Anyone else think this tenant is pushing it?

hawkelady

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/my-landlord-is-making-my-life-hell-pensioner-77-says-landlord-threatened-to-kick-her-out-after-she-refused-rent-increase-35413571.html

I see the indo is stirring the pot here with this story .. carol wants to remain anonymous and they are playing on her age .. I believe she has a right to maintain the house to a standard herself. Granted her landlord could have done some stuff as to not aggravate the situation but this carol sounds like a nightmare tenant.
That is of course if this story is not made up
Anyone else have an opinion ??

Sleeper12

Landlords copy of the lease obviously doesn't say that she can stay for life. She sounds like a nut. I'd normally tend to side with the tenant but in this case she actually seems to have the landlord scared of her

rawn

I actually think she sounds like an absolute nightmare. Straight to a solicitor over a €30 increase? Blaming the LL for the place being a mess? She also doesn't mention how much she herself has to pay in damages. Considering how often the RTB side with tenants I'm sure there's a lot more to the story than she is letting on. Besides, I can't imagine ANY LL agreeing to a "til death" lease!!

Selik

"I called my solicitor and he said my landlord could only increase my rent in line with the inflation rate in Ireland, which was nowhere near the increase"

Well this nonsense for starters!

EmoCourt

She's a bit old to be galloping around on a Horse.

astrofool

How could it fall into "disrepair" inside 4 years after being immaculate?

76544567

Just another lesson along with all the other hard lessons landlords have just learned.
Never let to someone who can use anything a sob story to keep your property.
Remember the two women in dalkey.
Now a frail pensioner.
The papers love this sh1te and the landlord suffers for being nice.
Same rent for 3 years. Increase by only €30. Let her keep her ponies.
She is so bad his only way out is to sell, and then she fights that too.
Landlords simply do not own their properties anymore. It's in name and expenses only that you own your own property after you rent it out.

pilly

Yeah I would have to say I think she's completely taking the piss. Whilst no-one wants to see someone of 77 homeless 30 is not much to ask, the old age pension has gone up a lot more than that over the course of the same 4 years.

Not many places would allow you to keep ponies either.

On the other side of the argument though if you take a tenant of 77 you can't expect them to do the maintenance on a property.

satguy

She should have ponied up the €30 ,, it was not a big increase.

the_syco

"We went for an adjudication and the RTB sided with the landlord saying I had printed the contract and added to it saying that I could stay until the end of my life. It doesn't make sense because we both signed it together.

That the RTB sided with the landlord speaks volumes. Also the part about her printing out the document and adding what she wanted to it... lol.

pilly wrote: »

On the other side of the argument though if you take a tenant of 77 you can't expect them to do the maintenance on a property.

If you rent, you gotta take care of the place. If you can't maintain the place you live in, pay someone to do it, or consider asking a relative to help you. If the government says that landlords must take care of old people that they rent to, old people will suddenly find it impossible to get a house.

The_Conductor

What the hell is the story with keeping ponies in the back garden?
You have to have an equine registered premises to keep ponies- and the premises can be inspected for suitability.

All it takes is a neighbour to tip off the local Department of Agriculture office- and both she and he could end up in court.........

Gumbo

From now on, I will be signing every page of the lease along with the tenant so nobody can add in text or pages.

hawkelady

The_Conductor wrote: »

What the hell is the story with keeping ponies in the back garden?
You have to have an equine registered premises to keep ponies- and the premises can be inspected for suitability.

All it takes is a neighbour to tip off the local Department of Agriculture office- and both she and he could end up in court.........

I'd say it's a property out in the sticks with a field attached ..... ha I've visions of some auld one in a big semi -d in terenure with 8 ponies roaming around the back garden !!

newacc2015

I would be of the opinion, if you don't like the nature of free market rentals ie the fact a landlord can increase his prices like any other business, then rent from the state. Although I can't imagine any council being keen on a tenant having several ponies in the back garden.

I dont quite get how she felt that she was being robbed with being asked to pay €30 more per month when she could afford to keep her ponies elsewhere for a year.

I think the Indo if they were going to print this hot mess of a story by keeping this 'questionable' individual anonymous could have at least corrected her 'questionable' advice from her 'solictor'.

4ensic15

kceire wrote: »

From now on, I will be signing every page of the lease along with the tenant so nobody can add in text or pages.

Lease should have pages number 1/10 etc. Two copies should be signed and the tenant offered a choice. Other features can be put in to make additions easily detectable.

The_Conductor

4ensic15 wrote: »

Lease should have pages number 1/10 etc. Two copies should be signed and the tenant offered a choice. Other features can be put in to make additions easily detectable.

You can add security features to leases- if you really want to- but hell, if your relationship with your tenant is such at the outset that you feel the need to take these lengths- you're probably in trouble from the get go.

This individual, by her own admission, was given a property in a reasonable state of repair, in good condition. After a short period of time- it appears to have deteriorated into a dangerous state- to say absolutely nothing of the equines out the back- which she agreed to remove- and subsequently brought back to the property a year later without the permission of the landlord.

Quite honestly- her attitude is stupendous.
The landlord will sleep better once he is rid of her- though after horses and god only knows what else has been traipsing over the property- hes probably going to have a hell of a bill to bring it back up to the sort of condition he can relet it in.

For everyone's sake- I genuinely hope that the RTB case is searchable- as some other unfortunate is going to encounter this individual without any forewarning.

There has to be some manner of holding people responsible for their actions.

76544567

The_Conductor wrote: »

There has to be some manner of holding people responsible for their actions.

