General Ongoing Doctor Discussion

pixelburp

I didn't mind the preachiness, though that last speech was laying it on way too thick; what I objected to was the script, clearly written on cocaine and red bull. Christ it was like the RTD era at its most frenetic and daft. Barely any element, plot point or character given so much as a breath, like 3 episodes rammed into one. That was manic stuff.

FunLover18

fritzelly wrote: »

That was a shambles of an episode
Mommy issues, end of the world, climate change and that sermon in the Tardis - really? We already know Earth survives for millennia so this episode kinda doesn't make sense saying the world ended. (Previous episodes always had the Doctor saving the Earth by whatever means - so this kinda negates all those other episodes but lets ignore all that so we can send a message)
Was kinda hopeful after last weeks episodes but Chibnall has no idea and this political correctness/social agenda thrown at us constantly is damn annoying

(As for the monsters mouths lol)

Having now watched Orphan 55 I agree that the final speech was on the nose, whereas The Doctor is prone to give speeches there are usually in character and work within the context of the show but this wasn't so subtle or nuanced. That said I have no issue with Doctor Who addressing these issues, as it always has done but Jesus, Chibnal and team just aren't good at it.

fritzelly

Tonights episode was more fun but, the scene jumps were all over the place - in a factory, now on a train, in one labe now in another, in the same lab, now on an alien ship - felt like there was a lot of cuts to get the time down
And is it my imagination or are the monsters each episode occupying less time. Last week bar a few close up shots of mouths there was hardly any interaction - same goes this week, the monster was barely on screen. Oh and these monsters look a lot like another monster...

flazio

It was an improvement on last week at least.
The Racnoss Scorpion Queen was played by Sarah Jane Adventures actress Anjili Mohindra in case anyone was familiar with that series.

ixoy

Much more enjoyable - good fun and it delivered a decent message without using a sledgehammer. Performance for Tesla was nicely understated too. The aliens were a little all over the place sure, but they had enough screen presence. If it stayed at this level for the "monster of the week" episode I'd be much happier.

pixelburp

ixoy wrote: »

Much more enjoyable - good fun and it delivered a decent message without using a sledgehammer. Performance for Tesla was nicely understated too. The aliens were a little all over the place sure, but they had enough screen presence. If it stayed at this level for the "monster of the week" episode I'd be much happier.

Agreed, that was a much better episode and like you said, the characterisation of Tesla was pretty deftly handled. The aliens were a touch too scooby doo though, undermining the otherwise excellent period & character work. I'd love to see more of Tesla in fact, wouldn't require much tweaking. Heck he'd be good companion material.

It just highlights that they should really go back to "pure" historical stories; pacing might be a problem in sticking too closely to events, but jamming in arbitrary aliens almost always detracts - especially when the human stuff was this entertaining in its own right.

Fun fact. There's a crowdfunded campaign trying to get the old Wardenclyffe facility (seen in the episode) turned into a museum. Millions were raised though not sure where the project sits ATM...

TheValeyard

flazio wrote: »

It was an improvement on last week at least.
The Racnoss Scorpion Queen was played by Sarah Jane Adventures actress Anjili Mohindra in case anyone was familiar with that series.

Was still convinced it was the Racnoss until near the very end!


Although I liked the Scorpion Drones and adding of Tesla.

But....

Why not mind wipe Tesla like she did to the others?

I thought the Doctor could no longer travel to New York after the whole Amy and Rory event?

Doctor DooM

Caught up today. A decent episode of Who all round.

flazio

TheValeyard wrote: »

Was still convinced it was the Racnoss until near the very end!


Although I liked the Scorpion Drones and adding of Tesla.

But....

Why not mind wipe Tesla like she did to the others?

I thought the Doctor could no longer travel to New York after the whole Amy and Rory event?

He fixed it in the Return of Doctor Mysterio

fritzelly

TheValeyard wrote: »

I thought the Doctor could no longer travel to New York after the whole Amy and Rory event?

