Disc vs Rim brakes

Lumen

Zen0 wrote: »

One disadvantage of discs which I have just realised it's that fixing a broken spoke on the disc side becomes more complex. It wouldn't necessarily put me off discs, but I have yet to do the job. Maybe I should get an emergency spoke.

On the other hand disc wheels have so many spokes the wheel is unlikely to go far out of true, and even if it does you won't get brake rub.

Chips Lovell

I suppose one advantage of disc brakes is that you can use full carbon clincher rims without the associated danger of cooking them, but feck me, 1770g is a bit porky, isn't it?

Tenzor07

Aero wheels are generally heavier than non-aero rims...

For example: Zipp 404 Firecrest Carbon Clinchers have claimed weights of 725g and 895g (1,620g total)

xxyyzz

lethal, nobody told this guy unfortunately
https://twitter.com/philmaertens/status/838846885133701121

OleRodrigo

Alek wrote: »

Coming down from the Kilmashogue lane today, 18% gradient, in the dark and wet, with a blind bend at the end, I realised I can probably fry any rim brake wheels you throw at me in a week of this kind of cycling.

I know it sounds crazy but you could always choose another hill when its wet and dark.

Unless you were out looking for a problem to apply your clunky and expensive solution to....in which case carry on

Alek

Unless you were out looking for a problem to apply your clunky and expensive solution to....in which case carry on

Very smart.

I wanted to do 5 reps of the hill before work, so I did. This meant starting in the dark.

Having rim brakes wouldn't really stop me (pun not intended), as I ride hills most often, but I probably go through aluminium hoops in higher rate than I change worn out rotors now.

benneca1

I always used discs on MTB but on my road bike discs are solving  a problem which does not exist I can descend with the best and honestly the problem never was that I wasnt able to slow the wheel the problem always is will the tyre hold. with MTB unitl V brakes came you couldnt even slow the wheel on a wet day and after v brakes you went through rims for sport wicklo mud and brake pads seems to be very abrasive, None of this applies on road. Nonetheless marketeers think we should have them so we will (they are noisy bastards on the road too because I think road spray has more oily material in it than what you encounter off road)

Alek

on my road bike discs are solving a problem which does not exist

My road bike gets ridden on many very narrow and often steep back roads in the mountains, with bushes or walls on both sides.. Going downhill, even cautiously, and being able to break before the oncoming car is something worth considering...

wasnt able to slow the wheel the problem always is will the tyre hold.

This is why road disc calipers don't have the MTB power / grab. And also why I run 35mm tyres on my (all)road bike.

Tenzor07

benneca1 wrote: »

I always used discs on MTB but on my road bike discs are solving  a problem which does not exist I can descend with the best and honestly the problem never was that I wasnt able to slow the wheel the problem always is will the tyre hold.

That sounds like an opinion based on experience!

Cerdito

I just built a Surly LHT for touring. Had the choice of rim or disc brakes. I went with rim brakes over disc brakes myself for the following reasons:

Cost saving - disc brake components are more expensive. I also already had a set of wheels (Mavic rims w/ Deore hubs) that were rim brake models.

Complexity - I can adjust rim brakes in my sleep. Disc brakes can be fiddly to adjust and optimize. I had disc on an MTB before and I couldn't get them to stop rubbing/squealing

Flying with bike - I plan to fly with my bike to the start of a tour. Disc's are another component that can get damaged (e.g. bent rotors). Rim brakes v. unlikely to be damaged and an easy swap if they are

I have never had an issue stopping with rim brakes, even fully loaded in the wet (25kg+). There seems to be a drive to add complexity to the simplistic beauty of the bicycle and this gives rise to things like disc brakes and electronic groupsets that require special support systems.

Zen0

Lumen wrote: »

On the other hand disc wheels have so many spokes the wheel is unlikely to go far out of true, and even if it does you won't get brake rub.

True. In fact I rode 100km on the broken spoke at the weekend and only noticed towards the end. It was only when I spotted the damage that I realised what the ping sound I had heard earlier was. Luckily the wheel didn't collapse.

Tenzor07

Cerdito wrote: »

Flying with bike - I plan to fly with my bike to the start of a tour. Disc's are another component that can get damaged (e.g. bent rotors). Rim brakes v. unlikely to be damaged and an easy swap if they are.

Likely if you're using a cardboard box!

The discs can always be removed if someone is worried the discs may bend, otherwise in a decent bike bag there's no issue, and stick a bit of cardboard between the pads if worried about pads sticking..simple..

Zen0

So after 12 pages of debate, the answer is pretty clear. Discs all the way

Mods, can we lock this thread now before it reaches the size of the helmet thread

OleRodrigo

Zen0 wrote: »

So after 12 pages of debate, the answer is pretty clear. Discs all the way

Well, that would be in line with the mass delusion the bike industry has successfully perpetrated upon impressionable road cyclists.

Tenzor07

Injury caused to Francisco Ventoso, which occurred
after an incident during the Paris-Roubaix in 2016 not due to disc brakes:


http://www.wfsgi.org/system/files/2017-02/Report_DiscBrakes_UZollinger.pdf

cython

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Injury caused to Francisco Ventoso, which occurred
after an incident during the Paris-Roubaix in 2015, not due to disc brakes:


http://www.wfsgi.org/system/files/2017-02/Report_DiscBrakes_UZollinger.pdf

It may seem like a triviality, but the glaring error of the letter claiming that an incident from PR 2016 happened in 2015 doesn't provide the best first impression of the expert, all other aspects aside.....

