Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2016/2017

5starpool

J Mysterio wrote: »

Suso has got 6 goals in 19 appearances for Genoa this season (Serie A) on the back of 39 and 7 for Milan last season. Still only 23, which is hard to believe.

Most of those Milan performances are this season. He was on loan at Genoa the second part of last season I think. I was a fan of Suso when he was at Liverpool, would have liked to see him get more of a chance, especially given the crap we were served up a lot of the last season he was there. Obviously wasn't trusted to play though.

BorneTobyWilde

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/liverpool-mamadou-sakho-crystal-palace-10429587

“You can’t con anyone that he didn’t make a massive difference, we won some massive games with him,” he said.

“He’s a big character, he’s got the respect of all the players, and it’s one we’d like to do. But, of course, we have a lot of things we need to do in the summer, and the money needs to work for us and for Liverpool.”

~Rebel~

noodler wrote: »

Defoe will make chances for himself.

He will finish more of the chances he gets.

I'm not entertaining anything that tries to say Origi is anywhere near as clinical.

I don't think anyone's saying he is. But he's bigger, stronger, faster, more mobile and versatile, and is 13 years younger.

One of those players is on the way up, the other is on the way down.
You can expect more from one each year, you can expect less from the other.

Defoe has his strengths, but all things considered, it's not even a close decision imo.

~Rebel~

J Mysterio wrote: »

Well, we have Origi, Ings, Firmino and Sturridge. Firmino isnt really a striker Ings is a question mark and Origi is still not quite there. I wouldnt sell Sturridge, he is still only 27 and should be coming into his prime.

This is only true of players that haven't been wrecked by injury. We've seen it countless times when players hitting their 'prime' are actually found to have been in their prime back at 23/24. Especially fast players. Owen's the obvious example. Rooney has been poor for 3 seasons now, and is only 31.

Sturridge will never be as good as he was. Even if he managed to stay fit, it looks like his pace of 3 years ago is gone and isn't coming back. Like Owen, he has to adapt his game to match, and while he'll always score goals because he's a natural finisher, he won't ever be able to do what he could before. Putting the ball into space and letting him outpace the defenders is how he made his name. That's gone.

shamrock55

Whats the best pub around anfield for atmosphere,last game i went to the albert was packed but no singing whatsoever before the game,it used to be great there,went to the park after and was pretty much the same but we had lost the game then

54and56

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Sturridge will never be as good as he was. Even if he managed to stay fit, it looks like his pace of 3 years ago is gone and isn't coming back. Like Owen, he has to adapt his game to match, and while he'll always score goals because he's a natural finisher, he won't ever be able to do what he could before. Putting the ball into space and letting him outpace the defenders is how he made his name. That's gone.

Na. He's much more than a one trick pony.

His ability to create space, his close control, his ability to find team mates and his shooting accuracy were all as or more important to his performance than out and out pace and if he can stay (relatively) fit there's no reason why he can't contribute 10-15 goals a season particularly in home games where we struggle to open up packed defences. His days as the #1 striker for 90 minutes game after game a la Costa are long gone but if we can't get a decent fee for him why get rid of him?

ricero

shamrock55 wrote: »

Whats the best pub around anfield for atmosphere,last game i went to the albert was packed but no singing whatsoever before the game,it used to be great there,went to the park after and was pretty much the same but we had lost the game then

The park before a game is great fun. Enjoy and no moaning. Hope we get the job done

Harry Palmr

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

Na. He's much more than a one trick pony.

His ability to create space, his close control, his ability to find team mates and his shooting accuracy were all as or more important to his performance than out and out pace and if he can stay (relatively) fit there's no reason why he can't contribute 10-15 goals a season particularly in home games where we struggle to open up packed defences. His days as the #1 striker for 90 minutes game after game a la Costa are long gone but if we can't get a decent fee for him why get rid of him?

Probably worth pointing out he's scored 15 goals in 3 seasons, he is endemically weak at some basic medical level, it's beyond my own ability to imagine him saying fit enough for long enough to score double figures in a season again but he will fetch a decent fee easily. There is always a club willing to take a chance on a quality player who has question marks hanging over him. West Ham look like prime candidates despite their experience with Andy Carroll.

~Rebel~

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

Na. He's much more than a one trick pony.

