2018 Leaf

cros13

ELM327 wrote: »

If it starts at 29k USD, what do we reckon the MSRP is going to be here?
€35? Very expensive if so.

The current 30kWh S Leaf of the spec listed in the Autobytel leak starts at $30.68k so the 2018 would be $690 cheaper than the current model. I've been told to expect aggressive pricing, so I'd expect to see the retail price of the new 40kWh Leaf somewhere around €23-24k for the XE. Also, I wouldn't entirely discount a bigger battery option.

Deleted User wrote: »

ChaDeMo is far from Obsolete, ChaDeMo II is 350 Kw capable.

Well the 2.0 spec is only released for up to 150kW. CCS 2.0 (350kW) is much further ahead in the process than CHAdeMO, with technicals all nailed down and commercial chargers already deploying.

thierry14

150bhp nice

I knew they would upgrade the drivetrain significantly

They had to with Tesla

Leaf ain't a city car anymore, has to be a proper motor

Should be close to sub 8 secs to 60 at that power

Topspeed preview had it at 160bhp, 340nm and 8.2 secs to 60, they could be right

If it's close to 25k I'm in

I hope they have different power options I would pay a bit extra for more oomph

160 hp with the weight might see 8.5-9 seconds to 100 kph.

147 hp or about 30 more Kw is still welcome probably 9-9.5 seconds 0-100 not going to win any records thats for sure but still better. It's not just about the 0-100, overtaking power is more important in my opinion, 80-120 Kph for instance. This really made the I3 feel so much more powerful.

I doubt there'll be more than 40 Kwh on offer at launch and I wish I knew when it would become available because I could lease the car another 6 months and get a 182.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

160 hp with the weight might see 8.5-9 seconds to 100 kph.

147 hp or about 30 more Kw is still welcome probably 9-9.5 seconds 0-100 not going to win any records thats for sure but still better. It's not just about the 0-100, overtaking power is more important in my opinion, 80-120 Kph for instance. This really made the I3 feel so much more powerful.

I doubt there'll be more than 40 Kwh on offer at launch and I wish I knew when it would become available because I could lease the car another 6 months and get a 182.

Are you considering leaf2?
If so that's interesting to me as any leaf owners I speak to at charge points are looking towards the Ioniq or dreaming of a Tesla. I haven't met one who is openly considering leaf2.

I would not buy a new leaf, as a current leaf owner.

DrPhilG

ELM327 wrote: »

Are you considering leaf2?
If so that's interesting to me as any leaf owners I speak to at charge points are looking towards the Ioniq or dreaming of a Tesla. I haven't met one who is openly considering leaf2.

I would not buy a new leaf, as a current leaf owner.

I'm considering Leaf 2, but not new. Would never buy a new car.

I'll be waiting about 6 months to a year. See if Ioniq 2 whips the Leaf, find out if there are any teething problems with Leaf 2, then shop in England or via Phil Fitzgerald (Electric Autos) for a second hand one.

The Ioniq is a much better looking car than Leaf 1, but if the images for Leaf 2 are accurate then it's a close run thing. Main issue is that my wife won't go back to a car without 360 cameras after the Leaf 1 Tekna spoiled her. That makes the Ioniq difficult.

Soarer

Teaser advert run in Japan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQDpuzaOoSM

Glimpses of Leaf screen grabbed from the above ad














Looks like the front grille will be filled in, just with a lot more subtlety than the Ioniq.

goz83

ELM327 wrote: »

Are you considering leaf2?
If so that's interesting to me as any leaf owners I speak to at charge points are looking towards the Ioniq or dreaming of a Tesla. I haven't met one who is openly considering leaf2.

I would not buy a new leaf, as a current leaf owner.

as a 2 Leaf Owner I am very interested in Leaf 2

But I also wouldn't buy new. I almost did with Ioniq, but I am glad I held back. I am happy to wait a year, or two or even three before buying one with big depreciation. I will be seeing how Brexit is going, keeping an eye on £/€ and also watching out for what may happen with VRT exemption.

video fixed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQDpuzaOoSM

grogi

Soarer wrote: »

Looks like the front grille will be filled in, just with a lot more subtlety than the Ioniq.

It has to. A regular grill destroys the Cx.

