FE1 Exam Thread (Read 1st post!) NOTICE: YOU MAY SWAP EXAM GRIDS

lawbee3

SwD wrote: »

Sorry to interrupt.

But I plan on taking my first sitting of FE1s in October.

Would anyone have the more recent manuals for sale?

Ideally looking for European, Constitutional, Property, and Company.

Thanks

I have property and company!

angela1711

I was thinking of doing criminal, EU, company and don't know what the 4th one should be? I want to do criminal because I really enjoy it, company because I just did it recently in college so it shouldn't be too hard to do it again, and EU because I absolutely hate it, and even if I fail it will at least give me some idea of what its like. What does everyone think the 4th one should be?

SwD

Ill PM you.

SwD

That makes a lot of sense. Thanks Tony_TwoLegs.

Username1994

Are there any manuals in particular that are worth buying/avoiding or is there little difference between them?

angela1711

Just out of curiosity someone here has mentioned that you approach the FE1's differently to your college exams, anyone knows what they mean by this? We were always told to use the ILAC form for problem questions are we not suppose to do that for FE1s? One of my lecturers said that you need to back up a lot of your points with case law and that you really need to know a lot of cases is this true?

Yoop_

angela1711 wrote: »

Just out of curiosity someone here has mentioned that you approach the FE1's differently to your college exams, anyone knows what they mean by this? We were always told to use the ILAC form for problem questions are we not suppose to do that for FE1s? One of my lecturers said that you need to back up a lot of your points with case law and that you really need to know a lot of cases is this true?

I've passed all of my FE-1s and I approached study and the exams pretty much the same as I did in college. Just be aware that there's a lot more mixing of topics than there was in college.

- You need sufficient caselaw but more importantly you need to know recent relevant caselaw, particularly for Constitutional.
- Be really focused on who you are advising and be sure to really state the consequences/possible outcome/etc. for your 'client'.
- There will often be little pieces of information in the question that you should take note of as well. These could affect what Court your client's case will be heard in or possible compensation etc.
- Keep the reform to the essay questions. Your client in the problem question probably won't care unless there's some pending appeal case that might affect them or something along those lines.

Edit: use ILAC if you've always done it. I've seen people in exams very clearly and in red, underlined headings writing out their 'Issue', 'Law' and so on.

lawbee3

angela1711 wrote: »

Just out of curiosity someone here has mentioned that you approach the FE1's differently to your college exams, anyone knows what they mean by this? We were always told to use the ILAC form for problem questions are we not suppose to do that for FE1s? One of my lecturers said that you need to back up a lot of your points with case law and that you really need to know a lot of cases is this true?

Well I just think college exams are marked far easier....you'd get away with not having the case names all right etc a bit more....not in these!

graduate555

angela1711 wrote: »

Just out of curiosity someone here has mentioned that you approach the FE1's differently to your college exams, anyone knows what they mean by this? We were always told to use the ILAC form for problem questions are we not suppose to do that for FE1s? One of my lecturers said that you need to back up a lot of your points with case law and that you really need to know a lot of cases is this true?

It's basically just knowing everything and inch deep and a mile wide. In college, you can cut out topics and explore each topic in depth. In FE1s, you need to know more or less everything, but you will only be required to know the basics.

When it comes to knowing cases, when you add up all the topics, yes its a lot. But per each topic, its not a ridiculous amount, maybe 4 or so per topic, depending on the subject. Contract by its nature has a lot, EU law doesn't, for example.

Frankie5Angels

Username1994 wrote: »

Are there any manuals in particular that are worth buying/avoiding or is there little difference between them?

Interested to know this too. Looking to get a few manuals/exam grids etc (have some, but not all I need), but spotted the 'Blackhall's Essential Law Revision Series' for 20 a book. Anyone used these?

Yoop_

Frankie5Angels wrote: »

Interested to know this too. Looking to get a few manuals/exam grids etc (have some, but not all I need), but spotted the 'Blackhall's Essential Law Revision Series' for 20 a book. Anyone used these?

