Near misses - mod warning 22/04 - see OP/post 822

12 element

buffalo wrote: »

:rolleyes: Can you offer a reasoned rebuttal to the points argued above?

To be fair a Qashqai is only 140mm longer and 100mm taller than a VW Golf
Potentially lighter than a Golf too depending on options.

check_six

Ray Bloody Purchase wrote: »

I hope for a more inclusive world where SUV drivers can be accepted as normal people too.

Some of my best friends are suv drivers.

*pins tyre-track pattern ribbon to lapel*

*single tear rolls down cheek*

droidus

Yes, people have choices, and the choices they make affect other people. There are design issues with SUV's (huge metal boxes, which are indeed present on irish roads), and even smaller hybrid vehicles which negatively affect other road users, the environment and society as a whole.

Can you make an argument as to why we should be tolerant of people who make choices which negatively impact other people?

Incidentally, there have been some studies in the US which show that discourteous drivers do tend towards these kinds of vehicles, so there is a chicken/egg situation here too.

Felexicon

Some strange thinking in here around SUV's. The whole "King of the Road" mentality is, in my experience, down to the individual and not the vehicle they drive. If you're a c&*t in a Polo you'll still be a c&*t in a Land Rover and vice versa.

I don't think I've had more close passes/near misses with SUV's compared to other vehicles.


Also I'd feel safer in a cardboard box than a Kia Sportage

droidus

To be fair they have been specifically marketed to appeal to this sentiment.

Felexicon

droidus wrote: »

Yes, people have choices, and the choices they make affect other people. There are design issues with SUV's (huge metal boxes, which are indeed present on irish roads), and even smaller hybrid vehicles which negatively affect other road users, the environment and society as a whole.

Can you make an argument as to why we should be tolerant of people who make choices which negatively impact other people?

Incidentally, there have been some studies in the US which show that discourteous drivers do tend towards these kinds of vehicles, so there is a chicken/egg situation here too.

I don't think you can compare your average Irish driver to their American cousins. Having had the pleasure of a 4 week road trip up the West Coast a few years ago I can tell you that our driving style is much less aggressive on this side of the Atlantic.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

daragh_ wrote: »

Chap on a motorbike rides up at speed behind me. He can't get past as we are taking the lane to overtake. This makes him very unhappy so he sits on my wheel (half wheeling according to my fellow commuter) and starts revving like crazy.

Overtake complete I move left back to the middle of the lane, and he shoots past me, skimming me deliberately. 2 seconds later he's stuck behind a taxi and heading to the red lights at Booterstown. The cyclist behind me (who had a much better view of how dangerous this all was) catches up with him to have a word. Chap on the bike doesn't give a F**k, leans the bike towards him, revs at him etc. usual slagging match ensues as we all have to stop at 2 more sets of lights. He vanishes before I can find a Guard.

I had a very similar experience with a motorbike in the very same place a couple of years ago.

Commuting into town and there's a motorbike in the bus lane. A bus in front of him stopped due to the traffic there and the motorbike stopped for a couple of seconds. He then decided to use the cycle lane but didn't indicate or look behind him, just pulled right out in front of me. I had to break hard and my road bike skidded to a halt. I let out a shout and he lost his shít. Like completely went mental. He drove right beside me in the cycle lane pushing me to the side, lifted his visor and told me to stop, that he was going to fight me. He stopped his bike, then drove past myself and a group of other cyclists at high speed revving like a maniac. He could have easily killed somebody at that speed. It's unfortunate that this guy is still alive harassing people on the road. I would have zero pity to hear he hit a wall or tree at speed.

Felexicon

Charli Loose Snowball wrote: »

I had a very similar experience with a motorbike in the very same place a couple of years ago.

