Rent late

bajer101

If a tenant is one day late with their rent, is a landlord entitled to issue a 14 day notice, and then be entitled to evict a tenant 28 days later if that month's rent is not paid in full?

aido79

bajer101 wrote: »

If a tenant is one day late with their rent, is a landlord entitled to issue a 14 day notice, and then be entitled to evict a tenant 28 days later if that month's rent is not paid in full?

There has to be more to this story than the tenant being a day late with the rent....

Stravos Murphy

aido79 wrote: »

There has to be more to this story than the tenant being a day late with the rent....

There may not, let facts be facts here.

The_Conductor

You could issue the 14 days notice- but really, unless there was a very good reason for doing so, I'd let it be for a few days at very least (if not longer). Its not normal to issue a notice of arrears if a tenant is a day late- you can do it, as-in, you are within your rights to do it- however, it really is going over the top not allowing a little leeway. If there were other issues- and you are simply dotting your 'i's and crossing your 't's- then so be it- but in isolation of anything else being askew- it is way over the top issuing a notice when they're only a day late with the rent.

bajer101

The_Conductor wrote: »

You could issue the 14 days notice- but really, unless there was a very good reason for doing so, I'd let it be for a few days at very least (if not longer). Its not normal to issue a notice of arrears if a tenant is a day late- you can do it, as-in, you are within your rights to do it- however, it really is going over the top not allowing a little leeway. If there were other issues- and you are simply dotting your 'i's and crossing your 't's- then so be it- but in isolation of anything else being askew- it is way over the top issuing a notice when they're only a day late with the rent.

Thanks. I am the tenant in question, not the landlord. I suspect that the landlord wants to evict me (and my child), as there was a recent rent increase which will now be the basis for the new 4% max increase and they could get more with a new tenant and lease. The problem has arisen as I recently became ill and have had to rely on rent allowance, which is paid a month in arrears.

So technically, a landlord can legally evict a tenant if the rent is 15 days late.

punisher5112

bajer101 wrote: »

Thanks. I am the tenant in question, not the landlord. I suspect that the landlord wants to evict me (and my child), as there was a recent rent increase which will now be the basis for the new 4% max increase and they could get more with a new tenant and lease. The problem has arisen as I recently became ill and have had to rely on rent allowance, which is paid a month in arrears.

So technically, a landlord can legally evict a tenant if the rent is 15 days late.

No they can't.

Honestly if your in no way taking the pi#s then they will not be able to kick you out.

They may go down the selling or needing for a family member to get you out.

I would suggest if you feel you will be late contact ll by text or email to say sorry but something came up and state you will be a day late.

Don't worry you are protected also and I fully understand when someone is a messer they should be able to get them out but even that is extremely difficult and can take a year even if not paying at all.

The_Conductor

bajer101 wrote: »

Thanks. I am the tenant in question, not the landlord. I suspect that the landlord wants to evict me (and my child), as there was a recent rent increase which will now be the basis for the new 4% max increase and they could get more with a new tenant and lease. The problem has arisen as I recently became ill and have had to rely on rent allowance, which is paid a month in arrears.

So technically, a landlord can legally evict a tenant if the rent is 15 days late.

Nope- if they get a new tenant in- and the dwelling is in an area included in the 'pressure zone' the new tenant is subject to the same 4% rule- i.e. the rent you pay is associated with the dwelling rather than the tenancy- the landlord does not get to reset the clock on the rent, by virtue of ending the tenancy (other than by carrying out 'major renovations') and getting a new tenant in. A new tenant pays the rent you pay + a max of 4% (depending on timescales). New tenant/tenancy does not equate with an opportunity for the landlord to set rent at market rates.

With respect of rent allowance being paid in arrears etc- and unfortunately (and I have every sympathy with you being ill etc)- in the private residential renting market- rent is paid in advance, not in arrears. Technically you could be a month + a day in arrears- if you did not make good the difference between paying the rent in advance and arrears when you moved over to rent allowance- whether you realise it or not. A landlord is under no obligation whatsoever to accept rent in arrears (which is one reason rent allowance is disliked by many- both landlords and tenants- to say nothing of the paperwork).

I empathise fully with you being ill (I've a long term illness myself)- hope you feel better- and I hope you normalise the situation with your landlord, the last thing you need is the additional stress of a late rent notice. Talk to your landlord- and if you haven't normalised your rent situation- talk to the Community Welfare Officer and see if they can assist.

bajer101

But the law says they can evict, or am I missing something here? If the rent is one day late they can issue a 14 day notice. If the rent is not paid within that 14 days they can then issue a 28 day eviction notice and that would that.

The_Conductor

bajer101 wrote: »

But the law says they can evict, or am I missing something here? If the rent is one day late they can issue a 14 day notice. If the rent is not paid within that 14 days they can then issue a 28 day eviction notice and that would that.

Talk to the landlord- find out the exact situation- then talk to the Community Welfare Officer- and try to regularise the situation with the landlord.

Technically- if you are late with the rent- the landlord does have a right to end the tenancy- its far better trying to fix the problem than allowing it to escalate to the situation where you are in a position of having the tenancy terminated.