I bought the one for Constitutional. It's handy as a checklist for cases and things like that, but definitely only a supplement to your notes.

Tony_TwoLegs

Frankie5Angels wrote: »

Interested to know this too. Looking to get a few manuals/exam grids etc (have some, but not all I need), but spotted the 'Blackhall's Essential Law Revision Series' for 20 a book. Anyone used these?

Yeah they're not issued by the Law Society - A solicitor in Cork puts them together. They won't be adequate on their own. Nowhere near it in fact.

laurenburne

chops018 wrote: »

I just want to address a few of your points, which I will do below. Please note that I do not mean to offend. I used to be a regular poster on this and previous FE1 threads when I completed them. I too found them bizarre at the best of times. I agree on the point of transparency.



Of course this will sound smart, but why not call or email the FE1 section of the Law Society and inquire about this? As has been previously said, the Law Society regulate the Solicitor profession in Ireland, and so, they decide how someone enters that profession. No one regulates the Law Society, so people are right to criticise this aspect. Of course, if it is alleged they are doing something illegal, they could still be pursued.



What do you mean by this?



Absolutely not the Law Society's fault if you cannot afford a recheck. I am sorry to be blunt on that, and don't mean to be harsh. But that's the reality.

If they were to include an optional recheck in the exam fee, then you'd have everyone who failed automatically avail of this. It wouldn't work in my opinion. Also, they would just jack up the price of the exam fee if they were to include it. So you'd end up paying either way.

By the way, they have an access programme for those who are not doing well financially but want to qualify. This applies to FE1 candidates as far as I know. Links:

https://www.lawsociety.ie/About-Us/Diversity-and-CSR/Access-Programme

https://www.lawsociety.ie/Documents/education/hbs/Law%20Society%20Access%20Programme_Information%20Leaflet.pdf




In my opinion, I do not believe that to be the case. How many people do you know got rechecks out of the amount of people that sat the exams in the most recent sitting? Without a published report on these figures you won't know. Maybe they are broken down somewhere in the reports released each year of the Law Society's accounts, I don't know, but if you google Law Society Accounts, I think, then they will come up in the search results, if you want to read up on that.

Also, what evidence do you have that they are not corrected right? Again, I do not mean to be harsh, and again I'd like to point out that when I was doing these exams I also found some results strange. Possibly human error in the corrections of some of the papers, I'll agree. But you seem to be making sweeping generalisations.



Obviously I cannot say this with surety, but I would assume there is such low figures attending the PPC courses due to the recession and the closure of the Cork facilities for the PPC courses. I doubt there is another conspiracy here to keep the numbers low. In fact, if I know the Law Society, I would assume they would prefer more numbers as they would get more money from the person or their firm for PPC fees and eventually their practising cert and CPD etc. They would prefer more people on the roll as it's more money for them. Leaving the idea of them failing people to keep the numbers down aside, have you ever heard of anyone asking for the indenture pack to be sent out so they can apply to go to PPC1 in September of a certain year only to be told no, that they have filled all the places that year? I haven't anyway. That's not to say that it's not possible of course.



I refer to my comment above. I do not think there is a conspiracy theory. They don't control the amount of trainees firms take on, and I think that this is a factor rather than them passing people. You will hear of plenty of people saying they have all the exams, but do not have a training contract in place. Many firms have a certain quota of trainees that they take on each year and this would be why there is a similar number every year in Blackhall on the PPC1 course. Referring to your pre 2007 comment above, that was before the recession, so the big firms probably took on more trainees. There would have also been loads of small firms who had trainees before the recession, who probably still do not take on trainees now even they were are supposedly out of the recession.



