The Truth about Obesity

Hammer89 · 06-01-2017 1:08pm

Tactic 36: Lie to yourself by saying that the pig who gave his life for your breakfast roll died happily and in his sleep.

06-01-2017 1:10pm

I'd love some coco pops now

Hammer89 · 06-01-2017 1:12pm

Tactic 37: Lie to yourself and pretend that the monkey in the Coco Pops ad did those commercials willingly and got paid well.

learn_more · 07-01-2017 5:11am

What I have gotten from the responses to my OP about the Obesity Crisis:

1 Noone wan't to deal with it
2 Anyone who mentions it, has a some kind of hate of 'fat people', it's all just body fascism
3 The reason for obesity is largely to do with mental issues
4 The Obesity crisis can't be tackled because mental issues can't be resolved
5 People with mental issues know noting about food content because their mental disability specifically restricts their brain from upstanding such things.
6 If you have a mental health problem, you cant stop yourself from eating junk food, even if you do actually fully understand the consequences.
7 If you have a mental health issue, it means you have to feed your children junk food as well, despite the fact they don't have any mental health issues

======================================

The Reality

1. The percentage of people who are overweight as a results of serious mental issues is minuscule in comparison to the percentage of people who are either fat or obese

2. Being overweight in a young persons life, especially a childs, causes mental issues.

3. Most overweight adults who have mental issues have mental issues as a direct result of being unhealthy, not least because of the body image problem.Otherwise, where did this sudden huge increase in mental health issues come from ?

4. The best way to avoid mental health issues is to be as healthy as you can, and that includes regular cardiovascular exercise, as a necessity. It's not just about heart and lung health, it's to do with your brain as well.

5. The result of unhealthy eating when our youngsters are adults, is going to be huge. It's going to have a hugely negative effect on our society and our economy. It is a much bigger crisis than terrorism or global warming.

======================================

@KERSPLAT! I have hardly had anyone on this thread support a single word I said ( not surprisingly re obesity) , so if you will forgive me, I know I am on my own here, but I don't think I'm being a dick. I have been insulted left right and centre, and I think I've been quite contained in my responses.

@Zillah seems to be the only person who talks any sense re diet. And I haven't seen anyone on this thread support him either. That really sums up the general attitude for me really.

07-01-2017 5:30am

learn_more wrote: »

3. Most overweight adults who have mental issues have mental issues as a direct result of being unhealthy, not least because of the body image problem.Otherwise, where did this sudden huge increase in mental health issues come from ?

I'm a great fan of the whole "put down the cake, get out and run" attitude.

On the other hand, there is a huge confusion between being obese and the health issues, and being fat and the appearance issues. You only have to see the number of gyms and personal trainers now that don't seem to even bother with referring to health or fitness, the ads are all based on the "body/slim/abs/looks" angle, which I think actually reinforces the problem, as if having a toned gym body equates to happiness.

Either way, I would take issue with the above point, the increase in mental health issues may be due to a vast array of issues, obviously an increase in diagnoses of mental health issues for starters...

Chiparus · 07-01-2017 5:56am

Being slightly "overweight" may be healthier than being "underweight".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obesity_paradox

Hammer89 · 07-01-2017 5:59am

learn_more wrote: »

Most overweight adults who have mental issues have mental issues as a direct result of being unhealthy.

Their mental health deteroriates as a result of their eating habits, of course, but you must consider the possibility that there is likely underlying mental health, confidence or self-esteem issues which prompt the over-eating in the first place.

We know this is probably the case because over-eating is not a normal behaviour and people of sound mental health do not over eat on a chronic level. It's a bit like claiming people who self harm are grand before they start slicing their forearms, and claiming that only then do the mental health issues start. No. The behaviour happens because of deeper problems which exist before the issues manifests itself in the form of cutting or over eating.

Obesity is the result of chronic over-eating, but over-eating in itself is a result of something else and that 'something else' is usually a pretty sad story, so have a heart.

learn_more · 07-01-2017 7:48am

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm a great fan of the whole "put down the cake, get out and run" attitude.