OleRodrigo

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Injury caused to Francisco Ventoso, which occurred
after an incident during the Paris-Roubaix in 2015, not due to disc brakes:


http://www.wfsgi.org/system/files/2017-02/Report_DiscBrakes_UZollinger.pdf

Hmm. So a private and expensive consultancy provides an analysis in support of the safety of disc brakes?

You wouldn't want to be cynical about the power of commercial interests.

xxyyzz

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Hmm. So a private and expensive consultancy provides an analysis in support of the safety of disc brakes?

You wouldn't want to be cynical about the power of commercial interests.

Well that and the fact that the other bike would have to have been going in the opposite direction for the rotor to somehow contact his left leg.

He made an utter tool of himself and I suspect Doull is in the same boat.

OleRodrigo

xxyyzz wrote: »

Well that and the fact that the other bike would have to have been going in the opposite direction for the rotor to somehow contact his left leg.

He made an utter tool of himself and I suspect Doull is in the same boat.

What would their motive be for lying ?

Maybe they really dislike disc brakes and lied out of childish insolence.

xxyyzz

OleRodrigo wrote: »

What would their motive be for lying ?

Maybe they really dislike disc brakes and lied out of childish insolence.

Your trolling leaves a bit to be desired.

doozerie

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Hmm. So a private and expensive consultancy provides an analysis in support of the safety of disc brakes?

You wouldn't want to be cynical about the power of commercial interests.

There is so much hyperbole around this topic, some of it in this thread, that it's hard to know whether you are being serious or not.

To me the analysis is not "in support of the safety of disc brakes", it just concludes that they were an unlikely cause of the injury in this case. If you disagree with their conclusion it would be interesting to hear why.

And if we are being generally facetious and/or conspiracy theorists then I suspect we'd get more mileage out of claiming that that analysis is actually secretly funded by the people behind the Gates Carbon Drive System, trying to cast aspersions on the dangers of conventional toothed blades on the vast majority of bikes (their chainrings have teeth too, but they are hippy teeth and spread peace, not war).

OleRodrigo

doozerie wrote: »

There is so much hyperbole around this topic, some of it in this thread, that it's hard to know whether you are being serious or not.

To me the analysis is not "in support of the safety of disc brakes", it just concludes that they were an unlikely cause of the injury in this case. If you disagree with their conclusion it would be interesting to hear why.

And if we are being generally facetious and/or conspiracy theorists then I suspect we'd get more mileage out of claiming that that analysis is actually secretly funded by the people behind the Gates Carbon Drive System, trying to cast aspersions on the dangers of conventional toothed blades on the vast majority of bikes (their chainrings have teeth too, but they are hippy teeth and spread peace, not war).

Bumped into Mrs.Doozerie yesterday on the Tara 200

Can I just say that:
1. Disc brakes are awesome
2. I suck and have no taste.
3. See number 1

ford2600

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Bumped into Mrs.Doozerie yesterday on the Tara 200

Can I just say that:
1. Disc brakes are awesome
2. I suck and have no taste.
3. See number 1

Sounds like you cracked in cross examination...:D

OleRodrigo

ford2600 wrote: »

Sounds like you cracked in cross examination...:D

Too right !

Macy0161

I'm having to change my wheels, and am considering an upgrade. Nice additional whack on the likes of Zondas for disc brake versions.

ford2600

Macy0161 wrote: »

I'm having to upgrade my wheels, and am considering an upgrade. Nice additional whack on the likes of Zondas for disc brake versions.

Olerodrigo is after cracking.

Buy the Zondas, fit them with your shimano groupset and go for a spin with gaa shorts and a swimming cap. Post up a photo then and he'll probably have a stroke

Lumen

I rode my rim braked bike yesterday for the first time in about a year.

It was really surprising to find how uncomfortable the ride quality was compared to my disc braked bike.

This reminds me that road brakes of all types just work and there are more important things to drive a bike purchase.

dvntie

07Lapierre wrote: »

To improve your descending skills, you've got to learn NOT to use your brakes. IMO Overuse of the brakes (rim or disc) will not improve your descending.

This is me descending Col De Galibier....https://youtu.be/jHL45P1w45g

I'm not the fastest descender but you'll note that I don't brake too often...the trick is to try and NOT use your brakes.

And if you are to use your brakes the rear brake is to slow down the front is to stop.

benneca1

"There seems to be a drive to add complexity to the simplistic beauty of the bicycle and this gives rise to things like disc brakes and electronic groupsets that require special support systems."
Ah but elecronic groupsets look cool and no ugly cables

NamelessPhil

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Bumped into Mrs.Doozerie yesterday on the Tara 200

Can I just say that:
1. Disc brakes are awesome
2. I suck and have no taste.
3. See number 1

Ahem, that'll be Ms. NamelessPhil to you! I didn't take his Boards name when we married.

Disc brakes are awesome on an Audax bike, I have rim brakes on the road bike and commuter bike and I find them twitchy and hand-cramping in comparison. That's a nice Genesis equilibrium that you have that could only be improved by disc brakes.😀