Height limits for buildings in Cork City

ofcork

Ojections gone in against hotel on sullivans quay.

yogmeister

ofcork wrote: »

Ojections gone in against hotel on sullivans quay.

Typical there's always some wally out there to object to anything good for the city .

CHealy

yogmeister wrote: »

Typical there's always some wally out there to object to anything good for the city .

Its the women who owns the college building adjacent, and she's objected because she says BAM have not provider her with adequate information as to how the construction of the building will affect her, not the height of the building. I agree though, the planning process in this country just gives any sort of NIMBY the right to object for any little thing. This is likely to set the project back months.

satanta99

An Taisce have also submitted an appeal to An Bord Pleanála.

They also submitted an appeal to the previous proposal on grounds of building height.

GavRedKing

This is why we cant have nice things.

D'Agger

In fairness, given how BAM have acted with the events centre I'm glad to see them getting fúcked over by a bit of red tape that's designed to prevent hasty & potentially poorly planned building projects.

The college has every right to appeal for more information - An Taisce - expected that to an extent, didn't they object to the Capitol building also?

I know it's jobs for the city, but other than that, it's a hotel - if it's delayed a few months so be it.

marno21

An Taisce object to all forms of development.

This is no surprise but it's disappointing to see because it's a massive source of more delays that we really could deal without.

The amount of objections to the 40 storey is going to be depressing

snotboogie

D'Agger wrote: »

In fairness, given how BAM have acted with the events centre I'm glad to see them getting fúcked over by a bit of red tape that's designed to prevent hasty & potentially poorly planned building projects.

The college has every right to appeal for more information - An Taisce - expected that to an extent, didn't they object to the Capitol building also?

I know it's jobs for the city, but other than that, it's a hotel - if it's delayed a few months so be it.

They are knocking one of the ugliest buildings in the city and replacing it with one of the better designs I've seen for Cork. The sooner the monstrosity is bulldozed the better

draiochtanois

This post has been deleted.

Meursault

marno21 wrote: »

An Taisce object to all forms of development.

This is no surprise but it's disappointing to see because it's a massive source of more delays that we really could deal without.

The amount of objections to the 40 storey is going to be depressing

The proposed 40 storey development will be interesting. It will be built on the point between the two channels, therefore it wont be restricting any other business or obstructing anyone's views. The Elysian is already located in that area, so its hard to object, due to height - (admittedly, this will be much taller), and it could potentially be a real landmark as you approach the city from Tivoli.

In reality, someone is bound to object. For some reason, a lot of Irish people appear to have a phobia of buildings with more than 5 storeys.

The delay with Sullivan's quay is a disgrace. The old tax building is hideous. The complaint - (the negative impact on Griffith College, during construction) - is nonsense. Navigation sq is going up without any fuss, and there were no complaints from Carey's tools, sextant, idle hour, etc.

Outkast_IRE

Meursault wrote: »

The delay with Sullivan's quay is a disgrace. The old tax building is hideous. The complaint - (the negative impact on Griffith College, during construction) - is nonsense. Navigation sq is going up without any fuss, and there were no complaints from Carey's tools, sextant, idle hour, etc.

Of course there was no complaints from them, they are going to massively benefit from this development and it will increase the value of their land hugely.

namloc1980

Meursault wrote: »

The proposed 40 storey development will be interesting. It will be built on the point between the two channels, therefore it wont be restricting any other business or obstructing anyone's views. The Elysian is already located in that area, so its hard to object, due to height - (admittedly, this will be much taller), and it could potentially be a real landmark as you approach the city from Tivoli.

In reality, someone is bound to object. For some reason, a lot of Irish people appear to have a phobia of buildings with more than 5 storeys.

The delay with Sullivan's quay is a disgrace. The old tax building is hideous. The complaint - (the negative impact on Griffith College, during construction) - is nonsense. Navigation sq is going up without any fuss, and there were no complaints from Carey's tools, sextant, idle hour, etc.

For one An Taisce will be all over it given the 40 floor building is to be adjacent to the bonded warehouses and Port of Cork building. There'll be numerous other bodies and individuals object on those grounds alone. I think they'll be a lot of objections and in Ireland there's really no limit on how frivolous a complaint/objection can be. You can object on virtually any grounds whatsoever.

Meursault

namloc1980 wrote: »

For one An Taisce will be all over it given the 40 floor building is to be adjacent to the bonded warehouses and Port of Cork building. There'll be numerous other bodies and individuals object on those grounds alone. I think they'll be a lot of objections and in Ireland there's really no limit on how frivolous a complaint/objection can be. You can object on virtually any grounds whatsoever.

