Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

Robson99

bangkok wrote: »

Palace away, West Ham away, Swansea away, fenerbace home, arsenal home

Arsenal game aside he was pretty anonymous in all the other big games. Palace,Swansea, West Ham & fenerbarche are hardly the games we were expecting / hoping him to star in when spunking 90m+on him

Robson99

Jayop wrote: »

The comparison to Mings one is silly really. Mings looked down to see where Zlatan was, then he forced his foot down. He didn't lift his boot on contact, it slid off Zlatan's head and continued down.

They're nothing like the same.

Rojo seen where Hazard was as well and put the boot in. Simples really. Why would they chose to ignore it

Jayop

bucketybuck wrote: »

And yet nobody is criticising Rashford who was even further forward and getting even less service.

Pogba bring pushed forward is one of the weakest defences for a poor performance I've heard in a while, he wasn't told to stand by the corner flag you know, he could have done a lot more than he did.

Fact is, before the game we knew we needed a big performance from him. Yet again we didn't get it.

They're not. Thanks for pointing that out. If they're complaining about one surely they should complain about the other. Rashford did as little as Pogba apart from the run and chance which he fluffed. You can bet if the roles were reversed, what's saving Rashford from criticism tonight would be another stick to beat Pogba with.

Jayop

Robson99 wrote: »

Rojo seen where Hazard was as well and put the boot in. Simples really. Why would they chose to ignore it

He didn't look down in the reply I seen.

Robson99

Jayop wrote: »

He didn't look down in the reply I seen.

Jayop take a look at it from a few different angles. He put his right leg into Hazard. I just dont see how he will get away with it

adox

I'd be amazed if Rojo doesn't get done. Amazed.

Jayop

Mings...

Looks down (you can see it clearly on 17 seconds) to see where Zlatan's head was. Stamped him and the boot continued down sliding off Zlatan's head.

Rojo...

As you can see on the angle from behind he doesn't look down to see where he is. Player falls under him, he immediately lifts his foot away upon contact. Clearly didn't apply pressure given that Hazard isn't in intensive care considering Herrera almost killed him earlier.

xtal191

Looks intentional to me, be surprised if he doesn't get a 3 match ban

https://twitter.com/ManLikeSmalling/status/841408405411659776

adox

Jayop wrote: »

He didn't look down in the reply I seen.

He tustled with Hazard for the ball. Was right behind him in close contact and then Hazard went down. Hazard was only ever going to be in front of him on the ground. He doesn't have to look down to know where to leave his foot if he wants to.

I think it was certainly intentional and he will get banned. I can't see any way he won't get done for it.

Robson99

Jayop wrote: »

Mings...

Looks down (you can see it clearly on 17 seconds) to see where Zlatan's head was. Stamped him and the boot continued down sliding off Zlatan's head.

Rojo...

As you can see on the angle from behind he doesn't look down to see where he is. Player falls under him, he immediately lifts his foot away upon contact. Clearly didn't apply pressure given that Hazard isn't in intensive care considering Herrera almost killed him earlier.

How can you tell what way he is looking from behind. His eyes are at the front of his head

jambofc

adox wrote: »

It's a second yellow. Ref talks to the captain after Hazard is fouled for the seventh or eight time in the half and warns him about the constant fouling of the player. Free kick is taken, maybe a ten yard pass to Hazard and he's fouled.

It was idiotic from Herrera and got what he deserved imo.

It can be debated but I don't get the "ref fecked us over, never a second yellow in a million years" narrative being spun

lol fouled he went down at the thought someone was near him,ive yet to see an angle that Hazard was even touched for the second yellow Anders got even if he did in the context of THAT challenge it was not a yellow card no debate about it
idiotic lol dude ya need a chill out
we fought well in the game but i do agree with you on Pogba he needs dropping he just fafs about during games and is giving us nothing that any ordinary midfielder could give us,i'd say Basti would do far better than him at the minute

imo he needs a good kick up the arse

Utopia Parkway

xtal191 wrote: »

Looks intentional to me, be surprised if he doesn't get a 3 match ban

https://twitter.com/ManLikeSmalling/status/841408405411659776

Definitely looked intentional anyway. You don't have to look directly at someone to know roughly where they are. It's one of those "he knew what he was doing" ones.

Jayop

Robson99 wrote: »

How can you tell what way he is looking from behind. His eyes are at the front of his head

Good christ. Try jumping like that and looking down without tilting your head. His head stays as if he's looking forward.

Also, you literally said "Rojo seen where Hazard was as well and put the boot in.".

How can you tell that he seen him then?

