Need to drive uninsured car two hours to collect insured car. Ins Co won't swap cover

flatty

I know what I would do.

iwillhtfu

OP if you did drive the uninsured car over to pick up the insured cap. What did you plan on doing with the uninsured car?

It might help if you let us know your starting point.

iwillhtfu

TequilaMockingBird wrote: »

Thanks for replies.

I don't have insurance to cover me to bring and leave old car to Remotest Place in Ireland, so I could collect Good car that has insurance. Bus would take daaaays.

The car I have here is crap, I can't understand why insurance co won't swap cover for two days. I only have 3rd party, so no skin off their nose if it dies in the middle of the bog.


Does anyone know of services that would drop Good Car home to me?

20 mins west from Belmullet town to Sligo town.

judeboy101 wrote: »

He said Sligo to west of belmullet, one assumes that's Sligo in Ireland. So please explain how getting the train from Sligo to balina works? Maybe go to mullingar and transfer?

where did you read that?

I hope OPs driving is better than their chart plotting 20 mins west of Belmullet you're in the Atlantic.

Special Circumstances

CramCycle wrote: »

Most policies it needs to be insured and/or roadworthy i.e. NCT and taxed. All of mine have always been that the car has insurance on it and is not owned by me. It maybe a common misconception but I have yet to meet anyone where it is not applicable.

Your car could have both and be completely unroadworthy.
Your car could have neither and be perfectly roadworthy.

Not saying that the Irish government and insurance companies don't love Catch 22s.... but if you need tax to be roadworthy, how would you get your Certificate of Road Worthiness to get your tax to get your.....

TallGlass

Akrasia wrote: »

Not for the vast majority of policies.

This is a common misconception

True, but it does need valid tax and NCT on it.

CramCycle

Special Circumstances wrote: »

Your car could have both and be completely unroadworthy.
Your car could have neither and be perfectly roadworthy.

Not saying that the Irish government and insurance companies don't love Catch 22s.... but if you need tax to be roadworthy, how would you get your Certificate of Road Worthiness to get your tax to get your.....

Very true, I meant more the requirements of the insurance company not what is actually roadworthy in technical sense but roadworthy in a legal sense ie what would a garda fine you or impound tha car for, I would have though that was obvious.

I have never heard of a policy that does not require the car to be insured in another persons name but akrasia says this is common. Admittedly though I only have experience with a small number of policies, parents, in laws, partners and my own, plus a few friends. I have read most of these due to swapping cars around for various reasons. Maybe Akrasia is right but I presume there would be some other requirement for the car to be insured. When I say roadworthy, I am talking about, what would be legally required to be driving on the road.

TallGlass

Special Circumstances wrote: »

if you need tax to be roadworthy, how would you get your Certificate of Road Worthiness to get your tax to get your.....

Well if you wanted to get technical about it you should technically tow it to NCT center get cert and tow it back then TAX it!

Special Circumstances

TallGlass wrote: »

Well if you wanted to get technical about it you should technically tow it to NCT center get cert and tow it back then TAX it!

It's turtles all the way down.

TallGlass

CramCycle wrote: »

I have never heard of a policy that does not require the car to be insured in another persons name

Hi CramCycle,

You can see here from Liberty there is no mention of it needing to be insured, it does need to be in a roadworthy condition, not in your name and you are not currently insured on it. Obviously it would need to be taxed to use it on a public road.

Check your Certificate of Insurance to see if you are covered to drive other cars. If so, the policyholder will have third party only cover to drive other private motor cars that are temporarily borrowed, under the following conditions:

the vehicle is not owned by you or your employer or hired to you or them under a hire-purchase or lease agreement;
you currently hold a full European Union (EU) licence;
the use of the vehicle is covered in the Certificate of Insurance;
cover is not provided by any other insurance;
you have the owner’s permission to drive the vehicle;
the vehicle is in a roadworthy condition;
you still have your vehicle and it has not been damaged beyond cost-effective repair; and
your occupation is not restricted by our acceptance criteria.
This extension applies while being driven in Ireland or the UK, and only to private passenger vehicles.