On the other hand, there is a huge confusion between being obese and the health issues, and being fat and the appearance issues. You only have to see the number of gyms and personal trainers now that don't seem to even bother with referring to health or fitness, the ads are all based on the "body/slim/abs/looks" angle, which I think actually reinforces the problem, as if having a toned gym body equates to happiness.

Either way, I would take issue with the above point, the increase in mental health issues may be due to a vast array of issues, obviously an increase in diagnoses of mental health issues for starters...

TACTIC 17

If you take up a healthy lifestyle then one can never do or eat anything unhealthy. It's either all of one and none of the other, or the other way round.

You talk about confusion but your deliberately obfuscating the issue of obesity, general health, and happiness. This thread is about obesity. It's not about general fitness, or muscle building. There is a fitness forum here for that.

I have no idea why you think a gym advertising six pack abs contributes to obesity. A gym is a private enterprise that provides one with equipment that most would not be able to sustain at home, for those that want it. No one has to go to a gym to not eat junk food. Sorry if that sounds really complicated but it's actually quite simple.

I have to say I'm getting really fed up with those who talk about obesity as if it's an 'image' problem. Image is the last of peoples worries if your a/obese or b /unhealthy, especially if it starts from a very young age.

learn_more · 07-01-2017 7:54am

Hammer89 wrote: »

Their mental health deteroriates as a result of their eating habits, of course, but you must consider the possibility that there is likely underlying mental health, confidence or self-esteem issues which prompt the over-eating in the first place.

We know this is probably the case because over-eating is not a normal behaviour and people of sound mental health do not over eat on a chronic level. It's a bit like claiming people who self harm are grand before they start slicing their forearms, and claiming that only then do the mental health issues start. No. The behaviour happens because of deeper problems which exist before the issues manifests itself in the form of cutting or over eating.

Obesity is the result of chronic over-eating, but over-eating in itself is a result of something else and that 'something else' is usually a pretty sad story, so have a heart.

What nonsense. Overeat on vegetables and see how fat you'll get. Why is it that when ppl overeat, it's never on healthy food, it's always on junk food.

Edit: I am fully aware of the mental condition of 'over-eating'. However to suggest that that is reason why the vast majority of people are overweight is nothing but another tactic.

07-01-2017 8:08am

learn_more wrote: »

TACTIC 17

If you take up a healthy lifestyle then one can never do or eat anything unhealthy. It's either all of one and none of the other, or the other way round.

You talk about confusion but your deliberately obfuscating the issue of obesity, general health, and happiness. This thread is about obesity. It's not about general fitness, or muscle building. There is a fitness forum here for that.

I have no idea why you think a gym advertising six pack abs contributes to obesity. A gym is a private enterprise that provides one with equipment that most would not be able to sustain at home, for those that want it. No one has to go to a gym to not eat junk food. Sorry if that sounds really complicated but it's actually quite simple.

I have to say I'm getting really fed up with those who talk about obesity as if it's an 'image' problem. Image is the last of peoples worries if your a/obese or b /unhealthy, especially if it starts from a very young age.

Someone missed the point, and rather spectacularly.

I do like the whole "there is a fitness forum, sorry if this is complicated but this is simple, I'm fed up" stuff. You'll really charm people over to your pov. Though you may have to try to understand the points made by others first and maybe not harangue posters.

Sorry if that sounds really complicated but it's actually quite simple.

learn_more · 07-01-2017 8:45am

Deleted User wrote: »

Someone missed the point, and rather spectacularly.

I do like the whole "there is a fitness forum, sorry if this is complicated but this is simple, I'm fed up" stuff. You'll really charm people over to your pov. Though you may have to try to understand the points made by others first and maybe not harangue posters.

Sorry if that sounds really complicated but it's actually quite simple.

Ok. Which point was it you made that I missed ?

I think I understood your point perfectly well and my response to your point was something you didn't like to hear.

I think that's why you have responded in such a snarky manner, without explaining where your coming from.

In case that isn't correct, I ask you again, what point is it you made that you think I missed ?