Commuting into town and there's a motorbike in the bus lane. A bus in front of him stopped due to the traffic there and the motorbike stopped for a couple of seconds. He then decided to use the cycle lane but didn't indicate or look behind him, just pulled right out in front of me. I had to break hard and my road bike skidded to a halt. I let out a shout and he lost his shít. Like completely went mental. He drove right beside me in the cycle lane pushing me to the side, lifted his visor and told me to stop, that he was going to fight me. He stopped his bike, then drove past myself and a group of other cyclists at high speed revving like a maniac. He could have easily killed somebody at that speed. It's unfortunate that this guy is still alive harassing people on the road. I would have zero pity to hear he hit a wall or tree at speed.

Jesus wept.

buffalo

PaulieC wrote: »

No. I shouldn't need to. People have a choice as to what they buy to transport themselves around. It's nothing to do with me what other people drive, as long as they drive safely with respect to other people who use the roads.
I don't agree with driving large cars around the city myself, in fact I recently swapped out of a VW Passat to a seat Ibiza, but neither do I agree with forcing my opinions on others. Especially when the usual rhetoric is used (massive metal boxes, huge monstrosities, etc. etc.). It's not like this is the US where the SUVs are actually huge. We're talking about "SUVs" here that have a smaller footprint than most saloons.

Does posting your opinions on a discussion forum count as 'forcing your opinions on others'?

As stated above, if such a driver hits a pedestrian, there's a higher likelihood of death or serious injury. That alone should warrant discouraging use in heavily populated areas. And as a frequent pedestrian, it's not 'nothing to do with me'.

average_runner

droidus wrote: »

Yes, people have choices, and the choices they make affect other people. There are design issues with SUV's (huge metal boxes, which are indeed present on irish roads), and even smaller hybrid vehicles which negatively affect other road users, the environment and society as a whole.

Can you make an argument as to why we should be tolerant of people who make choices which negatively impact other people?

Incidentally, there have been some studies in the US which show that discourteous drivers do tend towards these kinds of vehicles, so there is a chicken/egg situation here too.

I used to driver an Almera and now I drive a KIA Sportage. Sportage is alot better car for giving me a better view of the road, front, side and back!!


Actually in fairness, I have owned a polo, almera, passat, insignima and sportage. Sportage for me is the best of the lot for a better view of your surroundings

average_runner

buffalo wrote: »

Does posting your opinions on a discussion forum count as 'forcing your opinions on others'?

As stated above, if such a driver hits a pedestrian, there's a higher likelihood of death or serious injury. That alone should warrant discouraging use in heavily populated areas. And as a frequent pedestrian, it's not 'nothing to do with me'.

But you can refer that to everything if your not careful.

Hurrache

PaulieC wrote: »

It's not like the car models mentioned are actual SUVs. They are actually perfectly suited to an urban environment.

droidus wrote: »

I disagree, they are far too large
.....
..... small trucks.....

Duckjob wrote: »

these ridiculous looking tanks clogging up the roads

buffalo wrote: »

:rolleyes: Can you offer a reasoned rebuttal to the points argued above?

I'm with PaulieC on this one. I don't own one but I have a car that takes up more road space as it's longer but would be seen as more socially acceptable because it's not thrown into the faux 'SUV' category.

Take 2 of the most common cars on the road, the Qashqai is 4,394mm long, a Renault Megane hatchback, classed as a small/medium car, is 4,359 mm, about an inch longer.

The Qashqai, mirror to mirror, is 2,070mm, the Megane hatchback is 2,058 mm. Only 12mms wider.

But you won't get people complaining about parents dropped their kids off in a Megane hatchback.

This whole thing about classifying one as a tractor/tank,clogging up roads more than other cars is simply untrue when you actually look at the facts, it's all in peoples head, a prejudice if you will.

Weepsie

I recently went into the back of one of these SUVs spoken of today (A QASQAI). I was glad it was that car, as a smaller one would've seen me through the rear windscreen.

That said, the position of the wiper may have been the reason why part of my face split open.

PaulieC

buffalo wrote: »

Does posting your opinions on a discussion forum count as 'forcing your opinions on others'?

As stated above, if such a driver hits a pedestrian, there's a higher likelihood of death or serious injury. That alone should warrant discouraging use in heavily populated areas. And as a frequent pedestrian, it's not 'nothing to do with me'.