Can't have it both ways.

adox

jambofc wrote: »

lol fouled he went down at the thought someone was near him,ive yet to see an angle that Hazard was even touched for the second yellow Anders got even if he did in the context of THAT challenge it was not a yellow card no debate about it
idiotic lol dude ya need a chill out
we fought well in the game but i do agree with you on Pogba he needs dropping he just fafs about during games and is giving us nothing that any ordinary midfielder could give us,i'd say Basti would do far better than him at the minute

imo he needs a good kick up the arse

Lol all you want. How can there be "no debate about it" when we are debating it?

I'm plenty chilled out. i don't know why you think I'm not.

Robson99

Jayop wrote: »

Good christ. Try jumping like that and looking down without tilting your head. His head stays as if he's looking forward.

Also, you literally said "Rojo seen where Hazard was as well and put the boot in.".

How can you tell that he seen him then?

Can't have it both ways.

Rełax I meant that as a joke!!!
But if you look at it from the front angle he clearly sees where Hazard is and puts the boot in. Just hope its only 3 games he gets

adox

You don't have to be looking at a player to know where he is to stamp on him when he falls directly in front of you.

Jayop

adox wrote: »

You don't have to be looking at a player to know where he is to stamp on him when he falls directly in front of you.

I was arguing that it was nothing like the Mings one for two reasons.

1) Mings looked down, seen where he was and studded him on the head
2) Rojo clearly used zero force and lifts the foot immediatly, Mings followed through and the boot slid off.

After saying this the poster said they were exactly the same and Mings lifted his boot off after contact and Rojo looked down. Both things are untrue and I'm pointing that out.

Personally I've never seen a stamp that was intentional and the person removes the boot immediately so not to cause damage. Seems counter productive to the whole stamping thing.

Jayop

Robson99 wrote: »

Rełax I meant that as a joke!!!
But if you look at it from the front angle he clearly sees where Hazard is and puts the boot in. Just hope its only 3 games he gets

Aye you meant it as a joke now when videos show you're wrong.

Fair enough :rolleyes:

jambofc

adox wrote: »

Lol all you want. How can there be "no debate about it" when we are debating it?

I'm plenty chilled out. i don't know why you think I'm not.

it was not a yellow card offence the ref punished Anders for previous fouls is nonsense,have you seen an angle in which he even made contact with Hazard ?
and as said Hazard just kept on dropping at the slightest touch all that is wrong with football today.Costa aswell

Robson99

Jayop wrote: »

Aye you meant it as a joke now when videos show you're wrong.

Fair enough :rolleyes:

No but twist it whatever way you want to make you happy. Time will tell

adox

Jayop wrote: »

I was arguing that it was nothing like the Mings one for two reasons.

1) Mings looked down, seen where he was and studded him on the head
2) Rojo clearly used zero force and lifts the foot immediatly, Mings followed through and the boot slid off.

After saying this the poster said they were exactly the same and Mings lifted his boot off after contact and Rojo looked down. Both things are untrue and I'm pointing that out.

Personally I've never seen a stamp that was intentional and the person removes the boot immediately so not to cause damage. Seems counter productive to the whole stamping thing.

But your boot will naturally slide off someone's head if you catch it in the right place. Catching someone on the torso you are always going to have to take your foot back up because there is nowhere for it to go.

The force of the stamp is irrelevant.

If you watch Mings, he looks down at Ibra before he procedes to stamp. He's not looking down at him when he stamps on him but we both agree it was intentional. Rojo didn't need to look at him when planting his foot back down for it to be an intentional stamp.

I'd put money on him getting a three game ban for violent conduct.

Nalz

jambofc wrote: »

it was not a yellow card offence the ref punished Anders for previous fouls is nonsense,have you seen an angle in which he even made contact with Hazard ?
and as said Hazard just kept on dropping at the slightest touch all that is wrong with football today.Costa aswell

Costa dived or exaturated all night, Hazard did it twice. He was fouled a lot. I love how people are saying we kicked him all night... Most of the fouls against Hazard were pushes, trips, leans or body blocks. There was no kicking.

secman

All things aside..... we are way of the pace ...league table is a fair reflection of where we are at the moment.
Season started slow.... we picked up... playing well... creating lots of chances.... but of late our creativity has really dried up. Very lucky to beat Southampton, poor against Bournemouth, not great against Rostov.... apart from a few players tonight we were poor again. Pogba has been a huge disappointment , Darmian not good enough. Looks like we still need a clear out....

Shane St.