His ability to create space, his close control, his ability to find team mates and his shooting accuracy were all as or more important to his performance than out and out pace and if he can stay (relatively) fit there's no reason why he can't contribute 10-15 goals a season particularly in home games where we struggle to open up packed defences. His days as the #1 striker for 90 minutes game after game a la Costa are long gone but if we can't get a decent fee for him why get rid of him?

It's a lovely idea, and if there was some way to guarantee even some basic level of fitness, i'd be ok with him staying. (though I think you're underestimating his pace - just go back and look at his goals. A lot of the ones where he wasn't sprinting into space, he scored by opening space with a lighting quick burst over 5 yards, which also seems to be gone)

But it's the fitness thing... he's our second highest earner I believe. Having him there filling that spot means that's another player on super-wages we simply won't buy. We only have so many of those slots, and one of ours is usually not even in the stadium, let alone on the bench.

As for 10-15 goals... It took him till last Sunday to score 15 league goals over the past THREE seasons in total. I don't see what evidence there is to trust that that's going to change.

I love Sturridge. I really do. He's a fantastically gifted footballer, and I actually like how aloof and different he is from the usual footballer. But there comes a time where you have to just accept the reality, and after 3 years, it's hard to keep faith of some change. He's spent more of his Liverpool career injured than fit.

shamrock55

ricero wrote: »

The park before a game is great fun. Enjoy and no moaning. Hope we get the job done

Ha ha,there will be no moaning unless we fail to win, anyway i used to go to park but the switched to the albert for a while, im going with a lad who hasnt been to a game before and just want to show them a good atmosphere

SuperTortoise

I hope Sturridge stays for another year, he might even finish as our top goalscorer this season as mad as that sounds, and that with a severly limited ammount of playing time.

If we can get 30 starts out of him in all competitions next year i'd bet he'd return 15-20 goals, no other striker at the club would give us that return.

When i was listening to Klopp's comments after the game he seems to rate him highly, i have a feeling he'll take a punt and keep him.

~Rebel~

SuperTortoise wrote: »

I hope Sturridge stays for another year, he might even finish as our top goalscorer this season as mad as that sounds, and that with a severly limited ammount of playing time.

If we can get 30 starts out of him in all competitions next year i'd bet he'd return 15-20 goals, no other striker at the club would give us that return.

When i was listening to Klopp's comments after the game he seems to rate him highly, i have a feeling he'll take a punt and keep him.

Only if he scores 10 goals this weekend...

And we've only gotten 41 starts out of him in 3 years.

I dont think anyone would doubt that if he plays regularly, he'll get goals. But there's zero evidence that he'll play.

SuperTortoise

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Only if he scores 10 goals this weekend...

A hatrick against Boro will see him joint top goalscorer in all competitions.
He has 7 league and 3 cup, Mane has 13 all in.

I should have said in all competitions in my previous post.

~Rebel~

SuperTortoise wrote: »

A hatrick against Boro will see him joint top goalscorer in all competitions.
He has 7 league and 3 cup, Mane has 13 all in.

I should have said in all competitions in my previous post.

I don't know where you're getting your stats from, but he has only 3 in the league and 4 in the EFL cup.

54and56

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Probably worth pointing out he's scored 15 goals in 3 seasons, he is endemically weak at some basic medical level, it's beyond my own ability to imagine him saying fit enough for long enough to score double figures in a season again but he will fetch a decent fee easily.

I totally get the fact he's contributed SFA over the last three seasons but if his fitness is really that poor and its not something which he can overcome how will any club pay a fee for him? It just doesn't make sense. I get that towards the end of the transfer window there will be a few clubs panicking that they need a striker or need a "big" signing to show they mean business etc (don't forget we did sign Balotelli in similar circumstances) but will they actually write a cheque on a guy who has scored less than 15 goals in 3 seasons and can't stay fit and is on £150,000 a week or whatever? Best case scenario IMHO is someone offers to take him off our hands and offer him some form of pay as you play deal which we'll end up subsidising about 80% of. If that's the best we can get for him he might as well stay in and be a squad player.