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

160 hp with the weight might see 8.5-9 seconds to 100 kph.

Looking at the weight issue a bit more. The leaked spec shows a GVWR of 2020kg.

The same value for the 24kWh and 30kWh Leaf is 1945 and 1970 so its actually only 50kg more than the 30kWh Leaf which is pretty good considering it is probably for an extra 10-12kWh's of capacity.

My understanding is that the GVWR is a fully loaded weight(passengers and extras) not the same at all as the kerbside weight which is more like 1500kg on Leaf I.

With that in mind and the bump of an extra 30kW's of motor power it should surely do better than 9secs? Leaf I can do 10secs so surely it will be a good bit better than that?

cros13

KCross wrote: »

its actually only 50kg more than the 30kWh Leaf which is pretty good considering it is probably for an extra 10-12kWh's of capacity.

Yup, but the battery will weigh about the same or even less. The increased weight is largely down to the new Leaf being physically slightly larger.

KCross wrote: »

With that in mind and the bump of an extra 30kW's of motor power it should surely do better than 9secs? Leaf I can do 10secs so surely it will be a good bit better than that?

I'd anticipate 8-9 seconds with no real difference in low speed performance where the current Leaf is traction limited anyway.

Shefwedfan

I am just wondering am I missing something here? The original Leaf was launched in 2010. Probably shipped in 2011. One small change to battery in 2014. Nothing really to the car. The new one will be 2018. That is 8 years of dev and test. Also loads of customer feedback as Nissan got the jump on other manufacturer's. They have biggest customer base....they also delay car by a year

And we get

F**k all to be honest, 40kWH battery which is no major jump compared to other manufacturer. The same design as any other Nissan so no new thinking there. A few nice to have like auto parking which every other vendor is doing...

Where is the thougth? the new idea's? anything.

I find it majorly disappointment. There is nothing here that Hyundai couldn't do next week and they launched there first electric car this year. If I was Nissan I would be embarrassed with the whole thing. It is the only electric car they sell, bar the NV200 which is a van, and it feels like they sat down last year and put the plan together

At least Toyota with Hybrid have rolled it out to entire range and done something new.

If you are a loyal Leaf customer do you not find it a bit of a joke?

maybe it is just me......

thierry14

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I am just wondering am I missing something here? The original Leaf was launched in 2010. Probably shipped in 2011. One small change to battery in 2014. Nothing really to the car. The new one will be 2018. That is 8 years of dev and test. Also loads of customer feedback as Nissan got the jump on other manufacturer's. They have biggest customer base....they also delay car by a year

And we get

F**k all to be honest, 40kWH battery which is no major jump compared to other manufacturer. The same design as any other Nissan so no new thinking there. A few nice to have like auto parking which every other vendor is doing...

Where is the thougth? the new idea's? anything.

I find it majorly disappointment. There is nothing here that Hyundai couldn't do next week and they launched there first electric car this year. If I was Nissan I would be embarrassed with the whole thing. It is the only electric car they sell, bar the NV200 which is a van, and it feels like they sat down last year and put the plan together

At least Toyota with Hybrid have rolled it out to entire range and done something new.

If you are a loyal Leaf customer do you not find it a bit of a joke?

maybe it is just me......

When you put it that way

24kwh to 40kwh in 9 years is a bit meh

Hyundai, Tesla and all them are not doing any better though for 25k on the road, wouldn't be slating Nissan here

It's more a realisation of just how little battery tech has improved year on year

Even the godly Tesla wouldn't do better for 25k on the road

I am one of the biggest critics of the original Leaf, but 40kwh, 150bhp, faster charging, auto parking is pretty good for 25k

Alot better than equivalent 1.6TDi Golf

unkel

All depends on the price, but if Nissan can get the Leaf II on the road for about €25k they are surely onto a winner. Why? That's the same price as an Ioniq. Which might have a better spec, but it also has a smaller range that the Leaf II, which with 40kWh must be able to get an EPA of over 250km. Which is the magical Dublin to Cork without charging that many people on here talk about. BK want one?

Also the looks have improved radically, you get level 2 autonomous driving (I presume this is standard on all models) same as Ioniq. And of course the availability of Ioniq is terrible. So the Leaf II is not a joke at all in my book!