Lots of ppl writing pogba off. He has everything. Yes he's been very poor since the liverpool game and underwhelming in most of the big games but i believe mourinho will sign the players in the summer and tailor the tactics to get the best out of him.

Cantona's Collars

Papers saying Veratti wants to leave PSG,we've been linked with him a good bit. Could be a big option for us.

StringerBell

Veratti can pick whatever team he wants to go to, Bayern/Madrid/Juve etc. He is a long shot to say the least imo

beno619

Jayop wrote: »

Was I wrong in saying it was a tactical decision?

How do you expect Pogba should have done better in the second half given where he was playing and the service he got?

Why is there always an excuse for him ?

You don't believe there was any plausible way he could have had a better game ?

Jose's positional change made it impossible for him to bother his hole in the second half ?

It's incredible the standards people hold the likes of Lingard, Young and Valencia to who are technically inferior to Pogba but when a so called world class midfielder who's gone two months without putting in a decent performance it's everyone else fault but his own.

fullstop

Jayop wrote: »

I was arguing that it was nothing like the Mings one for two reasons.

1) Mings looked down, seen where he was and studded him on the head
2) Rojo clearly used zero force and lifts the foot immediatly, Mings followed through and the boot slid off.

After saying this the poster said they were exactly the same and Mings lifted his boot off after contact and Rojo looked down. Both things are untrue and I'm pointing that out.

Personally I've never seen a stamp that was intentional and the person removes the boot immediately so not to cause damage. Seems counter productive to the whole stamping thing.

Keep clutching at straws all you want, he stamped on him and will most likely get banned. The fact that he realised what he was doing was completely stupid and then pulled away is neither here nor there really.

Liam McPoyle

Pogba was poor last night, again. The price tag skews some peoples perception of what he should be doing but he didn't look like a £30 million player last night never mind a £90 million one.

He will come good i think and we will see why we paid what we paid over the coming seasons but the last few months for him are concerning.

Rojo clearly stamped on Hazard, it will be a minimum of a 3 game sanction, possibly more considering he got away with a couple of shockers earlier in the season, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him get 5.

Nalz

Pogba was doing ok 11 V 11

secman

Nalz wrote: »

Pogba was doing ok 11 V 11

Ok so

Nalz

secman wrote: »

Ok so

He was to be fair to him. I know we expect more and we should but he's still only 23 and first proper season in England. He's played a shít load of football consecutively and will come good.


However, he does infuriate me at times as does Lingard, Rooney, Fellaini etc... As much as those guys.

I expected his finishing to be much better. One thing that surprised me since he has joined.

bangkok

Jose says pogba was the best utd player last night..

Trigger

bangkok wrote: »

Jose says pogba was the best utd player last night..

You actually think that he believed himself when he said that. Pogba looks seriously low on confidence atm and that is just Jose's way of trying to instill a bit in him.. Jones Rojo and DeGea were all better than him..

Mantis Toboggan

bangkok wrote: »

Jose says pogba was the best utd player last night..

Pogba was possibly the worst player on the field last night.

The_Kew_Tour

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but no matter what some will turn a blind eye and its painful reading, like banging head against wall stuff.

How in gods name do people think Pogba had a good game. How??!!!!

Pickpocket

That was difficult to watch last night. We'll never know what Jose's exact instructions were but at the very least he sent his team out to bruise Chelsea up a bit.

In relation to the second yellow, well Hazard made the most of it but that's exactly what Herrera does week in week out. Cheating and diving. He's quickly turning into one of the most unlikeable players in the league. Ditto Marcus Rojo. Up until now I thought (hoped) that he just had a bit of a temperament issue that could be sorted out, but he's starting to emerge now as a genuine thug. Hopefully he gets a three game ban for that stamp. It has no place at the club.

Then there's Pogba. I take people's point about him being tired, but his heart doesn't seem to be in it either. Laughing and joking at the final whistle isn't a good look either, especially when you've just been one of the worst players on the pitch at a quarter final. He's entitled to embrace his friends and ex-colleagues after the match but everything from the smile on his face to the hair on his head tells me his mind is elsewhere. He's a genuine talent but he's currently a shadow of the player he was last season. It's hard to accept he's the most expensive player in the world.

Backstreet Moyes

Pogba needs a break or I hope that is the reason he has been awful the last few weeks.

A long year last year and no pre season he could do with being benched.

FutureGuy

Ah lads there is no defending Rojo. That was a stamp. He'll get a ban.

Minderbinder

Tyson Fury wrote: »

bangkok wrote: »

Jose says pogba was the best utd player last night..

Pogba was possibly the worst player on the field last night.

