My lawn is dying- help!

KFed

Over winter my lawn has died out badly in the back garden but is pretty good still in the front.

I bought a house in late 2013 and the garden was terribly overgrown front and back. It was professionally redone in 2014.

Both gardens were cleared, weedkiller applied, left for a couple of weeks, rotovated, sand added for drainage and then laid in turf.

Summer 2015, 2016 the lawns were healthy and I mowed weekly, top dressed, raked out any thatch regularly etc. It was pretty well cared for.

However over winter 2016, the back lawn has died out badly. I would say 40% of the entire lawn is now dead. It's worst at the edges, 100% dead for the peripheral yard, but looks to be spreading in also. I am wondering if it's being eaten by a parasite, nematodes?

Any help, advice would be gratefully appreciated.

KFed

KFed wrote: »

Over winter my lawn has died out badly in the back garden but is pretty good still in the front.

I bought a house in late 2013 and the garden was terribly overgrown front and back. It was professionally redone in 2014.

Both gardens were cleared, weedkiller applied, left for a couple of weeks, rotovated, sand added for drainage and then laid in turf.

Summer 2015, 2016 the lawns were healthy and I mowed weekly, top dressed, raked out any thatch regularly etc. It was pretty well cared for.

However over winter 2016, the back lawn has died out badly. I would say 40% of the entire lawn is now dead. It's worst at the edges, 100% dead for the peripheral yard, but looks to be spreading in also. I am wondering if it's being eaten by a parasite, nematodes?

Any help, advice would be gratefully appreciated.

Can you post a picture? We're you spraying anything late 2016. Did it get really dried out?

twignme

It sounds like crane fly, also known as leatherjackets. I posted on here last year about the same thing and didn't get much help as not many people know about them.
I had re-turfed the lawn as well, which is an indicator, and it was looking good until it over wintered. You need to dig down a little in the affected parts and if it is leatherjackets, you will find the blue grey grubs not far below the surface as they feed on new grass roots.
If it is, I can tell you how I have managed the devastation because it took me a lot of research to find out.

KFed

twignme wrote: »

It sounds like crane fly, also known as leatherjackets. I posted on here last year about the same thing and didn't get much help as not many people know about them.
I had re-turfed the lawn as well, which is an indicator, and it was looking good until it over wintered. You need to dig down a little in the affected parts and if it is leatherjackets, you will find the blue grey grubs not far below the surface as they feed on new grass roots.
If it is, I can tell you how I have managed the devastation because it took me a lot of research to find out.[/quote

I also think it may be leather jackets. I have attached some photos of the garden.

The turf was put down in 2014 and we'll looked after in 2015 and through 2016 summer/autumn but over this winter, and it seems even just through spring 2017, the back garden has been eaten alive.

I have been researching online and it seems nemasys is available from April so I am hoping to pick this up to use.

Any advice at all greatly appreciated.

KFed

Attempting to upload images from Imageshack also:













This was all lush lawn when it went down originally and as you can see it is dying out from the periphery first, but it's getting progressively worse. You can see at the edges how there are one or two random pieces of grass left as an 'island' of green while all the other plants have died out around them..

One side of the lawn is sheltered a lot (due to neighbours extension) so this side of garden never fared as well as the other, but the part that gets the majority share of sunlight has always thrived but this side (trellis fence between other neighbours garden) has died out really quickly through this winter/Spring.

I suspect it is leatherjackets also and the plants are being eaten from the roots under the soil, so was hoping to get nemasys leatherjacket killer when it goes on sale in April.

Based on the pictures does this look like the problem and does anyone have advise as regards how to successfully treat?

Any advice greatly appreciated!
Thanks.

twignme

Yep, that's leatherjackets for sure and I hate to tell you but it is possibly going to get quite a bit worse. It does start around the outside, the turf actually 'shrinks' as the grass shoots get eaten. I had about 6 times the size of yours affected and all anyone would say was that I need to dig it all up and start again, not possible financially-wise! Your lawn will start to look quite 'weedy' and the only thing that will grow are little circles of wire grass that shoot up uncontrollably. The rest is just soil.

The only chemical solution was banned this time last year, so the only thing available now is nemasys. You could try it in April but from my research, its the wrong time in the leatherjacket lifecycle for it to work, and it's not cheap. I reconciled myself to the fact that I would have a really awful looking lawn for 2016 (and yes, it looked REALLY bad) and then treat it in October with the nematodes. Until then, I religiously went over it with the lawn mower every week on the absolute lowest setting, even all the parts that were just dirt with a few blades of grass. This cut the weeds and wiregrass right down and by September, I had the beginnings of the grass growing back. I used the nemasys in the first week of October, following all the instructions religiously and used four packs of them. Then I kept my fingers crossed and it seems to have done the trick. I now have my lawn back, albeit not as lush as before and still quite a lot of weeds, but some good lawn treatment and plenty of TLC this year should have it back to rights by the end and looking as good as ever.
Best of luck KFed, let me know how you get on.