KCross wrote: »

Leaf I can do 10secs

I thought the official 0-100km/h time for Leaf I was 11.9s (0-60mph 11.5s)? Maybe it's been clocked quicker than that? Ioniq is officially 9.9s but I've seen GPS verified tests that clock it at 8s

Soarer

@Shefwedfan: You drive an e-golf, yeah?

grogi

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I am just wondering am I missing something here? The original Leaf was launched in 2010. Probably shipped in 2011. One small change to battery in 2014. Nothing really to the car. The new one will be 2018. That is 8 years of dev and test. Also loads of customer feedback as Nissan got the jump on other manufacturer's. They have biggest customer base....they also delay car by a year

And we get

F**k all to be honest, 40kWH battery which is no major jump compared to other manufacturer. The same design as any other Nissan so no new thinking there. A few nice to have like auto parking which every other vendor is doing...

24 kWh Leaf was loosing money for Nissan when it was released.

Where is the thougth? the new idea's? anything.

Ideas don't earn money... There is time for ideas, there is time for mass market.

I find it majorly disappointment. There is nothing here that Hyundai couldn't do next week and they launched there first electric car this year.

There is. Deliver the actual car to the customer. Hyundai showed they can engineered an excellent car - but they are struggling with production.

Nissan is showing something maybe less sophisticated or advanced, but I believe they are able to deliver volumes. And do it at reasonable price.

If I was Nissan I would be embarrassed with the whole thing. It is the only electric car they sell, bar the NV200 which is a van, and it feels like they sat down last year and put the plan together

That's true. They should have bestsellers - Micra and Qashqai electrified already.

If you are a loyal Leaf customer do you not find it a bit of a joke?

maybe it is just me......

Loyal?! Very few will buy a new Leaf out of loyalty. People will buy it because it gives the best value/€$ ratio. Not because it is Leaf.

thierry14

KCross wrote: »

Looking at the weight issue a bit more. The leaked spec shows a GVWR of 2020kg.

The same value for the 24kWh and 30kWh Leaf is 1945 and 1970 so its actually only 50kg more than the 30kWh Leaf which is pretty good considering it is probably for an extra 10-12kWh's of capacity.

My understanding is that the GVWR is a fully loaded weight(passengers and extras) not the same at all as the kerbside weight which is more like 1500kg on Leaf I.

With that in mind and the bump of an extra 30kW's of motor power it should surely do better than 9secs? Leaf I can do 10secs so surely it will be a good bit better than that?

Think the same

It's almost a 40% increase in motor power and torque at 340nm is 30% up on even the i3

Will be 8secs easy, maybe low 8secs

Thats 170bhp Golf GTD territory

At least now the Leaf will be a match for good 2 litre turbo diesels, that's a significant upgrade to where it is now

KCross

unkel wrote: »

I thought the official 0-100km/h time for Leaf I was 11.9s (0-60mph 11.5s)? Maybe it's been clocked quicker than that? Ioniq is officially 9.9s but I've seen GPS verified tests that clock it at 8s

Yea, it depends on who's testing it and there is also the added complication that the 2011-2013 Leaf was actually faster off the line but was subsequently toned down in the 2014+ models to limit wheel spin because "people" couldn't handle the power!!! :mad:

The Leaf has had a few tests that show it at 9.4-10.4secs to 96kmh

https://www.0-60specs.com/nissan-leaf-0-60-times/
http://insideevs.com/plug-vehicle-cross-section-acceleration-30-mph-60-mph-ev-mode/

The point still is though, at roughly 10secs today, it should do much better with the boost in power it is supposedly getting. Its down to how Nissan use the power. If they dumb it down again it might be a disappointing 0-100 figure.

thierry14 wrote: »

Think the same

It's almost a 40% increase in motor power and torque at 340nm is 30% up on even the i3

Will be 8secs easy, maybe low 8secs

Thats 170bhp Golf GTD territory

At least now the Leaf will be a match for good 2 litre turbo diesels, that's a significant upgrade to where it is now

They might engineer it for 7.9secs just so they have some more marketing stuff to put out!

I'd take 8secs though and, as Mad_Lad says, more even spread of the power upto 120km/h.

Shefwedfan

Soarer wrote: »

@Shefwedfan: You drive an e-golf, yeah?

