Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

Mitch Connor

Jayop wrote: »

Liverpool have 4 games from the 29th of January to the end of February. In that same period we'll have played 7.

The away fixtures against St Etienne is the Wednesday before the cup final. Hopefully we can wrap the tie up in the home fixture so we don't need to be putting the first team out.

They only have 16 games left this season, they are going to have no fatigue issues for the remainder of the season, which is arguably what has been the cause of their crap form over January.

RobertKK

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They only have 16 games left this season, they are going to have no fatigue issues for the remainder of the season, which is arguably what has been the cause of their crap form over January.

Doesn't matter if Klopp doesn't change tactics.

Despite their lack of games, they still have only beaten Plymouth this month, and don't have good squad depth.

We are in a much better position.

Mitch Connor

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They only have 16 games left this season, they are going to have no fatigue issues for the remainder of the season, which is arguably what has been the cause of their crap form over January.

I'd also argue that if Klopp doesn't get Liverpool into the top 4 at this stage with nothing else to worry about and with their current league standing it surely would be have to be considered a sackable offence.
Best result for us tomorrow is if Chelsea rub salt into the wounds and allow us us to gain further on Liverpool...but we need to making sure we do our job.
Another draw in the league is simply not good enough.

Lovely Bloke

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They only have 16 games left this season, they are going to have no fatigue issues for the remainder of the season, which is arguably what has been the cause of their crap form over January.

that's not a very watertight argument when you consider the kids he threw under the bus on many occasions in January, then told everyone he was angry with the performances.

And the wind.

Jayop

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They only have 16 games left this season, they are going to have no fatigue issues for the remainder of the season, which is arguably what has been the cause of their crap form over January.

They played 7 games in January, two of them we're against a d2 side where they played their kids, 1 against the worst team in the league and one against a championship team. Really their first team only played 5 games in January so how they could be any more fatigued than the rest is a mystery. They clearly have no strength in depth but that's another matter.

They just look to have hit a crap patch of form and have missed two players so badly it shows their squad up. 16 games is feck all but they are so reliant on a few players that I still think they'll struggle.

Jayop

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'd also argue that if Klopp doesn't get Liverpool into the top 4 at this stage with nothing else to worry about and with their current league standing it surely would be have to be considered a sackable offence.
Best result for us tomorrow is if Chelsea rub salt into the wounds and allow us us to gain further on Liverpool...but we need to making sure we do our job.
Another draw in the league is simply not good enough.

They'll not sack him regardless and they'd be right not to. It would be a terrible failure but you can't keep sacking managers after a season or two and expect to build.

Korat

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'd also argue that if Klopp doesn't get Liverpool into the top 4 at this stage with nothing else to worry about and with their current league standing it surely would be have to be considered a sackable offence.

You are a harsh man.

Jayop

So they have 16 games left. We have a minimum of 20 and a max (barring replays) of 30 if I worked it out right.

After this round in the Europa there's 7 more games including the final and in the cup there's three more games after the fifth round.

Almost double the games should we progress in the cups.

duffman13

Jayop wrote: »

They'll not sack him regardless and they'd be right not to. It would be a terrible failure but you can't keep sacking managers after a season or two and expect to build.

Agreed, he needs some more time before they make a call and to be honest with nothing but the league to play in id still think they make top 4. They've been awful lately but there has to be a reaction from them at some point. I think they have a pretty handy run in for the last 8-10 aswell if my memory serves.

SteM

If Liverpool loose tomorrow then we'll finish above them imo. They've put all their eggs into the top 4 basket and if it starts to slip for them they'll panic. That, along with their high-pressure game will kill them off.

PS, would love if Boards could put a filter in place for the terms 'snowflake' and 'generation snowflake'. Becoming the most overused term on Boards.

Jayop

duffman13 wrote: »

Agreed, he needs some more time before they make a call and to be honest with nothing but the league to play in id still think they make top 4. They've been awful lately but there has to be a reaction from them at some point. I think they have a pretty handy run in for the last 8-10 aswell if my memory serves.

