FE1 Exam Thread (Read 1st post!) NOTICE: YOU MAY SWAP EXAM GRIDS

fehun123

Hi all,

I hope everyone's exams are going well. I'm sitting my very first four and I'm feeling a bit disheartened right now because I really have no idea as to what standard they're expecting for a pass, what is an average mark and what sort of an answer would get you an 'average' mark. I have sat company and contract this week - company was touch and go with three strong questions and contract had four okay-to-good questions. Obviously trying to get the magic three so if any seasoned FE1ers could maybe shed some light on the standard/ marking and how hard it really is to hit the 50 would be very very much appreciated (I know this has been asked a few times but I'm still just not 100% grasping it haha)

Tony_TwoLegs

fehun123 wrote: »

Hi all,

I hope everyone's exams are going well. I'm sitting my very first four and I'm feeling a bit disheartened right now because I really have no idea as to what standard they're expecting for a pass, what is an average mark and what sort of an answer would get you an 'average' mark. I have sat company and contract this week - company was touch and go with three strong questions and contract had four okay-to-good questions. Obviously trying to get the magic three so if any seasoned FE1ers could maybe shed some light on the standard/ marking and how hard it really is to hit the 50 would be very very much appreciated (I know this has been asked a few times but I'm still just not 100% grasping it haha)

It's all subjective. Depends on your own ability really. An ability to memorize won't necessarily give good answers and vice versa.
I have 6 passed. 2 pending.
To illustrate.... one marker taught me in University. I got 65% in that subject there. I failed it first time at FE1 level. Same marker!!
If you pass 3 that's all that matters. I'm sure you will

illy.m

Would any good soul have examiners report for march 2017 sitting?

illy.m

sorry march 2018*

user115

Really unsure about today I had 2 unreal answers, 1 good answer and then answered 3 other questions that were only OK..... Really really hope I passed i really couldn't have put more into in, mentally exhausted after it, still have a headache! If I don't pass with that effort not sure what crazy high level they are looking for just to pass!

Roll on Tuesday when its done and I can have my life back!!!

Vegetarian2017

kasey0123 wrote:

Omissions? Just up so... Sexual offences.. property offences , non fatal, public order ?

Honestly after contract today, i wouldn't rely on what has come up on the last paper nor predictions. Unless it happens to be a more predictable paper.

illy.m

Property
_________

October 2011 PQ - pq seems to me to be on proprietary estoppel, the examiners report and sample answer I have refer to estoppel licence. WTF some please help, whats the difference.

Jaspoon12

Anybody have any idea how criminal is marked or the difficulty of it? Preparing for a horrendous weekend of study

illy.m

Jaspoon12 wrote: »

Anybody have any idea how criminal is marked or the difficulty of it? Preparing for a horrendous weekend of study

From what he says in October 2017 report - the overall pass rate was "very healthy" and that most candidates did well once you answer all 5 questions. He says thats its very hard to reach 50% threshold if you don't attempt all 5 questions. Also its important to know legislation and cases I was told and to highlight them. I have a few sample answers but they are 2011.

tamadate

I'm looking through past papers in property and Question 3 for Autumn 2016 asks: "Criticially evaluate the creation and effect of rights of way and the right to light and the right to support, making suggestions for reform." What would be good to include for the suggestions for reform part?

bigtophat13

Jaspoon12 wrote: »

Anybody have any idea how criminal is marked or the difficulty of it? Preparing for a horrendous weekend of study

illy.m wrote: »

From what he says in October 2017 report - the overall pass rate was "very healthy" and that most candidates did well once you answer all 5 questions. He says thats its very hard to reach 50% threshold if you don't attempt all 5 questions. Also its important to know legislation and cases I was told and to highlight them. I have a few sample answers but they are 2011.

Had the examiner in college and he's a lovely guy so I can't see him being anything but fair.

jus_me

illy.m wrote: »

Property
_________

October 2011 PQ - pq seems to me to be on proprietary estoppel, the examiners report and sample answer I have refer to estoppel licence. WTF some please help, whats the difference.