I do. Not sure why that makes a difference?

I test drove the Leaf and it wasn't for me. If it was next year and the new Leaf was out maybe it would be a different story....

My point was more to do with Nissan. They have had a long time to get the Leaf 2 right. After all the talk it just looks like something they could have thrown together last year and put in production.

I get your point on mass production but after 8 years of doing it for current Leaf you would guess that is not a concern.....

Nissan seemed to have spent more time on the new Micra than on the Leaf 2

Lads, this isn't a brand new model but a facelift, ok a fairly heavy facelift but still not a brand new model.

Yes coming from Leaf I is a bit of a disappointment but I'd still appreciate the extra range, if it's more efficient than the current model and Zoe 40 Kwh owners can see 280 Kms on a charge , probably driving 80 Kph but still, the new Leaf should easily see 250 Kms and 300 (possible).

I would like to see much greater than 45 Kw charging on DC however if you have 40 Kwh and 250 Kms range it might not be a huge issue, 3 phase AC would make a big difference. I know some people like Unkel are not a fan of AC but on many trips I only use AC and avoid DC altogether and faster AC would be a big benefit to me. It's a shame the Ioniq didn't have faster AC charging considering the CCS network isn't as good as ChaDeMo.

It would be interesting to see if ChaDeMo would still be limited to 45 Kw on the triple headed units that can charge the Ioniq at 65 Kw.

I hope the pro pilot is decent and not a useless gimmick like on the Ioniq. I did read you have to have at least one hand on the steering which to me is useless and defeats the purpose but would be a great help in the event you loose concentration or fall asleep, that's my greatest fear driving home after night shifts and one reason I never, ever use cruise driving home after nights.

2,000 Kg, that's a heavy beast and I doubt 147 Hp is enough to get it past 9 seconds but as I said I'd much rather see better performance at 80+ Kph.

Yes I'm still considering the I3 I Just hope BMW get the cost down for the facelift but that's unlikely. It sure is a lot of fun and a very good quality. Shame there's no battery upgrade and that's what will probably convince me to get the updated Leaf.

DrPhilG

I am expecting to be disappointed with Leaf 2.

I wanted a comfortable 200 miles range and the chances of that are slim/none.

Hence my Leaf 2 decision will depend on what Ioniq 2 brings, and whether there is any potential for a 50/60kwh version soon after.

If a 200 mile affordable car is still another 2 or 3 years away even after Leaf 2 then I wouldn't wait that long to upgrade.

grogi

grogi wrote: »

Loyal?! Very few will buy a new Leaf out of loyalty. People will buy it because it gives the best value/€$ ratio. Not because it is Leaf.

That and because it will likely have the most range of any affordable ev currently available at the time and perhaps the Pro pilot will be attractive to a lot of people or that's what Nissan will be hoping.

grogi

DrPhilG wrote: »

I am expecting to be disappointed with Leaf 2.

I wanted a comfortable 200 miles range and the chances of that are slim/none.

Hence my Leaf 2 decision will depend on what Ioniq 2 brings, and whether there is any potential for a 50/60kwh version soon after.

If a 200 mile affordable car is still another 2 or 3 years away even after Leaf 2 then I wouldn't wait that long to upgrade.

I think people here need to start controlling their expectations...

Shortly before the release there is a self inflating bubble of expectations and everyone ends up being disappointed.

Between generations the entry level Leaf is getting almost 100% battery size increase, 50% power increase and probably some efficiency gains. It should bring it close to 300km of range... It will get self-driving features and many more refinements. At the same price point...

Not enough?!

DrPhilG

DrPhilG wrote: »

I am expecting to be disappointed with Leaf 2.

I wanted a comfortable 200 miles range and the chances of that are slim/none.

Hence my Leaf 2 decision will depend on what Ioniq 2 brings, and whether there is any potential for a 50/60kwh version soon after.

If a 200 mile affordable car is still another 2 or 3 years away even after Leaf 2 then I wouldn't wait that long to upgrade.

Ioniq 2 ? you'll be waiting, the Ioniq was only released last year.

Nissan can make a 60 Kwh just not at the cost they want and by face lifting the Leaf they didn't have to spend a tonne of money on a whole new model.