Special Circumstances

CramCycle wrote: »

Very true, I meant more the requirements of the insurance company not what is actually roadworthy in technical sense but roadworthy in a legal sense ie what would a garda fine you or impound tha car for, I would have though that was obvious.

I have never heard of a policy that does not require the car to be insured in another persons name but akrasia says this is common. Admittedly though I only have experience with a small number of policies, parents, in laws, partners and my own, plus a few friends. I have read most of these due to swapping cars around for various reasons. Maybe Akrasia is right but I presume there would be some other requirement for the car to be insured. When I say roadworthy, I am talking about, what would be legally required to be driving on the road.

Good stuff. Can you give a list of the companies that will not cover you third party extension on cars that are not currently insured by someone else.

Off the top of your head like, don't be going to any hassle. You surely remember a few.
To be fair it actually has starting creeping (back?) in (again?) now. There was a time when NOBODY could actually produce a policy document that could support that assertion when asked.

iwillhtfu

CramCycle wrote: »

I have never heard of a policy that does not require the car to be insured in another persons name but akrasia says this is common.

That'd be because they don't exist or at least I couldn't find one. I have to insure a car for 2 evenings a week school/creche run approx 6km drive. It literally sits on the drive more than it is used. €450/annum I actually considered opening a taxi account and having the taxi pick them up. :eek:

The insurance system over here needs a complete overhaul and not just the cost of insurance also the pay out and compensation claims.

To nip it in the bud. Yes it's only 6kms which I happily walked/biked during summer months with 4 kids in tow. However due to lack of cycling infrastructure and also unsuitable footpaths for walking on a car was required for the winter months.

iwillhtfu

TallGlass wrote: »

Hi CramCycle,

You can see here from Liberty there is no mention of it needing to be insured, it does need to be in a roadworthy condition, not in your name and you are not currently insured on it. Obviously it would need to be taxed to use it on a public road.

Check your Certificate of Insurance to see if you are covered to drive other cars. If so, the policyholder will have third party only cover to drive other private motor cars that are temporarily borrowed, under the following conditions:

the vehicle is not owned by you or your employer or hired to you or them under a hire-purchase or lease agreement;
you currently hold a full European Union (EU) licence;
[B]the use of the vehicle is covered in the Certificate of Insurance;[/B]
cover is not provided by any other insurance;
you have the owner’s permission to drive the vehicle;
the vehicle is in a roadworthy condition;
you still have your vehicle and it has not been damaged beyond cost-effective repair; and
your occupation is not restricted by our acceptance criteria.
This extension applies while being driven in Ireland or the UK, and only to private passenger vehicles.

I don't think you're reading that right. I called liberty and they said all cars have to carry an insurance policy to be driven on our roads. The only exemption is a mechanic can cover it on their policy/plates Mon-Fri.

Cows Go µ

Aviva is one that the other vehicle needs to have insurance: https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.aviva.ie/media-library/MotorCare%2520Policy%2520Booklet.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwi5vOb7stDRAhUBLMAKHZhaBT8QFgggMAI&usg=AFQjCNEw9rIBz1iKepf3_IDQOqpG0wrt7A&sig2=PCwT8aZVSmHh7BwBBlLLvw

This cover will only apply if –

4 a current certificate of insurance
has been issued and remains in
force on the Private car being
driven under the Driving other
cars cover provided

TallGlass

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I don't think you're reading that right. I called liberty and they said all cars have to carry an insurance policy to be driven on our roads. The only exemption is a mechanic can cover it on their policy/plates Mon-Fri.

True, not saying I disagree with you but I was told the opposite!

What I think 'the use of the vehicle is covered in the Certificate of Insurance', means in this case is that, your own COI actually says that you can drive other cars 'third party'! It says it on mine (might double check it), maybe you can opt out of it or something?

