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Chain Issues

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    #32
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    cython wrote: »
    ... Typically an extremely worn chain is one that is gone beyond 0.75% stretch...
    I'd hardly describe beyond .75% as extremely worn. It's generally an indication that it needs to be replaced soon. I usually wait until it's gone to 1%. There are thousands of cyclists out there who allow it to go way beyond that!


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    #33
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    Pinch Flat wrote: »
    Fair enough, maybe I'll try this the next time I change my chain. Just sort of got used to the technique Sheldon Brown describes.
    Sheldon often over-complicates matters IMO! :)


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    #34
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    I'd hardly describe beyond .75% as extremely worn. It's generally an indication that it needs to be replaced soon. I usually wait until it's gone to 1%. There are thousands of cyclists out there who allow it to go way beyond that!

    Being probably been one.

    Just thinking back. Chain was changed twice in 10k km. Probably should have been a bit earlier than that


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    #35
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    godtabh wrote: »
    ...Chain was changed twice in 10k km. Probably should have been a bit earlier than that
    Depends on several factors including cleaning regime and mudguard use. I generally get about 4k per chain on the road bikes and about 2k on the fixie/single speed (which I don't really understand as the chain is much heavier and isn't required to move laterally).


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    #36
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    Depends on several factors including cleaning regime and mudguard use. I generally get about 4k per chain on the road bikes and about 2k on the fixie/single speed (which I don't really understand as the chain is much heavier and isn't required to move laterally).

    Get an even number front and rear and a decent lube and you should hardly ever have to change it

    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chain-life.html

    With minimal maintenance easy to get over 8k km from a chain at under .75 wear. I mean a good lube, a rag and a quick wipe every 300km or so


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    #37
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    ford2600 wrote: »
    Get an even number front and rear ...
    Well you learn something new everyday! I never knew that and it makes sense as I'm currently running 48/17. My previous wheels had a 16 and the chain lasted ages!

    (In saying that, single speed chains are relatively inexpensive so I won't lose any sleep over it).


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    #38
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,940 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Its rare for me to say but I don't get his reasoning there. Just because they are even I cannot see that you will get the same connection each time. Maybe if there was more to it like the number of teeth being divisible from the small to the large. Can someone explain his thinking as I am either tired or stupid or both. Every single speed chain I have ever had has lasted an age and in fact was only replaced out of boredom and probably unnecessarily. Every mixture of gears under the sun even/even, odd/even, even/odd. None seemed to make a difference.


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    #39
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    CramCycle wrote: »
    ... Just because they are even I cannot see that you will get the same connection each time....
    Makes sense. Suppose you were to mark the sprocket teeth front and rear. The chain would connect with the corresponding teeth each time (assuming it wasn't removed/refitted) with an even set-up. In an odd set up like I have, it would alternate all the time.


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    #40
    equivariant
    Registered Users Posts: 966 ✭✭✭equivariant


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    Makes sense. Suppose you were to mark the sprocket teeth front and rear. The chain would connect with the corresponding teeth each time (assuming it wasn't removed/refitted) with an even set-up. In an odd set up like I have, it would alternate all the time.

    Surely what you want is to maximize the greatest common divisor?

    I might be just imagining this....


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    #41
    Chuchote
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    How to check and replace your chain, by the best moustache in the business:



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    #42
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Back up and running with new chain rings this morning.


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    #43
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,754 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    equivariant wrote: »
    Surely what you want is to maximize the greatest common divisor?

    I might be just imagining this....

    Not sure what the exact logic is, but it is more than having an even number of teeth on cassette and chain ring. I just checked by following the quick-link around in 50/12, 50/11 and and 53/13 and 53/14 and the position of the quick link on the chain ring moved on each occasion.


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    #44
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 49,617 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    godtabh wrote: »
    Back up and running with new chain rings this morning.
    any photos of the old ones?


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    #45
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,940 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    A divisible number makes sense as in within each full rotation of the chainring, there will be a whole number of cog rotations.

    The only logic for the even thing is that maybe the number of full rotations before they line up again is potentially less with even teeth numbers, or that you will always have even on even.

    Do the number of links on the chain then have an influence?

    Personally, I really do not see any great benefit to his suggestion on a well looked after single speed or fixed gear, that makes a differnce so large it would be noticeable to the layman


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    #46
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    Did anyone actually read the link...

    The wear rate will be the same, but on an even front and rear it won't matter as inner/outer wear will be different and matched to wear pattern on chainring...


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    #47
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,940 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    ford2600 wrote: »
    Did anyone actually read the link...

    The wear rate will be the same, but on an even front and rear it won't matter as inner/outer wear will be different and matched to wear pattern on chainring...

    I read it but I am going to have to see it to believe, doubting thomas that I am. My mind just keep telling me that it being even makes no difference to the chain wear as if the links in the chain are o..........


    Damn it, I think I get it now. I am an idiot.

    tell me if I am right. A chain, no matter what length, will have an even number of connectors ((outer + inner)x N) as the last inner, will always connect to the last outer. Therefore the fact that the chain is always even means that the cog will only have even to even (or whatever you decide to name every 2nd tooth front) and odd to odd. Not the same ones each time mind you. His proposal is that there is no elongation between the inners (I am not as convinced as him but lets take it as is for now), therefore, if you don't have a chain skip, or move it off place by an odd number when cleaning the chain (or whatever) it will only really wear half the teeth badly. Again, I think the rollers have wear as well, not as much as the stretch mind you.

    I get the theory, I am just not convinced, that even, all going well you never have the chain moved off place by one, that there is a noticeable difference to chain/chainring/cog life. But I do finally understand where he is coming from.

    personally I have found a taught chain on a single speed lasts far longer than a slack one and if an eye is kept on it it will last for a huge length of time, several years and 10s of thousands of kilometers.


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    #48
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 49,617 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    nothing like having a few beers and then deciding to tackle a chain change for the first time. even though the chain has easily 6k+ on it, there's no confusing lengths of chains when comparing old and new, the links lined up absolutely fine. the change went swimmingly*.

    *caveat - i haven't actually cycled the bike since changing it.


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