KFed

twignme wrote: »

Yep, that's leatherjackets for sure and I hate to tell you but it is possibly going to get quite a bit worse. It does start around the outside, the turf actually 'shrinks' as the grass shoots get eaten. I had about 6 times the size of yours affected and all anyone would say was that I need to dig it all up and start again, not possible financially-wise! Your lawn will start to look quite 'weedy' and the only thing that will grow are little circles of wire grass that shoot up uncontrollably. The rest is just soil.

The only chemical solution was banned this time last year, so the only thing available now is nemasys. You could try it in April but from my research, its the wrong time in the leatherjacket lifecycle for it to work, and it's not cheap. I reconciled myself to the fact that I would have a really awful looking lawn for 2016 (and yes, it looked REALLY bad) and then treat it in October with the nematodes. Until then, I religiously went over it with the lawn mower every week on the absolute lowest setting, even all the parts that were just dirt with a few blades of grass. This cut the weeds and wiregrass right down and by September, I had the beginnings of the grass growing back. I used the nemasys in the first week of October, following all the instructions religiously and used four packs of them. Then I kept my fingers crossed and it seems to have done the trick. I now have my lawn back, albeit not as lush as before and still quite a lot of weeds, but some good lawn treatment and plenty of TLC this year should have it back to rights by the end and looking as good as ever.
Best of luck KFed, let me know how you get on.

Thanks a million, sorry to hear you have the same problem but glad to hear it can be resolved with a bit of patience and effort.

Can I ask who or where you got the nemasys product? I think I'll take a chance on an April application see if it does anything and then go again later in the year. It's just sad watching it die yard by certain yard!

twignme

I bought my Nemasys from Mr Middleton in Dublin. They do a mail order if you aren't local. When the packs arrive, you keep them in the fridge and have a very short window in which to use them.
If you are going to try an April treatment, I would be really interested to know how it all works out for you. Best of luck.

KFed

Thanks a million, I ordered from Mr. Middleton also so waiting for them to arrive.

Hopefully they'll work as the lawn is literally being destroyed. I'd say it's 40% gone at this stage...

Are leather jackets a recent phenomenon?

I don't know anyone who's had a similar problem down through the years...

snowstreams

I just found out ive an infestation of leatherjackets too. I found hundreds of them covering my driveway.
And after a bit of reading I discovered they are the reason one section of my lawn is dying. 
This is the first year I ever had this problem with them too, maybe it was due to the mild winter? Though my lawn is only 4 years old. 
Ive a huge rural garden so I dont know how I'll get enough nematodes to treat all of it. I hope it never spreads to other areas of the lawn in future years!

twignme

No, they aren't something new, but the conditions have to be just right. Recently turfed is one, I don't think well established lawns are tender enough roots. I understand that the grass can support a certain number of larvae but once it gets above a specific density per sq ft, it's curtains for the lawn.

Snowstreams, I commiserate with the size of lawn you have to deal with, but a word of warning. I only used the Nemasys on the area affected, which was very large anyway. I didn't use them on an area I thought was well away from that but lo and behold, the little beggars have eaten that bit now this year, so it's mr Middleton for me again in October. If you're going to do it, do it all. It does actually show the nematodes work though. Last years destruction is improving by the week on my treated area.

snowstreams

Thanks for the tips twignme. Thats good to hear that the nematodes work. 
I had gone off and bought a load of fertilizer thinking that my soil was useless or even poisoned! 
I'll put a lump sum of money aside for nematodes this October so. None of my neighbours have this problem from what I can see when out walking, so it must be due to my new grass. 
I wonder would phosphorous strengthen the roots to keep them away in the future after a treatment has been done?

twignme

Difficult to know Snowstreams. I guess I will have the answer to that next year on the area I treated last year, just to see if the results are permanent.

I also have a theory, unprovable of course, that the leatherjackets were already at a crisis level in the new turf when I bought it in and had it laid. It just needed another year or so to develop to destruction.

My next job is to decide how to deal with the sunken level of turf and the shrinkage away from the wall that has left a huge gap, even though the grass is recovering well. Any ideas welcomed.

Oggie_Winters

Call in professional like myself or the kingdom crusader mchenry!