And just in case your wondering, I don't think for second that the vast majority of obesity cases are due to mental health issues.

dexter_morgan · 07-01-2017 9:00am

learn_more wrote: »

Tactic 1 again. Playing Dumb.

The word macros has only 5 letters, and it has a very simple meaning in terms of food content. But I wil try use sht r wds frm now on.

Last time I checked, the word macros had 6 letters! If you are going to mock and ridicule other peoples posts, at least try to get your own correct.

learn_more · 07-01-2017 9:04am

dexter_morgan wrote: »

Last time I checked, the word macros had 6 letters! If you are going to mock and ridicule other peoples posts, at least try to get your own correct.

I know but I deliberately said 5 so as not to worry anyone who can't count beyond the number of digits on one hand. I didn't think anyone would notice, obviously your more intelligent that I thought.

Advbrd · 07-01-2017 9:06am

learn_more wrote: »

I know but I deliberately said 5 so as not to worry anyone who can't count beyond the number of digits on one hand. I didn't think anyone would notice, obviously your more intelligent that I thought.

We all believe that oh great superior being.
You could also learn the difference between your and you're.

mansize · 07-01-2017 9:07am

This is my third petit dejunier in Paris this morning.

I eat because I'm unhappy, I'm unhappy because I eat, it's a vicious cycle... sorry, I farted

learn_more · 07-01-2017 9:16am

Advbrd wrote: »

We all believe that oh great superior being.
You could also learn the difference between your and you're.

There is noting like spelling lessons that add to a debate. I'm absolutely certain the mod's would agree and won't pull you're up on it.

TACTIC 18

People who are bad spellers should not comment on the obesity crisis.

Advbrd · 07-01-2017 9:18am

learn_more wrote: »

There is noting like spelling lessons that add to a debate. I'm absolutely certain the mod's would agree and won't pull you're up on it.

TACTIC 18

People who are bad spellers should not comment on the obesity crisis.

And the nonsense goes on. Is that tactic 19?

ford2600 · 07-01-2017 9:43am

https://goo.gl/images/MCT8BN

Take this random image of an infant and give him 20 years of similar overfeeding and what chance does he have? 20 years of ingrained bad habits, metabolic damage (leptin resistance, insulin sensitivity, dysfunctional gut microbiota etc etc) a message which boils down to "eat less move more you fat bastard" isn't going to work for him in all probability.

In all likelihood for lots of infants born today in the developed world the damage starts in the womb with lots of the metabolic dysfunction in the mother inherited by child. 10 years ago I worked in a professional capacity with midwifes assessing their work from an ergonomic point of view; the big issue they highlighted (other than understaffing) was the increasing size of your average Irish mother. They all dreamed of having all Polish patients!

Most people who diet, in the long term fail. We are talking 80-90% here. Even our leading obesity clinic admit this; Dr O'Shea's colleague was recently on Newstalk and openly admitted as much.

If the infant above reached 30 with a BMI of 35 is he a fat lazy bastard or just a young man with a dysfunction in how his body regulates bodyfat due to 30 years exposure to obesogenic environment. If a human has a difficult with how they regulate their level of sodium/potassium/iodine do we call them sick and treat them accordingly? Why is bodyfat so different?

I say this as someone who is effortlessly lean at 41. Why is it easy for me but hard for lots of others? If I grew up like a typical obeses teenager in a deprived area what would I be like now at 41?

To quote True Detective "start asking the right fcuking questions"

Wibbs · 07-01-2017 9:59am

ford2600 wrote: »

Take this random image of an infant and give him 20 years of similar overfeeding and what chance does he have?

That right there is child abuse IMHO :mad: and should be treated as such. With a fat baby or toddler, it isn't the kids fault it is the 100% the parents fault.

10 years ago I worked in a professional capacity with midwifes assessing their work from an ergonomic point of view; the big issue they highlighted (other than understaffing) was the increasing size of your average Irish mother. They all dreamed of having all Polish patients!

