least 2 weeks out from lambing?

wrangler

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Odd case here this morning

Ewes are due to start lambing on 11-Feb and a few are stating to show little dugs but none are starting to swell up. So, just going thru the routine now feeding them.

But this morning I noticed a hogget with her water blister out. Fed them as normal in the yard and then put her in a pen and handled her. The blister was now after breaking.

I couldn’t swear to it but I’m fairly sure her cervix was still closed when I put my hand in. I could get my hand/arm in a bit and move it around but I couldn’t feel a leg or head anyplace. I didn’t push too hard obviously but I had a good feel around all the same.

She’s not a big hogget herself and isn’t too big with the lambs either.

I marked her and left her into the main pen with the rest of them again. And I’ll check her again in an hour.

Anyone come across this in a ewe that’s at least 2 weeks out from lambing?

Yea, I've seen that, where she has put out the water bag and done no more,
If you think she's lambing Oxytocin might help to open her up. Give here the oxytocin then leave and try her in half an hour, plenty of lube and plenty of time . first one finger then two and so on, but I've seen cases where they never open up and I just had to leave her, cervix never breaks down, lamb rotten so no hope of ceasarean, bring her to a vet if she doesn't progress,
After all that the lambs lungs mightn't be developed

weatherbyfoxer

farawaygrass wrote: »

Good point. I would be mid 30’s myself, no father or siblings to help out, wife is working in the public sector (not teaching unfortunately!!!) but have 3 young children, 7 and under.
I see a lot of younger college guys, that kinda age, and they are mad for relief milking. It would be nice to build a relationship with some though. 100 cows would definitely need help at times.
I hear what you are saying about the 10k the farm would leave at 400 ewes, but that’s still a lot of work on top of a full time job, even say for ten months of the year. Don’t want to be missing kids matches etc either. Hard to find a balance every way I suppose. But I do like sheep , have a gra for them, and was brought up with them. Love the technical side of dairying too and how everything is measured and evaluated.

I honestly reckon its possible pull €30k per year from 400 ewes and payments..with the labour side of things it is surly possible get an agri student or veterinary student in the peak of lambing...rest of the year you would be quiet enough with just dosing,shearing and generally management,...not trying to put you or anyone off dairying there is definitely money to be made but as an old farmer said to me before.."the grass is greener on the other side till you jump the fence but can get back when the greener grass is gone"

White Clover

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Odd case here this morning

Ewes are due to start lambing on 11-Feb and a few are stating to show little dugs but none are starting to swell up. So, just going thru the routine now feeding them.

But this morning I noticed a hogget with her water blister out. Fed them as normal in the yard and then put her in a pen and handled her. The blister was now after breaking.

I couldn’t swear to it but I’m fairly sure her cervix was still closed when I put my hand in. I could get my hand/arm in a bit and move it around but I couldn’t feel a leg or head anyplace. I didn’t push too hard obviously but I had a good feel around all the same.

She’s not a big hogget herself and isn’t too big with the lambs either.

I marked her and left her into the main pen with the rest of them again. And I’ll check her again in an hour.

Anyone come across this in a ewe that’s at least 2 weeks out from lambing?

Could be breach too. I have seen them put out the water bag and not make any progress then. When breach the cervix may not dialate fully. If you're checking her again, check for a tail.

Kevhog1988

weatherbyfoxer wrote: »

I honestly reckon its possible pull €30k per year from 400 ewes and payments..with the labour side of things it is surly possible get an agri student or veterinary student in the peak of lambing...rest of the year you would be quiet enough with just dosing,shearing and generally management,...not trying to put you or anyone off dairying there is definitely money to be made but as an old farmer said to me before.."the grass is greener on the other side till you jump the fence but can get back when the greener grass is gone"

30k net or gross?

weatherbyfoxer

Kevhog1988 wrote: »

30k net or gross?

net.