The next few games are crazy for them though. Chelsea, spurs, Leicester and arsenal in the next 5 games. Would be hilarious if they got nothing from. I those.

duffman13

With the squad we have we can really put out two separate sides, one in the league and on in the FA Cup/Europa.

De Gea
Valencia Bailly Jones Shaw
Carrick Herrera Pogba
Mkhitaryan Ibra Martial

Romero
Darmian Smalling Rojo Blind
Schweinsteiger Fellaini Rooney
Lingard Rashford Mata

With others like Fosu Mensah, Tuanzabe and Young all available too. That second team depending on the draw could be fine for FA Cup and even a round or two of the Europa. It's nice to see Mourinho start to give the likes of Ibra and Pogba a decent breather, something he was not doing before xmas for various reasons.

We have a good strong squad but we need to prioritise and the FA Cup looks like it's low on our radar at the moment which is the correct call

Jayop

Yeah I love the cup but right now it's 4th in the list in terms of priorities.

We have a great chance in the Europa league. Beat St Etienne and were in the last 16 and should be favorites.

Liam O

Jayop wrote: »

So they have 16 games left. We have a minimum of 20 and a max (barring replays) of 30 if I worked it out right.

After this round in the Europa there's 7 more games including the final and in the cup there's three more games after the fifth round.

Almost double the games should we progress in the cups.

Pogba has started to look leggy as well and there's not really anyone capable of providing what he does when he's firing. Zlatan was looking a bit less mobile too.

Schweinsteiger stood out I think yesterday despite maybe not being match fit because ironically he had the least miles on the clock in midfield. Fellaini was getting up and down the pitch too despite only playing here and there recently. If those 2 and maybe Fosu Mensah or Blind can come in and put in a performance a few times before the end of the season in midfield it could be invaluable with regards staying competitive.

duffman13

Jayop wrote: »

The next few games are crazy for them though. Chelsea, spurs, Leicester and arsenal in the next 5 games. Would be hilarious if they got nothing from. I those.

I know, huge run of games and the strange thing is Liverpool could possibly win the there next 5 games against the better sides in the league and drop crazy points on the run in. To be honest they are incredibly hard to predict, they could falter of seriously which wouldn't surprise me or bounce back and go on another great run.

Mane seems to be there saving grace at the moment but I dunno if he can make that much of a difference. Klopps team selection has been poor recently along with his in game management. The top 4 race is gonna be very interesting

Jayop

Liam O wrote: »

Pogba has started to look leggy as well and there's not really anyone capable of providing what he does when he's firing. Zlatan was looking a bit less mobile too.

Schweinsteiger stood out I think yesterday despite maybe not being match fit because ironically he had the least miles on the clock in midfield. Fellaini was getting up and down the pitch too despite only playing here and there recently. If those 2 and maybe Fosu Mensah or Blind can come in and put in a performance a few times before the end of the season in midfield it could be invaluable with regards staying competitive.

Yeah rotating is a must. If we do get to all finals it's an average of 7.5 games a month for the rest of the season. Big rotation for the fa Cup and maybe 3 players at a time for the EL.

brinty

duffman13 wrote: »

I know, huge run of games and the strange thing is Liverpool could possibly win the there next 5 games against the better sides in the league and drop crazy points on the run in. To be honest they are incredibly hard to predict, they could falter of seriously which wouldn't surprise me or bounce back and go on another great run.

Mane seems to be there saving grace at the moment but I dunno if he can make that much of a difference. Klopps team selection has been poor recently along with his in game management. The top 4 race is gonna be very interesting

Imagine what would happen if Mane ggoes down injured for the remainder of the season.

Did i see an article in the Indo on Saturday saying how the Liverpool team was still Brendans team??

Karius
Klaven
Matip
Wijnaldum
Mane

all signed by Jurgen

He's had three windows to do what he wants with the team. Its his mess now, get on with it.

Jayop

duffman13 wrote: »

I know, huge run of games and the strange thing is Liverpool could possibly win the there next 5 games against the better sides in the league and drop crazy points on the run in. To be honest they are incredibly hard to predict, they could falter of seriously which wouldn't surprise me or bounce back and go on another great run.

