Kilmessan GP. Sunday, March 26th

PeadarCo

Beasty wrote:

The issue is the media get hold of it and use it against cycling in general and racing in particular. Then you potentially influence the attitude of AGS, particularly when the general public submit links along with their complaints about cyclists going over the white line and riding 3, 4 or 5 abreast. So yes - go ahead and publicise it as much as you want!

Look at the road haulage association to the proposed law for the distance required when passing a bike. All the proposed law does is give some definition to dangerous overtaking in relation to cyclists. It should be covered under dangerous driving as it is. Imagine their response to something that was against the rules of the road.

It is something that needs to be looked at but videos like that online are detrimental to the sport as a whole.

Beasty

07Lapierre wrote: »

the Commisares using cameras is a good idea...posting the footage online and making it public is a Bad idea!

I think if riders knew that there every move was recorded and could result in sanctions it would definitly help make riders behave better.

The theory is fine. However what if the guards request sight of these videos following complaints?

Of course it's possible for anyone to video action from the roadside or even a car. Everyone racing really needs to consider their own actions and how they may be interpreted particularly if anything goes wrong.

PeadarCo

Beasty wrote:

Of course it's possible for anyone to video action from the roadside or even a car. Everyone racing really needs to consider their own actions and how they may be interpreted particularly if anything goes wrong.

Is not part of the reason that most race promotions struggle to break even. So there is an incentive to have big numbers. Lower numbers would be ideal safety wise but the long-term cost would be higher race entry and or license fees.

dahat

Is it normal to have 100 or so fields in A4?

Two of my three races have had 137 & 98 rider races and both have been quite risky with narrow roads and above mentioned reckless behavior.

I understand the need to break even or make a few quid but surely safety becomes an issue at some point.
One day licences are possibly not helping imo, if you can't or won't fork out a full fee should you even be allowed to race on open roads in large numbers?

boysinblack

Could anyone please pm the link to the YouTube account that posted the video.

dahat

Stickybottle are carrying it on an article onsite.

boysinblack

dahat wrote: »

Stickybottle are carrying it on an article onsite.

Anyone have the link to that article

Glass Prison 1214

boysinblack wrote: »

Anyone have the link to that article

It has rightfully been deleted, the article was purely stickybottle putting out false speculation regarding the crashes.

Harrybelafonte

InTheAttic wrote: »

Would've loved to have seen it out of interest as it all happened so fast. Also another thing I observed in the race itself. I sat up about 2km from the end as I didn't want to go in near the sprint. A BMW estate (with 2 road bikes attached to the rack on the back - I did not see any decals on the car so assumed it was not a team car) came up behind me while as I was on my own and they blasted the horn at me. Yes, I could've been closer in to the left, but it was a race and the main bunch was still somewhere behind me. The pr1ck in the passenger side of the car showed me his middle finger and as the car drove by, I saw a rider behind. The BMW looked like it was pacing him back on as it did not speed up and the front bunch was not far ahead. Can you not be cited for this sort of carry on?

There was a lot of angry people about at that race.

Beasty

InTheAttic wrote: »

Can you not be cited for this sort of carry on?

Not sure the citing concept is relevant - I suspect it would need an official to witness it for further action

Of course they could be considered to be driving dangerously on a public road

Beasty

PeadarCo wrote: »

Is not part of the reason that most race promotions struggle to break even. So there is an incentive to have big numbers. Lower numbers would be ideal safety wise but the long-term cost would be higher race entry and or license fees.

The issue of breaking even could be easily solved by ensuring prize money is suitable based on the size of the field. At this level no-one should be looking to make a living out of racing and anything they do win should be considered a bonus

De Bhál

There should be no prize money for any grade below A1

InTheAttic

De Bhál wrote: »

There should be no prize money for any grade below A1

And why not?

Sarz91

De Bhál wrote: »

There should be no prize money for any grade below A1

Money for prime's seem a bit over the top as well.

InTheAttic

Sarz91 wrote: »

Money for prime's seem a bit over the top as well.

How did you spend your kilmessan winnings?!

Sarz91

InTheAttic wrote: »

How did you spend your kilmessan winnings?!

I didn't take any. I had to leave straight after to go for a meal that I'd organised with my brother and sister for my mom. It being mothers day and all.

Crocked

De Bhál wrote: »

There should be no prize money for any grade below A1

InTheAttic wrote: »

And why not?

Because it's nuts. What purpose does it serve?

I've competed in a few sports both individual and team, and none had cash prizes. Amateur level competition giving cash prizes in minority sports just takes cash out of the sport/promoting clubs where it could be better used.

dahat

A racing license is €125 or so with €15-20 entry so I think it's only right each grade has some sort of prize money.

RobFowl

Beasty wrote: »

The theory is fine. However what if the guards request sight of these videos following complaints?

Give it to them?
Can't see the issue with that...

Weepsie

Surely glory and glorious failure are the only reason to race. Said by someone who has no intention of racing as I'd take out the entire bunch

RobFowl

InTheAttic wrote: »

Also another thing I observed in the race itself. I sat up about 2km from the end as I didn't want to go in near the sprint. A BMW estate (with 2 road bikes attached to the rack on the back - I did not see any decals on the car so assumed it was not a team car) came up behind me while as I was on my own and they blasted the horn at me. Yes, I could've been closer in to the left, but it was a race and the main bunch was still somewhere behind me. The pr1ck in the passenger side of the car showed me his middle finger and as the car drove by, I saw a rider behind. The BMW looked like it was pacing him back on as it did not speed up and the front bunch was not far ahead. Can you not be cited for this sort of carry on?