I just read the property chapter on licenses there’s 3 1.bare 2. Estoppel and 3. contractual have a quick flick thru that chapter and you’ll feel much better it’s a short chapter and seems to come up a bit

Vegetarian2017

All sorry for the spamming re equity but is there anyone you can direct/advise me on equity. I haven't sat it since law degree many years ago. I am thinking of paying to sit it on Thursday and just covering a few topics along with any I've picked up through contract and taking a massive gamble /prayers too.
No idea of the exam. Is it a fairly marked one, are there any banker questions?
My last attempt of getting the magic 3 hence any advice would be appreciated, even to say I'm crazy take it on. Bear in mind I have property and criminal.

This is my third attempt so not attempting them after this. I haven't paid for any prep courses either but just fed up as personally for me things outside my control go wrong absolutely everytime -_-

Natalie_06

Vegetarian2017 wrote: »

All sorry for the spamming re equity but is there anyone you can direct/advise me on equity. I haven't sat it since law degree many years ago. I am thinking of paying to sit it on Thursday and just covering a few topics along with any I've picked up through contract and taking a massive gamble /prayers too.
No idea of the exam. Is it a fairly marked one, are there any banker questions?
My last attempt of getting the magic 3 hence any advice would be appreciated, even to say I'm crazy take it on. Bear in mind I have property and criminal.

This is my third attempt so not attempting them after this. I haven't paid for any prep courses either but just fed up as personally for me things outside my control go wrong absolutely everytime -_-

I guess its worth a shot if your other exams are over before equity. Focus as much time as you can on your next subjects before getting distracted with Equity though. You seem quite distracted by the thought of sitting equity already haha.

You never know you might have scraped a pass in the exam you are convinced that you failed. Just try to move on to the next exams and take them as they come. Obviously make sure you can actually sit equity before you start studying it. If you are doing equity i reckon focus more so on trusts than the equity side of things and just try to recognise the main issues instead of getting too bogged down with casenames and details. A broad understanding of as much of the course as you could cover would be better than trying to pinpoint topics you think might come up. (Although I think theres too much to remember for injunctions to do last minute).

Good luck

MagicThree18

Vegetarian2017 wrote: »

All sorry for the spamming re equity but is there anyone you can direct/advise me on equity. I haven't sat it since law degree many years ago. I am thinking of paying to sit it on Thursday and just covering a few topics along with any I've picked up through contract and taking a massive gamble /prayers too.
No idea of the exam. Is it a fairly marked one, are there any banker questions?
My last attempt of getting the magic 3 hence any advice would be appreciated, even to say I'm crazy take it on. Bear in mind I have property and criminal.

This is my third attempt so not attempting them after this. I haven't paid for any prep courses either but just fed up as personally for me things outside my control go wrong absolutely everytime -_-

Honestly, you're up against it. Equity isn't an easy subject. I should know, I've failed it twice. In fairness the first attempt was a half-hearted effort but on my second attempt I sat an evening course and put a lot of work in, and still only hit 42% on the day (although it was my third exam in three days and I think it was fatigue that killed me in the end). Even so, it's a tricky exam and I'm dreading it.

I really don't know how anyone could study an entire subject in such a short space of time, especially with two other subjects in the balance as well. But you seem determined, so the very best of luck!

bigtophat13

Vegetarian2017 wrote: »

All sorry for the spamming re equity but is there anyone you can direct/advise me on equity. I haven't sat it since law degree many years ago. I am thinking of paying to sit it on Thursday and just covering a few topics along with any I've picked up through contract and taking a massive gamble /prayers too.
No idea of the exam. Is it a fairly marked one, are there any banker questions?
My last attempt of getting the magic 3 hence any advice would be appreciated, even to say I'm crazy take it on. Bear in mind I have property and criminal.

This is my third attempt so not attempting them after this. I haven't paid for any prep courses either but just fed up as personally for me things outside my control go wrong absolutely everytime -_-

I can't speak from any experience but just from the fact I have the last 5 papers I have my own kind of short term grid. Charitable trusts every year and It went Essay - Problem - Essay - Problem - Problem. I'll be doing it all but I'll have a very good knowledge of Cy pres and on Initial and subsequent failure because that was asked in both essays.

Undue Influence in cases of wives has been up in Autumn 16, Spring 17 and Spring 18. It's quite common.

There seems to be a Constructive trust / resulting trust every second trend with a break of secret trusts in there once so since spring 16 Resulting (bank account) - Constructive - Resulting - Secret - Resulting (Quistclose) so I'm going to learn constructive top to bottom.