You're not the first I've heard that one from. The stats show this too. Basically some nations, Ireland, the UK pile on the pounds in youth, whereas in others middle aged spread hits in well, middle age. So an average Italian woman of 45 is going to be about the same as an average Irish woman of 45, but she was a fair bit thinner at 25. The age where she was more likely to be having kids. That's changing too though. EG the Spanish were one of the leanest in Europe a generation ago, but now have the fattest children in the EU.

PucaMama · 07-01-2017 10:21am

Hammer89 wrote: »

Let's be honest: We, as a society, don't really like obese people, do we? We don't. We treat them like second-class citizens and conjure up gross generalisations about their character based on their size. In our minds, they're all a bunch of lazy, weak-willed, greedy arseholes with no self-control, who don't deserve sympathy because they've done it to themselves. When we see a 30-stone man or woman, we see everything but the truth, and the truth is that person is suffering in a major f*cking way. Odds are they already despise themselves and when they're part of a society which already treats them like sub-humans then what chance have they got?

I'm not saying society is the problem, but it absolutely doesn't help. I can tell you, for a fact, that it's an absolute joke how differently we treat them compared to slim, normal-sized folk. It is. I used to be really big and the societal difference is massive: I was smiled at a lot more; people said hello or good morning to me out of courtesy; you get doors held open for you so much more and politeness, in general, improves drastically. How sad is it that you need to lose eight stone before people start treating you like a human being again?

If you see a very large man or woman then instead of jumping to conclusions about their character, think about it. Think about why they're over-eating. Maybe it's greed, but you must explore the idea that their eating disorder stems from something far deeper like, say, emotional abuse, sexual abuse, intense loss or a deep, deep sadness which dopamine-flooding foods releases them from temporarily. Whatever the reason, it's most probably a pretty sad one. Over-eating is a result of something else going on. If you want to think that 'something else' is greed or laziness then, well, obese people aren't the only ones who need to take a look at themselves.

This is an excellent post

Wanderer78 · 07-01-2017 10:26am

Advbrd wrote:

We all believe that oh great superior being. You could also learn the difference between your and you're.

I regularly get this one wrong, amongst other things, more than likely linked to me being dyslexic

Wanderer78 · 07-01-2017 10:32am

Some foods and food ingredients should not be sold as they are unfit for human consumption, but because of market forces, this isn't the case. Marketing and advertising also plays a part in why we are over eating, ultimately, this is a form of manipulation, and it works

PucaMama · 07-01-2017 10:34am

Read enough of these threads and you wonder why the **** you bother with anything any more. Why is there so much hate for overweight people an especially overweight women.

Wanderer2010 · 07-01-2017 10:35am

Its strange that society treats obese people differently given that so many people out there are already overweight or obese, slim people are the MINORITY these days.

Goya · 07-01-2017 10:41am

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Its strange that society treats obese people differently given that so many people out there are already overweight or obese, slim people are the MINORITY these days.

The minority? I know being overweight has increased but I didn't think overweight people actually outnumbered those who are a healthy weight. It doesn't correlate with what I observe day to day anyway.

Wanderer78 · 07-01-2017 10:42am

Wanderer2010 wrote:

Its strange that society treats obese people differently given that so many people out there are already overweight or obese, slim people are the MINORITY these days.

May not be true but obesity is becoming a big problem

Wibbs · 07-01-2017 10:44am

Hammer89 wrote: »

If you see a very large man or woman then instead of jumping to conclusions about their character, think about it. Think about why they're over-eating. Maybe it's greed, but you must explore the idea that their eating disorder stems from something far deeper like, say, emotional abuse, sexual abuse, intense loss or a deep, deep sadness which dopamine-flooding foods releases them from temporarily.

Fair enough but one presumes people a generation or two ago also had issues like you mention(if not more considering they had far fewer avenues of treatment for any mental disorders), yet there were far fewer fat people. Americans are fatter than the Dutch, does this mean fat Americans are wandering around with eating disorders stemming from some deep hurt to their psyche? I call shenanigans on that TBH. For the extremely obese? Sure, but for the average fat person wandering around it's more about the environment and lack of basic understanding of diet and yep convenience and laziness.

