Near misses - mod warning 22/04 - see OP/post 822

Rechuchote

To my mind the main reason for red light ninjas is that women perceive cycling as too unsafe, so it's dominated by young men, who set the standard of manners. If there were more women and more older people - and, obviously, safe infrastructure - standard behaviour would be more well-brought-up generally.

Tombo2001

CramCycle wrote: »

Of course some do, as do some drivers, the real danger to young cyclists though surely is heavily skewed towards one group than the other.

My own experience with children has been if they are taught correctly, they are more likely to correct an adult rather than copy them.

There's the 'get out' again....


....If drivers drive responsibly...

(they dont.....or to be more specific, as lot of them dont)

....if kids are taught 'correctly'

(they arent, and what does being 'taught correctly' even mean).

average_runner

site_owner wrote: »

Well that's a ridiculous attitude.
Better infrastructure equals better outcomes in every city worldwide.

Yes better infrastructure equals better outcomes for normal people, but you can't help stupid people.

For example on Dame St this morning, a guy runs across the road in front of a bus, bus stopped luckily. Infrastructure is already there for crossing the road, 2 pedestrian crossings within 200m of each other.

HardyEustace

Rechuchote wrote: »

To my mind the main reason for red light ninjas is that women perceive cycling as too unsafe, so it's dominated by young men, who set the standard of manners. If there were more women and more older people - and, obviously, safe infrastructure - standard behaviour would be more well-brought-up generally.

More female cyclists are killed by HGVs turning left then male cyclists.  Female cyclists need to get more assertive to be safer on the roads.  There is a happy medium but a bit of assertiveness is very important to deal with the awful infrastructure and car dominant mindset of some drivers that we have.

Tombo2001

Rechuchote wrote: »

To my mind the main reason for red light ninjas is that women perceive cycling as too unsafe, so it's dominated by young men, who set the standard of manners. If there were more women and more older people - and, obviously, safe infrastructure - standard behaviour would be more well-brought-up generally.

I'd dispute a few things here.

Firstly, young men dont set the standard, the standards of all road users are in line with standards in society.

This notion that cyclists 'own' red light breaking, that its a cyclist thing, really annoys me as I actually believe that, like for like, cyclists probably run less red lights than motorists or pedestrians.

Firstly pedestrians, I hardly need explain but there is scarcely a single pedestrian in Ireland who will stand at a red man pedestrian light if no cars or visible from either direction. The only people who do it are parents trying to set an example to young kids. 99.9% of irish adults routinely break pedestrian lights.

Second, motorists - if you observe traffic lights you will observe that nearly always when a motorist has an opportunity to break a red light, they near always do it.

That motorist specifically - is the last motorist in the line as the lights are changing to red. Nearly always, that motorist will go through. The motorist behind them has to stop as the cross flow traffic then starts to move, and obviously none of the motorists behind him/ her are in a position to break the lights as they are back in the line of traffic.

Cyclists in contrast can all go to the front of the queue, they all have the opportunity to break the lights if its clear, unlike pedestrians - most of them dont break the lights.

Internet Friend

HardyEustace wrote: »

More female cyclists are killed by HGVs turning left then male cyclists.  Female cyclists need to get more assertive to be safer on the roads.  There is a happy medium but a bit of assertiveness is very important to deal with the awful infrastructure and car dominant mindset of some drivers that we have.

Assertiveness is important yes, but makes f all difference if you've no awareness of whats going on around you or ability to anticipate what a vehicle might do. Not saying this specifically about female cyclists, it applies to everyone.

xckjoo

Tombo2001 wrote: »

I'd dispute a few things here.

Firstly, young men dont set the standard, the standards of all road users are in line with standards in society.

This notion that cyclists 'own' red light breaking, that its a cyclist thing, really annoys me as I actually believe that, like for like, cyclists probably run less red lights than motorists or pedestrians.

Firstly pedestrians, I hardly need explain but there is scarcely a single pedestrian in Ireland who will stand at a red man pedestrian light if no cars or visible from either direction. The only people who do it are parents trying to set an example to young kids. 99.9% of irish adults routinely break pedestrian lights.

Second, motorists - if you observe traffic lights you will observe that nearly always when a motorist has an opportunity to break a red light, they near always do it.

That motorist specifically - is the last motorist in the line as the lights are changing to red. Nearly always, that motorist will go through. The motorist behind them has to stop as the cross flow traffic then starts to move, and obviously none of the motorists behind him/ her are in a position to break the lights as they are back in the line of traffic.

Cyclists in contrast can all go to the front of the queue, they all have the opportunity to break the lights if its clear, unlike pedestrians - most of them dont break the lights.