Nobbies

We had what can onlybe described as a infestation of leatherjackets back in 2014 on the lawn.January,February and march were very wet that year and i believe they thrived in them conditions.by the time April came round they had the lawn destroyed.it was only then we could do anything about with dryer weather.get your garden rake out and roll up the sleeves is all i can say.you can get rid of them.a hard hard raking will stimulate them and bring them to the surface.we got chemical of national agri distributors in dublin.1 litre bottle of clinch i think its called.would,nt be surprised if you can't get it anymore with regulations??anyway applied with the knapsack sprayer.but this will only work when u,ve raked them up to the surface.very little info on them in alawn back then,but we went through the ringer as they say with them.

Nobbies

Looked about nematodes after all above.research suggested mixed results??autumn i think is the time for applying i think?never got them anyway and lawn seems to be back too normal now.but not before abag of grass seed.

KhyrieLiam

I also had the same issue with my backyard. I always wanted to do some landscapes on it. I called a professional and it looks pretty well now. I hope it well get done before this month ends.

dos30

I have the same issue, 1 acre lawn riddled with the little beggars.
Some morning have come across hundreds wriggling around the patio. They've even invaded the kids sandbox.
Nematodes are going to work out really expensive for an area my size.

Here are some of the best resources I've come across in my research

http://www.livingwithbugs.com/PDFiles/cranefly.pdf

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/how_to_choose_and_when_to_apply_grub_control_products_for_your_lawn

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/watch_for_european_crane_fly_damage_in_grand_rapids_mich_and_detroit_area

$41 delivered and should cover 2 acres.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003BWVUR6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Will tell you if it gets through customs in 2 weeks time.

twignme

Interesting articles dos30, thank you. I'm interested to know why your fellas decided to go walkabout in the sandbox. Were they the full, black/grey coloured larvae as we know them? Please let us know how it goes with the product.

Nobbies

dos30 wrote: »

I have the same issue, 1 acre lawn riddled with the little beggars.
Some morning have come across hundreds wriggling around the patio. They've even invaded the kids sandbox.
Nematodes are going to work out really expensive for an area my size.

Here are some of the best resources I've come across in my research

http://www.livingwithbugs.com/PDFiles/cranefly.pdf

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/how_to_choose_and_when_to_apply_grub_control_products_for_your_lawn

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/watch_for_european_crane_fly_damage_in_grand_rapids_mich_and_detroit_area

$41 delivered and should cover 2 acres.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003BWVUR6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Will tell you if it gets through customs in 2 weeks time.

Unless i,m mistaking this is not the stage where nematodes will work.it,s in the autumn when the cranefly/daddy long legs are pupping for the want of a better word that the nematodes do there job.leatherjackets will as the season goes on turn into cranefly and cycle starts again.

snowstreams

I've about 1/3 of an acre of them on my lawn. So that bulk buy off Amazon could be handy.
I get loads wiggling out on my concrete driveway. I put a few photos of them up on the nature forum when I didn't know what they were!




They look grey brown I would say.

dos30

Nobbies wrote: »

Unless i,m mistaking this is not the stage where nematodes will work.it,s in the autumn when the cranefly/daddy long legs are pupping for the want of a better word that the nematodes do there job.leatherjackets will as the season goes on turn into cranefly and cycle starts again.

I didn't link to nematodes, but nematodes can be used now but at a double concentrate to the August/Setember period.
I linked to a product which contains Imidacloprid 21.4%, which is a highly concentrated Insecticide. It's also not the correct time of year for spraying it, so I'll be waiting until September. Ordered early in case it doesn't get through customs.

From another article( http://www.turfmagazine.com/lawn-care/crane-fly-larvae-can-be-devastating-to-turf/ )

The first control option takes place during the adults’ oviposition phase in the fall. In her location, Stahnke says this is about September 15. There are two interchangeable insecticides that have proven to give 75 percent control of larvae at this point: imidacloprid (Merit) and thiamethoxam (Meridian). These are “least-toxic†formulations that give good control at labeled rates and have a short residual period. Stahnke points out that this treatment will not work if they are used at one of the other time periods. A 75 percent control level works out pretty well, as she calculates that birds eat about 30 percent of the larvae in any case.

dos30

twignme wrote: »

Interesting articles dos30, thank you. I'm interested to know why your fellas decided to go walkabout in the sandbox. Were they the full, black/grey coloured larvae as we know them? Please let us know how it goes with the product.

Yes they're the black/grey/brown coloured larvae, like the first image here
http://lawnpartners.co.uk/common-lawn-problems/lawn-pests/

dos30

For treatment now you need carbaryl which again is banned in the EU. But can be gotten on Amazon, probably a bit late in the season now with delivery times from the US.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000RNEYBG/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3RFV9HS8845OH

It'll work out expensive for my area but would be fine for smaller gardens, the bottle above (1 litre) will cover 300m2

snowstreams

Do any of those insecticides kill worms?
It took a few years for my population of worms to take hold so I dont want to loose them in my soil ! 
I calculated that I would need over 100 euro worth of nematodes to treat my whole lawn though.

dos30

snowstreams wrote: »

Do any of those insecticides kill worms?
It took a few years for my population of worms to take hold so I dont want to loose them in my soil ! 
I calculated that I would need over 100 euro worth of nematodes to treat my whole lawn though.

