Motor tax expiry date dictating when I can go on holiday?

Fogmatic

I'm trying to plan a holiday this spring, driving over to the UK. It could be late February to mid March, late April to mid May, or anything in between. I have to plan well ahead, as I can't afford last-minute ferry fares, and the timing depends on when various relatives will be visitable. And, it seems, on the motor tax system.

Mine expires at the end of April, and it looks as if we can't renew it more than a month in advance. So it looks like I can't be away all April - is that correct? Or is there some way round it?

Vicxas

Fogmatic wrote: »

I'm trying to plan a holiday this spring, driving over to the UK. It could be late February to mid March, late April to mid May, or anything in between. I have to plan well ahead, as I can't afford last-minute ferry fares, and the timing depends on when various relatives will be visitable. And, it seems, on the motor tax system.

Mine expires at the end of April, and it looks as if we can't renew it more than a month in advance. So it looks like I can't be away all April - is that correct? Or is there some way round it?

You know you can buy Tax online?

Thoie

Do the police in the UK check for Irish tax discs? If not, then you could do your motor tax online from the UK, and ask someone at home to post it over to you in England so that it's in your windscreen when you arrive back in Ireland. Who'd be collecting your post when you were away for a month anyway?

biko

Police in the UK (at least in NI) check for Irish tax discs, or in short they may check that car is legal in country of origin, and then follow up with that government. Cars in NI have been seized.

That said, you may be ok in England, if you fancy risking it..

kerryked

Just go on your holiday - of course your motor tax isn't dictating when you can leave the country.

Once you're back before the end of May and get the car taxed before then you're grand.

From MotorTax.ie:
How long after my renewal date will I be able to tax my vehicle online?
6A. One month after your renewal date, motor tax arrears will become due on your vehicle.

Effects

You're worrying over nothing. Just tax it online while you are away.

Isambard

perhaps he doesn't have internet access :-)

mgbgt1978

kerryked wrote: »

Just go on your holiday - of course your motor tax isn't dictating when you can leave the country.

Once you're back before the end of May and get the car taxed before then you're grand.

From MotorTax.ie:
How long after my renewal date will I be able to tax my vehicle online?
6A. One month after your renewal date, motor tax arrears will become due on your vehicle.

That simply tells you that you can tax your car online within a month of expiry....and that after that you must either tax it by post or in person, as arrears will be due.
It doesn't mean that your car is taxed for May (in this instance).
OP just tax it online during April, if you are away for the whole month. You will get an online receipt which you can show in the UK if needed.

uck51js9zml2yt

You can't renew except in the final month of the current tax disk as the system looks on it as a replacement disc application.
You can do it online when away or post it into the local MTO before you go.They will hold it until they can process it.
They will process the application and send you out a disk. Just make sure everything is completed on the form and you enclose payment or a credit card number. Putting your mobile number on the form helps if there are any problems.

colm_mcm

Is there some insurance limit on how long you can drive abroad?

mgbgt1978

Basic cover (within EU....Brexit's coming OP) until the policy expires (usually TP only).
Fully Comp etc. anywhere between 3 to 6 months depending on your Insurers T & C's

Effects

Isambard wrote: »

perhaps he doesn't have internet access :-)

That's his issue to sort out.

PrettyBoy

Christ almighty..are you seriously asking if a foreign holiday you're trying to plan is no longer possible because the tax disc in your windscreen will be a few days out of date?

Some threads on this site are just utterly stupid.

ironclaw

PrettyBoy wrote: »

Christ almighty..are you seriously asking if a foreign holiday you're trying to plan is no longer possible because the tax disc in your windscreen will be a few days out of date?

Some threads on this site are just utterly stupid.

Its not exactly a stupid question. A lot of overland forums are littered with questions such as this and for good reason. For example, on the Mongol Rally (Banger car to Mongolia), there is often police and border checks that stipulate the cars must be legal in the country of origin (Tax, MOT etc), going as far to have proof you will be removing the car from the country. Paperwork is very important if you are outside your home country.

The OP can tax online and print off the receipt, this will suffice for all but the most By The Book Barry's of foreign police.

grogi

Fogmatic wrote: »

I'm trying to plan a holiday this spring, driving over to the UK. It could be late February to mid March, late April to mid May, or anything in between. I have to plan well ahead, as I can't afford last-minute ferry fares, and the timing depends on when various relatives will be visitable. And, it seems, on the motor tax system.

