HSE bill and threat of debt collectors

Kai123

Hello,

I'd like some input on this since I am not sure where I stand.

I was due to have minor surgery late last year after 2 years of waiting, not a problem since it was not life threatening (but was told it had the potential to be and still does depending on who you ask).

After 6 hours of waiting I was on the bed and getting ready, the consultant who I never met (since the old one left in the previous 2 years) checked me over and said he cant see anything wrong and advised against the surgery. He said they can still do the surgery but its not life threatening and I can go home if I wanted. An appointment was made to see him in March.

So, I have a €75 bill to pay. I can see this as a price to pay regardless since I feel like I wasted everyone's time (although this was not my fault) or try and dispute it, since its basically paying €75 for sitting in a chair for 6 hours.

I've had a final letter saying they will send this to the debt collectors if I don't pay. Would this be something worth disputing or am I being unreasonable?

Kai.

newacc2015

So you asked to see a consultant, who you did and you were billed accordingly. Because you didn't hear what you like, you don't think you should pay now? You asked for a service and you got it. You have to pay for it

If you dont want to wait 2 years for an appointment and not have to wait 6 hours for a consultant. Go private.

I think you are being quite unreasonable.

Corruptedmorals

No, the €75 is the inpatient charge. OP was only very briefly an inpatient as the surgery did not go ahead.

I think you would have grounds to dispute the charge OP. Ring patient accounts of the hospital and explain. Although you presented on the day and received medical advice, that was all

tracey turnblad

I think it's more along the lines if he wouldn't have been there only for he was diagnosed incorrectly. If he was diagnosed correctly in the first place he wouldn't have been told he needed surgery and he wouldn't have had to stay there and be seen by the consultant therefore incurring no charge. I don't know I think I'd pay it, I'd just be so relieved that I was fine.

davo10

tracey turnblad wrote: »

I think it's more along the lines if he wouldn't have been there only for he was diagnosed incorrectly. If he was diagnosed correctly in the first place he wouldn't have been told he needed surgery and he wouldn't have had to stay there and be seen by the consultant therefore incurring no charge. I don't know I think I'd pay it, I'd just be so relieved that I was fine.

Op was waiting 2 years for a minor surgery, the problem could have resolved during that time due to medication/changes in lifestyle/body's natural ability to heal. I think it is disingenuous to say the op was misdiagnosed, the surgeon said the op could still go ahead if he/she wanted any lingering issue resolved but in the surgeon's opinion the issue was not that bad. Personally I'd be relieved, if I was the op I'd pay the €75, it's a small price to pay for the service and opinion provided.

Estrellita

Pay the fee. How long you were waiting is irrelevant, it sounds like any other hospital in the country. The consultants don't work for free, and whatever you were told before isn't this one's fault.

I'd be rather reluctant to dirty my bib with a hospital, you never know when you will need them again. €75 is manageable, and I'd be just happy I got a free pass.

rock22

[QUOTE=Estrellita;102616968he consultants don't work for free, and whatever you were told before isn't this one's fault.
[/QUOTE]

The consultant is being paid so that is irrelevant.
Clearly the OP was brought to the hospital for a procedure that was then cancelled. He has a good case for having the fee cancelled if he were to write to the hospital with these facts.

Estrellita wrote: »

I'd be rather reluctant to dirty my bib with a hospital, you never know when you will need them again. €75 is manageable, and I'd be just happy I got a free pass.

Do you seriously believe the OP would have any difficulty in accessing hospital services because his procedure was cancelled

AudreyHepburn

I'll never understand why people in this country expect to get everything for free.

OP you availed of the consultant's appointment, you can't refuse to pay just because you were something other than you were expecting.

€75 will hardly break the bank and you can't expect the consultant to work for nothing. Just pay your bills and move on.

davo10

rock22 wrote: »

The consultant is being paid so that is irrelevant.
Clearly the OP was brought to the hospital for a procedure that was then cancelled. He has a good case for having the fee cancelled if he were to write to the hospital with these facts.



Do you seriously believe the OP would have any difficulty in accessing hospital services because his procedure was cancelled

He wasn't "brought" to the hospital, he was given an appointment, anyone that is on a surgical waiting list would gladly swop places with the op.

The procedure wasn't "cancelled", the op was examined by a second consultant and given the option to proceed with surgery if he/she wished. He/she got a second opinion and the issue seemingly having resolved somewhat in the time since the initial examination, he/she was a advised that surgery may not be necessary.

Estrellita

rock22 wrote: »

The consultant is being paid so that is irrelevant.
Clearly the OP was brought to the hospital for a procedure that was then cancelled. He has a good case for having the fee cancelled if he were to write to the hospital with these facts.

Do you seriously believe the OP would have any difficulty in accessing hospital services because his procedure was cancelled

Instead of having a pop at me, why don't you read the original post and get the facts straight. Whether you agree with me or not is what is irrelevant.

coylemj

This is clearly a public hospital situation. Whatever you think of the merits of the OP getting a bill for €75, the money is not going to pay the consultant.