I would also disagree with you as far as "fat acceptance" goes these days. The perception of what is "normal" has climbed upwards. There would be enough people seen as "normal" these days that would have been seen as "fat" twenty years ago.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5 · 07-01-2017 10:45am

Flimpson wrote: »

The minority? I know being overweight has increased but I didn't think overweight people actually outnumbered those who are a healthy weight. It doesn't correlate with what I observe day to day anyway.

AFAIK more than half of Irish adults are overweight or obese. I'd say people's reading of what constitutes overweight has been changed by that. "Shur they're not overweight, they're the same size as most other people"

beggars_bush · 07-01-2017 11:26am

It is scary seeing a child aged 9/10 and they are like a minature adult they have so much weight on

Similarly a teenager being larger than the parents

smaller plates, better food prepared by yourself and not out of a packet

meeeeh · 07-01-2017 11:42am

Eliana Gorgeous Microchip wrote: »

AFAIK more than half of Irish adults are overweight or obese. I'd say people's reading of what constitutes overweight has been changed by that. "Shur they're not overweight, they're the same size as most other people"

Yes majority of Irish adults are obese or overweight. Which is handy for those who are skinny and unfortunately stupid. They can finally feel superior about something. It probably wasn't as easy for tgem 50 years ago when Ireland was basically malnourished.

Anyway if it was that easy to lose weight more than 10% (or some similarly low number) would be actually successful long therm.

Hammer89 · 07-01-2017 3:13pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Fair enough but one presumes people a generation or two ago also had issues like you mention(if not more considering they had far fewer avenues of treatment for any mental disorders), yet there were far fewer fat people. Americans are fatter than the Dutch, does this mean fat Americans are wandering around with eating disorders stemming from some deep hurt to their psyche? I call shenanigans on that TBH. For the extremely obese? Sure, but for the average fat person wandering around it's more about the environment and lack of basic understanding of diet and yep convenience and laziness.

I said "very large man or woman" to be fair because it's a thread about obesity. I'm not suggesting everybody with a bit of weight to lose, like two or three stone, has mental health, stress, body and confidence issues.

If that man or woman with a couple of stone to shift ends up ballooning, however, then I would suggest that their over-eating stemmed from something deeper and darker than convenience and laziness, because over-eating, over a long period of time, isn't normal.

snubbleste · 07-01-2017 3:19pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

May not be true but obesity is becoming a big problem

Puntastic.

Wibbs · 07-01-2017 3:24pm

meeeeh wrote: »

Yes majority of Irish adults are obese or overweight. Which is handy for those who are skinny and unfortunately stupid. They can finally feel superior about something. It probably wasn't as easy for tgem 50 years ago when Ireland was basically malnourished.

Wut? Eh…. no, Ireland was not "basically malnourished" fifty years ago. *facepalm*. Type 2 diabetes was almost unknown for a start. God forbid somebody has some self control and takes personal responsibility in not stuffing themselves to the point of bursting. See what I did there? Now, maybe let the penny drop and not accuse thin people as being "unfortunately stupid". Unreal.

Hammer89 wrote: »

If that man or woman with a couple of stone to shift ends up ballooning, however, then I would suggest that their over-eating stemmed from something deeper and darker than convenience and laziness, because over-eating, over a long period of time, isn't normal.

Sorry, I'm still not buying this. The number of people "ballooning" has gone through the roof and again my point stands. There are far more morbidly obese in the US of A compared to Holland. Does this mean fat Americans are wandering around with eating disorders stemming from some deep hurt to their psyche and the slim Dutch are not?

TBH I'm beginning to get a pain in my fundament with every single facet of human experience that's negative being medicalised and blamed on "mental illness". Worse, too often used as some sort of excuse.

Well either that or the conclusion that must be reached is that current generations are getting progressively emotionally and mentally weaker compared to previous generations. And whatever about saying that mental illness was hidden in the past, it's a lot harder to hide people dying from anorexia or people dying from massive fat gain.

_Jamie_ · 07-01-2017 3:39pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Wut? Eh…. no, Ireland was not "basically malnourished" fifty years ago. *facepalm*. Type 2 diabetes was almost unknown for a start. God forbid somebody has some self control and takes personal responsibility in not stuffing themselves to the point of bursting. See what I did there? Now, maybe let the penny drop and not accuse thin people as being "unfortunately stupid". Unreal.

