The ninja cycle epidemic *mod warning - see OP*

Tombo2001

A lot of lights these days are the rechargeable LED lights; some of the cheaper ones have very short charge times.

I've been caught out with these a few times - where its charged and a few days later the light is gone and you have to charge it again....

This is a part reason why people appear to be cycling with no lights.

cython

mrcheez wrote: »

Spotted quite a few girls with baskets at the front blocking a perfectly decent light that was switched on but pointing upward to the sky!!!

If you're going to have a light, at least have it somewhere it can be seen

Maybe they were contacting our alien overlords



Agree with this, particularly on road bikes ridden by guys in full racing regalia where it seems to be the light was chosen for it's minimalist style rather than function.

Single LED lights can be seen when you are 3m away max, unless it's a perfectly dark night, but I doubt it can be seen from a car that's approaching at 40 kph.

Sorry, but that last bit is outright wrong. Better a single strong LED IMHO than multiple very weak ones. I use a Lezyne Micro Drive, and as you can see below, its single LED is plenty visible without it being pitch black:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBQVXYSz-rY

I also carry spares in case it fails.

Tombo2001

The other point I would make....

And of course this wont suit the punters who like to complain about Ireland in general, and everywhere else is brilliant and Ireland is such a sh*t-hole....etc...

But I was in Berlin recently and was quite struck by the fact that (I) there were way way more cyclists than in Dublin and (ii) none of them had lights, high viz or helmet at night time.....and I really do mean.....I was watching out, and had to wait quite a while before I saw a cyclist with a light.

So its a cultural thing overseas - and as you know, a very high proportion of the 20 somethings in Dublin are from overseas.

Of course what they do have in Germany that we don't have is proper street lighting, cycle lanes and drivers that obey the rules of the road.

mrcheez

cython wrote: »

Sorry, but that last bit is outright wrong. Better a single strong LED IMHO than multiple very weak ones.

That's pretty good alright, although I've seen a few single LEDs that were barely visible.. so probably battery-related then.

Tombo2001

On my final point.....and I know this is off topic......but I recently saw my first full cycle of driver light breakers. That is to say....lights go red, pedestrian lights green - first car goes through......wow, broke the lights.....second cars just nips through to, sure he's in a hurry.....third car....sorry about that.....fourth car......pedestrian lights are orange......and fifth car pedestrian lights are red.

Is that a record?

Botanic Avenue.

mrcheez

Tombo2001 wrote: »

But I was in Berlin recently and was quite struck by the fact that (I) there were way way more cyclists than in Dublin and (ii) none of them had lights, high viz or helmet at night time.....and I really do mean.....I was watching out, and had to wait quite a while before I saw a cyclist with a light.

So its a cultural thing overseas - and as you know, a very high proportion of the 20 somethings in Dublin are from overseas.

I did make that point in another thread as another possibility, although it was shut down because I suggested it may be a culture amongst some foreigners.

Tombo2001

mrcheez wrote: »

I did make that point in another thread as another possibility, although it was shut down because I suggested it may be a culture amongst some foreigners.

Probably not as much fun bashing cyclists if they are not Irish cyclists.....

Macy0161

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

An RSA campaign highlighting the importance of cyclist/pedestrian visibility is probably needed.

With a focus on lights, not on builders vests.

The RSA campaigns the last few years are part of the problem.

tomasrojo

And if the RSA can only afford to give out inadequate lights, they shouldn't give out lights at all, at least not without saying this light is not suitable as a primary light. Not even when combined with the magic of similarly cheap hiviz jackets.

If a light costs €2 in Aldi, it is of no use as a primary light.

tomasrojo

Tombo2001 wrote: »

So its a cultural thing overseas - and as you know, a very high proportion of the 20 somethings in Dublin are from overseas.

It's a perpetual thing with cyclists through the years and across countries. I don't think it's got much to do with our large sub-population of German youths.

Roadhawk

tomasrojo wrote: »

And if the RSA can only afford to give out inadequate lights, they shouldn't give out lights at all, at least not without saying this light is not suitable as a primary light. Not even when combined with the magic of similarly cheap hiviz jackets.