~Rebel~

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

I totally get the fact he's contributed SFA over the last three seasons but if his fitness is really that poor and its not something which he can overcome how will any club pay a fee for him? It just doesn't make sense. I get that towards the end of the transfer window there will be a few clubs panicking that they need a striker or need a "big" signing to show they mean business etc (don't forget we did sign Balotelli in similar circumstances) but will they actually write a cheque on a guy who has scored less than 15 goals in 3 seasons and can't stay fit and is on ?150,000 a week or whatever? Best case scenario IMHO is someone offers to take him off our hands and offer him some form of pay as you play deal which we'll end up subsidising about 80% of. If that's the best we can get for him he might as well stay in and be a squad player.

You're right - it makes absolutely no sense. And I don't understand it at all. And yet we see it happen time and time again. What is happening right now on this thread happens in the real world, and you see players with terrible injury histories gaining fitness and making a move, and then breaking down again.

Clubs are desperate for goals, and they're apparently willing to make the move under the hope/impression that they'll be different - they'll be able to manage the injuries.

West Ham were ****ing nuts to pay us what they did for Carroll - sure he spent most of his loan season with them out injured. And yet they did. And he's been injured most of the time since.

That's why this is the time to sell. While everyone's in short term 'Sturridge is back!' mode.

SuperTortoise

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I don't know where you're getting your stats from, but he has only 3 in the league and 4 in the EFL cup.

Sorry, i misread his stats.:o

Knex*

There's also a chance that Sturridge refuses to leave. If its only the likes of West Ham or other middle table teams that come in for him, he could easily snub them tbh.

I definitely think he's the type of player who still believes himself to be capable of being the main man for a top club, and playing CL football.

He could decide to back himself to get into the team next year, despite whoever Liverpool may sign in the summer, and then all of this sell or don't sell just becomes pointless conjecture.

~Rebel~

Knex. wrote: »

There's also a chance that Sturridge refuses to leave. If its only the likes of West Ham or other middle table teams that come in for him, he could easily snub them tbh.

I definitely think he's the type of player who still believes himself to be capable of being the main man for a top club, and playing CL football.

He could decide to back himself to get into the team next year, despite whoever Liverpool may sign in the summer, and then all of this sell or don't sell just becomes pointless conjecture.

This is definitely an issue alright.

I'd love to see him play abroad in a slightly less physical, more technical league. Think he'd thrive in Spain in particular. Seville maybe.

Bowlardo

If coutinho is going to be playing in the central the definitely keep sturridge. I'd let origi and ings go on loan for the first half of the season. I would start firmino against the top 7 team and sturridge at home against the lesser lights.

~Rebel~

This thread seriously goes into Spousal abuse mode with Sturridge every year;

"This time it's going to be different... everything's great right now, and I can see no reason why it would ever go back to being like it was. Even though it's happened loads of times, and I think this each time and end up disappointed. This time is different."

GotTheTshirt

According to the Telegraph......

Arsenal beat Sunderland 3-0 on Tuesday, before drawing 0-0 against Everton on the final day.

Manchester City draw 2-2 with West Brom in their final home game of the season, before ending the season with a shock 3-1 defeat against Watford at Vicarage Road.

Liverpool lose 1-0 to already relegated Middlesbrough on the final day of the season.

If all those above results come in, all three sides would be on 73 points, a goal difference of +32 and 75 goals scored for the season.

tinpib

GotTheTshirt wrote: »

According to the Telegraph......

Arsenal beat Sunderland 3-0 on Tuesday, before drawing 0-0 against Everton on the final day.

Manchester City draw 2-2 with West Brom in their final home game of the season, before ending the season with a shock 3-1 defeat against Watford at Vicarage Road.

Liverpool lose 1-0 to already relegated Middlesbrough on the final day of the season.

If all those above results come in, all three sides would be on 73 points, a goal difference of +32 and 75 goals scored for the season.

All this was decided at the 2015 Bilderberg Group meeting.

~Rebel~

Three team mini league playoff? I'd fancy us to be honest!

mormank

~Rebel~ wrote: »

This thread seriously goes into Spousal abuse mode with Sturridge every year;

"This time it's going to be different... everything's great right now, and I can see no reason why it would ever go back to being like it was. Even though it's happened loads of times, and I think this each time and end up disappointed. This time is different."

Am I the only one who read that in David Mitchell's voice?

D0NNELLY

mormank wrote: »

Am I the only one who read that in David Mitchell's voice?

Am i the only one who straight away thought of Liverpool and not Sturridge

noodler

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I don't think anyone's saying he is. But he's bigger, stronger, faster, more mobile and versatile, and is 13 years younger.

