Over zealous, and inconsistent modding on the politics cafe forum.

jackofalltrades

Permabear wrote: »

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For every political thread in AH, I'd estimate that there would be about 2/3 that are moved out of it into Politics Cafe.
That and posters will start up threads in the Cafe, knowing that the thread would be closed or moved in they did the same in AH.

As long as the above is going on your going to need a forum where people can discuss what is mostly news in a casual setting.
I'd think AH would be a better fit for a lot of the threads in PC.
Posters tend to get called out if they're acting the muppet in AH.
That said there are posters in AH who don't want political threads/want very few and would oppose this idea.

Permabear

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Hotblack Desiato

Permabear wrote: »

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The Fully Baked Left Wing Vegan Cookies thread must have escaped your notice.

Right wing politics is very much on point in A&A, there's a strong correlation with religious fundamentalism especially in the USA.

Left wing intolerance of free speech very much is on point there, also.

Permabear

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Hotblack Desiato

Permabear wrote: »

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Yes over 2 years (and almost 2000 posts) ago so your point is long moot at this stage.

It seems to me you need to look closer to home for lack of tolerance of opposing views.

I find it humorous that an A&A mod hates the right so much that he even starts threads attacking Ayn Rand, who is one of the most important women atheists of the 20th century.

So was Mao, but I wouldn't regard either of them as sane or any type of a role model. So Rand should be on some sort of criticism-free pedestal just because she was an atheist? Are you being remotely serious?

Special Circumstances

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I'd agree that the Cafe serves a valuable purpose and I'd also agree that there are those (on all sides) who take it far too seriously in regards supposed standards and so on.

At the end of the day it's just a forum on a website. Is it really so outrageous if a thread deviates off course into a related side issue (this could be levelled at the site as a whole really) so long as points are well made and no abuse is given?

However, I've noticed a definite trend in certain Cafe topics where particular users will arrive, post something inflammatory and clearly intended to stir up shyte, then proclaim ignorance when called on it. It's this sort of nonsense that causes many of the issues in the Cafe in my opinion and it's always the same crowd.

I reported such a post yesterday as it seemed obvious to me that rather than counter the points raised in an adult manner, the intent was clearly to disrupt the thread, prompt mod intervention and have other users sanctioned or maybe the thread locked.

And yep, I catch up this morning and one of those posters who called the user in question out on the nonsense has been carded and no visible repercussions or warning for the individual who caused the issue in the first place..

It's that sort of inconsistent modding that feeds into the "problems" there too.

Add moderators "revising" threads to flatter a certain agenda by removing only certain posts and you have the perfect description of the mess boards modding is in.

jackofalltrades

Permabear wrote: »

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I haven't and wouldn't say that political discussion is banned in AH, but it is deliberately restricted.
The threads that you talked about are busy but still small in number.
Closing PC, as you propose, would dump a lot of political threads into AH.
Including threads that are seen as an "embarrassment" or have the wrong viewpoint winning the argument.

Special Circumstances

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Including threads that are seen as an "embarrassment" or have the wrong viewpoint winning the argument.

I'm not sure I've ever seen a thread where the anti agenda posters were not modhunted out of there with their posts selectively deleted, or the thread was shutdown as a "train wreck " before too much damage could be done to "insert boards sponsored agenda here"!

Permabear

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Special Circumstances

Permabear wrote: »

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It's run as the moderators personal fiefdom. Policitics Café itself is the trainwreck not the inconvenient truth threads that get mod revised in there. Some of the worst "dick" behaviour I've seen on boards.ie is evident in agendas are enforced on AH and PC whether it be smug "appeal it you like" warnings, selective depleting or infractions. All delivered in a completely biased way.

bucketybuck

If the mod responses in this thread are any indication then I can see why people are getting fed up.

Special Circumstances

bucketybuck wrote: »

If the mod responses in this thread are any indication then I can see why people are getting fed up.

Some serious "smug clique" buzz off the whole thing.

Lovely Bloke

Permabear wrote: »

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yep.

robindch

Permabear wrote: »

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As at least one other poster has pointed out, there are two threads on the forum - one for discussion of "right-wing" silliness" and one for discussion of "left-wing" silliness. Please feel free to contribute to either one, as you feel is appropriate.

Permabear wrote: »

I find it humorous that an A&A mod hates the right so much that he even starts threads attacking Ayn Rand, who is one of the most important women atheists of the 20th century.

I am thrilled, and a little humbled, that a thread which I started almost seven years ago, which has attracted perhaps four posts a week until it went quiet last May - still has the power to move you!

More seriously, if you're unhappy to see right-wing frauds openly discussed, or third-rate pseudo-religious economists ridiculed along with the many other flavours of silliness which the forum posterhood discusses from time to time, well, you seem to have judged correctly that A+A isn't the right place for you.

Permabear

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robindch

Permabear wrote: »

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As above, "right-wing" views and people with "right-wing" views are entirely welcome throughout the forum.

In fact, just checking briefly, I see that the "Half-baked Republican Presidential Fruitcakes" thread has reached 3,520 posts in around 80 months, while the "Fully Baked Left Wing Vegan Cookies" thread has reached 1,900 posts in 25 months.

Stats directly from the forum, therefore, show that the anti-"left-wing" thread is almost exactly twice as popular as the anti-"right-wing" thread.

I hope this puts your thoughts into some reality-based perspective

Have a great weekend!

Permabear

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robindch

Permabear wrote: »

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Permabear wrote: »

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Well, you should make up your mind - you seem to be finding this much funnier than somebody with a genuine grievance would

Permabear wrote: »

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Not only on account of her "right-wing views" as you seem to think so very energetically.