Mane seems to be there saving grace at the moment but I dunno if he can make that much of a difference. Klopps team selection has been poor recently along with his in game management. The top 4 race is gonna be very interesting

Mane wasn't exactly flying just before he left either.

First it was all OK because we got Klopp, then it'll be OK when Coutinhio comes back, now it'll be OK when mane comes back.

We'll wait and see I guess.

duffman13

Jayop wrote: »

Mane wasn't exactly flying just before he left either.

First it was all OK because we got Klopp, then it'll be OK when Coutinhio comes back, now it'll be OK when mane comes back.

We'll wait and see I guess.

This is true, he looked leggy and hasn't had a great time of it at AFCON. It'll be interesting to see if he straight in on Tuesday against Chelsea. Hopefully for ourselves it's a comfortable Chelsea win to keep the Liverpool heads down and get is to within a point if we beat Hull

Strange how reluctant he has been in the transfer market, no investment last January or this January. The couple of players he's signed bar Mane and Matip are only bench players (Klavan, Wiljnaldum and Karius)

newballsplease

Utd to win the Europa league and Liverpool to finish 4th

Cookiemunster

newballsplease wrote: »

Utd to win the Europa league and Liverpool to finish 4th

Would mean both qualify for the CL.

Jayop

newballsplease wrote: »

Utd to win the Europa league and Liverpool to finish 4th

United to finish in the top 4 and win the Europa would be the sickener for them. Taking their top 4 spot and then not needing it.

Glorious.

StringerBell

Lovely Bloke wrote: »

Body language experts now. Good grief. It's a hookum theory most of the time, but when amateur psychologists start analyzing players on a discussion forum it's time to check yourself.

Would you ever get over yourself

yabadabado

Once Mane went to AFCON he suddenly became this unreal player.Don't get me wrong he is good but he wasn't single handedly dragging Pool up the table.
He seems to be used as an excuse for them having a terrible run of results.

Flint Fredstone

yabadabado wrote: »

Once Mane went to AFCON he suddenly became this unreal player.Don't get me wrong he is good but he wasn't single handedly dragging Pool up the table.
He seems to be used as an excuse for them having a terrible run of results.

Hopefully that penalty miss is weighing on his mind for a couple of months or so.

TheDoc

Jayop wrote: »

Jesus that's incredibly harsh on martial.

Like I said it might be.

But he was clearly painted in the spotlight by Jose in the buildup, so naturally all attention was on him. Thought he was dire in the first half and while improved in the second half, don't believe the point where Mourinho will consider it a plan that worked.

Seeing a lot of tweets and posts about his assists, and that somehow translates to a good game. sorry but there is more to a performance then "assists", a statistic already a bit blown out of proportion if I'm being honest.

Trigger

Mitch Connor wrote: »

seriously, where are the reports of Woodward being in Munich? I am seeing nothing - can anyone provide a link.

Not that I think it is transfer related, but I don't even see a basis for the speculation.

Its more than likely bull**** imo.

It's coming from an SergeMUFC on twitter who said his mate was on a flight to Munich that Woody was on.. though in fairness why would he lie.

https://twitter.com/SergeMUFC/status/825992674108928000

If true It's more than likely to do with the Munich anniversary imo

sky88

duffman13 wrote: »

With the squad we have we can really put out two separate sides, one in the league and on in the FA Cup/Europa.

De Gea
Valencia Bailly Jones Shaw
Carrick Herrera Pogba
Mkhitaryan Ibra Martial

Romero
Darmian Smalling Rojo Blind
Schweinsteiger Fellaini Rooney
Lingard Rashford Mata

With others like Fosu Mensah, Tuanzabe and Young all available too. That second team depending on the draw could be fine for FA Cup and even a round or two of the Europa. It's nice to see Mourinho start to give the likes of Ibra and Pogba a decent breather, something he was not doing before xmas for various reasons.

We have a good strong squad but we need to prioritise and the FA Cup looks like it's low on our radar at the moment which is the correct call

What makes you put shaw in the league team id have him no were near the first team at the minute thought he was poor yesterday granted like bastian i think rust was heavy part of it.