No, that would be Herrera who cost us the game. Still not sure what people see in him. He is certainly not good enough to be captain of the club.

beno619

Nalz wrote: »

Pogba was doing ok 11 V 11

He did do okay in the first half to be fair.

Pete Moss

Rod Munch wrote: »

Pogba was poor last night, again. The price tag skews some peoples perception of what he should be doing but he didn't look like a £30 million player last night never mind a £90 million one.

He will come good i think and we will see why we paid what we paid over the coming seasons but the last few months for him are concerning.

Rojo clearly stamped on Hazard, it will be a minimum of a 3 game sanction, possibly more considering he got away with a couple of shockers earlier in the season, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him get 5.

Just to play devil's advocate, but in what role do you think he'll come good at? So far - and I'm aware it's very early days - but so far, it's been very hard to identify what his exact role is in midfield, or at least as to what role he'll progress in.

He doesn't seem to posses the intelligence of a Scholes or Xavi to fill the role of a playmaker. He's not contributing with goals, as Lampard or Gerrard did. He's not breaking up the play, in a similar fashion to Kante. He doesn't seem to posses the qualitative leadership factor which can be seen in someone like Zlatan. He has talent, no doubt and maybe it's a case that he can do all of the above to some extent like a 'jack of all trades, master of none'.

Backstreet Moyes

Minderbinder wrote: »

No, that would be Herrera who cost us the game. Still not sure what people see in him. He is certainly not good enough to be captain of the club.

He is a better player than Pogba and gives everything on the pitch.

Compare to Pogba who throws his hands in the air when he loses the ball and half arses tracking back and smiling after losing.

Herrera can be reckless at times but i will take that any day over someone who downs tools when things are not going good.

bangkok

Pete Moss wrote: »

Just to play devil's advocate, but in what role do you think he'll come good at? So far - and I'm aware it's very early days - but so far, it's been very hard to identify what his exact role is in midfield, or at least as to what role he'll progress in.

He doesn't seem to posses the intelligence of a Scholes or Xavi to fill the role of a playmaker. He's not contributing with goals, as Lampard or Gerrard did. He's not breaking up the play, in a similar fashion to Kante. He doesn't seem to posses the qualitative leadership factor which can be seen in someone like Zlatan. He has talent, no doubt and maybe it's a case that he can do all of the above to some extent like a 'jack of all trades, master of none'.

Zinedine Zidane, a left sided attacking midfielder.

Leroy42

"Pogba did ok, he'll come good, its early days."

Listen to yourselves. This is nothing but hope based on blind faith.

There is simply no reason to believe that Pogba has what it takes to be a top player in the EPL. None. It is looking increasingly likely that SAF was right all along.

Ok is not good enough at this level and certainly not good enough for what is supposed to be a player capable of dominating games.

He loses nearly every 50/50 ball, he was disposed 8 times yesterday. Even if you take the line that he is struggling to adapt, these are the basics of the game and he needs to be able to do them before he can do the circus stuff.

He, like Kante, had a shot from outside the box but he didn't even get it on target. So we now have a player who can't defend, is easily dispossessed, isn't particularly good in the air, is constantly bypassed, has no leadership skills, and is not particularly good at scoring. Jebus, last week he had two chances in the 6 yard box to win the game and f3cked both of them up. So either he lacks the ability or the temperament. Neither is good.

Will he ever get better? Well given the resources tha Utd will put into him (coaching etc) then yes in all probability he will improve. But how long should we wait. How many other better players are we going to pass on while we hope that Pogba can become what we hope he can be rather than what he clearly is.

This isn't a temporary blip, or due to Utd. He was pretty crap in Euro 16, but in a bid to make it seem we were getting diamond we passed that off as the managers fault. And yet again, it seems it is not Pogbas fault for being completely useless.

You look at how Mihky was treated, how Shaw and Rooney are treated. And compare that to Pogba. He should be dropped and told to pull his finger out. He should be told, in no uncertain terms, that he is getting paid to be the key man and is failing spectacularly.

He goes missing in the big games, in the small games, when the pressure is on he panics.

What exactly are you guys expecting from him?

bucketybuck

I'm not saying dump Pogba or he is useless or anything, but there does seem to be a constant stream of excuses for him these days, I think there are more excuses than good performances at this stage.

Last night before the game I said that due to circumstances we were going to need a big performance from him, when we went to ten men it became even more important to get a big performance from him, but what did we get? Nothing. Yet again we got nothing.

Its not about one game, personally I'm just a little sick of hearing excuses for what was supposed to be one of the worlds very best midfielders.