You need to do the running on this though- DPD/DSP will not talk to the landlord about your rent allowance etc- you need to negotiate- they won't even talk to the landlord.

bajer101

The landlord was well aware of the situation as I kept them apprised at all times. They knew exactly what they were doing. I resolved the situation myself by borrowing the money. I'll be back in work in a couple of months and it won't be an issue after that. I just couldn't believe that this would be legal, but apparently it is. I'll probably move elsewhere when things settle down as I am not comfortable doing business who would make a child with special needs homeless like this.

davo10

Op your opening post is an oxymoron, can a landlord issue notice if rent is one day late, and can he evict if rent is not paid in full by end of month. If the rent is not paid in full, it is late so even if you paid part of the rent, you are late paying the full rental amount.

Non payment of agreed rent is a grounds for eviction, even if you are paying part of it. Rent must be paid in full each month.

davo10

bajer101 wrote: »

The landlord was well aware of the situation as I kept them apprised at all times. They knew exactly what they were doing. I resolved the situation myself by borrowing the money. I'll be back in work in a couple of months and it won't be an issue after that. I just couldn't believe that this would be legal, but apparently it is. I'll probably move elsewhere when things settle down as I am not comfortable doing business who would make a child with special needs homeless like this.

Op, this will be the exact same with all LL's if you are late with your rent.

sullivk

davo10 wrote:

Op your opening post is an oxymoron, can a landlord issue notice if rent is one day late, and can he evict if rent is not paid in full by end of month. If the rent is not paid in full, it is late so even if you paid part of the rent, you are late paying the full rental amount.

I'm confused... was OP one day late paying rent? Or 14 days? Or 28 days?

bajer101

davo10 wrote: »

Op, this will be the exact same with all LL's if you are late with your rent.

No it won't. I was a landlord in the past and would never have tried to evict someone over rent being late. I don't know of any other person who would.

The_Conductor

bajer101 wrote: »

No it won't. I was a landlord in the past and would never have tried to evict someone over rent being late. I don't know of any other person who would.

With all due respect- and I empathise with the fact that you have been ill lately- renting is a business like any other business. The government is trying to standardise the experience for all tenants- and the legislation in force is firmly in a tenants favour. Up to this point- you could appeal to a landlord's better nature and try to make a personal case if you felt you needed accommodations over and above those provided for you in law. The manner in which the industry is going- is there will be a similar approach taken by all landlords- without exception.

No tenant should have a reasonable expectation to be late with the rent, to pay it in arrears, to part pay the rent- or to expect special terms and conditions on the grounds of their own health or their children's health. If you have an issue- which means you are not in a position to cover your responsibilities under the Residential Tenancies Act (the most basic responsibilities of which is to pay your rent in full and on time)- you need to proactively take whatever action is necessary to ensure you discharge those obligations (which will normally entail making a case to your local Community Welfare Officer for assistance).

The fact that landlords cut you slack in the past- does not mean it is an entitlement or an expectation that you can receive similar treatment now or in future.

I do sympathise with your situation- however, there seems to be a disconnect here- the very basic expectation and right a landlord has- is that their tenant will pay their rent in full and on time- and in a reciprochal manner- they have obligations towards a tenant- none of which include special accommodations for your child's or your medical conditions or ill health.

There seems to be a disconnect here.

What you need to do- without allowing this go any further- is regularise your situation with the landlord, ensuring your rent is paid in full and ontime- and ensure you keep with this. If this means making a case to the Community Welfare Officer, family members, a credit union loan- or whatever- that is what you need to do. You need to remedy this. No-one will even talk to the landlord if your rent allowance is late or curtailed- this is up to you to chase and resolve- not the landlord.

You have very significant rights as a tenant- alongside some very reasonable and indeed, quite fundamental, obligations- as does the landlord. You are impinging on any landlord by trying to make a case to them for conditions other than payment of your rent in full and on-time.

punisher5112

sullivk wrote: »

I'm confused... was OP one day late paying rent? Or 14 days? Or 28 days?

1 day that's why they are upset.

To be honest you could be a unlucky ll and have a tenant that is always late and have to issue 14 day notice. Still at that they can't be turfed out.

Its a strange set up but in the instance once we take the op at their word its a bit silly the ll for 1 day doing that.

If it were one not paying or always late yes I would agree fully and believe there should be a better system but we have to work with what is in place.

Op don't stress over it it was one day and work on recovering and move on from it. There are plenty of rules in place to protect you.

There are people who don't pay anything left in property for a year or more as it is that difficult to get them out legally.
I don't condone that in anyway and believe in paying your way so its a very bad thing to be at.

bajer101

bajer101 wrote: »

I just couldn't believe that this would be legal, but apparently it is.

I'm not sure why you thought it would be illegal for a LL to seek to evict a tenant who is late with their rent. A LL is operating a business and rent should be in time every single month. I appreciate you are going through a tough time but a LL has a mortgage and bills to pay too and your non payment could be putting him in financial difficulty.

punisher5112

Cash Young Yachtsman wrote: »

I'm not sure why you thought it would be illegal for a LL to seek to evict a tenant who is late with their rent. A LL is operating a business and rent should be in time every single month. I appreciate you are going through a tough time but a LL has a mortgage and bills to pay too and your non payment could be putting him in financial difficulty.