The number one problem with leases between landlords and tenants.
Leases are so one sided.
People complain about not getting long leases. I'm.pretty sure all landlords would be happy to give long leases except that a lease means nothing at all on the tenants side.
They can walk away from it. The landlord can't.

And now the rules make that worse.
I think the next quarter will show a significant change in the amount of properties for rent in certain areas and possibly the next half year will show a big change in what's for sale too.

The_Conductor

hawkelady wrote: »

I'd say it's a property out in the sticks with a field attached ..... ha I've visions of some auld one in a big semi -d in terenure with 8 ponies roaming around the back garden !!

There is a current case involving a tenant and a property in Rathmines with the RTB- Rathmines of all places- so nothing will surprise me. There is also another case involving the a property in a residential estate in Bray- which has come before the RTB 3 times in the last 5 years- apparently with different tenants on each occasion (though I suspect they're all members of the one wider family)- also involving horses.

Nothing would surprise me.

The_Conductor

76544567 wrote: »

The number one problem with leases between landlords and tenants.
Leases are so one sided.
People complain about not getting long leases. I'm.pretty sure all landlords would be happy to give long leases except that a lease means nothing at all on the tenants side.
They can walk away from it. The landlord can't.

And now the rules make that worse.
I think the next quarter will show a significant change in the amount of properties for rent in certain areas and possibly the next half year will show a big change in what's for sale too.

Of course you're right.
A lease cannot detract from the extensive rights granted to a tenant in the Residential Tenancies Act (and nor should it)- however, it shouldn't really try to spell out the rights of either tenants or landlords- it should instead be used to clarify matters- how the property is run, day of the month on which rent is due, the actual level of the rent at the outset etc etc. You end up in a quagmire- when you try to use it as a compendium of landlord and tenants rights. A simple article at the very start- telling the tenant their rights are specified in the Residential Tenancies Act and perhaps a very short guide- would suffice- but you will have to clarify too- that nothing in the lease detracts from those rights granted in the act to either the tenant or the landlord. This may seem like common sense- only- sense doesn't appear to be very common.......


The other thing- is some estate agents are already reporting landlords indicating properties are to be kept vacant once current tenancies end- to extinguish current tenancies associated with the properties- allowing to either relet at market rates, or sell the property, without having any tenancy strictures hanging over their heads.

This may not involve a large volume of properties (yet)- however, the Minister has to have been aware that if he shifted the scale so far in favour of tenants at the expense of landlords- that it would actually become more worthwhile- at least in the short term- to keep properties empty.

Our property sector is a trainwreck- which was poorly cobbled back together after the last bust- and is rapidly thrundling downhill towards its next trainwreck.

4ensic15

4ensic15 wrote: »

Lease should have pages number 1/10 etc. Two copies should be signed and the tenant offered a choice. Other features can be put in to make additions easily detectable.

Numbering pages is useless to prevent small but significant chages being made to one copy.

In other juristictions its standard practice for both parties to initial all pages of a contract in the bottom corner. A serious pain in the wrist if you have a 100 page contract (not for rental obviously).

76544567

The_Conductor wrote: »

The other thing- is some estate agents are already reporting landlords indicating properties are to be kept vacant once current tenancies end- to extinguish current tenancies associated with the properties- allowing to either relet at market rates, or sell the property, without having any tenancy strictures hanging over their heads.

This may not involve a large volume of properties (yet)- however, the Minister has to have been aware that if he shifted the scale so far in favour of tenants at the expense of landlords- that it would actually become more worthwhile- at least in the short term- to keep properties empty.

Our property sector is a trainwreck- which was poorly cobbled back together after the last bust- and is rapidly thrundling downhill towards its next trainwreck.

For my own part I have given all of my tenants noticeto quit as I am selling. Then, as my properties become empty, I will be putting them on the market.
I fully intend to sell them, and will be asking the full current market price. I will airbnb them via an agent I was discussing this with while I wait for them to sell.

Then if they don't sell at the price I am happy with, due to the properties being devalued because if the rent limit on them, then think I will stick with airbnb and put them on the market if the price ever rises when the rent lock expires or cgt reduces.

I wont be letting long term ever again for sure.
From others I've been talking to this seems to be a very popular course of action.

76544567

76544567 wrote: »

and put them on the market if the price ever rises ...... or cgt reduces.

The role of CGT in the property mess is often overlooked.

If the government ever wants to make house prices more affordable, all they need to do is lower the CGT rate. It would cause an immediate increase in supply onto the market.

Paradoxically, lowering the rate substantially would also cause an increase in CGT tax reciepts as few fully liable CGT sales are taking place now.

athtrasna

Mod note

Can we stick to the subject of the OP please. Let's not turn this thread into another "why I'm getting out of being a landlord thread" thanks.

FinanceDublin

pilly wrote: »

Yeah I would have to say I think she's completely taking the piss. Whilst no-one wants to see someone of 77 homeless 30 is not much to ask, the old age pension has gone up a lot more than that over the course of the same 4 years.

Not many places would allow you to keep ponies either.

On the other side of the argument though if you take a tenant of 77 you can't expect them to do the maintenance on a property.

To be fair, while I do think the whole article is a load of nonsense, the pension has not gone up by "a lot more than [€30] over the course of the same 4 years".... in fact, it has only gone up by €12 per month, with a further €20 increase due at the end of March... so €2 more than the rent rise, or €32 total, hardly "a lot more" than €30!

Otherwise though the whole thing is a nonsense. Jesus wept. Normally I'd sympathise with tenant but this sounds like nonsense.