Ok


I know the driver very welll


And the pr1ck as well


2 issues


1) the main bunch was not behind you, it was in front and you did not sit up you were dropped


2) maybe the driver who "blasted" the horn (or tooted twice) was not telling you to get out of the way and the pr1ck was not giving you the finger. Perhaps they were offering a member of a neighbouring club (possibly you) a tow as they were to another member of another neighbouring club....

Actually 3 issues

3) it was not a BMW you blind gobsh1te

koutoubia

RobFowl wrote:

2) maybe the driver who "blasted" the horn (or tooted twice) was not telling you to get out of the way and the pr1ck was not giving you the finger. Perhaps they were offering a member of a neighbouring club (possibly you) a tow as they were to another member of another neighbouring club....

RobFowl wrote:

1) the main bunch was not behind you, it was in front and you were dropped

RobFowl wrote:

I know the driver very welll

RobFowl wrote:

And the pr1ck as as well

RobFowl wrote:

1) the main bunch was not behind you, it was in front and you were dropped

RobFowl wrote:

2 issues

RobFowl wrote:

I know the driver very welll

RobFowl wrote:

And the pr1ck as as well

RobFowl wrote:

1) the main bunch was not behind you, it was in front and you were dropped

RobFowl wrote:

2) maybe the driver who "blasted" the horn (or tooted twice) was not telling you to get out of the way and the pr1ck was not giving you the finger. Perhaps they were offering a member of a neighbouring club (possibly you) a tow as they were to another member of another neighbouring club....

RobFowl wrote:

Actually 3 issues

RobFowl wrote:

3) it was not a BMW you blind gobsh1te

I would sincerely hope that that rider didn't throw a shocking amount of abuse to a motorist they didn't know. Give the sport a bad name and all that!

JK.BMC

happyhappy wrote: »

Yep, shooting the messanger is easier than fixing the actually issues.

I have a club mate who was injured last Sunday as a result of the crash (he's in the vid lying on the ground in a bad way) which has made me think about this.

Racing crashes happen - I was injured myself last year and missed most of the season but it occurred in a sprint and couldn't have been foreseen, it was just one of those things. However, The crash on the video where the car is coming against the bunch was totally avoidable.

This isn't a go at Skane Wheelers at all who are a great club - it's widespread in loads of races - why do we insist on putting 100+ Racing cyclists down a narrow open country road with cars coming against them and simply say 'stay on your own side of the road'. It's impossible. That video shows it.

Another example: The starter at race a few weeks back started the A4 race with an oncoming vehicle 50 metres away instead of waiting 15 seconds for it to clear. The bunch was squeezed and split and it was a mess. 200 metres up the road there was a massive puddle wit a car in it which forced everyone out again into oncoming traffic. What other sport would do this??


Last year another race went thru a temporary set of traffic lights on a fast part of the course. If a car had come thru on a legitimate green the opposite way there would have been carnage. I pointed it out to the comms prior to the race who told me that the civil defence would control the lights. As we passed there was a young civil defence lad who looked no more than 14 standing stopping the traffic at a green traffic light. Fair play to him but 450 odd cyclist came thru that red light at speed several times and there was huge potential for an accident. Again, what other sport who tolerate this lads.

I accept all the bad behaviour of riders, and some of it is shocking, but when are we going to start to get realistic above running these races without hoping for the best and properly fully risk assessing them.

'ULSTER SAYS NO'

Up north, we have an example of how to organise races- no crossing the line, no over-subscribed fields and no messing generally. That's why I do like racing there, as opposed to the usual stuff that happens especially in Leinster, as outlined yet again in this thread. Same thing over and over and over and over.......

harringtonp

JK.BMC wrote: »

'ULSTER SAYS NO'

Up north, we have an example of how to organise races- no crossing the line, no over-subscribed fields and no messing generally. That's why I do like racing there, as opposed to the usual stuff that happens especially in Leinster, as outlined yet again in this thread. Same thing over and over and over and over.......

On the "no crossing the line" point, I've often wondered what race code is on smaller roads where there is no white line. On these roads the bunch more often than not uses the whole road but you usually do also have very little oncoming traffic. In fact sometimes there is so little oncoming traffic that I've wondered have the race organisers managed to unofficially close the road for a bit.

Harrybelafonte

InTheAttic wrote: »

Lovely!

I think that, considering you accused the driver and navigator of extremely poor behaviour on a public forum, an apology would be more appropriate. Sarcasm won't cut it for a lot of us.

koutoubia

It's very possible that the pr1ck passenger took exception to your tirade of abuse and would like to send a complaint to your club secretary.

InTheAttic

koutoubia wrote: »

It's very possible that the pr1ck passenger took exception to your tirade of abuse and would like to send a complaint to your club secretary.

I shouldn't have used that word and I sent an apology to rob. End of discussion.

Chips Lovell

Right, that's enough of calling each other pr1cks and gobsh1tes. If the people involved in this incident want to discuss it further, I'd suggest taking to PM.

Weepsie

Yes, it seems that under the cloak of anonymity of an online forum people can come in and be all righteous and point fingers and call names and insult people without giving an accurate and full story.

I know which poster I'd be veering towards believing here, even if they do have a questionable allegiance to a certain football team.

koutoubia

Weepsie wrote:

I know which poster I'd be veering towards believing here, even if they do have a questionable allegiance to a certain football team.

He took a bang to the head many years ago and has been a closet scouser since