One of those players is on the way up, the other is on the way down.
You can expect more from one each year, you can expect less from the other.

Defoe has his strengths, but all things considered, it's not even a close decision imo.

Ask yourself, will Origi be here in two years?

I don't think his age matters.

~Rebel~

noodler wrote: »

Ask yourself, will Origi be here in two years?

I don't think his age matters.

He turned 22 a month ago. Wouldn't be at all surprised if he was still here and playing a bigger role in 2 years. He's also the exact type of player that usually develops more around 24 or so, as they build out their natural frame, and use their size more.

His age really gets totally ignored, I presume because he's played so much. He's a year younger than Batshuayi at Chelsea. At the same age, Lacazette had just come off the back of a season in which he scored 3 goals for Lyon in 27 games. Young strikers take a little time to develop. We happen to have one of the better young ones around, who contributes a lot, while still developing, with a massive ceiling.

This is still the kid that, just before turning 21 last season, spearheaded our attack against Dortmund, got us the massive away goal, and kickstarted our comeback with the first goal in the home leg too.

SuperTortoise

SuperTortoise wrote: »

.......................

When i was listening to Klopp's comments after the game he seems to rate him highly, i have a feeling he'll take a punt and keep him.

Knex. wrote: »

There's also a chance that Sturridge refuses to leave. If its only the likes of West Ham or other middle table teams that come in for him, he could easily snub them tbh...................

Exactly, Klopp, the club and Sturridge will collectively decide if he stays or goes. The club payed small money for him and then gave him a pay increase ......... he got injured .....repeatedly........and will almost certainly do so again.... que sera sera.

noodler

~Rebel~ wrote: »

He turned 22 a month ago. Wouldn't be at all surprised if he was still here and playing a bigger role in 2 years. He's also the exact type of player that usually develops more around 24 or so, as they build out their natural frame, and use their size more.

His age really gets totally ignored, I presume because he's played so much. He's a year younger than Batshuayi at Chelsea. At the same age, Lacazette had just come off the back of a season in which he scored 3 goals for Lyon in 27 games. Young strikers take a little time to develop. We happen to have one of the better young ones around, who contributes a lot, while still developing, with a massive ceiling.

This is still the kid that, just before turning 21 last season, spearheaded our attack against Dortmund, got us the massive away goal, and kickstarted our comeback with the first goal in the home leg too.

I do hate when people list off a number of exceptions to the rule to try and make the point!

I'd argue we'd need to have seen alot more from him by 22 to convince us he would have a longterm future.

How much will he develop as our backup anyway? We'll almost certainly buy at least one more forward in the summer.

I think Origi isn't seen to best effect in a front 3

~Rebel~

It's the other way around, in that he's the exception at the level he's at, at that age. The norm for that age is to produce a fraction of what's he's shown so far. Pretty much any other players who have done or bettered what he's done in their first 21 years, went on to be very very expensive.

And I'd agree he may get pushed back if we strengthen heavily, and if that happens, a loan move to play week in week out would be great. I'd have no doubt we'd have no problems finding premier league suitors. As another comparison, next season he'll be at the same stage Sturridge was when he got that half season Bolton loan move.

paulie21

Why should Arsenal get a playoff against us. They've lost twice to Liverpool this season and City lost once and drew once. Head to Head should be included

Morzadec

Origi has played 42 times this season I heard.

We are not blessed with a big squad and have more games next season.

He'll get plenty of game time bext season and will ve a very useful squad option to have.

We'd be mad to send him on loan imo, we need all the numbers we can get, especially if they have proven they can contribute

Origi does score his share of goals.
Klopps system isn't old fashioned striker friendly.

brevity

Don't sell anyone that doesn't want to go, just buy better players.

The squad is thin enough as it is.

ush

I know Klopp's set up isn't old fashioned striker friendly. But they're gonna need that option. Can see them chasing a late equaliser in an away champions league game with attacking midfielders.

noodler

brevity wrote: »

Don't sell anyone that doesn't want to go, just buy better players.

The squad is thin enough as it is.

I think we have got a little sidetracked talking about Origi - originally alot of the point was just that Defoe would score more and would be free.

No harm in both.

We have spent half the season without a striker or with Origi as the only option which has been like treading water.

I also think its optimistic in the extreme to expect Ings to be contributing next season.