Its 1 day. Seriously if a ll can't wait 1 day or 14 for that matter they shouldn't really be a ll.

In no way am I saying its right but things can happen.

The person has been working became I'll fell behind for 1 month a day not a month just one day and are getting help off the state while they get better.

Op you don't need to worry.

The_Conductor

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 1 day. Seriously if a ll can't wait 1 day or 14 for that matter they shouldn't really be a ll.

In no way am I saying its right but things can happen.

The person has been working became I'll fell behind for 1 month a day not a month just one day and are getting help off the state while they get better.

Op you don't need to worry.

Its actually not clear that its a day.
The OP clearly stated they have recently moved onto Rent Allowance- and its paid in arrears.
Its not clear what exactly the one day late relates to.

Zulu

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 1 day. Seriously if a ll can't wait 1 day or 14 for that matter they shouldn't really be a ll.

Perhaps the LL would agree with you, doesn't want to be a LL, but has been forced into that situation - eitherway it doesnt matter.
If you were one day late paying a loan to a bank, they'd list you as a bad debtor on the ICB.
If you were one day late repaying a CC debt you'd incur interest.

Business is business.

murphaph

I would reserve judgement of the LL without knowing what his past experiences have been. Perhaps he's been burned with overholding before and made a resolution to immediately issue a NoA on day one, to ensure no delay if this turns out to be another case of overholding and a 28 day notice needs to be issued.

Get well soon OP. Hope things work out for you and your child.

Mrs OBumble

I have a property managed by professional property managers.

They will allow rent to be one day late, but a 14-day letter is issued at the start of day 2 if the rent hasnt turned up on day 1. No discretion applied: the computer checks status of all properties each day and sends letters accordingly. That said, it counts business days only, effectively stopping the clock for holidays.

Eviction desisions are based on the commercial relationship only: the tenant having a kid or granny or dog or whatever does not change the decision if theres a rent-lateness issue. But there will be some discretion applied based on the proportion of rent that is late and frequency of it being late.

If your kid becomes homeless because you havent paid the rent, then i don't see that as the landlords fault.

mel123

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 1 day. Seriously if a ll can't wait 1 day or 14 for that matter they shouldn't really be a ll.

Would you find it acceptable if your employer paid you 14 days late?

Its effectively the same thing, its all business. How on earth you think 14 days late would be acceptable is baffling!!!

davo10

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 1 day. Seriously if a ll can't wait 1 day or 14 for that matter they shouldn't really be a ll.

Op you don't need to worry.

The ops posts are unclear, but I suspect judging by the last sentence in the opening post that the rent has not been paid in full for a month, due to the op moving to RA which is paid in arrears.

You are wrong, the op does need to worry if she is a month behind on the rent, non payment of rent on time is a bone fide reason for notice of eviction.

beauf

The RA is a month behind. making the Months deposit useless, or putting the tenant always in 30 days arrears. Its one of the (many) flaws of the RA scheme.

the_syco

punisher5112 wrote: »

Its 1 day. Seriously if a ll can't wait 1 day or 14 for that matter they shouldn't really be a ll.

It's a business. How long should the LL wait, in your opinion? Two months? And why exactly should they? They're running a business, not a charity.

bajer101 wrote: »

The problem has arisen as I recently became ill and have had to rely on rent allowance, which is paid a month in arrears.

bajer101 wrote: »

I'll probably move elsewhere when things settle down as I am not comfortable doing business who would make a child with special needs homeless like this.

It's nice that the current LL signed the papers for you to get the RA, as some won't. If they want'ed to get you out, they could have not signed the papers, and evicted you. But they did sign the RA papers. This however, doesn't mean that they should not expect you to pay when you said you'd pay when you first moved in.

Grolschevik

the_syco wrote:

It's a business. How long should the LL wait, in your opinion? Two months? And why exactly should they? They're running a business, not a charity.

Off topic, but the self-employed and many other businesses often have to wait for weeks or months for payment of invoices. They have to manage their cash flow to accommodate.

beauf

I think the issue is why does the ra pay one month in arrears. It's the disparity between private housing and social housing provision.

davo10

Grolschevik wrote: »

Off topic, but the self-employed and many other businesses often have to wait for weeks or months for payment of invoices. They have to manage their cash flow to accommodate.

Ya but if the self employed or businesses don't get paid on time, they have the option of not providing goods/ services to the debtor with immediate effect and taking them to court to recover their money. When a tenant stops paying it could take years to remove them and the LL still has to provide the service (rented property).

Zulu

Grolschevik wrote: »

Off topic, but the self-employed and many other businesses often have to wait for weeks or months for payment of invoices. They have to manage their cash flow to accommodate.

And that makes it OK? :rolleyes:

Elemonator

Could be any reason for being late with the rent. Give them a bit of leeway and if they continue to mess around unnecessarily, you should proceed.