Could be wrong, but I don't think there's any laws related to pedestrians crossing on a red man. We don't have Jaywalking laws anyway. IMO it should be that way. A person should have absolute right to safety when walking. Maybe this should apply more to within city or village limits, but this thing of forcing people/pedestrians to jump through hoops so cars/drivers can do what they want is ridiculous.

Internet Friend

Internet Friend wrote: »

Assertiveness is important yes, but makes f all difference if you've no awareness of whats going on around you or ability to anticipate what a vehicle might do. Not saying this specifically about female cyclists, it applies to everyone.

It's more about not going inside a large vehicle. Stay behind it. Always.

CramCycle

Tombo2001 wrote: »

There's the 'get out' again....


....If drivers drive responsibly...

(they dont.....or to be more specific, as lot of them dont)

....if kids are taught 'correctly'

(they arent, and what does being 'taught correctly' even mean).

The response to this is a higher investment in enforcement. Cue a load of people on social media about shooting fish in a barrel, or revenue collectors but you know what. Fish don't jump into barrels voluntarily, motorists and others who break similar law do. Average speed cameras, red light cameras, a small civilian force (so as not to take time out of Gardais pockets), would solve alot of problems, it is just politically unpalatable, which is beyond annoying.

Taught correctly is simple, follow the rules, simple as. I have found my own driving wanting since I started talking out loud to teach my son. I turn into my driveway without indicating and so begins an evening of Daddy is a bad driver. And you know what, he is right. It used to be taught in schools, and it probably could do with being taught again only for the fact that nowadays, they'd have the kids scared sh1tless to step outside rather than actually teaching them correctly.

Internet Friend

Deleted User wrote: »

It's more about not going inside a large vehicle. Stay behind it. Always.

Aye, aware enough to not do something stupid. See it almost daily!

Ray Bloody Purchase

Saw a guy nearly get T-boned on Clanbrassil Street this morning from somebody pulling out from the left. They didn't bother checking for cyclists.

Then on the hill at Christ Church, another guy nearly got knocked over by a punto driver who didn't check his mirror when turning left to up towards Vicar Street.

Tombo2001

CramCycle wrote: »

The response to this is a higher investment in enforcement. Cue a load of people on social media about shooting fish in a barrel, or revenue collectors but you know what. Fish don't jump into barrels voluntarily, motorists and others who break similar law do. Average speed cameras, red light cameras, a small civilian force (so as not to take time out of Gardais pockets), would solve alot of problems, it is just politically unpalatable, which is beyond annoying.

Taught correctly is simple, follow the rules, simple as. I have found my own driving wanting since I started talking out loud to teach my son. I turn into my driveway without indicating and so begins an evening of Daddy is a bad driver. And you know what, he is right. It used to be taught in schools, and it probably could do with being taught again only for the fact that nowadays, they'd have the kids scared sh1tless to step outside rather than actually teaching them correctly.

I think you can teach a kid the rules of the road, but it still doesnt tell them how to cycle safely on their own.

The primary reason is that the rules of the road are primarily written with cars in mind, and more importantly, in Ireland roads are built with cars in mind.

As such, you would have to teach kids to recognise situations where even within the rules of the road, its quite a dangerous position for cyclists because of the layout. Which goes back to my point that the roads are not suitable for kids.

Examples would include

- the likes of Constitution Hill where there is a bike lane, but the adjacent drivers lane is so narrow that drivers typically drive with one wheel in the cycle lane
- the likes of drumcondra road just before the bridge on the tolka, where the cycle lane weaves from the footpath onto the road at a point where traffic is already travelling very fast coming down a hill.
- any 'turn right' situation on a four lane road
- the likes of Richmond Road, where there is two way traffic that is so narrow that if any car does decide to overtake you then its likely to be a dangerous overtake.

A lot of the chat earlier on is about 'assertiveness', 'owning the lane' and all thats stuff......stuff that is important for safety......but you cant expect a kid to do it. Not on their own.

Autochange

Rechuchote wrote: »

To my mind the main reason for red light ninjas is that women perceive cycling as too unsafe, so it's dominated by young men, who set the standard of manners. If there were more women and more older people - and, obviously, safe infrastructure - standard behaviour would be more well-brought-up generally.

That is offensive to young men. If there were less woman drivers the entire road network would be safer for everyone. Also people should have to hand over their driving license after they turn 65

CramCycle

Rechuchote wrote: »

To my mind the main reason for red light ninjas is that women perceive cycling as too unsafe, so it's dominated by young men, who set the standard of manners. If there were more women and more older people - and, obviously, safe infrastructure - standard behaviour would be more well-brought-up generally.