If a light costs €2 in Aldi, it is of no use as a primary light.

I dont think the RSA should be giving anything out for free at all. It only leaves them open to criticism about the quality of products. They could be using that money on something more productive like a campaign or something.

tomasrojo

Roadhawk wrote: »

I dont think the RSA should be giving anything out for free at all. It only leaves them open to criticism about the quality of products. They could be using that money on something more productive like a campaign or something.

I don't like the hi-viz and light giveaways. However, they generally meet the approval of TDs and members of the public. Who don't really consider "second-round effects" and the like. The main thing is that they're cheap. Whether they're effective is never looked into, because they're cheap.

papu

Tombo2001 wrote: »

On my final point.....and I know this is off topic......but I recently saw my first full cycle of driver light breakers. That is to say....lights go red, pedestrian lights green - first car goes through......wow, broke the lights.....second cars just nips through to, sure he's in a hurry.....third car....sorry about that.....fourth car......pedestrian lights are orange......and fifth car pedestrian lights are red.

Is that a record?

Botanic Avenue.

Happens at doyles corner in phibsboro on a daily . You get cars going through orange , then others follow flat out breaking the red.. It's pretty bad.

Roadhawk

tomasrojo wrote: »

I don't like the hi-viz and light giveaways. However, they generally meet the approval of TDs and members of the public. Who don't really consider "second-round effects" and the like. The main thing is that they're cheap. Whether they're effective is never looked into, because they're cheap.

Well I suppose the RSA is taking the same approach as any mass pandemic would be tackled...they are trying to plug the gap of numerous cyclists without lights in the most affordable way.
The same approach is taken when trying to feed staving nations...you send cost effective foods like oats and rice, not steak and veg.

tomasrojo

I think it's more an approach of:

Something must be done!
This is something.

Chips Lovell

"We can't afford the cholera vaccines, but here's a Dispirin."

tomasrojo

--Where's your Dispirin?
--It's ok, I've had my cholera shots.
--You're very reckless. Why isn't Dispirin mandatory?

Pinch Flat

Roadhawk wrote: »

Well I suppose the RSA is taking the same approach as any mass pandemic would be tackled...they are trying to plug the gap of numerous cyclists without lights in the most affordable way.

I still have my iodine tablets. About as much use as the lights the RSA hand out.

Roadhawk wrote: »

The same approach is taken when trying to feed staving nations...you send cost effective foods like oats and rice, not steak and veg.

Us cyclists prefer cake and muffins as sustenance. It could be funded from "road tax" :pac:

Tenzor07

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Us cyclists prefer cake and muffins as sustenance. It could be funded from "road tax" :pac:

Ah there should be a saddle tax, based on weight, McDonald's for the skinny cyclist, carrot sticks for the heavy ones, for the mass pandemic of obesity!

Doctor Bob

Roadhawk wrote: »

The same approach is taken when trying to feed staving nations...you send cost effective foods like oats and rice

Are the RSA sending oats and rice, or are they sending Peel's Brimstone?

seamus

Roadhawk wrote: »

Well I suppose the RSA is taking the same approach as any mass pandemic would be tackled...they are trying to plug the gap of numerous cyclists without lights in the most affordable way.
The same approach is taken when trying to feed staving nations...you send cost effective foods like oats and rice, not steak and veg.

I know you're just trying to make an illustration, but I think it's telling how extreme the example is that you're using.

Cyclists without lights isn't a huge problem. It's annoying, sure. But there aren't scores of unlit cyclists being mown down or mowing down people on a daily basis.

Whatever about how irritating it is, or whatever about the "that's cos drivers are being extra attentive" argument, it boils down to the fact that it's just not really a big problem.

A more apt comparison would be worrying that a lot of college students appear to be coming into college without a breakfast. And rather than discussing the benefit of a proper dietary regime, the state instead pays someone to hand out biscuits to students on their way into college. In other words, not solving the "problem", and potentially making it worse by providing the illusion that biscuits can replace a proper breakfast.