Adamocovic

After all the talk of us having little to no chance of winning yesterday to play the majority of the game with 10 men and come that close is a big credit.

Chelsea looked to be getting into it more and more before the red card but have to say the defending and goalkeeping was very good at times, bar some blips here or there. Was sure Rashford was going to tuck away his chance.
The game was very feisty, good for the atmosphere but you could see us becoming frustrated as the game went on. Pogba seems to be the player everyones talking about. He had a poor game alright, was overrun in the midfield and was disposed far too easily.
Saying that, I think some people are jumping on him a bit too much in my eyes. I was quite vocal in my opinions about him before he came back. I didn't want him back, especially not at that price, but I think many responded that we had the money and it wasn't coming out of my pocket so why should I care, which is a fair reply.

I don't think Pogba has been as "awful" as some people make out. He had a bad game yesterday true, being overrun in the midfield at 10 men by the best team in England at the moment doesn't help. He's had a decent season so far, found himself a couple of goals, some assists and man of the match performances, but the problem is with the price tag surrounding him there is so much expectations around him being the game changer player we wanted, something he hasn't really been.

I know people argue that at that price we should be expecting someone who individually can make the difference between a draw and a win, I was in that group of people back in summer, but to be fair many warned back in summer not to fall into that thinking, and that the price was a result of modern football, agents, a team not wanting to sell, and a team willing to spend big.

Pogba is a good player that has been hampered by the price tag around him in my eyes.
It's also his birthday tomorrow, so I expect many good happy birthday posts

bangkok

Leroy42 wrote: »

"Pogba did ok, he'll come good, its early days."

Listen to yourselves. This is nothing but hope based on blind faith.

There is simply no reason to believe that Pogba has what it takes to be a top player in the EPL. None. It is looking increasingly likely that SAF was right all along.

Ok is not good enough at this level and certainly not good enough for what is supposed to be a player capable of dominating games.

He loses nearly every 50/50 ball, he was disposed 8 times yesterday. Even if you take the line that he is struggling to adapt, these are the basics of the game and he needs to be able to do them before he can do the circus stuff.

He, like Kante, had a shot from outside the box but he didn't even get it on target. So we now have a player who can't defend, is easily dispossessed, isn't particularly good in the air, is constantly bypassed, has no leadership skills, and is not particularly good at scoring. Jebus, last week he had two chances in the 6 yard box to win the game and f3cked both of them up. So either he lacks the ability or the temperament. Neither is good.

Will he ever get better? Well given the resources tha Utd will put into him (coaching etc) then yes in all probability he will improve. But how long should we wait. How many other better players are we going to pass on while we hope that Pogba can become what we hope he can be rather than what he clearly is.

This isn't a temporary blip, or due to Utd. He was pretty crap in Euro 16, but in a bid to make it seem we were getting diamond we passed that off as the managers fault. And yet again, it seems it is not Pogbas fault for being completely useless.

You look at how Mihky was treated, how Shaw and Rooney are treated. And compare that to Pogba. He should be dropped and told to pull his finger out. He should be told, in no uncertain terms, that he is getting paid to be the key man and is failing spectacularly.

He goes missing in the big games, in the small games, when the pressure is on he panics.

What exactly are you guys expecting from him?

Fergie was right about what? Fergie wanted to keep him, offered him a new contract. Raved about how good he was in the academy.

Blind fate? He has already proved he is a world class player at juve and with france. Just needs to get back to the level and has already shown glimses of it

TheDoc

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Wouldn't call Herrera a leader tbh

He's clearly a leader in that team, he organises, communicates, leads by example in terms of tackling and pressing.

He has morphed into a really important player for us, and a big part is how he sets an example.

TheDoc

Leroy42 wrote: »

Simple question.

Kante or Pogba. I defy anybody to seriously suggest we did better business than Chelsea (even forgetting about the actual money)

This is such nonsensical stuff.

So simple answer, we did with Pogba. He is just so obviously a superior talent and player that as time goes on will become so much more then Kante. I've great admiration and respect for Kante, but I'm pretty confident that we will end up with a far superior player.

While there is no hiding from Pogba being poor lately, Jose has to take some blame there for some horrendous mismanagement. I think last night was his 38 start this season, after having a long season with Juve, a long Euros and no real pre-season.

Sorry but I'm hardly surprised he looks sluggish and his performances arn't great. Where the expectations have been sky high day one, he really hasn't been managed well at all.

Whatever about criticising Pogbas performances, which are fine, some of the comments basically calling him a bust or a flop not even a full season in, is the height of capper fandom