The can't get a deal they wanted with LG Chem probably due to lack of production.

I would rather them have a brand new model and rebrand the existing leaf and keep selling it, this way they could have made back most if not all the cost of that model.

grogi

grogi wrote: »

I think people here need to start controlling their expectations...

Shortly before the release there is a self inflating bubble of expectations and everyone ends up being disappointed.

Between generations the entry level Leaf is getting almost 100% battery size increase, 50% power increase and probably some efficiency gains. It should bring it close to 300km of range... It will get self-driving features and many more refinements. At the same price point...

Not enough?!

I know what you mean, can't keep us happy lol.

Yes the upgrade will be welcome but you can't blame us for expecting more than just twice the battery capacity , or rather 10 Kwh more than the 30 Kwh Leaf after 2 whole years.

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

Are you considering leaf2?
If so that's interesting to me as any leaf owners I speak to at charge points are looking towards the Ioniq or dreaming of a Tesla. I haven't met one who is openly considering leaf2.

I would not buy a new leaf, as a current leaf owner.

Of course I'll consider it. Leaf will have more range and pro pilot will be far better than their useless lane keep assist even if you have to ave one hand on the steering which I'm not keen on at all.

The I3 is still an option even with less range, I had a lot of fun in it on the test drive.

I don't think the Ioniq will be an option, supply restraints and lack of full options greatly let it down and of course 28 Kwh....

DrPhilG

Deleted User wrote: »

Ioniq 2 ? you'll be waiting, the Ioniq was only released last year.

Ioniq "gen 2" then.

When the Ioniq was released they said themselves that they hoped to have an upgraded option by 2018 to offer 200 miles range.

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

2,000 Kg, that's a heavy beast and I doubt 147 Hp is enough to get it past 9 seconds but as I said I'd much rather see better performance at 80+ Kph.

Its not 2000kg. See post 760

thelikelylad

DrPhilG wrote: »

Ioniq "gen 2" then.

When the Ioniq was released they said themselves that they hoped to have an upgraded option by 2018 to offer 200 miles range.

I think you're dead right to wait and see what the 2nd gen Ioniq has to offer. As we know Hyundai are expected to release the ~50kWh Kona next year. If they can get at least a 45kWh pack into the current Ioniq chassis without any compromises on efficiency then you'll have a 200-mile EPA rated EV

Soarer

thelikelylad wrote: »

I think you're dead right to wait and see what the 2nd gen Ioniq has to offer. As we know Hyundai are expected to release the ~50kWh Kona next year. If they can get at least a 45kWh pack into the current Ioniq chassis without any compromises on efficiency then you'll have a 200-mile EPA rated EV

At what price?

DrPhilG

thelikelylad wrote: »

I think you're dead right to wait and see what the 2nd gen Ioniq has to offer. As we know Hyundai are expected to release the ~50kWh Kona next year. If they can get at least a 45kWh pack into the current Ioniq chassis without any compromises on efficiency then you'll have a 200-mile EPA rated EV

Just need to get 360 degree parking cameras installed somehow to keep the boss happy!

thelikelylad

Soarer wrote: »

At what price?

No idea. If the ~50kWh Kona is rumored to come in at €35k then surely €30-32k (-€4k for unkel :P) would be realistic? At €30k it's not far off the current price for the 28kWh. Even if they come out with a 40kWh battery my guess is it will still pip the Leaf 2 range but I could be wrong. Not Leaf bashing or anything but I think waiting is a wise move and it won't cost you anything to wait, if you're already driving an EV.

grogi

thelikelylad wrote: »

No idea. If the ~50kWh Kona is rumored to come in at €35k then surely €30-32k (-€4k for unkel :P) would be realistic? At €30k it's not far off the current price for the 28kWh. Even if they come out with a 40kWh battery my guess is it will still pip the Leaf 2 range but I could be wrong. Not Leaf bashing or anything but I think waiting is a wise move and it won't cost you anything to wait, if you're already driving an EV.

Kona will cash on the SUV market, cannot imagine it will be comparable in price to Ioniq. €35k will come with the basic 30/28kWh battery, while the bigger one will demand a bigger payment.

thelikelylad

grogi wrote: »

Kona will cash on the SUV market, cannot imagine it will be comparable in price to Ioniq. €35k will come with the basic 30/28kWh battery, while the bigger one will demand a bigger payment.