Autochange wrote: »

That is offensive to young men. If there were less woman drivers the entire road network would be safer for everyone. Also people should have to hand over their driving license after they turn 65

MOD VOICE: Unless you can provide hard data on your reasonings behind this, leave it out. Sexism is not suited to here, the next to drag it up as gets a perma ban.

Autochange

CramCycle wrote: »

MOD VOICE: Unless you can provide hard data on your reasonings behind this, leave it out. Sexism is not suited to here, the next to drag it up as gets a perma ban.

My reply was an obvious tongue in cheek response to the posters sexist and ageist comment.

CramCycle

Autochange wrote: »

My reply was an obvious tongue in cheek response to the posters sexist and ageist comment.

And mine was just a mod warning that can be taken seriously, any issues, via PM only.

magicbastarder

worst driver brain fade i've seen from a motorist in a while (i.e. in a week or two) - was coming down the malahide road, swung onto marino crescent as i was taking a left towards clontarf; at the junction where 'north dublin home care' is on the link below, a motorist drove straight through a yield sign at me. he seemed surprised i was there.
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.364761,-6.2291379,19.25z

DanDublin1982

Not so much a near miss as a direct hit... cycling home yesterday a dead seagull fell from the sky and hit me square on the head (well, helmet). Was like someone had chucked a brick at me but managed to stay upright thankfully.

p15574

Close pass on Anglesea Road...a woman in a '182 - obviously worried about scratching the paintwork in her nice new car, she leaves about a metre clearance inside the white line to her right, and about a centimetre on her left...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30i90ftdDWk

CramCycle

DanDublin1982 wrote: »

Not so much a near miss as a direct hit... cycling home yesterday a dead seagull fell from the sky and hit me square on the head (well, helmet). Was like someone had chucked a brick at me but managed to stay upright thankfully.

I know the site is anonymous but your not a Dublin Councillor, are you?

DanDublin1982

CramCycle wrote: »

I know the site is anonymous but your not a Dublin Councillor, are you?

This has happened to others? Any idea if there's a support group? :pac:

homer911

On the vein of red-light breaking, Macken Street/Pearse Street junction this morning I was stopped at the red pedestrian lights along with a small number of other cyclists when was overtaken, at significant speed, by a cyclist, who had to swerve hard to avoid colliding with pedestrians as he crossed the junction and headed on towards the Liffey - completely reckless!

amcalester

DanDublin1982 wrote: »

Not so much a near miss as a direct hit... cycling home yesterday a dead seagull fell from the sky and hit me square on the head (well, helmet). Was like someone had chucked a brick at me but managed to stay upright thankfully.

You should contact Mannix Flynn, he was ranting about the danger caused by seagulls a few weeks ago.

He's not too fond of cyclists either so it'd be interesting to hear his thoughts on these wantonly diving seagulls.

DanDublin1982

amcalester wrote: »

You should contact Mannix Flynn, he was ranting about the danger caused by seagulls a few weeks ago.

He's not too fond of cyclists either so it'd be interesting to hear his thoughts on these wantonly diving seagulls.

Outside his area, doubt he'd be interested.

magicbastarder

that reminds me of that childhood prank where you'd point up in the air and say 'look, a dead bird'.

are you sure the seagull was dead when it hit you? or did you actually loaf it so hard that you killed it?

Tombo2001

Might just have been a drunk seagull - thats the new thing apparently.

Rechuchote

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Might just have been a drunk seagull - thats the new thing apparently.

If it was on the quays, more likely a stoner.

Alanstrainor

p15574 wrote: »

Close pass on Anglesea Road...a woman in a '182 - obviously worried about scratching the paintwork in her nice new car, she leaves about a metre clearance inside the white line to her right, and about a centimetre on her left...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30i90ftdDWk

You can't put in https://youtu.be/30i90ftdDWk for the link. You have to use the very last bit only for it to work:

30i90ftdDWk

In a normal youtube link it is the bit after "v="

As for the pass. Ridiculous. Pure madness passing there. However, you have to realise that your road positioning can invite people to pass. I would say you were far too close to the kerb and should have been out more. Once you realise that most motorists don't give cyclists a single thought, and consider any pass without touching a successful one, you realise that you have to take whatever measures you can to make yourself stand out.

magicbastarder

Rechuchote wrote: »

If it was on the quays, more likely a stoner.

is it not the crows who get stoned?

magicbastarder

this morning, sitting in an advanced stop box waiting for the lights, a guy in a car squeezed up alongside me and past me. which was a dick move, but what i found more interesting was that the entire left hand side of his windscreen was smashed. looked like something about the size of - or bigger - than a basketball had smashed into it.
regardless of the cracking that had to have spread across to the driver's side (i didn't really see from the angle i had how bad it was), there's no way the left side of the windscreen could have been seen through.