The proposed development involves the bonded warehouses, which are currently lying idle, and falling in to disrepair. You'd imagine An Taisce would support this, but you are probably right. They are likely to do everything they can to prevent it from going ahead.

cgcsb

I'd love to see the 40 storey go up. In reality though An Taisce has government funding behind it and can afford to appeal and appeal and go to higher and higher courts until private developers run out of money.

the beer revolu

Meursault wrote: »

The proposed development involves the bonded warehouses, which are currently lying idle, and falling in to disrepair. You'd imagine An Taisce would support this, but you are probably right. They are likely to do everything they can to prevent it from going ahead.

I don't think that the bonded warehouses are idle. Or at least up until recently, they were still being used as bonded warehouses. Beautiful vaults.

I'm all for the 40 story tower, btw, but no doubt, we will get a terrible, compromised, wishy washy version of it.

Meursault

the beer revolu wrote: »

I don't think that the bonded warehouses are idle. Or at least up until recently, they were still being used as bonded warehouses. Beautiful vaults.

I'm all for the 40 story tower, btw, but no doubt, we will get a terrible, compromised, wishy washy version of it.

I didnt realise they were still in use. The look dreadful from the outside, but they definitely have great potential.

namloc1980

Meursault wrote: »

The proposed development involves the bonded warehouses, which are currently lying idle, and falling in to disrepair. You'd imagine An Taisce would support this, but you are probably right. They are likely to do everything they can to prevent it from going ahead.

Guaranteed they will object on the basis that the modern building imposes on the bonded warehouses. Have no doubt they'll object.

snotboogie

the beer revolu wrote: »

Meursault wrote: »

The proposed development involves the bonded warehouses, which are currently lying idle, and falling in to disrepair. You'd imagine An Taisce would support this, but you are probably right. They are likely to do everything they can to prevent it from going ahead.

I don't think that the bonded warehouses are idle. Or at least up until recently, they were still being used as bonded warehouses. Beautiful vaults.

I'm all for the 40 story tower, btw, but no doubt, we will get a terrible, compromised, wishy washy version of it.

The footprint is so small there they can't go much lower and keep it commercially viable.

mire

may i ask - objectively, what is it about a 40 storey tower that is deemed to be so important?

I think there is merit in a landmark/tall element there, and an economic/financial tradeoff with the cost of restoration of historic structures, but why 40 storeys? It is coming across as a bit 'desperate' i.e 'Cork needs to project an image to the world..' This is kind of outdated and a teeney bit insecure.

btw, i'm in favour of a tall building there, but not as some kind of brash, look at us 'statement'

PreCocious

Meursault wrote: »

The proposed 40 storey development will be interesting. It will be built on the point between the two channels, therefore it wont be restricting any other business or obstructing anyone's views. The Elysian is already located in that area, so its hard to object, due to height - (admittedly, this will be much taller), and it could potentially be a real landmark as you approach the city from Tivoli.

In reality, someone is bound to object. For some reason, a lot of Irish people appear to have a phobia of buildings with more than 5 storeys.

The delay with Sullivan's quay is a disgrace. The old tax building is hideous. The complaint - (the negative impact on Griffith College, during construction) - is nonsense. Navigation sq is going up without any fuss, and there were no complaints from Carey's tools, sextant, idle hour, etc.

Carey's and The Idle Hour both submitted quite detailed objections to Navigation Square.

The owners of the Elysian objected to One Albert Quay. The owners of a number of bars near the Event Centre objected to the Student Accommodation planned for the Event Centre site.

Sometimes objections go in because developers haven't fully engaged with other stakeholders and as a result things have to be sorted/ confirmed during the planning process.

AugustusMinimus

mire wrote: »

may i ask - objectively, what is it about a 40 storey tower that is deemed to be so important?

I think there is merit in a landmark/tall element there, and an economic/financial tradeoff with the cost of restoration of historic structures, but why 40 storeys? It is coming across as a bit 'desperate' i.e 'Cork needs to project an image to the world..' This is kind of outdated and a teeney bit insecure.

btw, i'm in favour of a tall building there, but not as some kind of brash, look at us 'statement'

Because Ireland has a population density problem. We don’t have sufficient population density in any of our cities to support decent public transport.

And every time we try to build up to sort this issue, the buildings go through planning hell and get rejected. It’s infuriating.

snotboogie

mire wrote: »

may i ask - objectively, what is it about a 40 storey tower that is deemed to be so important?

I think there is merit in a landmark/tall element there, and an economic/financial tradeoff with the cost of restoration of historic structures, but why 40 storeys? It is coming across as a bit 'desperate' i.e 'Cork needs to project an image to the world..' This is kind of outdated and a teeney bit insecure.

btw, i'm in favour of a tall building there, but not as some kind of brash, look at us 'statement'

Very limited space and Times Square want a mixed use; office, hotel, residential and commercial development. To achieve that they need to build up.

marno21

Here come the fruitcakes

http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Corks-Custom-House-would-be-destroyed-by-skyscraper-6c6cd5ab-f9b7-4860-ad6e-d02dcda71db5-ds

Water John

Had he been around, one suspects he would have objected to the cathedral in his home town. Too high, out of tune with its surroundings.

