Ryzen new build

GoHardOrGoHome

Hi all, I'd like some advice on a Ryzen build. In addition to the normal questions below here are a few things that I have in mind:

1TB SSD (have an 8TB NAS but will still probably want some local HDD storage in addition to the SSD)
2x16 or 4x16 GB RAM
Might hobble along on integrated graphics before Vega comes along. Do the Ryzens even have integrated graphics?
This is not a gaming machine but would be nice if the GPU is decent enough to handle some modern games, say, BF1.
I want it to run cool and quiet so was thinking about one of the Noctua coolers. Maybe the Ryzen stock coolers will be okay?
Motherboard with loads of USB ports.
Presume I'd go with ATX size but have a friend who's put together a powerful machine in a mini-ITX Silverstone rvz02 with an i7-7700K and a 1080gtx.

Thanks in advance for any advice. Am I missing anything glaring?

1. What is your budget? €1200-€1600 - flexible if it's worth it

2. What will be the main purpose of the computer? Main purpose would be doing data analysis and visualisation, creating multiple VMs, in the future would be interested in VR, small bit of gaming

3. Do you need a copy of Windows? [Yes/No] No

4. Can you use any parts from an old computer? [Hard drive/DVD Drive/Case/PSU/etc.] (If possible state brand and model of the parts to ensure compatibility) No - completely new build

5. Do you need a monitor? [Yes/No] Not at the moment

5b. If no, what resolution is your current monitor and do you plan to upgrade in the near future? [1920x1080/1440x900/etc.] [Yes/No] Current monitor is a cheap Samsung 28" 4K. Happy with that at the moment as I'm not playing games but may upgrade in the future

6. Do you need any of these peripherals? [Keyboard/Mouse/Wireless Card/Card Reader/Speakers/etc.] - Not for the moment.

7. Are you willing to try overclocking? [Yes/No] No - in 4/5 years if this rig becomes my secondary machine I may want the ability to overclock. At the moment I want a very quiet, cool running machine

8. How can you pay? [Bank Transfer/Credit Card/Laser] Credit Card - suppose I could do Bank Transfer if necessary but would prefer not to

9. When are you purchasing? I guess when Ryzen comes out.

10. If you need help building it, where are you based? South Dublin - might be okay on my own. Deceit offered to help but I haven't been in contact in a while!

K.O.Kiki

Wait for benchmarks!

But this is around what I'd expect:
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD RYZEN 7 1700X 3.4GHz 8-Core Processor (€439.00)
CPU Cooler: Scythe Mugen 5 51.2 CFM CPU Cooler (€48.74 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X370-PRO ATX AM4 Motherboard (€168.85)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2800 Memory (€239.94 @ Mindfactory)
Storage: Crucial MX300 525GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (€147.83 @ Mindfactory)
Storage: Western Digital Blue 3TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive (€100.24 @ Mindfactory)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 480 8GB NITRO+ OC Video Card (€252.99 @ Mindfactory)
Case: Phanteks ECLIPSE P400 ATX Mid Tower Case (€76.84 @ Mindfactory)
Power Supply: XFX XTR 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€95.42 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €1569.85
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-01 20:10 CET+0100

Again, wait for benchmarks - for all I know, the 1700X overclocks fine on a €95 B350 motherboard; or maybe the €359 1700 overclocks to 1700X levels.
Also IDK if you need 32Gb RAM for your workloads.

wotzgoingon

Ryzen's do not have integrated graphics. The motherboards are all set up to support APU's when they release them for AM4.

I'd say a Ryzen 7 1700X is the one to go for with your budget.

Redfox25

As Kiki mentioned above, wait for benchmarks as the current set of benchmarks are not showing Ryzen in a good light for gaming. For your other needs it would likely be good to very good but maybe hold off another week or two to see if stuff changes with driver optimizations and the likes.

BloodBath

In fairness it's only not a good light at 144Hz with the highest end graphics cards and even at that with the right settings it's not far off the intels. + the op's main purpose is not gaming. In most Scenarios the GPU will be the limiting factor.

smacl

GoHardOrGoHome wrote: »

Main purpose would be doing data analysis and visualisation, creating multiple VMs, in the future would be interested in VR, small bit of gaming

Which software and which visualisation tools and how big is the data? You might want to do some profiling on your existing rig to see where you hit bottlenecks (e.g. single CPU thread, all CPU threads, GPU, RAM, disk and/or network bandwidth). No point building a powerful PC that solves a problem you don't have nor ever will while failing to solve the one you do have.

Slutmonkey57b

Redfox25 wrote: »

As Kiki mentioned above, wait for benchmarks as the current set of benchmarks are not showing Ryzen in a good light for gaming. For your other needs it would likely be good to very good but maybe hold off another week or two to see if stuff changes with driver optimizations and the likes.