But also significantly, as you can see here and here, because of her truly abundant, and atrocious lack of writing talent. The fact that she seems to have been a monumental hypocrite almost fades into insignificance in comparison. Almost.

Permabear wrote: »

One would expect the focus of an atheism forum to be more on someone's religious beliefs (or lack thereof) than on her economic views, but in its present incarnation A&A functions as a right-bashing forum that specifically targets right-wing atheists like myself and prevents us from contributing to a forum that would otherwise be of interest. In reality, A&A is welcoming only to left-wing atheists.

If you addressed the issues with clarity and wit, rather than taking offence at some perceived sleight against some "right-wing" hero and stomping off waving your umbrella in the air, you'd find A+A a much more welcoming and entertaining place, regardless of your views and regardless of how peculiar they might or might not be.

Robineen

Permabear wrote: »

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How can you know that? There are thousands of boards.ie members and I doubt you know all the right-wing active members to declare that they no longer post there. There is a currently active "Anti left-wing" thread in A&A. Maybe you have PMed with some other fellow right-wing posters who are disgruntled with A&A and deduced the bolded above from that. You would need to have been in contact with probably hundreds of users to be able to declare that A&A is a no-go area for right wing posters and that seems doubtful.

As well as that, isn't the site quietening down a lot in general? So posts by members of all political affiliations are likely falling in numbers. So noticing that there are less right wing posters there than a few years back doesn't mean they are dissuaded from posting in the forum. There could also be a drop in numbers of left wing posters but you might not have noticed because you wouldn't be sensitive to that and so wouldn't take notice.

Permabear

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Special Circumstances

Permabear wrote: »

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Standard mod tone across AH, PC etc if they hear something they don't personally like. They don't see how this is a problem but mere mortals can be put on the naughty step for far less.

Permabear

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Robineen

Permabear wrote: »

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If not the thousands than very likely in the hundreds. And very likely it runs into the thousands. Boards.ie has a large membership. You simply can't know what you claimed to very definitely above. Logistically, it's highly unlikely. And for some reason, you continue to ignore that there is an active anti left-wing thread on the forum. I doubt that's all left wing posters contributing.

Permabear

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Robineen

Permabear wrote: »

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Considering that people can close their accounts, meaning it's harder to keep track of members and their politics these days and that the site has been slowing down a lot in general, that's not a very useful metric. And atheism does often seem to align with left-wing views. Not always of course, but often. So, there probably is a slant towards those views on the forum. I'm not sure what can be done about that. But there is also criticism of left wing view on the forum. How much do you need? Is there a certain acceptable amount?

Permabear

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Permabear

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Hotblack Desiato

Permabear wrote: »

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In your bubble, perhaps.
In Ireland, she's not famous at all and this is primarily a discussion forum for Irish people and people who have a link to Ireland.
As far as I'm concerned the most famous female atheist of the 20th century is Marie Curie, and at least she did some good in the world. I'm sure there were many others better than your favourite crap book author who really isn't that well known outside right wing circles, sorry to burst your bubble.

One would expect the focus of an atheism forum to be more on someone's religious beliefs (or lack thereof) than on her economic views, but in its present incarnation A&A functions as a right-bashing forum that specifically targets right-wing atheists like myself and prevents us from contributing to a forum that would otherwise be of interest. In reality, A&A is welcoming only to left-wing atheists.

I'm a frequent poster there and I'm by no means left wing. There are plenty both to the right and the left of me. The idea that non-belief can be correlated to the political spectrum is nonsensical to me, and no doubt many religious people would say the same about their belief. There is a correlation between conservative christianity and far-right political views in the US however. Mike Pence says he is a Christian, but there is little of what is attributed to Christ in his witterings.

I personally don't post there anymore because I have recently seen other posters with similar views to my own treated so inconsistently by the mods that they have closed their accounts in frustration, or been permabanned from the forum for relatively minor offenses.

That just sounds like a whinge that people are not agreeing with you.

BTW if you want anti-SF I'm your man. Did that jar your stereotype any?

KyussBeeshop

PermaBear wrote:

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A&A as a forum is hostile to all views that border on religious (in the sense of rabidly fanatical/irrational beliefs) - so it's no surprise that Ayn Rand is high up there, in terms of ridicule.

On the list of things that Rand is notable for, being an Atheist is hardly high on that list.

Essentially, A&A is home to a group of people/mods who are much more well versed in skepticism/critical-thinking than average - and you are taking the fact that these traits come down hard on many right-leaning views, as an indication of targeting such views because they are right-wing - when instead it is targeting views that are usually demonstrably nonsensical/irrational.

I'm pretty sure there are no sacred cows on A&A - and I don't see why Ayn Rand should be one.

One thing I will agree with though, is sometimes the tone/ridicule used for attacking a subject isn't always necessary, and can make some true grey-area/borderline topics harder to discuss (e.g. I encountered that a tiny bit when applying skepticism to GMO/biotech type discussion) - but at the same time, some things are lacking in credibility enough that ridicule (after dismantling through argument first) is fair game really, and Rand pretty much fits that.

Robineen

Permabear wrote: »

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Well, you said:

Permabear wrote: »

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Saying you know numerous right-wing posters who have stopped posting there is a little different from saying that, with a few exceptions, right-wing posters don't post there any more. "Numerous" is still likely a tiny percentage of boards.ie members. Thank you for clarifying.

As for left-wing posters participating in the anti left-wing thread. It makes sense that many left-wing posters will contribute in a forum where there a lot of left-wing posters.