It'd be great to be proved wrong on that one but he has had one decent season for Burnley and has had two serious injuries in succession.

Knex*

~Rebel~ wrote: »

This thread seriously goes into Spousal abuse mode with Sturridge every year;

"This time it's going to be different... everything's great right now, and I can see no reason why it would ever go back to being like it was. Even though it's happened loads of times, and I think this each time and end up disappointed. This time is different."

I don't think anyone is advocating not getting in a top class striker, and instead just solely relying on Sturridge to be the main goal scorer in some act of blind faith.

You look at the top teams, Spurs aside as you could argue that they're somewhat of an anomaly, and they all have quality on the bench. Even Spurs spent money on Janssen even though he hasn't worked out, and have Son who can play the role too.

I think we need that depth and competition. There should be no urgency to get rid of Sturridge just to remove his wages, imo. The other top clubs can handle far higher than 150k a week for backups, just fine. The money in the PL right now, and the way we've increased our revenue streams since FSG have arrived, means we should have a lot of money to play with. We've barely spent money from a net perspective in the last few years, and have consistently removed or lost the high earners from the team.

We should be well able to pay 30m for another striker and have himself, Firmino, Sturridge and Origi battle it out. Our bench and overall squad depth is shameful at the moment, and players with Sturridge's striking ability are once in a decade type players for this club.

If you have those three plus another great striker, then you can almost guarantee that you will be challenging for things next season, imo. Fergie did it for years with United. Stack the **** out of the striking options and it covers your deficiencies greater than anything else you can do.

MD1990

Coutinho is having a great season. Had an out of form spell plus 2 months injured.
He would have at least 15 PL goals surely if he didn't injure his ankle. Still only 24 as well.

paulie21

paulie21 wrote: »

Why should Arsenal get a playoff against us. They've lost twice to Liverpool this season and City lost once and drew once. Head to Head should be included

It should be head to head when we have a better head to head. A playoff when we don't.

murpho999

RoboKlopp wrote: »

It should be head to head when we have a better head to head. A playoff when we don't.

Not worried about this as Liverpool will win on Sunday.

BullBlackNova

Spotted on the Summer Transfer Thread that we've been reported as having signed Andrew Robertson from Hull.

I had missed it so Googled and there's a few stories saying it, though all seem to reporting the same thing throughout the tabloids. Not exactly reliable so I'll wait until the lean, but what would people think we did sign him?

No doubting the fact that we need a left-back but would people be happy enough with him?

I think he has potential for sure, looked good in the few games I saw him in this season but probably don't see enough Hull to make a fully informed decision.

(Also the same rumours saying that Harry Maguire is on our list too.)

Buford T. Justice XIX

Dirk Kuyt and 130,000 Feyenoord supporters singing You'll Never Walk Alone:)

https://streamable.com/n3x05

5starpool

murpho999 wrote: »

Not worried about this as Liverpool will win on Sunday.

You said that last week, an how did that work out, eh?

murpho999

murpho999 wrote: »

Not worried about this as Liverpool will win on Sunday.

I wish I had that confidence about Liverpool at Anfield against teams we should be beating

BorneTobyWilde

Shirley Southampton would like Sakho and 10 million for Vertigo Van Dick . It would be a decent trade.
Southampton have a tendency though to receive big money instead of trades, and replace a player with a very small amount of that money they receive through sales. On paper though it would be an ideal trade for everyone.

citytillidie

RoboKlopp wrote: »

I wish I had that confidence about Liverpool at Anfield against teams we should be beating

Liverpool's league results at Anfield this season

Leicester 4-1
Hull 5-1
Man U 0-0
West Brom 2-1
Watford 6-1
Sunderland 2-0
West Ham 2-2
Stoke 4-1
Man C 1-0
Swansea 2-3
Chelsea 1-1
Spurs 2-0
Arsenal 3-1
Burnley 2-1
Everton 3-1
Bournemouth 2-2
Crystal Palace 1-2
Southampton 0-0

Win 11 Drew 5 Lost 2

BoardsMember

RoboKlopp wrote: »

I wish I had that confidence about Liverpool at Anfield against teams we should be beating

Same here. Last three home games we have taken 2 points when playing Bournemouth, Crystal Palace and Southampton. That's really not very good, certainly not confidence inducing.

Agent Coulson

16 years ago today we won the UEFA Cup.

If I didn't feel old already I do now.