Read again, that poster wasn't calling all thin people stupid. Just rightfully pointing out a certain subset of slim people have an air of superiority over overweight and obese people, as if they are free of failings.

Shenshen · 07-01-2017 3:44pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Sorry, I'm still not buying this. The number of people "ballooning" has gone through the roof and again my point stands. There are far more morbidly obese in the US of A compared to Holland. Does this mean fat Americans are wandering around with eating disorders stemming from some deep hurt to their psyche and the slim Dutch are not?

So where's the massive difference between the American and the Dutch population, in your mind, then?

While I'm not convinced that obesity is necessarily always a result of mental health problems, I'm even less convinced that large swathes of the planet's population are gaining weight because they are too stupid/ill-informed/lazy not to grasp the simple energy in vs. energy out concept. Some, certainly. Nearly half of the general population? Unlikely.

_Jamie_ · 07-01-2017 3:49pm

Shenshen wrote: »

So where's the massive difference between the American and the Dutch population, in your mind, then?

While I'm not convinced that obesity is necessarily always a result of mental health problems, I'm even less convinced that large swathes of the planet's population are gaining weight because they are too stupid/ill-informed/lazy not to grasp the simple energy in vs. energy out concept. Some, certainly. Nearly half of the general population? Unlikely.

Exactly, classifying a population this way isn't exactly illuminating and will stymie the search for solutions to the problem.

Hammer89 · 07-01-2017 3:54pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Wut? Eh…. no, Ireland was not "basically malnourished" fifty years ago. *facepalm*. Type 2 diabetes was almost unknown for a start. God forbid somebody has some self control and takes personal responsibility in not stuffing themselves to the point of bursting. See what I did there? Now, maybe let the penny drop and not accuse thin people as being "unfortunately stupid". Unreal.

Sorry, I'm still not buying this. The number of people "ballooning" has gone through the roof and again my point stands. There are far more morbidly obese in the US of A compared to Holland. Does this mean fat Americans are wandering around with eating disorders stemming from some deep hurt to their psyche and the slim Dutch are not?

TBH I'm beginning to get a pain in my fundament with every single facet of human experience that's negative being medicalised and blamed on "mental illness". Worse, too often used as some sort of excuse.

Well either that or the conclusion that must be reached is that current generations are getting progressively emotionally and mentally weaker compared to previous generations. And whatever about saying that mental illness was hidden in the past, it's a lot harder to hide people dying from anorexia or people dying from massive fat gain.

Well, they're wandering around with eating disorders, yes. We know this because they abuse food, and we know they abuse food because of the sheer size of them. What does it stem from? Everybody is different, but it does, at the end of the day, boil down to how that person relates to themselves and Americans are far better equipped to sooth whatever is happening inside them with food.

Wibbs · 07-01-2017 4:08pm

Shenshen wrote: »

So where's the massive difference between the American and the Dutch population, in your mind, then?

Culture, more acceptance of being fat in certain sub cultures, cheap heavily advertised food laden with crap and sugars and voila! fat Americans. The lack of education is a red herring IMH as is the "mental health awareness" BS. We've never had so much education on food and health, nor as much promotion of education around mental health, yet people are getting fatter and more are suffering from mental illnesses. Indeed the cultures with the most awareness on these matters are usually the fattest and most mentally delicate. Sorry, does not compute.

Hammer89 wrote:

Well, they're wandering around with eating disorders, yes

So you're claiming a third of Americans have a mental illness coming out as an eating disorder? Yet 30 years ago they didn't? Maybe they were "basically malnourished" back then. :rolleyes:

_Jamie_ · 07-01-2017 5:07pm

The subcultures that might celebrate obesity in the US are in a small minority. *Some* black culture celebrates this but certainly not all. In the US as much as any other Western country, the pervasive ideal is thin thin thin.