Wouldn't matter - it's way before their timeline starts in New York

FunLover18

Better episode but still bang average. Three companions is not working, they're not getting the time they deserve. Which is a shame because other shows have managed to do it, Star Trek, Buffy, but it's not working here. I don't know what any of them are getting out of travelling with The Doctor and any sense of "fam" is dwindling quickly.

pixelburp

Said it before, but Graham and Yaz should stay, Ryan can go. His story is done while Yaz has gont Sweet FA to do. Graham can stay cos "good intentioned older man" brings a nice energy to the mix, even if you see the writers sometimes struggling how to pitch him.

FunLover18

pixelburp wrote: »

Said it before, but Graham and Yaz should stay, Ryan can go. His story is done while Yaz has gont Sweet FA to do. Graham can stay cos "good intentioned older man" brings a nice energy to the mix, even if you see the writers sometimes struggling how to pitch him.

Yaz has been completely underserved, the fact that they keep forgetting she's a cop is infuriating. Don't make her a police officer of you're not going to incorporate it into her character.

pixelburp

It's like there's a ready made character conflict right there, and they don't want to take it: Yaz's police instincts & upholding "the law", versus Graham's "salt of the earth" pragmatism from having seen it all (and got a second chance via his cancer treatment).

Partly, there's also the element of the fundamental limitations of the show itself; it's weird that despite being quite a flexible beast, enabling its near 60 year existence, there's a huge amount of box ticking in the approach. Straddling the "family" line means you gotta have the monsters and "go team" texture, lest the younger audience tune out. So an otherwise entertaining story of meeting Nikolas Tesla took an abrupt turn into the goofy RTD era monster.

pixelburp

Well, Whittaker's not going anywhere; not official but she certainly doesn't believe herself out of a job:

“Yes, I’m doing another season,” she confirms. “That might be a massive exclusive that I’m not supposed to say, but it’s unhelpful for me to say [I don’t know] because it would be a massive lie! [Laughs] I absolutely adore it. At some point, these shoes are going to be handed
on, but it’s not yet. I’m clinging on tight!”

From (warning of autoplay video):
https://ew.com/tv/2020/01/22/jodie-whittaker-doctor-who-3/

NyOmnishambles

pixelburp wrote: »

Well, Whittaker's not going anywhere; not official but she certainly doesn't believe herself out of a job:



From (warning of autoplay video):
https://ew.com/tv/2020/01/22/jodie-whittaker-doctor-who-3/

I am fine with that, she isn't the problem with the show

It has shown a tiny improvement on last year but that is a very low bar, the writing and the quickly running past and not fully exploring ideas could be solved with a new crew and I would be happy to see Jodie stay, she is being badly let down

Martin Tyler AgueroooOO

Well now nice blast from the past and an intriguing story now. Timelines seem all over the shop now or maybe we have jumped into a parallel universe / dimension where all 13 Doctors are female and the minds of the Doctor from both are blending.

The Master

The Master wrote: »

There's been rumours of some big retcons coming this season

Including

The Hartnell to Capaldi set of regenerations was not The Doctors first

Oh and The Doctors first incarnation was a woman

:rolleyes:

Yeah, so looks like the rumours were true

liamtech

So the Time Lords were militarists or something, at some distant point in the past

aaronjennings

One of the big problems with the previous series was that there were too many standalone episodes, and not enough mythology or continuous storylines...

They've really doubled-down on addressing those complaints with that episode!

campo

Much better this week and now has me interested in where it is going

TheIrishGrover

Without going into too much detail but this was mentioned previously: It seems that there are now different timelines/dimensions.

I am a newbie: Only followed from Eccleston and didn't really follow much of Cappaldi after his first season but I can't remember, have they done alternative dimensions before? I mean in this way:

Having (possible) multiple timeline/dimension Doctors interacting like in this episode

Also

Captain Jack back brought a smile to my face. Never really got into Torchwood as I thought it was too much (Some characters should remain as secondary characters).