Mine expires at the end of April, and it looks as if we can't renew it more than a month in advance. So it looks like I can't be away all April - is that correct? Or is there some way round it?

Renew it online and have online receipt with you...?

grogi

mgbgt1978 wrote: »

That simply tells you that you can tax your car online within a month of expiry....and that after that you must either tax it by post or in person, as arrears will be due.
It doesn't mean that your car is taxed for May (in this instance).
OP just tax it online during April, if you are away for the whole month. You will get an online receipt which you can show in the UK if needed.

UK authorities don't have any business or enforcement tools in checking ROI motor-tax...

grogi

ironclaw wrote: »

Its not exactly a stupid question. A lot of overland forums are littered with questions such as this and for good reason. For example, on the Mongol Rally (Banger car to Mongolia), there is often police and border checks that stipulate the cars must be legal in the country of origin (Tax, MOT etc), going as far to have proof you will be removing the car from the country. Paperwork is very important if you are outside your home country.

The OP can tax online and print off the receipt, this will suffice for all but the most By The Book Barry's of foreign police.

Driving a car registered in Ireland, as Ireland never signed Vienna Convention (we would need to update our traffic regulations before to make them compliant), is regulated by Geneva Convention on Road Traffic from 1949. I don't see any mention of such in it.

ironclaw

grogi wrote: »

Driving a car registered in Ireland, as Ireland never signed Vienna Convention, is regulated by Geneva Convention on Road Traffic from 1949. I don't see any mention of such in it.

You can cite the convention all you want but when you are stopped and some traffic corp on a high horse wants to pull or detain your car, I'm sure they'll find a reason. Having a valid tax disc or valid NCT (For example) goes a long way to proving you and the car is on the level. Your just inviting trouble if a disc is clearly out of date or otherwise missing.

I'm not arguing with you, perhaps it has no grounding law, I'm just saying on a practical basis, I'd avoid all confrontation and have a means to appease. Goes a long way.

grogi

ironclaw wrote: »

You can cite the convention all you want but when you are stopped and some traffic corp on a high horse wants to pull or detain your car, I'm sure they'll find a reason. Having a valid tax disc or valid NCT (For example) goes a long way to proving you and the car is on the level. Your just inviting trouble if a disc is clearly out of date or otherwise missing.

I'm not arguing with you, perhaps it has no grounding law, I'm just saying on a practical basis, I'd avoid all confrontation and have a means to appease. Goes a long way.

Absolutely. The further east you go, the more laws become less official, shall we say...

Speaking from experience as well

Del2005

grogi wrote: »

UK authorities don't have any business or enforcement tools in checking ROI motor-tax...

They do, to be legal in the UK you have to be legal in Ireland. It's also a good job that they do as it was because of VOSA that our death trap commercial vehicles were detected and resulted in the replacement of the corrupt DOE with CVRT tests and RSA inspectors checking vehicles on the road.

It's not that hard for a police officer to see an out of date for missing tax disc.

grogi

Del2005 wrote: »

They do, to be legal in the UK you have to be legal in Ireland. It's also a good job that they do as it was because of VOSA that our death trap commercial vehicles were detected and resulted in the replacement of the corrupt DOE with CVRT tests and RSA inspectors checking vehicles on the road.

It's not that hard for a police officer to see an out of date for missing tax disc.

Is there a bi-lateral agreement on that subject between UK and ROI?

Del2005

grogi wrote: »

Is there a bi-lateral agreement on that subject between UK and ROI?

What subject?

grogi

Del2005 wrote: »

What subject?

On motor-tax enforcement.

When driving a car in particular country you need to obey rules of that country. Driving without insurance or not roadworthy car is certainly in violation of UK rules. But driving without ROI tax it something different, I can't imagine there is mention of Irish motor-tax in UK law.

So unless an agreement has been signed between UK and ROI on that subject, they have no business checking.

Fogmatic

Thank you all for taking the trouble to post a reply! It would be too complicated (and lengthy) to respond to each individually.

If it’s a stupid question, try writing a title describing the situation precisely enough to not waste people’s time, in a short sentence!

I had this idea that they’d done away with having a month after expiry to renew the tax. Stupidity I guess, but I must have been confusing it with NCT renewal, or the change re tax/off road periods. I’m having a perfect storm of things to juggle at the moment (NCT/work on car, passport renewal, the frequent over-70 driving licence renewal, etc), and they all seem to need watching like a hawk for changes in the rules. (Especially lately; had to produce my passport for the 1st time in November for going to the UK - maybe their guidelines have become as ambiguous as all the other Brexit stuff). But thanks to kerryked and mgbgt1978 putting me right, my query’s now resolved.