Bailiy and jones i dont think would make a good paring ethier would prefer rojo. theres something i never thought id say.

TheDoc

TheDoc wrote: »

Like I said it might be.

But he was clearly painted in the spotlight by Jose in the buildup, so naturally all attention was on him. Thought he was dire in the first half and while improved in the second half, don't believe the point where Mourinho will consider it a plan that worked.

Seeing a lot of tweets and posts about his assists, and that somehow translates to a good game. sorry but there is more to a performance then "assists", a statistic already a bit blown out of proportion if I'm being honest.

His form has been so so all season.
And his attitude could be considered questionable. I had discussed this in the match thread yesterday. He shouldn't be immune to criticism.
I think Jose has handled the situation quite well.

duffman13

astradave wrote: »

Its more than likely bull**** imo.

It's coming from an SergeMUFC on twitter who said his mate was on a flight to Munich that Woody was on.. though in fairness why would he lie.

https://twitter.com/SergeMUFC/status/825992674108928000

It's more than likely to do with the Munich anniversary imo

For 5 minutes of retweeting fame. A lot of wannabe in the knows. If he was it's most likely to do with Adidas or as you said the Munich anniversary. No journalist has picked up on it which is unusual, anything to generate a few clicks

duffman13

sky88 wrote: »

What makes you put shaw in the league team id have him no were near the first team at the minute thought he was poor yesterday granted like bastian i think rust was heavy part of it.

Bailiy and jones i dont think would make a good paring ethier would prefer rojo. theres something i never thought id say.

I was more just throwing out two teams, a few of those players are interchangeable really. Shaw is potentially our best left back and actually to be fair he's our only real out and out left back.

Rojo has been good, really impressed me lately and if he keeps it going and doesn't get any stupid red cards he will hold his place but if I like Jones if he can stay fit.

No great thought to the teams really, just threw them out.

TheDoc

Korat wrote: »

I do my best work when I'm in a bad mood. So focused on being annoyed with the world I just get **** done without worrying about how I do it. Not pleasant to be around though.

Everyone is different but if Martial is such a snowflake that he can't operate in anything other than ideal conditions then he's not someone you want on your team.

There are some massive egos in the current team but I think most will knuckle down when the pressure comes, if they can't or won't then let them go.

I think that is just a massive simplification of modern football and dressing room management.

The issue I addressed previously with Mourinho, regarding a "concern" about him alienating our young prospects and talent, is that he might be coming in hard and ruthless, to a generation of players who are not like that, and can't operate like that.

His teams from Madrid back contained some extremely talented, and older generation players. Players who responded in a certain way. You can see in his last Chelsea team how certain players, of a newer generation weren't responding in the same way.

It's different from being a snowflake and then being thrust into a different working environment where there is mixed messages. People interact and respond differently. We see this in life every day.

And what you likely see more and more is that there isn't a one size fits all anymore. It's not snowflake or millenial or some term to describe people who don't respond positively to being lashed out of it. The issue there isn't the people on the receiving end, its the people on the dishing end.

The bigger issue here for me is the potential support for the manager to undergo these actions, even it means casting out big talents, because of the Mhiki scenario which is being painted as some class form of man management. And which I think is a total load of bollox, and just a massive managerial **** up.

I'm not really surprised Martial (in my eyes) didn't deliver on the buildup and gauntlet Jose laid down to him. It's a team game, and putting that much pressure and spotlight on one player to perform just feels counter productive.

We saw the reports from Ducker about Zlatan re-assuring Martial to take head, and its all character building, and he wouldn't do it if Mourinho didn't rate him. Sorry but that's just window dressing and bollox to try look clever for fans who drag their knuckles. Slating a player in public in an attempt at reverse psychology is just a stupid move in modern football where player power is so much stronger.

Like heaven forbid that buying a player at that age, for that money, that he would get the wrong idea that the setup of the team WOULD BE AROUND HIM.