There were a lot of things stated above, some of it opinion, some of it possibly fact (no facts and figures to back anything up despite there being loads out there). As I said, I don't see the need for an SUV in an urban setting and I chose my car accordingly.

Stating that suvs have no place in an urban setting sounds more like a statement of accepted fact than opinion.

CramCycle

Ray Bloody Purchase wrote: »

I hope for a more inclusive world where SUV drivers can be accepted as normal people too.

I am an SUV driver, not every day but I learn to live with it.

PaulieC wrote: »

No. I shouldn't need to. People have a choice as to what they buy to transport themselves around. It's nothing to do with me what other people drive, as long as they drive safely with respect to other people who use the roads.

Some of them might be considered more difficult to drive safely

12 element wrote: »

To be fair a Qashqai is only 140mm longer and 100mm taller than a VW Golf
Potentially lighter than a Golf too depending on options.

I haven't driven a golf i a long time but have driven a few Quashqais. The size of the pillar in the car is huge, you seem to lose over 25degrees of viewing if you don't move back and forth constantly, something I have never noticed a Quashqai driver doing (not saying they don't). The issue with that car is not the size, it is the poor design and viewing angles.

droidus

PaulieC wrote: »

There were a lot of things stated above, some of it opinion, some of it possibly fact (no facts and figures to back anything up despite there being loads out there). As I said, I don't see the need for an SUV in an urban setting and I chose my car accordingly.

Stating that suvs have no place in an urban setting sounds more like a statement of accepted fact than opinion.

I invite you to go and do some research. As I said there's plenty of it out there, and most of it is not good.

Hurrache

CramCycle wrote: »

The issue with that car is not the size, it is the poor design and viewing angles.

Problem is that all the posts subsequent to it being told it has no place on the road have all been around the size of it, which apart from height, has no merit in reality.

droidus

One thing that hasnt been mentioned but which really annoys me when driving is that the position of the headlights on larger SUV's means that they shine right into the eyes of drivers in a normal seating position.

Hurrache

droidus wrote: »

One thing that hasnt been mentioned but which really annoys me when driving is that the position of the headlights on larger SUV's means that they shine right into the eyes of drivers in a normal seating position.

But that's also untrue. And if they do, it's by misaligned lights, not by design. Their lights may be at eye level so you may find yourself looking at them more than you would at another cars lights, but they're not pointed or directed at your eyes.

droidus

Hurrache wrote: »

This whole thing about classifying one as a tractor/tank,clogging up roads more than other cars is simply untrue when you actually look at the facts, it's all in peoples head, a prejudice if you will.

Best selling car in Ireland January 2016



Second best selling car in Ireland 2017, best selling car 2018:

mr spuckler

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

Maybe it’s just the weather and bank holiday, but this thread has quietened right down since the 1.5m ads on tv. I’ve had a couple of close-ish passes in the last week and maybe it’s jusg confirmation bias, but could it be working already? Have noticed more patience out there. I think.

as others have said, I just don't comment in here unless the close passes are particularly bad.
I do have a parking issue that's really p1ssing me off every day though. on Mespil road just after Baggot st bridge heading westbound, drivers of a couple of cars & vans insist on parking in the cycle lane every single morning, despite the fact that the car park spaces which are just a few yards away (literally less than 15 yards) are all free. it forces me out into traffic at a pinch point. often times they're sat in the cars on their phones.

droidus

Hurrache wrote: »

But that's also untrue. And if they do, it's by misaligned lights, not by design. Their lights may be at eye level so you may find yourself looking at them more than you would at another cars lights, but they're not pointed or directed at your eyes.

They're at eye level and are therefore more likely to affect the vision of oncoming drivers.

I really don't see how this is contentious.

magicbastarder

CramCycle wrote: »

The size of the pillar in the car is huge, you seem to lose over 25degrees of viewing if you don't move back and forth constantly

my wife is learning to drive and has commented on the size of the A pillar in some cars - even in our octavia, she finds it distractingly large (this was after she'd been for her 12 mandatory lessons with a driving school, in a small car).

the best car i've ever driven for visibility was years ago, in my mum's 1990 rover metro. fantastic for visibilty but i would have been concerned about the roof collapsing like wet paper if it rolled.

