Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

fuzzydunlop85

Pheonix10 wrote: »

3 points badly needed tomorrow, finally at least the chance of going 4th although very unlikely.

If we don't win tomorrow I'm giving up on top 4.

bangkok

Pro. F wrote: »

The end result wouldn't be lots of chances and goals created, that was the whole point of my post.

If David Beckham was on our right wing the end result would be goals and chances created without doubt. He is probably the best crosser in the history of the game and put loads of goals on plates for the likes of Cantona, van Nistelrooy etc and if he played in this current team with Ibra up front I have no doubt Ibra would be on over 30 goals right now

I just realized

wtf happened homerjay2005
Been along time since I spotted him post

J. Marston

fuzzydunlop85 wrote: »

If we don't win tomorrow I'm giving up on top 4.

If we don't win tomorrow, I'm giving up on this group of players.

sReq | uTeK

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I just realized

wtf happened homerjay2005

He's around manages our footy team on a Monday night. Good crack

ollkiller

Pro. F wrote: »

I think you've misunderstood my post (edit: or maybe not, it's your last sentence I'm talking about). Let Becks take Valencia's crosses for him and we still wouldn't see enough improvement in the number of chances created for it to be a worthwhile tactic. The problem is far more to do with the nature of the build-up leading to the crosses than with the quality of the crosses, is what I'm saying.

Seriously. I get ya regarding the build up play but if Beckham was in Valenica's positions this season we would have way more goals. You can say what you want about Beckham with pace or beating a defender but nobody could deliver a cross like him. Even Van Nistelrooy said he only scored as many goals because of Beckham's delivery. Also Beckham delivered much of his crosses not from the byline but in the general area Valencia would be now. Even if the defender was close to him he'd whip it around them.

Presser

brinty

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I just realized

wtf happened homerjay2005
Been along time since I spotted him post

Got taken down in Resident evil 7 i hear M!Ck^

Rayne Wooney

The problem with the crosses is we usually don't build up quick enough and the other team is back in shape by the time the ball is sent out to the wide player, we pile players into the box and then send in an out swinging corner that gives the defence a far better chance of clearing it.

Beckham was a master of sending in crosses that would catch the defence off guard. It's not a fair comparison either because these days teams in the league are incredibly well organised compared to what they were 10 years ago and the main tactic from teams 7th place to 20 is all out defence and counter attack, because it is effective as we have seen.

If we had Xabi Alonso standing on our right side sending in crosses all day it wouldn't make a significant difference.

Pro. F

sReq | uTeK wrote: »

Jokes? You're telling me if you have David Beckham and afforded him the time given to valencia he wouldn't create more goal scoring opportunities for the team...

Where did I say that?

You are always at this shít. Misreading my posts and then pissing and moaning about what you think I said. Do me a favour and put me on ignore.

Pro. F

bangkok wrote: »

If David Beckham was on our right wing the end result would be goals and chances created without doubt. He is probably the best crosser in the history of the game and put loads of goals on plates for the likes of Cantona, van Nistelrooy etc and if he played in this current team with Ibra up front I have no doubt Ibra would be on over 30 goals right now

I agree that he probably was the best crosser in history. But he didn't put loads of goals on a plate for his strikers by crossing from wide into a packed defence after a slow build up that had developed into limited options. Fergie's development of attacking play down the wing was purposeful and intelligent, completely different from the play that is leading to the majority of Val's crosses. There are lots of good things about what Jose is doing, but the type of play that is leading to the majority of Valencia's crosses is a weakness that needs to be fixed.

KH25

Pro. F wrote: »

I agree that he probably was the best crosser in history. But he didn't put loads of goals on a plate for his strikers by crossing from wide into a packed defence after a slow build up that had developed into limited options. Fergie's development of attacking play down the wing was purposeful and intelligent, completely different from the play that is leading to the majority of Val's crosses. There are lots of good things about what Jose is doing, but the type of play that is leading to the majority of Valencia's crosses is a weakness that needs to be fixed.

Think I see what you mean. The play isn't quick enough to catch the other team off guard. The crosses tend to come in when they've had a chance to set their defence. If that is what you're saying then I agree. The quality of the crosses doesn't help but yes, it's harder to make the killer pass.

Pro. F

ollkiller wrote: »

Seriously. I get ya regarding the build up play but if Beckham was in Valenica's positions this season we would have way more goals. You can say what you want about Beckham with pace or beating a defender but nobody could deliver a cross like him. Even Van Nistelrooy said he only scored as many goals because of Beckham's delivery. Also Beckham delivered much of his crosses not from the byline but in the general area Valencia would be now. Even if the defender was close to him he'd whip it around them.