KH25

duffman13 wrote: »

This is true, he looked leggy and hasn't had a great time of it at AFCON. It'll be interesting to see if he straight in on Tuesday against Chelsea. Hopefully for ourselves it's a comfortable Chelsea win to keep the Liverpool heads down and get is to within a point if we beat Hull

Strange how reluctant he has been in the transfer market, no investment last January or this January. The couple of players he's signed bar Mane and Matip are only bench players (Klavan, Wiljnaldum and Karius)

To be honest I would think he's hamstrung by the owners in terms of signings. Didn't Rodgers say that he could only sign players off a list rather than anyone he wanted?

TheDoc

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They only have 16 games left this season, they are going to have no fatigue issues for the remainder of the season, which is arguably what has been the cause of their crap form over January.

an alternative view that I would put forward also, is that teams are also coming to terms with how to deal with them or play against them.

They blew people away first half of the season and rightly so, they were so good. But you'd be an incompetent manager / team to play the second fixture and not know whats coming, and have some ideas in place to combat their play.

So rather than it being one thing, it feels to me a combination of fatigue, impact of key injuries/absences because of their weak squad and teams better equipped to cope with them as the season progresses.

While it looked ominous first half of season, believe I kept re-iterating the belief I had that Liverpool would fall short of top 4 along with Spurs and if we get our **** together we could get back in.

Conclusions from my side as obvious enough. Play style makes it tougher towards the end of the season, teams built on key individuals, and not enough strength and depth.

Both had poor summer windows, or which I believe will bite them both.

When you look at the sides we are putting out even in our cup competitions, we really do have such a strong squad. While we made a hash of the league thus far, we could well make something great happen towards the latter half of the season.

TheDoc

M!Ck^ wrote: »

His form has been so so all season.
And his attitude could be considered questionable. I had discussed this in the match thread yesterday. He shouldn't be immune to criticism.
I think Jose has handled the situation quite well.

For the money he cost, he has got away with murder this season to be honest. He's only being questioned and having some pressure put on him recently. As you say he has been so so, but at times absolutely pants.

I've no issue with him personally, apart from how he gets away with murder where as Memphis got slated, when for me Martial is the clearly more obvious "meh couldn't be arsed" player.

I appreciate very much why he might be annoyed and feeling a bit concerned at the situation he finds himself in.

J. Marston

yabadabado wrote: »

Once Mane went to AFCON he suddenly became this unreal player.Don't get me wrong he is good but he wasn't single handedly dragging Pool up the table.
He seems to be used as an excuse for them having a terrible run of results.

Their win percentage without him is 33% and with him, it's about 71%.

He pretty much was dragging them up the table on his own. Here's hoping the AFCON wrecked him.

yabadabado

J. Marston wrote: »

Their win percentage without him is 33% and with him, it's about 71%.

He pretty much was dragging them up the table on his own. Here's hoping the AFCON wrecked him.

I really don't think he was ,they have missed him but not to the level that's being portrayed.
It's a combination of things that has them in the slump.

duffman13

KH25 wrote: »

To be honest I would think he's hamstrung by the owners in terms of signings. Didn't Rodgers say that he could only sign players off a list rather than anyone he wanted?

Apparently he has money to spend on who he wants, he can bring in whoever he wants by the looks of it. He's said previously he only wants to spend on players who fit his philosophy and he will only buy the right players.

Your right though, Rodgers was on a committee and some players weren't his choices

duffman13

yabadabado wrote: »

I really don't think he was ,they have missed him but not to the level that's being portrayed.
It's a combination of things that has them in the slump.

I'm not saying he's a Ronaldo type or anything but he has been hugely important for them. He creates space for players like Lallana to move into.

Klopps made it worse by instead of just replacing him while he was away he reshuffled the whole team, moved Firminio wide and Lallana forward and brought Sturridge back in centrally. He's made 4 or 5 changes instead of just the one required

jayo26

J. Marston wrote: »

Their win percentage without him is 33% and with him, it's about 71%.

He pretty much was dragging them up the table on his own. Here's hoping the AFCON wrecked him.

I said it in that thread before the ad on they would Miss him and was told he aint that good and they said Matip was the bigger loss............