But in fairness, I don't think I have drove another car that wasn't insured in some way or another. So has never really been an issue, but I have an old car that needs NCT, has Tax and Valid NCT at the moment, just no insurance so was going to get the oul lad to drive it to the centre for me. So might just double check what the situation is there.

Special Circumstances

CramCycle wrote: »

I have never heard of a policy that does not require the car to be insured in another persons name but akrasia says this is common..

iwillhtfu wrote: »

That'd be because they don't exist or at least I couldn't find one.

I've never ever ever had a policy that required the other car to be insured so that my mandatory minimum required insurance would be "enabled".

CramCycle

CramCycle wrote: »

Most policies it needs to be insured and/or roadworthy i.e. NCT and taxed. All of mine have always been that the car has insurance on it and is not owned by me. It maybe a common misconception but I have yet to meet anyone where it is not applicable.

I've been insured with 3 or 4 different insurance companies as well as seeing policies from others. Never have I see the stipulation that it must be insured. That would mean most insurance companies operating in Ireland I have not seen this rule.

You are most likely misinterpreting what is said, as I've seen people claim this about their policy and when I read their cert it doesn't say it at all. The line that is usually misinterpreted is one stating that driving other cars only applies if you are not covered by another policy on the car i.e. if you are a named driver that over rules the driving other cars. People read this as meaning the other car must be insured for some reason.

xabi

Why wont insurance do a temp swap? Tell them its a loaner from garage while your car gets fixed.

challengemaster

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I don't think you're reading that right. I called liberty and they said all cars have to carry an insurance policy to be driven on our roads. The only exemption is a mechanic can cover it on their policy/plates Mon-Fri.

I've had Quinn/Liberty insurance for years - other car doesn't require it's own Insurance.

and BTW you could call Liberty 5 times and get 5 different answers from the different people on the phone. Doesn't matter what anyone says - what matters is what's written on the policy.

They're right in the sense that it needs to be insured (third party) to be driven on the road - but that insurance is covered by the driving other cars extension. It doesn't need a separate insurance policy of its own, nor is that stipulated in the policy documents.

The only real caveat is once you park the car it's uninsured.

lawred2

TequilaMockingBird wrote: »

What would you do? My head is wrecked trying to sort it out.

Edit: Uninsured car is in remotest place in Ireland or I'd hire a car for the day, but there's nowhere to leave it back out there.

I also don't have anyone to ask to drive me out that far.

Well what I wouldn't do is drive uninsured.

Special Circumstances

Cows Go µ wrote: »

Aviva is one that the other vehicle needs to have insurance: https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.aviva.ie/media-library/MotorCare%2520Policy%2520Booklet.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwi5vOb7stDRAhUBLMAKHZhaBT8QFgggMAI&usg=AFQjCNEw9rIBz1iKepf3_IDQOqpG0wrt7A&sig2=PCwT8aZVSmHh7BwBBlLLvw

This cover will only apply if –

4 a current certificate of insurance
has been issued and remains in
force on the Private car being
driven under the Driving other
cars cover provided

Yeah I think I was Aviva that was mentioned the last time this came up too. There's a whole bunch of reasons that Aviva won't insure me, not least because my car was damaged by a third party through no faul of my own and I had to claim off that persons policy.

Yup, Aviva won't insure anyone who has been the innocent victim of a bad driver, even if it was the bad drivers insurance that paid out.

Akrasia

CramCycle wrote: »

Most policies it needs to be insured and/or roadworthy i.e. NCT and taxed. All of mine have always been that the car has insurance on it and is not owned by me. It maybe a common misconception but I have yet to meet anyone where it is not applicable.

No insurance claim ever has been declined because the car wasn't taxed

ted1

Akrasia wrote: »

You're unlucky to have arse holes as an insurance company. Most companies don't require the vehicle to be otherwise insured.