Well if the entry level 1.0 petrol Kona is expected to come in at under €17k in the UK, then I can't imagine how they expect people to pay ~€20k extra for a 28kWh EV version.

The only thing I would worry about is supply. If Hyundai are struggling to churn out 28kWh Ioniq's then they surely will struggle with ~40kWh Ioniq's, let alone the 50kWh Kona.

CFC007

How are Nissan to deal with regarding scrappage. An extra €4K off the new leaf would be ideal. I know a good few on here were able to get the scrappage from Hyundai without the required NCT etc.

unkel

KCross wrote: »

The Leaf has had a few tests that show it at 9.4-10.4secs to 96kmh

https://www.0-60specs.com/nissan-leaf-0-60-times/

Ioniq is 8.1s according to that site

DrPhilG

DrPhilG wrote: »

Ioniq "gen 2" then.

When the Ioniq was released they said themselves that they hoped to have an upgraded option by 2018 to offer 200 miles range.

Won't be gen II just Gen I with new battery.

ewj1978

unkel wrote: »

Have to reserve judgment, pending pricing here in Ireland and range / aerodynamics and it's unfortunate it's the now obsolete chademo charging, but it looks decent and should have nice &quick acceleration Hope the speed limiter is set a bit higher than 144km/h this time...

Speed limiter? Must be off on mine..

unkel

All EVs have speed limiters. If the Leaf I didn't have one, it would probably do about 190km/h* at max power (80kW) and the battery (24kWh) would be depleted in 24/80 hours, or 18 minutes. In those 18 minutes the car would have gone from 100% full to completely empty in just 18/60 * 190 = 57km max range

*that's just a guess, but similar size ICE cars with similar power and a similar coefficient of drag would have an unlimited top speed of 190km/h or thereabouts

ewj1978

Pretty sure we've had this discussion before.. I've maybe seen 163 on my leaf with 5 adults onboard. Hence my speed limiter question.

grogi

KCross wrote: »

I'd take 8secs though and, as Mad_Lad says, more even spread of the power upto 120km/h.

I've found a power curve for a Leaf.



There are more at http://www.leaftalk.co.uk/showthread.php/15539-My-Leaf-on-a-Dyno-(Rolling-Road), but I cannot register atm...

Similarly story for a Tesla...




It would looks the power is limited by the battery. The torque, after initial spike, goes down to maintain the same power.
Because of that the Leaf might feel restrained - it lacks that umphs experienced at low speed. It is however not less powerful than a 110 bhp ICE car and will accelerate equally (if not better - who drives the ICE near max power?) at any speed.

So if the new Leaf comes with 150 bhp drivetrain, it will feel more powerful mid-high speed than the current one. But it will still feel weaker than around 30 km/h.

unkel

You can clearly see the speed limiter kicking in at about 89mph (143km/h) in that first graph

@ewj1978 - the indicated speed of any car is usually higher than the real speed. Legally it can be up to 10% + 4km/h higher. So an indicated speed of 180km/h could be as little as 160km/h. The Leaf is known to over read by quite a bit.

DrPhilG

My original plan was to keep my current Leaf for 4 years (2 down, 2 to go) and then trade up into a 1 year old Leaf 2 with 200+ miles range in all weathers, then keep that car long term.

Given that the upcoming Leaf is likely to leave me a bit disappointed and not make that 200 mile target, I have a few options.

1 - suck it up for a few more years in my 24kwh until that elusive 200 mile car is available.

2 - take the below target range and buy a second hand 40kwh, then repeat in another few years.

3 - this is the one I'm not sure about. I have never looked into PCP but could I buy a 40kwh on PCP and then trade up when the right car finally arrives? Can someone explain PCP for dummies? I'm currently putting aside €170 a month towards my next car. That's roughly the amount I'm saving compared to diesel. By the time Leaf 2 hits I will have about €5k saved, plus the value of my 141 which I should have a private buyer for.

cros13

DrPhilG wrote: »

Given that the upcoming Leaf is likely to leave me a bit disappointed and not make that 200 mile target, I have a few options.