Hurrache

droidus wrote: »

Best selling car in Ireland January 2016



Second best selling car in Ireland 2017, best selling car 2018:

The Kodiaq wasn't released until some time mid 2017 so it's impossible that it was the best selling car of January 2016.

Out of the top 5 for 2017 you had the
TUCSON
QASHQAI
FOCUS
OCTAVIA
GOLF

so the roads are hardly stuffed with tanks, the Octavia is actually the longest out of that list, and only slightly narrower than the Tucson I would guess.

droidus

Hurrache wrote: »

The Kodiaq wasn't released until some time mid 2017 so it's impossible that it was the best selling car of January 2016.

Out of the top 5 for 2017 you had the
TUCSON
QASHQAI
FOCUS
OCTAVIA
GOLF

so the roads are hardly stuffed with tanks, the Octavia is actually the longest out of that list, and only slightly narrower than the Tucson I would guess.

Sorry, your right, it was the Tucson, the article tricked me.

https://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/car-news/how-the-suvcrossover-boom-is-breaking-sales-records-right-across-europe-and-ireland-34418643.html

droidus

Some curious research here:

For 'modern mums' practical considerations score high as does style (56pc).

More than 80pc said the perception of SUVs' good performance "in bad weather, and on bad roads" has become more important.

Millenials see the SUV 'as a symbol of success'.

The survey says: "For 36pc, driving a car that makes them feel powerful has become more important over the past few years, a feature that 45pc most associated with SUVs."

And for "Quintastics" a high driving position has become more important for 81pc over the past few years.

https://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/car-news/study-shows-irish-mums-are-driving-surge-in-suv-sales-34723605.html

Status, power, position are common themes.

Weepsie

<Mod Note> Alright. Think we can leave the SUV chit chat aside now as it's way off topic.

Fighting Tao

mr spuckler wrote: »

as others have said, I just don't comment in here unless the close passes are particularly bad.
I do have a parking issue that's really p1ssing me off every day though. on Mespil road just after Baggot st bridge heading westbound, drivers of a couple of cars & vans insist on parking in the cycle lane every single morning, despite the fact that the car park spaces which are just a few yards away (literally less than 15 yards) are all free. it forces me out into traffic at a pinch point. often times they're sat in the cars on their phones.

I highlighted that to garda traffic twitter account quite a few times when I worked in the area. I met the same cars every day. Of course garda traffic are not interested in evidence of the law being broken. They actually give out to people for highlighting breaches to them.

mr spuckler

Fighting Tao wrote: »

I highlighted that to garda traffic twitter account quite a few times when I worked in the area. I met the same cars every day. Of course garda traffic are not interested in evidence of the law being broken. They actually give out to people for highlighting breaches to them.

you're right - it is the same cars / vans every day. I was wondering if reporting it would do any good, I guess your experience informs that conversation in my head!

AndrewJRenko

homer911 wrote: »

Last night at the Northumberland Rd/Haddington Road junction a cyclist decided to "go" on the pedestrian lights, just as three pedestrians stepped into the road in front of him. Absolute disgrace and the reason why we collectively get such a bad name - cyclists are always jumping these lights but that was the worst I have seen


This morning at UCD/N11 another impatient cyclist decided he could cycle through a red light (parallel to N11) when the lights went green for traffic exiting UCD. The driver pointed at the lights and wagged his finger at the cyclist. Another example of bad behavior that could get the rider/pedestrian injured or killed - come one everyone, we have to do better than this, don't give the other road users an excuse!

I see a lot of bad cycling along the canal at most of those junctions. It's not unusual to see cyclists pushing through bunches of pedestrian crossing. It's not hugely dangerous, but it is fairly rude.

But I don't quite get this 'collective bad name'. Do the motorists on the phone (2nd worst rates of mobile phone abuse in Europe) give all motorists a bad name? Do the motorists who kill 3 or 4 people on the roads each week give all other motorists a bad name?