From the OP

Main purpose would be doing data analysis and visualisation, creating multiple VMs, in the future would be interested in VR, small bit of gaming

Literally no reason for someone like this to hold off on a Zen build from the benchmarks. The drop in games on a 4k monitor is minimal.

Zen allows workstation users to save half the cost of a build, straight off the bat. No brainer.

GoHardOrGoHome

Thanks all for your replies, I've been reading them but haven't had a chance to post.

I've taken the basics of your build K.O.Kiki with the 1700X and the GPU and changed around a few components.

Still have to decide between large ATX tower and going the complete opposite and getting a Silverstone RVZ02 (limited to 32GB RAM).

I'm not working with any particular datasets at the moment but I'd like to buy now and not have the hassle of upgrading in 12 months.

Watching reviews it looked like the Ryzen 1700 was the one to go for (price/performance ratio) but the 1700X is only 25 euro more expensive. Hard to decide.

While not wanting to go bananas on price I'm happier to have a more than capable machine (for my needs) that will cope with my future VM/data analysis needs.


PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD RYZEN 7 1700X 3.4GHz 8-Core Processor (€439.00)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler (€79.39 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X370-PRO ATX AM4 Motherboard (€168.85)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory (€244.41 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Storage: Samsung 850 EVO 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€316.48 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 480 8GB NITRO+ OC Video Card (€249.00 @ Mindfactory)
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Evolv ATX Glass ATX Mid Tower Case (€189.85 @ Mindfactory)
Power Supply: XFX XTR 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€95.42 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €1782.40
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-09 00:21 CET+0100

BloodBath

The 1700 is €359 on Mindfactory through Geizhals.de. €75 cheaper. It's the best 1 to go for imo.

I'd go for 3200Mhz memory as well with a board that supports it.

Slutmonkey57b

The 850 evo ssd is a sata drive hogging an nvme slot; better to stick with sata and save money or go for a 960 nvme drive.

GoHardOrGoHome

BloodBath wrote: »

The 1700 is €359 on Mindfactory through Geizhals.de. €75 cheaper. It's the best 1 to go for imo.

I'd go for 3200Mhz memory as well with a board that supports it.

Reviews are saying the Ryzen 1700 can't handle faster than 2666 without over clicking. Is it worth it getting the fastest memory?

K.O.Kiki

GoHardOrGoHome wrote: »

Reviews are saying the Ryzen 1700 can't handle faster than 2666 without over clicking. Is it worth it getting the fastest memory?

DDR4 Memory Scaling on AMD AM4 Platform – The Best Memory Kit For AMD Ryzen CPUs

smacl

GoHardOrGoHome wrote: »

Still have to decide between large ATX tower and going the complete opposite and getting a Silverstone RVZ02 (limited to 32GB RAM).

Unless space is an issue, I'd tend towards to tower and a larger memory limit with more drive bays. While 32gb seems like lots, more threads means more memory in use at the same time, where a common strategy for multi-threading is for each thread to have its own copy of the data to avoid syncing issues.

BloodBath

GoHardOrGoHome wrote: »

Reviews are saying the Ryzen 1700 can't handle faster than 2666 without over clicking. Is it worth it getting the fastest memory?

The processors support it. There's just issues atm that will be fixed with future BIOS updates. This is a brand new architecture and the board makers only had 4 weeks to finalise their software. There's already been several updates and there will be a lot more no doubt over the coming months.

If you buy a board that supports it, then it should support it once they fix things and add ram multiplier options to the BIOS as it's locked at 1.2 atm and only manual overclocking of the bus can take it higher.

Ryzens performance is supposed to scale with memory speed so you might as well get the faster ram. It costs roughly the same anyway.

http://www.eteknix.com/memory-speed-large-impact-ryzen-performance/

GoHardOrGoHome

BloodBath wrote: »

The 1700 is €359 on Mindfactory through Geizhals.de. €75 cheaper. It's the best 1 to go for imo.

I'd go for 3200Mhz memory as well with a board that supports it.

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

The 850 evo ssd is a sata drive hogging an nvme slot; better to stick with sata and save money or go for a 960 nvme drive.