For what I'm talking about, the area of the pitch is not as important as the shape of the opposition and the interplay between the crosser and his teammate's. Yes Beckham delivered crosses from deep and from very wide at times, but the vast majority of the time it came after some interplay with Neville and another player or two which developed the play and drew the defence out of shape a bit. Or it was a cross off a quicker attack before the defence had gotten into a proper shape. We see that sometimes with Val, but too often we see his crosses being the last resort type, when there isn't anything else on because the build-up hasn't been good enough.

The fact that Beckham used to deliver some of those lovely crosses just around a defender who was close to him is another sign of how the build-up in wide play was different (as well as it showing that he was a better crosses than Valencia, which I agree with). There were defenders being drawn out and the crosser put in a position to capitalise on that.

TheDoc

KH25 wrote: »

I'd happily managed to erase that Fulham game from my mind until now. My god that was dreadful.

I still harbour massive resentment for the players, and still have massive sympathy for Moyes and the absolute mess he inhereted

TheDoc

KH25 wrote: »

Think I see what you mean. The play isn't quick enough to catch the other team off guard. The crosses tend to come in when they've had a chance to set their defence. If that is what you're saying then I agree. The quality of the crosses doesn't help but yes, it's harder to make the killer pass.

This is what I took him as meaning and I was nodding along. I don't think there is a more bread and butter situation for a defence to deal with then a wide cross when your set and facing play.

I think it was the Lingard to Zlatan goal (forget the match) that is the ideal crossing situation, where the defenders are running back to goal, the cross is whipped in behind them, and your striker can get a run and jump on them.

Wasn't there a goal recently, that was a lethal counter attack that I think Mhiki finished that was really good, think Martial assisted.

I think we do have the players and ability to tear teams up like that, general problem being more often than not we are dominating possesion and trying to break down static banks of four.

Still stand by my interpretation that its a tactic though. If it wasn't Jose would have addressed it by now. I think its noticable on that right flank the Rw tucks in, Herrera drops behind, and Valencia is given space to try 1v1 or cross.

Our left side shows a lot more overlapping and short triangles.

So for me it is something that is a tactic, to probably try allow Valencia get steam and space on a fullback (he'll roast most opposite fullbacks in a foot race)

yabadabado

West Brom game Doc.

That's the way you want the crosses coming in,defense on back foot and out of sync with attacking getting a run on them.
2 banks of 4 and a cross coming in is usually straightforward enough to defend no matter who is crossing .

KH25

TheDoc wrote: »

So for me it is something that is a tactic, to probably try allow Valencia get steam and space on a fullback (he'll roast most opposite fullbacks in a foot race)

Given the amount of attacks that end on the right it's most likely a tactic. I'd trust Valencia to beat most players in a race but the issue is the final ball. Pro F is right that the build up play limits that but I think valencias delivery could be improved too. It's a combination of both.

deaddonkey15

For a team with top 4 ambitions, crossing from the right really shouldn't be our primary method of creating chances.

adox

TheDoc wrote: »

I still harbour massive resentment for the players, and still have massive sympathy for Moyes and the absolute mess he inhereted

The league winning squad mess?

The_Kew_Tour

Tbf I think you could argue that the squad today is better then 2013.

brinty

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

Tbf I think you could argue that the squad today is better then 2013.

Our rivals are stronger than then too

3730/1 for a perfect weekend surely worth a tenner :cool:

jaykay74

Utd v Watford game on irish tv tomorrow anyone know ?

Liam O

Pro. F wrote: »

I agree that he probably was the best crosser in history. But he didn't put loads of goals on a plate for his strikers by crossing from wide into a packed defence after a slow build up that had developed into limited options. Fergie's development of attacking play down the wing was purposeful and intelligent, completely different from the play that is leading to the majority of Val's crosses. There are lots of good things about what Jose is doing, but the type of play that is leading to the majority of Valencia's crosses is a weakness that needs to be fixed.

While what you say is generally true, there have been a huge amount of times when Valencia does get around the defense and still messes it up, sometimes when it's easier to find a United player. A lot of breakdowns in attack do wind up at his feet but I wouldn't say it's a majority. A lot of the time the other team is shifting across to cover the ball across to him and he either hesitates, allowing them time to get set, or just fires a hopeless blast at the defender. He simply doesn't have the intelligence to make the right play.

Now in terms of getting up and down the wings there are few better and his vertical passing is actually quite good. If he could just sort out his final ball it would be great. It must also be noted that he was the exact same when playing on the right wing the years before, when he would get the ball in even better positions. I'm unsure what happened because he was very good that season he continually picked out Rooney in similar circumstances.

S.M.B.

jaykay74 wrote: »

Utd v Watford game on irish tv tomorrow anyone know ?

Sky Sports game.

"The future nobody knows. The future is the future. I'm very happy here, it's a great club. In England, football is enjoyed a lot...I will not talk about that subject any more. I just have to keep focused on my club."