You don't wait two years in the private system to see a consultant for 'minor surgery' (OP's description) and then have to hang around in the hospital for six hours for a slot in the theatre for a booked procedure.

CalamariFritti

How is this even a question?

You got professional advice that saved you from surgery. It shouldn't take this long and all that but you still got good advice. From a flawed but still good quality health system. On your health. On that single precious body you have.
How is €75 too much for that?

Kai123

Thanks for the input everyone.

Just to clarify the original GP and the first consultant I saw told me that the surgery was necessary to avoid complications in the future, the consultant I saw on the day of the surgery told me its actually fine and no surgery was necessary.

He was unable to see what everyone else saw before. I have an appointment in March to see this consultant because I told him maybe once every two days, the pain will make me keel over for a few seconds but it goes away very quickly.

All other appointments were paid for. The main dispute I have is the waste of everyone's time. The consultant on the day was just as miffed as to why I was there.

Just so everyone is aware, I am putting my case forward and looking for input, I am not saying I am refusing to pay this. I just got off the phone to the payment dept and its been put on hold until the end of the month (was originally due for payment by Friday).

coylemj

Kai123 wrote: »

Just to clarify the original GP and the first consultant I saw told me that the surgery was necessary to avoid complications in the future, the consultant I saw on the day of the surgery told me its actually fine and no surgery was necessary.

I think you're treating this as if a mechanic told you that you needed a part replaced in your car and another mechanic told you that it didn't need replacing.

What you have to bear in mind is that medicine is an inexact science. The decision as to whether you should have the surgery would be based not just on medical need but also on the balance of risk/reward - how does the benefit of having the surgery balance against the risk of it going wrong on the day or of it leading to possible complications down the line?

Every surgical procedure carries risks and being told that you don't need the surgery could be a simple case of a fresh pair of eyes taking a different view from the first consultant and that on balance, you're better off not having the procedure.

Arbie

This happens us every few weeks, a patient arrives and the problem has resolved or improved to such a degree that surgery isn't necessary or may be of minimal benefit. In the public hospital where I work, patients do not get charged for cancellations even if they are about to walk through the operating theatre doors. We just make a note that surgery is cancelled and book them in for review at clinic, or discharge them, depending on the case.

I don't think it's ethical to charge people for cancelled procedures. It could put a perverse pressure on people to have surgery that they would otherwise defer or decline.

dudara

I think in these circumstances, you have a case to request a dismissal of the charge. You were scheduled to attend hospital, which you did in good faith on the basis that surgery would proceed, and the surgeon then changed these plans.

I'll be interested to hear how this turns out.

rock22

Estrellita wrote: »

Instead of having a pop at me, why don't you read the original post and get the facts straight. Whether you agree with me or not is what is irrelevant.

I did get the facts straight. I work in the public health system. The consultant is paid a salary and is paid that whether the patient pays the €75.

The patient was brought into the hospital to have a procedure and that procedure was not performed. He did not become a day patient. The €75 fee is for inhospital procedures . He had a consultation with a public consultant which is free.
My advice was to write and explain the details. The billing department will not know that the procedure was cancelled.

Thoie

I'd look on it that the €75 is the fee for being an "inpatient", and she still took up a bed (through no fault of her own), meaning it wasn't available for someone else that day.

The operating theatre staff/consultants and the "bed providing people" aren't the same people.

Say I booked a hotel room for Monday night in order to have a meeting early on Tuesday. I arrive at the hotel, check in to my room, use the bathroom, lie on the bed for a short while, then I get a call to tell me the Tuesday meeting is cancelled and I can go home. I still owe for the use of the room, as the hotel can't fill it again easily.

Before you were sent home, what other services were used? Did you spend some time with an admin person checking in? Did nurses take some of your stats (weight, blood pressure, temperature)? The €75 inpatient charge is highly subsidised to begin with. I'd pay it.

SteoL

Thoie wrote: »

I'd look on it that the €75 is the fee for being an "inpatient", and she still took up a bed (through no fault of her own), meaning it wasn't available for someone else that day.

The operating theatre staff/consultants and the "bed providing people" aren't the same people.

Say I booked a hotel room for Monday night in order to have a meeting early on Tuesday. I arrive at the hotel, check in to my room, use the bathroom, lie on the bed for a short while, then I get a call to tell me the Tuesday meeting is cancelled and I can go home. I still owe for the use of the room, as the hotel can't fill it again easily.

Before you were sent home, what other services were used? Did you spend some time with an admin person checking in? Did nurses take some of your stats (weight, blood pressure, temperature)? The €75 inpatient charge is highly subsidised to begin with. I'd pay it.

Huge difference between a hotel and a public hospital. OP should call billing department as stated above they might not know procedure was cancelled.

Kai123

Just a quick update. I talked to their accounts dept and the bill has been dismissed due to me not receiving any treatment on the day.