There's always an injunction. Since Spring 16 its been Mareva - Quia Timet - Mareva - Anton Pillar & a second question on Mandatory interlocutory - Mareva so I'm going to have all of them besides Mareva.

Trustee Duties is very common too up the last 3 springs in a row but not Autumns.

Tracing and Donatio Mortis Causa seem to alternate - Tracing - Neither - DMC - Tracing - DMC so I'll have a good knowledge on tracing.

Express trusts and the 3 certainties were up Autumn 16 and 17 and none of the springs so I think it's due.

Estoppel was up autumn 16 and spring 17 and Spring 18, it might repeat but I think Specific performance is more due as it was up Spring 16, Autumn 16 and Autumn 17 so it's more due than a repeat of estoppel.

I'm sure plenty know better than me and have a larger sample size but based on what I've seen I'm aiming to have Charitable Trusts, Constructive Trusts, 3 certainties and tracing as my 4 I most expect. Of those I would like to think 3 or 4 will come up. Then I expect one of Undue influence / trustee duties although could easily be both. Then on top of that the injunctions would likely cover you. I'd like to get some specific performance done but don't know if I'll have time.

user115

Question on easements was lost modern grant completely abolished by lclra 2009? Or does it still exist for current claims of easement via prescription? So confused 🀔

Vegetarian2017

Thanks all. The responses are very helpful good karma coming your way It appears equity possibly is not as straight forward as i thought or remembered from college. And i suppose i should focus on the rest of the exam and pray i got contract today after all.the work i put in. Just wasn't a great selection of questions. Typical.the topics you love and did the extra mark study for don't come up

Freckley201

user115 wrote: »

Question on easements was lost modern grant completely abolished by lclra 2009? Or does it still exist for current claims of easement via prescription? So confused ��

It was abolished but only 2009 onwards, so careful of a question that has the prescription clock earlier than 2009

I still can't really explain that one, some kind of 'legal fiction'

user115

Freckley201 wrote: »

It was abolished but only 2009 onwards, so careful of a question that has the prescription clock earlier than 2009

I still can't really explain that one, some kind of 'legal fiction'

Thanks Freckle, ya seems still stands if it's pre 2009, and term that would need to run is like 20years under that but then 12 years under new law.... I think... so confusing like what possessed the people making up these laws to begin with!!! So complicated!

Jenosul

bigtophat13 wrote: »

I can't speak from any experience but just from the fact I have the last 5 papers I have my own kind of short term grid. Charitable trusts every year and It went Essay - Problem - Essay - Problem - Problem. I'll be doing it all but I'll have a very good knowledge of Cy pres and on Initial and subsequent failure because that was asked in both essays.

Undue Influence in cases of wives has been up in Autumn 16, Spring 17 and Spring 18. It's quite common.

There seems to be a Constructive trust / resulting trust every second trend with a break of secret trusts in there once so since spring 16 Resulting (bank account) - Constructive - Resulting - Secret - Resulting (Quistclose) so I'm going to learn constructive top to bottom.

There's always an injunction. Since Spring 16 its been Mareva - Quia Timet - Mareva - Anton Pillar & a second question on Mandatory interlocutory - Mareva so I'm going to have all of them besides Mareva.

Trustee Duties is very common too up the last 3 springs in a row but not Autumns.

Tracing and Donatio Mortis Causa seem to alternate - Tracing - Neither - DMC - Tracing - DMC so I'll have a good knowledge on tracing.

Express trusts and the 3 certainties were up Autumn 16 and 17 and none of the springs so I think it's due.

Estoppel was up autumn 16 and spring 17 and Spring 18, it might repeat but I think Specific performance is more due as it was up Spring 16, Autumn 16 and Autumn 17 so it's more due than a repeat of estoppel.

I'm sure plenty know better than me and have a larger sample size but based on what I've seen I'm aiming to have Charitable Trusts, Constructive Trusts, 3 certainties and tracing as my 4 I most expect. Of those I would like to think 3 or 4 will come up. Then I expect one of Undue influence / trustee duties although could easily be both. Then on top of that the injunctions would likely cover you. I'd like to get some specific performance done but don't know if I'll have time.

Thanks that's a big help. I had not done much for equity either. I had not time with other subjects and tiredness is getting the better of me.

I was considering picking specific performance as a topic I am going to take the gamble now on it and cram the life out of it.

Injunctions, Charitable, Expressed trusts- the 3 certainties, the maxims -maybe half of a question.