Those DDG quotes from yesterday are an example of the media coming up with an answer of '5' from 2+2, after a player tried to be honest in his thoughts.

In the few reports I've read, it seems that their main reason for asking DDG about his future or linking him with Real at this time, is that RM's transfer ban ends soon and they'll be able to buy players this Summer.

I don't find the quotes wholly assuring about his long-term future at the club, but that is nothing new. A clerical error in September 2015 is apparently the reason he is still at United in the first place, so I've been used to the thoughts for a while that David de Gea of Madrid, Spain is not a 'Man United for life' man. All that matters though is that while playing for United, he has played like his life depended on it.

It could be nothing exclusively do with distance from a lover, family, trophies, year-on-year success, at the time having LVG as a manager. He might just want to play for Real Madrid someday as someone who grew up directly in the light of their burning influence and success, and is now continuously pursued by them.

He has a PL medal with United, FA Cup medal too. He has been awarded in successive seasons a spot on the PFA's Team of the Year, multiple Sir Matt Busby POTY awards, twice Man United Player's POTY, successive Match of the Day 'Save of the Season' acknowledgments for the past 4 years and multiple POTMatch awards where he clearly saved United points and more embarrassment.

Overall, he has nothing left to prove at United or in England. If he left this Summer, it would be very hard to deny that he has been an outstanding player for Manchester United and one of the Premier League's greatest keepers. Still, it doesn't mean that it wouldn't be hard to watch him leave the club.

There's honesty in his most recent comments, honesty the media will punish a player for, but these comments are not the end of the world or a sign of its imminent arrival IMO. "The future nobody knows" - At 26 years old, the future is still a long time in DDG's professional career, 10+ years maybe, so you can't blame him for ruling anything out. "I'm very happy here, it is a great club" - This shouldn't be ignored. It is clear to see that DDG is happy at the club and isn't publicly angling for a move away from the slave-owners at Manchester United, like some in the past have.

In the meantime, short of pledging his career to Man United which I wouldn't expect any of our younger players to do in today's climate, this kind of response is par for the course. Enough for the media to try to get a few clicks and sell a few papers, nothing new though for anyone who wants to look a bit deeper than the headline.

jambofc

a lot of valencia's crosses are from positions that are to deep also floated in now the crosses from deep are surely what he is being told to do,but the floated one's from any position are just a waste of time and surely we would be better if he just kept possession.

personally i dont like valencia never have how such a one footed player a one trick pony(pace)has not been replaced is beyond me.on the defencive side of his play he is always being caught out of position or is the only defender playing opposition players onside.

Robson99

jambofc wrote: »

a lot of valencia's crosses are from positions that are to deep also floated in now the crosses from deep are surely what he is being told to do,but the floated one's from any position are just a waste of time and surely we would be better if he just kept possession.

personally i dont like valencia never have how such a one footed player a one trick pony(pace)has not been replaced is beyond me.on the defencive side of his play he is always being caught out of position or is the only defender playing opposition players onside.

Off the top of your head name 2 games where he was at fault for us conceding a goal

Sand

adox wrote: »

The league winning squad mess?

People give tremendous credit to RVP for his performance winning that league. For good reason.

Jayop

jambofc wrote: »

a lot of valencia's crosses are from positions that are to deep also floated in now the crosses from deep are surely what he is being told to do,but the floated one's from any position are just a waste of time and surely we would be better if he just kept possession.

personally i dont like valencia never have how such a one footed player a one trick pony(pace)has not been replaced is beyond me.on the defencive side of his play he is always being caught out of position or is the only defender playing opposition players onside.

A few years ago, but he's improved that side of his game massively and rarely to never plays peeps onside or allows that slipped ball inside him to happen.

bangkok

jambofc wrote: »

a lot of valencia's crosses are from positions that are to deep also floated in now the crosses from deep are surely what he is being told to do,but the floated one's from any position are just a waste of time and surely we would be better if he just kept possession.

personally i dont like valencia never have how such a one footed player a one trick pony(pace)has not been replaced is beyond me.on the defencive side of his play he is always being caught out of position or is the only defender playing opposition players onside.

Fairly obvious you havent been watching much of utd this season so

jambofc

Robson99 wrote: »

Off the top of your head name 2 games where he was at fault for us conceding a goal

eh i cant tbh but i didnt say his fault led to a goal being conceded

bangkok wrote: »

Fairly obvious you havent been watching much of utd this season so

why's that ? for a player that is basicly there for his attacking ability he is shocking as i said a one trick pony

Cantona's Collars

Squad members for tomorrows game via M E N.


De Gea

Romero

Henderson

Valencia

Darmian

Bailly

Smalling

Pogba

Herrera

Carrick

Mata

Lingard

Martial

Rooney

Ibrahimovic

StringerBell

No Jones, Shaw, Fellaini, Rojo or Mhikitaryan?