Again I ask why? They do not seem to have a set amount of numbers they take in each year. I would assume if they got an unprecedented number of applications from people looking for the indenture pack to attend PPC1 on a certain year and decided they could not cater for that amount then they would have to set a limit for that year or look at what else could be done. But I have never heard of that happening so why would they need to set a limit or inform people of this when it simply doesn't appear to happen.


Again, I apologise if I seem to be coming across as audacious or rude, as I know how horrible these exams can be. But you do seem to be making generalisations.

I did ring the law society about viewing my paper and there is no explanation to be got as to why I can't view my paper. That's just the rule.

Obviously I know it's not their fault if I can't afford a recheck.Your missing my argument. I have gone up in marks on three rechecks in the past, sometimes by as much as 5%. The increase in marks is not down to a clerical error as that is not what the recheck is for. 5% is a huge increase in marks and so my argument is that why didn't I get that result in the first place? If I accepted the result in the first instance and didn't get a recheck I would have missed out due to their failure to grade my paper correctly the first time. When you pay 115 to sit an exam and when you consider how massive a consequence it can have in your career id you fail, I simply do not think it is good enough that they can get it wrong...especially by 5% or more. That shouldn't be happening!

That explains why there is a culture of so many getting rechecks. They have got it wrong so many times. I shouldn't have to pay for a recheck on an exam I passed, they simply should not be getting this wrong. You should have a read back on this forum to give you a small insight into how people think about these rechecks. Their are people who have gone up by 10%. So you think that's right?

As for your comment about the recession and that being the reason for numbers being down in blackhall I feel you are being quite naive to think my comments in this regard amount to a conspiracy theory. It comes down to competition, the more solicitors there are, the higher prices they can charge. It really isn't far fetched at all to consider we are dealing with a monopoly here who are creating a barrier to enter this proffession in order to keep competition high. You should have a read of the competition authority bill for solicitors and barristers to understand where I am coming from.

Frankie5Angels

Tony_TwoLegs wrote: »

Yeah they're not issued by the Law Society - A solicitor in Cork puts them together. They won't be adequate on their own. Nowhere near it in fact.

I had more or less intended to pick up manuals for what I need anyway. Off to Adverts I go, so!

Redhighking

laurenburne wrote: »

As for your comment about the recession and that being the reason for numbers being down in blackhall I feel you are being quite naive to think my comments in this regard amount to a conspiracy theory. It comes down to competition, the more solicitors there are, the higher prices they can charge. It really isn't far fetched at all to consider we are dealing with a monopoly here who are creating a barrier to enter this proffession in order to keep competition high.

Since the Legal Services Regulation Act 2015, I believe the Legal Services Regulatory Authority has oversight over the Law Society and Bar Council for legal training, might worth contacting to see what their current position is. (see s.13(2) of the LSR Act 2015)

Additionally there seems to be nothing stopping a person under the 2015 Act in establishing another professional body akin to the Bar Council or the Law Society, if recognised by the Minister of Justice and Equality.

vita.s

Could anyone say what topics came up in March 2017 for Constitutional?

Trying to make an up to date exam grid.

If anyone has the exam paper they would be willing to share that would be great too. Thanks

graduate555

vita.s wrote: »

Could anyone say what topics came up in March 2017 for Constitutional?

Trying to make an up to date exam grid.

If anyone has the exam paper they would be willing to share that would be great too. Thanks

From what I remember:
- Problem q on freedom of association, assembly and expression
- Problem q on public administration of justice vs freedom of expression
- Problem q on sep of powers, esp non-delegation doctrine and quasi-judicial bodies
- Essay on freedom of conscience
- Problem q on justiciability of socio-economic rights, locus standi and right to life (i think)
- Essay on AG
- Essay on DPP v L (?) case about delay in proceedings against child abusers
- Case notes on Bederev, Cahill and I can't remember the rest

louser1

Hi could someone recommend an online course for constitutional? Thanks

Mod
Pls don't recommend or criticise particular courses or tutors etc here

vita.s

graduate555 wrote: »

From what I remember:
- Problem q on freedom of association, assembly and expression
- Problem q on public administration of justice vs freedom of expression
- Problem q on sep of powers, esp non-delegation doctrine and quasi-judicial bodies
- Essay on freedom of conscience
- Problem q on justiciability of socio-economic rights, locus standi and right to life (i think)
- Essay on AG
- Essay on DPP v L (?) case about delay in proceedings against child abusers
- Case notes on Bederev, Cahill and I can't remember the rest

Thank you very much!