Wibbs · 07-01-2017 6:38pm

I didn't say celebrate, I said acceptance and that's far more widespread. There is the media "ideal" which is thin, but fat is more an everyday sight that's accepted. What is seen as "normal" is very skewed.

meeeeh · 07-01-2017 7:39pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Wut? Eh…. no, Ireland was not "basically malnourished" fifty years ago. *facepalm*. Type 2 diabetes was almost unknown for a start. God forbid somebody has some self control and takes personal responsibility in not stuffing themselves to the point of bursting. See what I did there? Now, maybe let the penny drop and not accuse thin people as being "unfortunately stupid". Unreal.

I didn't say all slim people are stupid. I said that those who are slim but stupid can finally feel superior about something. 40 years ago Ireland had twice as many underweight people as there were obese. Malnourished was the wrong word but my point stands that 50 years ago being slim wasn't an achievement. Today those who have nothing else but their body shape going for them can tell the fat ones in I don't know how many facts what's they are doing wrong.

I don't believe every obese person has psychological issues, far from it. It's very easy to consume too much of the wrong food, too much alcohol and too little activity. But unfortunately it can be a habit learned from very early childhood and incredibly hard to shake. Starting a thread listing some 'facts' is not done for the benefit od overweight people, it's done solely for the op to feel smug about something.

learn_more · 08-01-2017 3:53am

meeeeh wrote: »

I don't believe every obese person has psychological issues, far from it. It's very easy to consume too much of the wrong food, too much alcohol and too little activity. But unfortunately it can be a habit learned from very early childhood and incredibly hard to shake. Starting a thread listing some 'facts' is not done for the benefit od overweight people, it's done solely for the op to feel smug about something.

Starting a thread listing some 'facts' is not done for the benefit od overweight people, it's done solely for the op to feel smug about something

The reason I did the tactic think was because I see the same invalid points made over and over again, not just on boards but in popular discourse. So much so that I felt I had to classify them.

The more ludicrous points, like yours, comes in the form of 'anyone who comments on the obesity crisis does so just to feel smug about themselves'. Etc etc.

Here is an admission about my (former) eating habits:

I love junk food. I could scoff a packet of biscuits in a matter of minutes, with a nice up of tea.

If I bought a bag of chips, I would laden it with ketchup, and mayo.

My favourite drink is Bulmers Cider, on a night out I could drink up to 8 or more pints of it without a bother.

My favourite junk food is Wagon Wheels, a sick pack, that I would devour in half an hour or less. Anything chunky chocolate rocks my boat too.

I have always had a voracious appetite that leaves anyone who I have dinner with thinking I'm some kind of monster, when I scoff it all in minutes.

But, at least if I put on the stones I don't pretend I don't know why.

I don't pretend that the body is somehow tuned in such a way that a desert after every meal every day and a crisp snack in the evening is something the body is designed to cope with, as if that level of junk food consumption is free, and anything after that is the reason one would put weight on.

I took measures to deal with my sugar addiction and if you think that I'm in no position to critique the obesity crisis and I'm only forwarding my views to feel smug about myself as if I'm naturally thin then I'm going to have to classify your view as TACTIC 19.

Carlos Orange · 08-01-2017 4:16am

Flimpson wrote: »

The minority? I know being overweight has increased but I didn't think overweight people actually outnumbered those who are a healthy weight. It doesn't correlate with what I observe day to day anyway.

"A massive 66% of Irish men over 20 are also considered overweight or obese, as are 50.9% of Irish women over 20 years: well in excess of the western European average of 47.6%."

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2014/0529/620368-irelands-obesity-levels-above-eu-average/

Hard to know really since what counts as overweight (in your head) is calibrated by society. All I know is when I was obese I had no trouble buying trousers, now I'm (almost) not overweight it is more work.

learn_more · 08-01-2017 4:47am

Flimpson wrote: »

The minority? I know being overweight has increased but I didn't think overweight people actually outnumbered those who are a healthy weight. It doesn't correlate with what I observe day to day anyway.

It is now accepted in our culture that if a child under 12 has a chubby disposition, it's considered as a 'well fed' healthy look. This is so so wrong.