I may well be provrn wrong they might pull it Back together but klopp ruined a lot of momentum by not respecting the cups instead of Having a loss or two against Southampton now they have poor performances against Plymouth and a comprehensive loss to wolves.

Mané will come back in and may lift the spirits but he will need his spirits lifted too so it could go eitherway.

Korat

TheDoc wrote: »

It's different from being a snowflake and then being thrust into a different working environment where there is mixed messages. People interact and respond differently. We see this in life every day.

I treat people differently in everyday life depending on how I think they'll react.

I probably get a pass on some things myself.

Choosing the people you want to work with is more about cohesion than ability, I think. If the rest of the team are happy with Martial's attitude then he'll stay regardless.

Flint Fredstone

J. Marston wrote: »

Their win percentage without him is 33% and with him, it's about 71%.

He pretty much was dragging them up the table on his own. Here's hoping the AFCON wrecked him.

Carrick...

Korat

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Carrick...

There's an iceberg moving down the Atlantic Ocean faster.

jayo26

Korat wrote: »

There's an iceberg moving down the Atlantic Ocean faster.

That would be bastian

Korat

jayo26 wrote: »

That would be bastian

U-boot Kapitan?

Nailz

jayo26 wrote: »

That would be bastian

I never got this, any time Bastian played for United (which obviously isn't that much) he put himself about the pitch much better than Carrick ever has. This whole thing that Schweinsteiger's legs are gone is a myth, he might not have the stamina for full back-to-back matches, but his endeavour and relative pace are still decent.

Cantona's Collars

According to MEN United are braced for a £20 million bid from China (Beijing Guoan) for Rooney.So we are back to being "braced" again.
£20 million might not sound much compared to what money was being thrown around but it's a decent fee for a player on a downward curve and just as importantly it would free up the guts of £300k a week in wages.There's another month to go in the Chinese transfer window so a deal might happen,either way I don't see Rooney at United next season.

StringerBell

Mane does provide them an extra dimension to the attack, his pace and unpredictability is a genuine cause of serious worry to opposition defences. He does make the attack tick, he creates space and makes runs others don't make. Klopp exasperated the problem by not having someone to fill in that role, didn't have to be as good as Mane at it, but a more like for like replacement rather then the shuffling around he did.

I have maintained my belief from the beginning that the squad is too light to keep up the pace over the course of a full season and particularly at the business end when the pressure comes on. Them being out of everything now other then the league does give them a boost, though hopefully the morale damage done from the past month of **** they have served up will keep them down another little bit and if Mane is carrying a hangover from the AFCON all the better. He improves the attack whatever way you look at it.

Our own league form needs to pick back up and remain intact however which is not a given either, especially now we are still going to be playing in 4 competitions. I feel like if we can get our necks in front of Liverpool or City we will stay there, missed out on some golden opportunities to shut those gaps already though and who knows how many more chances we can afford to blow.

Cantona's Collars

Probably sticking to form by posting this;)

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11667/10748319/jose-mourinho-it-will-be-difficult-to-bring-glory-days-back-to-man-utd

Korat

StringerBell wrote: »

Mane does provide them an extra dimension to the attack, his pace and unpredictability is a genuine cause of serious worry to opposition defences. He does make the attack tick, he creates space and makes runs others don't make. Klopp exasperated the problem by not having someone to fill in that role, didn't have to be as good as Mane at it, but a more like for like replacement rather then the shuffling around he did.

I have maintained my belief from the beginning that the squad is too light to keep up the pace over the course of a full season and particularly at the business end when the pressure comes on. Them being out of everything now other then the league does give them a boost, though hopefully the morale damage done from the past month of **** they have served up will keep them down another little bit and if Mane is carrying a hangover from the AFCON all the better. He improves the attack whatever way you look at it.

Our own league form needs to pick back up and remain intact however which is not a given either, especially now we are still going to be playing in 4 competitions. I feel like if we can get our necks in front of Liverpool or City we will stay there, missed out on some golden opportunities to shut those gaps already though and who knows how many more chances we can afford to blow.

I think you've been conned by the hype.

It's not worth that many words.

Mane is a good player, do you need to write a novel about it?