I think I will just stick to topics. I know I will not remember if I do more. I am actually freaking out.

Anymore tips please send them my way.

Fe1hayes

Anyone know are the timetables the same in regard to order of subjects every October and March ,or do they always change ?

MagicThree18

Fe1hayes wrote: »

Anyone know are the timetables the same in regard to order of subjects every October and March ,or do they always change ?

They change every year. I'd love to hear a reasonable explanation as to why that is. A more cynical person might think it's to create an additional hurdle for those that have to pay €105 for each exam.

Bigdreamer123

Fe1hayes wrote: »

Anyone know are the timetables the same in regard to order of subjects every October and March ,or do they always change ?

Yeah they change, which is cracked because its meant I've had three in a row them two !

L124

MagicThree18 wrote: »

They change every year. I'd love to hear a reasonable explanation as to why that is. A more cynical person might think it's to create an additional hurdle for those that have to pay €105 for each exam.

Excuse the question but the way you phrased that has me curious - Is there a way of not having to pay 105 per exam?

MagicThree18

L124 wrote: »

Excuse the question but the way you phrased that has me curious - Is there a way of not having to pay 105 per exam?

Forgive my clunky phrasing. I was merely alluding to how profitable these exams are for the Law Society, which the magic three requirement and unpredictable timetable make even more profitable.

L124

MagicThree18 wrote: »

Forgive my clunky phrasing. I was merely alluding to how profitable these exams are for the Law Society, which the magic three requirement and unpredictable timetable make even more profitable.

Sorry ... clutching at straws thinking there’s a way to make the whole thing a bit less expensive.
105 per exam.
115 per recheck.
And if you live outside Dublin you have to throw on accommodation costs.

MagicThree18

L124 wrote: »

Sorry ... clutching at straws thinking there’s a way to make the whole thing a bit less expensive.
105 per exam.
115 per recheck.
And if you live outside Dublin you have to throw on accommodation costs.

It's not the initial expense that bothers me per se. It's that the exams appear to be there to generate money for the Law Society, not to test prospective lawyers. I have no problem with the exams being very difficult, but that difficulty is artificially increased, by the 'pass three' requirement and the unpredictable timetable, to generate 'repeat business' and make even more money. It's a cynical theory of mine and I haven't a shred of proof, but hey ho, that's what's I think.

A whole cottage industry has popped up around these exams, with the various course providers etc. encouraging rote-learning instead of candidates critically engaging with the material. Examiner's reports constantly refer to candidates reciting learned off material instead of engaging with the material, and yet who can blame us when we know that it works. There's a disconnect between what the examiner's feel is necessary for prospective lawyers to know, and how candidates approach the exams because of the requirements involved. It's a broken system. It's there as a stop-gap solution to prevent a bottle-neck of applicants and to keep Blackhall Place extravagantly decorated.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'd like to see the exams become even more difficult, but in the correct way. Stop this emphasis on rote-learning, have a fixed timetable each year so people can identify their subjects of choice (and to fit work around it, for those of us that have to work their bollocks off in a law firm, or elsewhere, between exams) and allow people to bank and exam when it's passed, rather than having to re-sit something that you've already proved your competency in.

Vegetarian2017

I agree, the exams aren't actually that hard yes i haven't passed but it is the absolute fatigue and the whole system on top of fulltime work that gets you in the end. The whole system is unfair. Particularly when you have a good law degree then have to go through this hurdle. What frustrates me is i understand the topics but the whole process wears me down. Also even planning ahead you also have life situations you cannot plan for that can take a valuable weekend of study before exams. I've worked so hard this time but cannot control everything.
The fatigue in yesterdays exam i forgot things i know. It's awful.

It will never change unless every candidate out there sat a set of fe1s out to demand change.

I think if the were spread out and open book exams but tougher and a better system. It gives you a better idea of working as a solicitor. Not people revising repetitive material and essays!!

ronan.albert

Hi guys,

Hope the exams are going well. By any chance would one of ye have a copy of the October 2017 and March 2018 exam papers for EU law in electronic form? Or would one of ye be able to screenshot the exam questions and send them on?

I´ve only just realised I don´t have copies of these two most recent papers. If anyone can help me out I´d be so grateful. I´ve got loads of sample essays and exam grids for tort, equity, property and contract that I can send on as well in return.

Thanks in advance

Ronan