When I heard his voice I had a big smile on my face and thought he was great. Will be great to see how they interact (If they do this season)

Did anyone think initially

that Ruth was "The Lone Cyberman"?

I assume you were meant to initially (Until it is explained in future I suppose as per the season trailer)

Overall, I thought it was great.

CastorTroy

thought that was really good.

At first I thought Ruth was The Master.
Though if she is from The Doctor's past, why does she have a police box? I thought it's a police box due to something that happened with the First Doctor.

I noticed the end credits had her listed as Ruth and also "Introducing Jo Martin as The Doctor"

ixoy

What's happened - the show is suddenly good again?! Chibnail can write?!

Best episode of Chibnail's era yet. I wasn't expecting any of those twists - Jack was good enough but the Doctor reveal was something else. Seeing lots of speculation as to how this all fits in now:

1. Pre-Hartnell - Not sure I buy this. One it undoes the story line but two, as above, Ruth Doctor shouldn't have a police phone box as it got broken in 'An Unearthly Child' in Trotter's Yeard.

2. Alternate Universe - Quite possible. We know they exist so maybe this is a diverged time line and Ruth Doctor slipped into ours or we into hers.

3. Clone - The Time Lords clone each other. This Doctor is cloned from ours or vice versa. Fits into the original Looms stuff from the novels and we know they can be cloned because of the Doctor's daughter. The Master discovered this, that he's not even who he taught he was, and destroyed Gallifrey in response. My favourite of the theories.

Also RD's use of a gun:

Slippery slope to the Valeyard? Would they do it finally? Well a poster here could probably tell us...

CastorTroy

"What's a Cyberman?"
"Well you remember about 13 years ago when ghosts started appearing everywhere then turned into robots or a few years ago when the dead came back to life as robots?"

fritzelly

Better not be pre Hartnell, will piss a lot of people off
As for alternate dimension - what's the point insinuating its the same doctor
Another episode crammed full, monsters are a sideline, what is the point of the companions? Jack back for a few minutes - wasted opportunity
Not impressed with the episode, not sure what everyone else is seeing in it. More like lazy writing so let's go for a shock reveal so everyone forgets the bad writing

flazio

CastorTroy wrote: »

"What's a Cyberman?"
"Well you remember about 13 years ago when ghosts started appearing everywhere then turned into robots or a few years ago when the dead came back to life as robots?"

But then I rebooted the universe so you probably forgot all about what happened before that.

TheIrishGrover

Regarding theories. As it's out now about Captain Jack being back (yay!) being back I will not spoiler tag.

Apparently in an interview on Radio Times he said that in order to keep his appearance a secret they gave him/his involvement a codename: An anagram of Rose Tyler (Much like Torchwood itself).

So people are going crazy thinking she is the alternative Timeline David Tennant timeline Doc.

[HERE]

...........
The cameo was kept super secret, with Barrowman sharing that he was given a codename that was an anagram of “Rose Tyler” while working on set so no leaks would get out. He was allowed to tell only his spouse, but obviously the list didn’t end there. For starters, they had to get permission from Russell T. Davies, as he’d created the character (according to Barrowman, Davies said “Hoorah!” when Barrowman gave him the news). But that’s not all........

flazio

My theory is, because the Cybermen are involved, another random Time Lord got hold of a Cyber Stamp, like Jackson Lake, and just thinks she's the Doctor.

ebbsy

fritzelly wrote: »

Better not be pre Hartnell, will piss a lot of people off
As for alternate dimension - what's the point insinuating its the same doctor
Another episode crammed full, monsters are a sideline, what is the point of the companions? Jack back for a few minutes - wasted opportunity
Not impressed with the episode, not sure what everyone else is seeing in it. More like lazy writing so let's go for a shock reveal so everyone forgets the bad writing

Yeah, a lot of diversions this series.

After last series they found out that she could not carry an episode by herself.