SwD

Some of the FE1 preparatory courses are quite expensive.

Therefore, I was wondering if anyone has ever subscribed to one, via video lectures, and split the cost, and access (username and password) with a friend?

Somewhat similar to the Netflix agreement I have with my girlfriend... although in this scenario its my bank account that bears the 10 euro hit each month.

Frankie5Angels

SwD wrote: »

Some of the FE1 preparatory courses are quite expensive.

Therefore, I was wondering if anyone has ever subscribed to one, via video lectures, and split the cost, and access (username and password) with a friend?

Somewhat similar to the Netflix agreement I have with my girlfriend... although in this scenario its my bank account that bears the 10 euro hit each month.

Yep, I did it with a friend of mine. I signed up and she gave me half in cash and I shared the logon details with her. Good way of doing it. I had older notes and just copied anything new in the book (wasn't much iirc). The manuals are the only issue if you do that really.

angela1711

SwD wrote: »

Some of the FE1 preparatory courses are quite expensive.

Therefore, I was wondering if anyone has ever subscribed to one, via video lectures, and split the cost, and access (username and password) with a friend?

Somewhat similar to the Netflix agreement I have with my girlfriend... although in this scenario its my bank account that bears the 10 euro hit each month.

Yep, that's pretty much what I am going to do.

yournerd

I was hoping to split the courses between my friends so that everyone did a different one and shared everything so is anyone doing EU, EQuity, Company and Tort in October?

irishasj

Hi all,

I am sitting (hopefully!) my last 3 this October - Company, EU and Criminal.

I have some sample answers from all others that I could email to people in exchange for sample answers for the above three.

Please and thank you

angela1711

I was wodnering if there is a list of case law that we need to know for each topic? Or would that be too easy and we have to figure it out ourselves 😄

Redhighking

angela1711 wrote: »

I was wodnering if there is a list of case law that we need to know for each topic? Or would that be too easy and we have to figure it out ourselves 😄

Most of the examiners reports released after each sitting note the key cases to know/address for a particular question/topic.

If you know the most established and key cases, and can apply them proper to the question asked you will sail through these exams.

Wonderstruck

angela1711 wrote: »

I was wodnering if there is a list of case law that we need to know for each topic? Or would that be too easy and we have to figure it out ourselves 😄

If you look at the Criminal exam reports the examiner kindly goes to the trouble of listing the leading cases! The rest of the examiners don't seem to bother beyond vague stuff like "students didn't mention the any cases etc". For constitutional stuff like: "Write a case note on McDonald v Bord na gCon" (idk that case randomly came to mind I have no idea if that's actually ever came up) comes up very frequently but most Constitutional Law cases for each area are pretty famous so you would hardly miss them unless you didn't study that topic at all

Other than that, I just lifted the cases from the leading books on the various areas of the law... :pac: ... "leading" that sounded pretentious.

Oh, did anyone hear anything about the group chat since?

hullaballoo

I asked admin about setting up a private forum but it might be a few more days before I have an answer.

SwD

yournerd wrote: »

I was hoping to split the courses between my friends so that everyone did a different one and shared everything so is anyone doing EU, EQuity, Company and Tort in October?

I've just registered to sit Contract, Tort, Equity, and Criminal.

I'll be keeping the manuals but if someone would like access, pm me

angela1711

Just wondering if I have the 2014-2015 edition of the Foster, Blackstones Eu Treaties am I okey with them or should I get the newest 2017edn ?