General sheep thread

greysides

https://www.facebook.com/wicklowuplandscouncil/videos/252385628755083/

Willfarman

Lambman wrote: »

Neighbour took a lend off one my rams for hoggets he's 4 tipped outta 6 in 2 hours... lucky timing or would u expect repeats I always notice hoggets repeating.

My neighbor spent what i class as barbarious money on prize winning hoggets.. doubly barbaric money on a very nice Texel ram and was planning a romance for his elite flock in 3 weeks time.. two of my rough common rams broke into his comely maidens last week.. a few hours. I wonder with trepidation how many illegitimate wooly headed vendeens are going to appear next February!

Siamsa Sessions

Was at a farmer rep meeting the other night and the guy from the sheep committee said an extra 5 Euro per ewe was on the table for the Sheep Welfare Scheme in next week’s budget.

Anyone else hear something similar?

I’m going to email the 4 TDs in our area today anyway and tell them tis necessary. They might then Google “sheep welfare scheme” to see what it is, if nothing else!

Buford T. Justice XIX

An interesting post on worm dosing, if you can enlarge the photo in it.
https://twitter.com/PallasTb/status/1048329847125073920?s=19

Green farmer

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

An interesting post on worm dosing, if you can enlarge the photo in it.
https://twitter.com/PallasTb/status/1048329847125073920?s=19

Got results back from samples send away here on my closed flock. Was delighted, got a 100% kill on the basic white dose. Hope to test the other two groups next year, but so far so good.

greysides

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

An interesting post on worm dosing, if you can enlarge the photo in it.

Some interesting points in that article.

The comment that 28-30 day dosing is necessary is in contradiction to the best local advice:

Treatment of lambs
Lambs are often treated frequently to eliminate the negative effects of gastrointestinal parasitism and ensure high growth rates.

A number of strategies can be used to reduce the selection pressure for AR when treating lambs.

*Research carefully the need for preventive anthelmintic treatment for nematodirosis. Where farm and field histories suggest that the risk is significant, consider using 1-BZ or 2-LV anthelmintics instead of 3-MLs. Check 1-BZ effectiveness by a drench test 9-10 days post-treatment.

*Use FEC monitoring to help predict the need for treatment against T. circumcincta and Trichostrongylus spp.

*On farms where lamb treatments have been at very high frequency, such as every three weeks, explore strategies to extend the period between treatment to four or five weeks, or more.

*Look for management strategies which avoid the build-up of infectivity from mid-season. Avoid frequent treatment of lambs on the same fields as those where ewes were suppressively treated during lactation because there will be low numbers of larvae from unselected parasites and AR can be expected to develop more quickly.

Ditto the opinion of FECs:

FEC monitoring to optimise the timing of anthelmintic use
FEC monitoring provides information about the worm status of a flock of sheep and can help in the decision about the need for treatment with anthelmintics. If grazing sheep have high FECs, and the faecal samples have been collected appropriately, one can safely assume that worm burdens are high and that treatment is justified. Unfortunately the corollary is not always true and low FECs require careful interpretation.

It would also surprise me if there wasn't triple resistance on some farms in Ireland already given the current prevalences of resistance.

Green farmer

greysides wrote: »

Some interesting points in that article.

The comment that 28-30 day dosing is necessary is in contradiction to the best local.

You’d be surprised. Dosed about 5 weeks ago. Got the 100% kill, as per results. All was good, then roll on 4-5 weeks and the lambs are back squirting out grass, find some looking weak and one dies. I bring them back in and dose again, with a alternative color worm dose. No more deaths and the squirting is stopping. Only thing I can conclude is mild weather in the last week or two caused another hatching of eggs or the previous white dose killed fluke that were over semi mature but missed out on the young immature fluke. Roll on the few weeks and the need was there to kill the previously missed fluke, that were now mature enough to kill. Either way I had the need to go every few weeks at this time of year.

wrangler

Green farmer wrote: »

You’d be surprised. Dosed about 5 weeks ago. Got the 100% kill, as per results. All was good, then roll on 4-5 weeks and the lambs are back squirting out grass, find some looking weak and one dies. I bring them back in and dose again, with a alternative color worm dose. No more deaths and the squirting is stopping. Only thing I can conclude is mild weather in the last week or two caused another hatching of eggs or the previous white dose killed fluke that were over semi mature but missed out on the young immature fluke. Roll on the few weeks and the need was there to kill the previously missed fluke, that were now mature enough to kill. Either way I had the need to go every few weeks at this time of year.

There has been a big increase in worms in the last few weeks, so scouring from worms wouldn't be unusual after five weeks, but we had them scouring from the lush grass lately and no worms. .
Pity you didn't PM the lamb, white dose rate needs to be doubled to kill mature fluke, be surprised if it was fluke, it's early for it especially after the drought

wrangler

greysides wrote: »

Some interesting points in that article.

The comment that 28-30 day dosing is necessary is in contradiction to the best local advice:



Ditto the opinion of FECs:





It would also surprise me if there wasn't triple resistance on some farms in Ireland already given the current prevalences of resistance.