But regardless the OP has third party only insurance so probably doesn't have driving other cars on her policy so this doesn't apply

Most companies do. Otherwise people will but Micras and legally be driving 5 litre sports cars around.

iwillhtfu

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I don't think you're reading that right. I called liberty and they said all cars have to carry an insurance policy to be driven on our roads. The only exemption is a mechanic can cover it on their policy/plates Mon-Fri.

I called liberty about this a few years ago and they told me the other car 100% does not have to be insured. It does require an NCT though.

ted1 wrote: »

Most companies do. Otherwise people will but Micras and legally be driving 5 litre sports cars around.

No they don't, most companies do not require it to be insured. Some companies do limit the engine size of the other car though I think. My policy does not however, I can drive any car I want if its insured or not once I don't own it, lease it or owned by my employer.

Sam Kade

copeyhagen wrote: »

I done it a few years ago, but its dodgy obviously.

but then there what, 20% of drivers on the road or whaqtever their statistic was a few weeks back driving uninsured?!

I picked car up from Dublin docks, was told everything would be ok to insure it in order to drive it to the vrt centre (in santry at the time)

picked up car, rang insurance back "oh we didn't know it was on Japanese plates, nothing we can do"
err, I had clearly explained it was on jap plates.

it was like 3.30 and I think the old vrt place closed in like 40 minutes, so I drove the car through the port tunnel to the vrt office.

If the cutoms stopped you it would be bye bye Japanese car and more than likely a fine to boot.

Akrasia

challengemaster wrote: »

The only real caveat is once you park the car it's uninsured.

This isn't really relevant because when you're driving the car it's third party cover only. Fire and theft isn't covered whether the car is parked or driving. Unless you're an idiot and park the car in a dangerous place causing an accident, a parked car isn't going to cause any insurance risk to other drivers

Special Circumstances

ted1 wrote: »

Most companies do. Otherwise people will but Micras and legally be driving 5 litre sports cars around.

Can you name two others? Apart from Aviva. Who are undoubtedly @rseholes of the worst kind.

iwillhtfu

challengemaster wrote: »

I've had Quinn/Liberty insurance for years - other car doesn't require it's own Insurance.

and BTW you could call Liberty 5 times and get 5 different answers from the different people on the phone. Doesn't matter what anyone says - what matters is what's written on the policy.

They're right in the sense that it needs to be insured (third party) to be driven on the road - but that insurance is covered by the driving other cars extension. It doesn't need a separate insurance policy of its own, nor is that stipulated in the policy documents.

The only real caveat is once you park the car it's uninsured.

I've sent off another round of emails there to several insurance companies. If I hear back that I don't need to have a seperate policy on the car I won't be pleased. :mad:

CramCycle

Allianz
AXA
AIG

Have all required it, both verbally and on the document for me. I also think Quinn had it but I don't think I was covered to drive other cars with them, that was along time ago.

FBD in my fathers case

Cannot remember any other insurers.

Special Circumstances

CramCycle wrote: »

Allianz
AXA
AIG

Have all required it, both verbally and on the document for me. I also think Quinn had it but I don't think I was covered to drive other cars with them, that was along time ago.

FBD in my fathers case

Cannot remember any other insurers.

First one on your list makes no mention of it in current policy documentation
https://www.allianz.ie/allianz-insurance-documents/

– Driving other Cars
We will insure You in respect of legal liability, as provided under Section 1 (Third Party
Insurance) whilst You are driving another Private Car, provided such Private Car:
1. Does not belong to You or Your employer.
2. Is not hired or leased to either of the parties described above under a Hire Purchase or
Leasing Agreement.
3. Is not the property of or in the custody or control of a Motor Trade business of which You are a director, member or employee.
Cover under this Endorsement is limited to use within Ireland and the United Kingdom only.

iwillhtfu

Hang on a second is the first point not a game ender.

"The vehicle is not owned by you or your employer or hired to you or them under a hire-purchase or lease agreement;"