Okay! Updated to Ryzen 1700, faster memory (but cheaper?), Samsung 960 evo.
Had to halve the storage of the SSD as it was so expensive.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD RYZEN 7 1700 3.0GHz 8-Core Processor (€359.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler (€79.39 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X370-PRO ATX AM4 Motherboard (€168.85)
Memory: G.Skill TridentZ 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (€160.93 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Storage: Samsung 960 Evo 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€249.94 @ Mindfactory)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 480 8GB NITRO+ OC Video Card (€252.99 @ Mindfactory)
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Evolv ATX Glass ATX Mid Tower Case (€193.84 @ Mindfactory)
Power Supply: XFX XTR 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€95.42 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €1560.36
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-09 17:34 CET+0100

K.O.Kiki

GoHardOrGoHome wrote: »

Okay! Updated to Ryzen 1700, faster memory (but cheaper?), Samsung 960 evo.
Had to halve the storage of the SSD as it was so expensive.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD RYZEN 7 1700 3.0GHz 8-Core Processor (€359.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler (€79.39 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X370-PRO ATX AM4 Motherboard (€168.85)
Memory: G.Skill TridentZ 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (€160.93 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Storage: Samsung 960 Evo 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€249.94 @ Mindfactory)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 480 8GB NITRO+ OC Video Card (€252.99 @ Mindfactory)
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Evolv ATX Glass ATX Mid Tower Case (€193.84 @ Mindfactory)
Power Supply: XFX XTR 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€95.42 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €1560.36
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-09 17:34 CET+0100

Why the €200 case when you're on such a budget?

GoHardOrGoHome

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

Why the €200 case when you're on such a budget?

Good call. At the time I went with a nice looking case without checking the alternatives. I'd like a case that's easy to work with. Doesn't need the window if that's adding a lot to the price. I'll take a look at other options. I would like that 1TB SSD but it's pretty expensive. I guess in 5 years it will still be a quick SSD!

wotzgoingon

It's very easy to add extra SSD's in the future if need to.

BloodBath

I'f you're looking for a cheaper case I can recommend the NZXT H440. Great case. No optical drive support though.

https://geizhals.de/?fs=h440&in=

Also that motherboard supports m.2 SSD's does it not. Would you not be better off getting 1 of those? Maybe even a small super fast m.2 for windows and background programs and bigger sata SSD for your workspace programs.

Slutmonkey57b

You may find yourself running the equivalent of most budget systems: smaller ssd for boot drive & apps, spinning rust for file storage. Only in your case the "slow" drive is an ssd already faster than most people's and the "fast" drive doesn't even get maxed out for most consumer workloads!

If in doubt, you could stick with a 1 tb sata sad for their initial build, and if you find storage is slowing down some of your workloads, update to an nvme drive later; at least the slot would be free.

GoHardOrGoHome

BloodBath wrote: »

Also that motherboard supports m.2 SSD's does it not. Would you not be better off getting 1 of those?

Yes, you're right. You might have been looking at the original part picker list. The latest one I had was an M2 Samsung 960 Evo 512GB.

EDIT: my bad - here's the latest list

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD RYZEN 7 1700 3.0GHz 8-Core Processor (€359.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler (€79.39 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X370-PRO ATX AM4 Motherboard (€168.85)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory (€244.20 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Storage: Samsung 960 Evo 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€466.33 @ Mindfactory)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 480 8GB NITRO+ OC Video Card (€252.99 @ Mindfactory)
Case: NZXT H440 (Glossy White/Black) ATX Mid Tower Case (€128.83 @ Mindfactory)
Power Supply: XFX XTR 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€95.42 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €1795.01
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-10 00:15 CET+0100

Xenoronin

I will say from experience that a white case is a nightmare to keep clean, though my Bitfenix does have a softtouch coating that makes it a dust magnet anyway.

BloodBath

I wouldn't say a nightmare now. I have the white one as well. Just the top gets a bit dusty and needs a wipe.

GoHardOrGoHome

Was just about to pull the trigger but I can't find a Ryzen 1700 for 360 euro. 423 is the lowest available. The others have 1-2 shipping dates. Tried Mindfactory and Amazon. Any ideas?

BloodBath

You must be looking at the 1700X, there is a normal 1700 as well which is 359 on mindfactory through Geizhals.de.

It's base clock and turbo speeds are lower than the 1700X but it only uses roughly 65 watts of power stock compared to the 95 on the 1700X. Both overclock to similar levels though. 3.8 - 4.0Ghz on all cores.

GoHardOrGoHome

Okay, was looking at geizhals.de. Think that might be the solution. Nearly there!

GoHardOrGoHome

BloodBath wrote: »

You must be looking at the 1700X, there is a normal 1700 as well which is 359 on mindfactory through Geizhals.de.

Thanks Bloodbath but the mindfactory site has it as delivery in 1-2 months. When you click the "in stock" option there is no mindfactory option.

BloodBath

Ah right, yeah they are sold out. I'd expect retailers to jack the price up on what's left until more stock becomes available.

GoHardOrGoHome

I can get it from Amazon.co.uk for around 380 euro which is not *that* bad.

What's the deal with using my VAT number? Do the German sites accept it? It's a recognised European VAT number.

BloodBath

Yeah there is a section on the order form as far as I remember for that.

GoHardOrGoHome

BloodBath wrote: »

Yeah there is a section on the order form as far as I remember for that.

Thanks Bloodbath.