08-01-2017 6:47am

learn_more wrote: »

Here is an admission about my (former) eating habits:

I love junk food. I could scoff a packet of biscuits in a matter of minutes, with a nice up of tea.

If I bought a bag of chips, I would laden it with ketchup, and mayo.

My favourite drink is Bulmers Cider, on a night out I could drink up to 8 or more pints of it without a bother.

My favourite junk food is Wagon Wheels, a sick pack, that I would devour in half an hour or less. Anything chunky chocolate rocks my boat too.

I have always had a voracious appetite that leaves anyone who I have dinner with thinking I'm some kind of monster, when I scoff it all in minutes.

But, at least if I put on the stones I don't pretend I don't know why.

Ah, that explains the tone of your posts and your aggressive dismissal of those who differ. None so pure as the reformed hoor and all that? You sound like those who took stock, went to the gym, and became an expert on diet, lifestyle, psychology etc. Go on, tell me about the paleo diet and mindfulness...:)

Advbrd · 08-01-2017 7:09am

learn_more wrote: »

It is now accepted in our culture that if a child under 12 has a chubby disposition, it's considered as a 'well fed' healthy look. This is so so wrong.

I totally disagree with that. In my sons primary school, out of approx 140 there are very few who are not skinny and I mean skinny. This I regard as normal. The chubby ones stand out a mile. There is an obvious increase in my daughter's secondary school with the chubby ones still being a small minority.

Wanderer2010 · 08-01-2017 11:06am

Advbrd wrote: »

I totally disagree with that. In my sons primary school, out of approx 140 there are very few who are not skinny and I mean skinny. This I regard as normal. The chubby ones stand out a mile. There is an obvious increase in my daughter's secondary school with the chubby ones still being a small minority.

You need to get out and walk around town a bit more if you regard only a fee heavy kids from a class of 140 as "normal". And how do you define normal by the way? Skinny = normal? You are making a massive assumption based entirely on one class. Overweight and obese kids are absolutely everywhere, I'm not saying its right or wrong just that its very obviously there.

Shenshen · 08-01-2017 11:19am

Wibbs wrote: »

Culture, more acceptance of being fat in certain sub cultures, cheap heavily advertised food laden with crap and sugars and voila! fat Americans. The lack of education is a red herring IMH as is the "mental health awareness" BS. We've never had so much education on food and health, nor as much promotion of education around mental health, yet people are getting fatter and more are suffering from mental illnesses. Indeed the cultures with the most awareness on these matters are usually the fattest and most mentally delicate. Sorry, does not compute.

Isn't that putting the cart before the horse? As far as I'm aware, US waistlines have expanded in the last 50 years. Are you saying they expanded because people 50 years ago accepted a few fat people more easily in the US than they did anywhere else globally, and consequently more people got fat becasue it was accepted?

Advbrd · 08-01-2017 11:19am

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

You need to get out and walk around town a bit more if you regard only a fee heavy kids from a class of 140 as "normal". And how do you define normal by the way? Skinny = normal? You are making a massive assumption based entirely on one class. Overweight and obese kids are absolutely everywhere, I'm not saying its right or wrong just that its very obviously there.

Yeah, maybe I need to get out more. It's actually a school not a class, a small country school. I do regard skinny as normal particularly in the under 12 category which is the point I was answering. The chubby ones are very much in the minority where I live in that age group. In the secondary school my daughter attends, which is in a fairly large town there is a higher percentage of chubby's but they are still very much in the minority.

meeeeh · 08-01-2017 12:15pm

Advbrd wrote: »

Yeah, maybe I need to get out more. It's actually a school not a class, a small country school. I do regard skinny as normal particularly in the under 12 category which is the point I was answering. The chubby ones are very much in the minority where I live in that age group. In the secondary school my daughter attends, which is in a fairly large town there is a higher percentage of chubby's but they are still very much in the minority.

My son's school is the same, small country school in sort of middle class area and there are very few overweight kids. Yet when I take him swimming kids from other schools/neighborhoods are there and a lot of them are seriously overweight or obese. I think where are you born determines a lot in Ireland.

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