If I were you I'd go with the nematodes option. I'd prefer not to use chemicals myself but at about 500e I've no choice

snowstreams

The nematode for leatherjackets is called Steinernema Feltiae
The link below on amazon sells them in varying quantities up to 1.25 billion of them for £70.
Might be worth a look. 
50million will treat half an acre for an autumn dose or a quarter acre in spring.
I might get 100million and try them out while its still springtime.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Steinernema-Feltiae-Entomopathenogenic-nematodes-plastic/dp/B06X94VD4B/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1492002185&sr=8-9&keywords=steinernema+feltiae
I noticed that you would need to dispatch them to a parcel motel since the seller only delivers to the UK. 
I'll order 50 million next week when Im back from an Easter break and I'll see how i get on.

dos30

snowstreams wrote: »

The nematode for leatherjackets is called Steinernema Feltiae
The link below on amazon sells them in varying quantities up to 1.25 billion of them for £70.
Might be worth a look. 
50million will treat half an acre for an autumn dose or a quarter acre in spring.
I might get 100million and try them out while its still springtime.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Steinernema-Feltiae-Entomopathenogenic-nematodes-plastic/dp/B06X94VD4B/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1492002185&sr=8-9&keywords=steinernema+feltiae
I noticed that you would need to dispatch them to a parcel motel since the seller only delivers to the UK. 
I'll order 50 million next week when Im back from an Easter break and I'll see how i get on.

This is the reply I had gotten previously from superNemos(they're an irish crowd producing them)

Application:
For the treatment of 2000 m2(1/2 acre): require:
Two packs of 500million of SuperNemos.
One pack can be used, two weeks after the emerge adult of Leatherjacket (daddy-long-legs),
And use the second pack after 2-3 weeks from the first application.
Cost:
One pack of 500m of SuperNemos = e200 + VAT
Two Packs of 500m = e400 + VAT. Transport cost e30.00

So I'm not sure about the dosage you quoted above

The suppliers you linked to have their own site
https://www.mitemunchers.co.uk/

and quote
Standard control: 50 million per 200 m2 or 250 million per 1000 m2(1/4 acre)

Their prices are also different from the link on Amazon so I wouldn't be sure you'd get 1.25billion for £70 when it's £195 on their own site. It'd be a good deal if you did though;)

twignme

Just worth noting, nematodes are 'living' things and have a limited lifespan. They should be stored in an environment that's suitable and then utilised within an appropriate timeframe. Anything outside this renders then effectively useless, that's before you consider the correct timeframe for application dependant upon the lifecycle of the crane fly.
All the chemicals mentioned here so far are ones banned by the eu. Much as I hate what the larvae do to my lawn(and I also have just less than an acre) if natural methods and a healthy dose of patience can combat the destruction, that's the way to go for me. Nothing worth doing until Seotember/October.

prinzeugen

OP do you have a dog?

For leather jackets I always go for the "prevention is better than cure thing"..

A quick way to catch them is to water the ground in the evening and cover with a black bag. Go out then first thing in the morning and they will be on the surface so you can pick them up.

It may be that you have a heavy soil also so some sand (beach or river sand - NOT builders sand) over time could discourage them. They like dark,damp wet soil.

Leather jackets love under leaves in the autumn/winter. Rake any leaves/debris form other plants up daily if you can or as often as possible.

Most of the damage from leather jackets is actually caused by birds looking for them. In the pics you posted you can see little holes. That is from the birds beaks. They pull up chunks of ground and that is what gives you the patchy look.

prinzeugen

KFed wrote: »

Attempting to upload images from Imageshack also:













This was all lush lawn when it went down originally and as you can see it is dying out from the periphery first, but it's getting progressively worse. You can see at the edges how there are one or two random pieces of grass left as an 'island' of green while all the other plants have died out around them..

One side of the lawn is sheltered a lot (due to neighbours extension) so this side of garden never fared as well as the other, but the part that gets the majority share of sunlight has always thrived but this side (trellis fence between other neighbours garden) has died out really quickly through this winter/Spring.

I suspect it is leatherjackets also and the plants are being eaten from the roots under the soil, so was hoping to get nemasys leatherjacket killer when it goes on sale in April.

Based on the pictures does this look like the problem and does anyone have advise as regards how to successfully treat?

Any advice greatly appreciated!
Thanks.

Looked at the pics again.. Did you use builders sand when you put the lawn down? I notice that you only seem to have Fuscue grass growing and the green on the concrete.. Seen it before doubt it is leather jackets.