Roger Hassenforder

281 other people in Cork North Central liked the cut of his jib in 2011.

Water John

Problem is, like as happened in the Apple/Athenry case, one of the objectors has notched up over ten, judicial reviews.
It only takes one, to try and drag this out for years.

AugustusMinimus

Someone on Facebook keeps commenting on The Echo that Cork is embarrassing itself by trying to keep up with Dublin when there is literally any form of new build or investment going on. I cannot fathom it.

Cork people are Cork’s worst enemy. Unless we build up instead of out, there is no way we’ll reach critical density to support BRT lines or god forbid, light rail.

A very tall building like proposed is ideal for this site and will be a fantastic landmark when entering the city along the lower Glanmire road.

If high rise isn’t allowed here, it will effectively kill development on this site as the current bonded warehouses are protected structures and therefore the entire site will be economically unviable for just about any use.

Perceived use as a tourist site is pie in the sky. They are bonded warehouses with a small amount of architectural interest. They are not a site of vast cultural interest that An Taisce and the likes of this artist are trying to convey. And hell, no one actually wants to knock them.

But without private funding, they will go undeveloped. And Cork City Council will not put public money into them.

Meursault

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Someone on Facebook keeps commenting on The Echo that Cork is embarrassing itself by trying to keep up with Dublin when there is literally any form of new build or investment going on. I cannot fathom it.

Cork people are Cork’s worst enemy. Unless we build up instead of out, there is no way we’ll reach critical density to support BRT lines or god forbid, light rail.

A very tall building like proposed is ideal for this site and will be a fantastic landmark when entering the city along the lower Glanmire road.

If high rise isn’t allowed here, it will effectively kill development on this site as the current bonded warehouses are protected structures and therefore the entire site will be economically unviable for just about any use.

Perceived use as a tourist site is pie in the sky. They are bonded warehouses with a small amount of architectural interest. They are not a site of vast cultural interest that An Taisce and the likes of this artist are trying to convey. And hell, no one actually wants to knock them.

But without private funding, they will go undeveloped. And Cork City Council will not put public money into them.

Agree completely with this.

All there is in those bonded warehouses at the moment is potential. They look like sh*t at the moment, as does most buildings beyond the Idle Hour, on both sides of the quay. we need private investment to regenerate the city. we need to build up because we can't keep going out.

I bet this guy who is objecting never ventures near the city from one week to the next. And i bet he isnt stuck commuting from some satellite town for over an hour in the morning and again in the evening.

the Elysian has set the precedent. our world didnt collapse because they built a 20 storey building, nor will it collapse if this new place is built.

Roger Hassenforder

Meursault wrote: »

Agree completely with this.

All there is in those bonded warehouses at the moment is potential. They look like sh*t at the moment, as does most buildings beyond the Idle Hour, on both sides of the quay. we need private investment to regenerate the city. we need to build up because we can't keep going out.

I bet this guy who is objecting never ventures near the city from one week to the next. And i bet he isnt stuck commuting from some satellite town for over an hour in the morning and again in the evening.

the Elysian has set the precedent. our world didnt collapse because they built a 20 storey building, nor will it collapse if this new place is built.

Although i like his painting on his facebook page, as an artist a significant amount of his income is probably* art grants and bursaries.
Wish he'd STFU and let Cork city grow/develop into a modern city.
All these naysayers are quick to say what they dont want , but slow to offer practical, pragmatic and workable solutions other than 'pie in the sky' stuff.


*i could be completely wrong!

snotboogie

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Someone on Facebook keeps commenting on The Echo that Cork is embarrassing itself by trying to keep up with Dublin when there is literally any form of new build or investment going on.  I cannot fathom it.

Cork people are Cork’s worst enemy.  Unless we build up instead of out, there is no way we’ll reach critical density to support BRT lines or god forbid, light rail.

A very tall building like proposed is ideal for this site and will be a fantastic landmark when entering the city along the lower Glanmire road.  

If high rise isn’t allowed here, it will effectively kill development on this site as the current bonded warehouses are protected structures and therefore the entire site will be economically unviable for just about any use.

Perceived use as a tourist site is pie in the sky.  They are bonded warehouses with a small amount of architectural interest.  They are not a site of vast cultural interest that An Taisce and the likes of this artist are trying to convey.  And hell, no one actually wants to knock them.

But without private funding, they will go undeveloped.  And Cork City Council will not put public money into them.

To be fair the comments and likes on the article are predominantly in favor of the development and against the artist and his petition.It's the usual loud, entitled, minority who are against it