It's looking now as if mixed grazing for sheep is not just an advantage but a necessity

greysides

Green Farmer, I don't know where 'your own little world ' is located but unless it's Donegal or nearby counties, given results from the factory, I wouldn't think your problem was fluke. From what I've seen it's only really kicking off there now.
The 'local' advice would be to monitor with FECs and dose accordingly. That might result in 4 week intervals or more but you'd try to catch them a bit earlier than by eye.

greysides

wrangler wrote: »

It's looking now as if mixed grazing for sheep is not just an advantage but a necessity

Some action needs to be taken other than relying purely on dosing. Grazing will have to be managed with worm levels a lot more in mind. Mixing sheep with cattle or tillage. Using cull ewes to clean grazing used earlier by ewes with lambs. Reseeds, silage aftermath. Special grazing/ forbs. Whatever.

Green farmer

wrangler wrote: »

There has been a big increase in worms in the last few weeks, so scouring from worms wouldn't be unusual after five weeks, but we had them scouring from the lush grass lately and no worms. .
Pity you didn't PM the lamb, white dose rate needs to be doubled to kill mature fluke, be surprised if it was fluke, it's early for it especially after the drought

I get p.m’s done regularly enough alright, but I just didn’t want to wait 2-3 weeks before taking any action, so just blanket dosed the flock to stop any more losses. Appears to have worked anyway.

Lambman

Can your vet not do the post mortem and let u know within a hour that the case here?

Green farmer

Lambman wrote: »

Can your vet not do the post mortem and let u know within a hour that the case here?

Don’t know, I usually send them to the lab and they do all the tests.

Lambman

If you think flukes the problem hardly worth sending till lab when vet can tell you?

wrangler

Lambman wrote: »

If you think flukes the problem hardly worth sending till lab when vet can tell you?

The lab here costs less than €25 including disposal, whats the vet charging and by right he should send off samples to the lab if he's doing a proper PM

Lambman

Think it's in around that money wrangler aswell... what will lab tell u that vet can't? Not being cheeky just never sent any till lab before.

Green farmer

Lambman wrote: »

Think it's in around that money wrangler aswell... what will lab tell u that vet can't? Not being cheeky just never sent any till lab before.

I think the lab does the visual inspection like the vet but also tests for microscopic things as you get an interim report followed by a final report a week or two later.

greysides

Lambman wrote: »

Can your vet not do the post mortem and let u know within a hour that the case here?

Vet would only be of use with fluke due to the size of the worms.

wrangler

Lambman wrote: »

Think it's in around that money wrangler aswell... what will lab tell u that vet can't? Not being cheeky just never sent any till lab before.

Our vet would give us samples from the animal so I still have to bring to the lab for microbiology and histology, so obviously he can't do a complete PM. so I still have to pay the knackery and vet and lab.
Like if that lamb wasn't worms or fluke what was it, with the cold mornings it can be a clostridial, next cold morning could be three dead lambs.
My motto is never waste a dead sheep, we have a very good Lab though and I don't praise the public service too often.
Drop them in for PM for €21 or drop them into the knackery for €20

greysides

Wrangler, which lab is near you?

greysides

I use Kilkenny RVL but their existence is under threat. Hard to know how they could be replaced. The CVL in Dublin, Backweston, is too far in practical terms.

wrangler

greysides wrote: »

Wrangler, which lab is near you?

Athlone, very convenient. 25mls from here, knackery is 12 mls.

Advantage of living in the centre of the country

Green farmer

Way it works around here is, I drop it directly to department lab for €5 but your vet has to book you in. Report goes back to vet who rings you with results. Vets fee for involvement in process is €20. The alternative is call out the Knackery for €40. Some times you don’t just have time to drive to the lab though and go down the knackery route.

Westernrock

Green farmer wrote: »

Way it works around here is, I drop it directly to department lab for €5 but your vet has to book you in. Report goes back to vet who rings you with results. Vets fee for involvement in process is €20. The alternative is call out the Knackery for €40. Some times you don’t just have time to drive to the lab though and go down the knackery route.

The lab invoices your vet for tests they carry out, the €5 is a carcass disposal fee. Vet then passes charge from lab onto you.

Green farmer

Westernrock wrote: »

The lab invoices your vet for tests they carry out, the €5 is a carcass disposal fee. Vet then passes charge from lab onto you.

Ah fair enough. I though the vet got the €20. Either way, it’s a great service for small money. Just hard to always get the sheep to the lab within a reasonable time frame, as the evidence deteriorates the longer you leave it.

Westernrock

Green farmer wrote: »

Ah fair enough. I though the vet got the €20. Either way, it’s a great service for small money. Just hard to always get the sheep to the lab within a reasonable time frame, as the evidence deteriorates the longer you leave it.

+1
it’s priceless information that can be gained if acted on in time, often hear farmers complain they got no/poor results from the lab but it’s usually because the animal was dead too long before they got it in!

Willfarman

greysides wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/wicklowuplandscouncil/videos/252385628755083/

Prime time had the piece about Lyme disease last week.

Bleating Lamb

Bought ten ewe lambs on 1st Sept and gave them first Hep P Plus injection that day.....only realized there tonight they need 2nd shot asap,will be Sat before I can do them,that would be 44 days since first shot.So 2 days over 6 week limit,hopefully they would still be covered properly??
Appreciate anyone’s thoughts good or bad:)

greysides

Bleating Lamb wrote: »

Bought ten ewe lambs on 1st Sept and gave them first Hep P Plus injection that day.....only realized there tonight they need 2nd shot asap,will be Sat before I can do them,that would be 44 days since first shot.So 2 days over 6 week limit,hopefully they would still be covered properly??
Appreciate anyone’s thoughts good or bad:)

Be fine. The immune system doesn't work to absolutes..