Don't be so sure about that. There is definately a larger battery than 40kWh on the way with the new Leaf. The only question is when will they have enough cell supply from LG to get it into dealers. But I'm very confident n Leaf with more than 50kWh will be on Irish roads in 2018. What I don't know is whether Nissan will acknowledge the existence of the larger battery at launch.

If you want a car with more than 320km of range don't buy the 40kWh Leaf, just wait another 6 months.

unkel

DrPhilG wrote: »

1 - suck it up for a few more years in my 24kwh until that elusive 200 mile car is available.

If the 80 mile range in your current Leaf is adequate for your needs, why the need for he 200 mile range? Sure, more is always better but the problem with an emerging technology is that there is always something better around the corner. Can't just keep waiting forever for the perfect car to come along!

Leaf 2 looks like a good proposition for the next 2 years, but obviously it will be cheaper second hand. That said, I don't think we'll ever see the rapid depreciation of the Leaf 1 like we have seen over the past few years where you could bring in a 1 year old 30kWh for about half the new price

Go buy a brand new Leaf 2. You're worth it

grogi

unkel wrote: »

Go buy a brand new Leaf 2. You're worth it

If only they included the two way steering wheel alignment...

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

If the 80 mile range in your current Leaf is adequate for your needs, why the need for the 200 mile range?

First off, I drive my car like I stole it. I enjoy the speed and acceleration so I don't use eco or bother hyoermiling. So I definitely don't get 80 miles.

Secondly, the current range is adequate but it has definitely got drawbacks. I drive Donegal to Belfast half a dozen times a year, and that needs a charge in the Glenshane plus a charge once I hit Belfast. Dublin is on the cards maybe 3 times a year which means 15 minutes in Omagh, 25 minutes in Monaghan and half an hour in Applegreen on the motorway. That's the guts of an hour extra compared to a short Monaghan toilet stop, which is a pain.

I do Cork once a year and I hire an ICE for that as it's far too restrictive and reliant on charger functionality and availability.

A 200 mile car would make Belfast easy without stopping. Dublin the same and Cork a 1 or 2 stop trip which is what I'd be stopping anyway.

So essentially all the EV benefits without the downsides.

ELM327

PhilG - Have you considered an Ioniq?
Much much better than a leaf.
I believe there was a recent video showed cork-belfast in just 2 stops.

KCross

unkel wrote: »

All EVs have speed limiters. If the Leaf I didn't have one, it would probably do about 190km/h* at max power (80kW) and the battery (24kWh) would be depleted in 24/80 hours, or 18 minutes. In those 18 minutes the car would have gone from 100% full to completely empty in just 18/60 * 190 = 57km max range

*that's just a guess, but similar size ICE cars with similar power and a similar coefficient of drag would have an unlimited top speed of 190km/h or thereabouts

Not sure what the point of that post is. Its not technically possible to drive at max power for 18mins so its a pointless calculation.

Even if it were possible, what would you get from your equivalent ICE if you had it red lining for 18mins.... I'd say horrendous mpg and a new set of pistons shortly after!

ewj1978 wrote: »

Pretty sure we've had this discussion before.. I've maybe seen 163 on my leaf with 5 adults onboard. Hence my speed limiter question.

Yea, we've had the discussion a few times before!

The Leaf max's out at 150kmh (GPS speed) maybe a bit more if you are going downhill. The Leaf over reads so your 163 is about right.

unkel

ELM327 wrote: »

PhilG - Have you considered an Ioniq?
Much much better than a leaf.
I believe there was a recent video showed cork-belfast in just 2 stops.

Ioniq is a great budget EV but availability is poor. And the Leaf 2 should have more range for similar money. BTW stick to 100km/h and you can easily do Cork to Belfast in 1 stop in Ioniq

DrPhilG

I have considered the Ioniq, but there are drawbacks to that too. CCS coverage in the North west is very poor. The Ioniq doesn't have 360 degree parking cameras (essential for the wife) and it also won't get near 200 miles per charge in its current incarnation.

The CCS issue is the main one. If I was buying now it would still have to be the Leaf as a result.

My father has been ill recently and will most likely be in a nursing home for the rest of his days so my daily commute will change (3 days a week anyway) from 25 miles round trip to about 80 miles. That leaves very little wiggle room for anything else during the day and means that in my current car I need to charge during the day.