The last one really annoys me. Didn't see any press conferences, read transcripts or anything but is he injured? Fell, Rojo too?

Edit: On a second look your squad list appears to be missing a three spaces so no point wondering yet.

Trigger

StringerBell wrote: »

No Jones, Shaw, Fellaini, Rojo or Mhikitaryan?

The last one really annoys me. Didn't see any press conferences, read transcripts or anything but is he injured? Fell, Rojo too?

Edit: On a second look your squad list appears to be missing a three spaces so no point wondering yet.

Pretty sure Mkhitaryan is still staying in the Lowry so he wouldn't be snapped going in.. that's how MEN get their list

Cantona's Collars

StringerBell wrote: »

No Jones, Shaw, Fellaini, Rojo or Mhikitaryan?

The last one really annoys me. Didn't see any press conferences, read transcripts or anything but is he injured? Fell, Rojo too?

Edit: On a second look your squad list appears to be missing a three spaces so no point wondering yet.

I think they go by who they see going into The Lowry the night before the game.They probably missed a few players.
Tomorrow is the start of a fixture list featuring 7 teams in the league that we should be beating.

bangkok

zerks wrote: »

Squad members for tomorrows game via M E N.


De Gea

Romero

Henderson

Valencia

Darmian

Bailly

Smalling

Pogba

Herrera

Carrick

Mata

Lingard

Martial

Rooney

Ibrahimovic

Only 12 outfield players? That list is obviously fake or else missing loads off it

Lithium93_

zerks wrote: »

Squad members for tomorrows game via M E N.


De Gea

Romero

Henderson

Valencia

Darmian

Bailly

Smalling

Pogba

Herrera

Carrick

Mata

Lingard

Martial

Rooney

Ibrahimovic

Does the squad of 18 always have 3 Goalkeepers?

jayo26

As the lads said it's not the actual squad it's just the players that they see going into the hotel mostly they are never fully complete.

Always 3 keeper's at the stadium on match days incase one gets injured in warmup and they all warm up together then the third keeper sits in stands.

I remember that guy that played for city only a handful of times over about 10 years or something he did a bit of an interview on been third choice keeper he Said it was worst job in football because you had to do everything that is evolved in been in the starting 11 but then when the team sheet is handed in you are basically in the stands.

Trigger

jayo26 wrote: »

As the lads said it's not the actual squad it's just the players that they see going into the hotel mostly they are never fully complete.

Always 3 keeper's at the stadium on match days incase one gets injured in warmup and they all warm up together then the third keeper sits in stands.

I remember that guy that played for city only a handful of times over about 10 years or something he did a bit of an interview on been third choice keeper he Said it was worst job in football because you had to do everything that is evolved in been in the starting 11 but then when the team sheet is handed in you are basically in the stands.

You thinking of Richard Wright? If you are I don't even think he played a game for City.. was there 4/5 years too

Lithium93_

Aye the 3rd keeper in the squad never played for City, joined from Carlisle United in 2013.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Henderson

jayo26

astradave wrote: »

You thinking of Richard Wright? If you are I don't even think he played a game for City.. was there 4/5 years too

Yhh that's the one he prob didn't play for them maybe it was he only played a handful for any club over a long period of time I just remember something been said.

He's a crossing machine...



No matter what this does, if anything, to add to the Valencia debate, it certainly shows the unpredictable nature of crosses and the high probability of relinquishing possession when making one.

Cantona's Collars

stankratz wrote: »

He's a crossing machine...



No matter what this does, if anything, to add to the Valencia debate, it certainly shows the unpredictable nature of crosses and the high probability of relinquishing possession when making one.

Van Gaal was right,wasteful. Far better play it 60 yards backwards and start again.

Cantona's Collars

Interview with the man himself.

https://twitter.com/MailSport/status/830183048654290945

Lord TSC

If we win today, we'll be the first team to amass 2000 Premier League points

http://www.myfootballfacts.com/All-TimePremierLeagueTable1992-93to2010-11.html

(The table was from before the Leicester game)

jayo26

Match thread up guys and girls

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057704819/1/#post102586231

Hope to keep my none beaten and winning run going for match threads

GSPfan

What result are we all hoping for in the Pool v Spurs game?

I'm thinking a Spurs win or a draw. Any result other than a Liverpool win is better for us in my view.

jayo26

GSPfan wrote: »

What result are we all hoping for in the Pool v Spurs game?

I'm thinking a Spurs win or a draw. Any result other than a Liverpool win is better for us in my view.

Yhh draw is ideal but I wouldn't cry over a spurs win either.

Liam O

GSPfan wrote: »

What result are we all hoping for in the Pool v Spurs game?

I'm thinking a Spurs win or a draw. Any result other than a Liverpool win is better for us in my view.

No it's not. We go for second!