Online’s been my default car tax renewal method for years (and very quick and convenient it is too); it was getting the disc united with the car that was the possible problem. (My husband could post it to me from home, but that could mean more delays, as my itinerary within the UK often has to change suddenly. I will have internet access a lot of the time (via wifi phone), and, should the holiday go into late April, I’ll renew online. (And do a screenshot and a printout of the confirmation page/email, so I can show it when on the road).

Thanks for the insurance reminder (mine’s about the only thing I had already in place!).

endacl

Isambard wrote: »

perhaps he doesn't have internet access :-)

This thread might suggest otherwise...?

CiniO

There's hardly anything on this world which I would be less worried about than driving Irish registered car abroad while it's untaxed.
No country in this world have any legal grounds for enforcing Irish tax.
Once vehicle is registered in Ireland and have valid logbook + insurance + nct and driver has all documents to prove the above, that's all what's needed when abroad. Possibly also green card when driving outside EU or extra insurance when driving out of green card zone.
I've been pulled over by police multiple times all over Europe without tax disc and no one ever asked me for it (and rightly so).

MugMugs

Thoie wrote: »

Do the police in the UK check for Irish tax discs? If not, then you could do your motor tax online from the UK, and ask someone at home to post it over to you in England so that it's in your windscreen when you arrive back in Ireland. Who'd be collecting your post when you were away for a month anyway?

Stopped in the north, tax two months out Police noted it but only cared about Insurance.

Fogmatic

That makes sense, CiniO. Motor tax being (ideally) for road upkeep in drivers' resident countries.

Even so, I'd prefer not to be hit with a fine on the way back across Ireland (only just got rid of the points from my first ever speeding fine, the kind of borderline one that they often let us off when we lived in the UK!)

Perhaps Isambard meant internet access when away from home? (Given roaming charges, & non wifi phones). I can use my hosts' wifi internet in most places I'm going.

Fogmatic

Sorry about the passage of garbage in #24 (4th para.), now corrected (hadn’t spotted it through the narrow text window).

Forgot to say thanks, mgbgt1798, but I’m well aware that Brexit’s coming, being a Brit who’s suddenly going to be from outside the EU, thanks to a referendum I had no vote in!.

And having been self-employed/the office for our little construction firm all my working life, I’ve (a) learned the hard way to read the small print, and (b) been continually plagued by ambiguities in official forms and guidelines (such as the NCT website’s vagueness re the month after renewal).

Just one example, the official guidelines when moving here from London, saying that UK road tax was valid over here. With ours about to expire, and having virtually no money, a generous relative volunteered to renew ours for a year. We later stumbled on the fact that ‘valid in Ireland’ meant ‘the disc is road legal, but the Irish tax must be paid from the start of Irish residence’ (making the gift worthless).

That was in 1992, with no internet (or other info sources reachable from here). But even now, forums are full of queries arising from badly designed forms and ambiguous guidelines. It’s not helped by an increasing belief that long words might frighten the public. (End of rant!).

Charles Babbage

grogi wrote: »

Is there a bi-lateral agreement on that subject between UK and ROI?

Of course there is, agreements on mutual requirements for road tax go back to 1923

CiniO

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Of course there is, agreements on mutual requirements for road tax go back to 1923

Would you be able to provide any source of that information?

GM228

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Of course there is, agreements on mutual requirements for road tax go back to 1923

1925 actually, and only between Ireland-Northern Ireland (and still in force today by the way).

Ireland-the rest of the UK/and the rest of Europe is covered under EU directives and regulations which have been transposed into national laws (including the UK) meaning that valid Irish motor tax is legally required in the UK and other EU states.

From the DVLA:-
https://www.gov.uk/importing-vehicles-into-the-uk/temporary-imports

Temporary imports

You can usually use a vehicle with foreign number plates without registering or taxing it in the UK if all of the following apply:

• you’re visiting and don’t plan to live here
  
• the vehicle is registered and taxed in its home country
  
• you only use the vehicle for up to 6 months in total - this can be a single visit, or several shorter visits over 12 months

In NI valid Irish motor tax is required under the Motor Car (Irish Circulation) (Northern Ireland) Regulations 1925 (SI 1925/164).

Whilst in the rest of the UK it is required under EU Directive 83/182/EEC which has been transposed into UK law by the Motor Vehicles (International Circulation) Order 1975 (SI 1975/2008) (as amended).