ThisRegard

magicbastarder wrote: »

we used to have big, weak, ever ready jobbies that i suppose technically counted as lights.

Useless things used to cost a small fortune in batteries.

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

These were the type I had (with the big EverReady batteries). I used two up front - one on each fork. It was difficult to stop them from rattling/vibrating. We didn't really realise it at the time but the light they provided was shíte.

And they weren't much better.

odyssey06

seamus wrote: »

Cyclists without lights isn't a huge problem. It's annoying, sure. But there aren't scores of unlit cyclists being mown down or mowing down people on a daily basis.

If an unlit cyclist was involved in a non-fatal collision with a vehicle or pedestrian, would we even hear about it?

Are there scores of cyclists being mown down in the country on a daily basis, lit or unlit, full stop?
Does that mean Ireland's road safety can't be improved?

blackvalley

For every badly lit cyclist you see you will also come across those who really make an effort . Recently spotted a cyclist in town with small LED lights attached to the spokes both front and back. The bike was also well lit up both front and rear but I thought the " Wheel lights " were very effective and made the cyclist really visible particularly " side on "
" Keep her lit "

blackvalley

For every badly lit cyclist you see you will also come across those who really make an effort . Recently spotted a cyclist in town with small LED lights attached to the spokes both front and back. The bike was also well lit up both front and rear but I thought the " Wheel lights " were very effective and made the cyclist really visible particularly " side on "
" Keep her lit "

dreamerb

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Of course we also have a very weird species who fit a perfectly adequate rear light but choose to hide it behind a pannier, mudguard or long coat.

It's annoyingly easy to do though - with a mid-length jacket, whatever about a mudguard or pannier where it should be obvious that one fixed element covers another fixed element. I've been guilty with a coat I just didn't realise trailed that far - though at least I had a second rear light on my person.

Having been told, I've now got an extra rear light on the seat-stay, and roll the jacket up to make sure the seat-post one is visible too.

tomasrojo

I've seen wheel lights, and I thought they were only consistently visible from the side. From certain angles, they were almost completely obscured from behind and in front (which is fair enough, as I assume they're not meant to address front and rear visibility).

They seem a bit elaborate for the purposes of side-on visibility. They definitely do increase side-on visibility very markedly, but there are other ways to address that that are cheaper.

Roadhawk

seamus wrote: »

...Cyclists without lights isn't a huge problem...

But yet the government felt the need to further legislate on this exact issue...I would call it a huge problem.

seamus

odyssey06 wrote: »

Does that mean Ireland's road safety can't be improved?

I didn't say that though.

The application of road traffic laws, from how specific they are, to the penalties for breaching them, to the actual enforcement on the ground, is reflective of the danger posed by the action.

People drink-driving is taken very seriously because it's incredibly dangerous.

People not stopping behind the white line is practically ignored because while annoying, is not dangerous.

So too, unlit cyclists must fit in somewhere on the scale of dangerousness. And it seems that in practice that they fit in quite low on the scale, even though on paper it seems theoretically to be very dangerous.

With the end result that we've spent thousands of man-hours discussing it and coming up with action plans and get hot and bothered about it, without considering whether there may be other road safety measures which require more urgent attention.

If you wanted to make the roads safer, you wouldn't have AGS and RSA staff standing at Rathmines bridge pointing out when drivers had accidentally stopped over the white line. You'd have them out checking insurance and roadworthiness and doing MATs.

Likewise if you want to make cycling safer you'd have appropriately qualified people watching out for light-breaking and giving advice to cyclists on the roadworthiness of their bikes. Not just mindlessly handing out vests and lights that don't actually make a blind bit of difference (pun intended).

Roadhawk wrote: »

But yet the government felt the need to further legislate on this exact issue...I would call it a huge problem.

They did? In what way?

Roadhawk

Yep... huge!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3hqcm7h3r8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQSGIU46cBE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1a8cWkLftIs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7yKp5MG1Zg