2018 Leaf

unkel

6kW charging is an optional extra? Surely not just 3.3kW charging as standard???

unkel

Lot of waffle about aerodynamics. Just tell us the Cd FFS :rolleyes:

You're hearing more than I am Unkel.....or I'm just about to fall asleep after a bottle of wine lol

thierry14

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Lol, what ?

Seems to be the same range as the Zoe

Whats its EPA 280km?

thierry14

unkel wrote: »

Lot of waffle about aerodynamics. Just tell us the Cd FFS :rolleyes:

0-60 too

110kw aint much good if its 200kg heavier than the old Leaf

Pretty terrible presentation so far

I didn't hear anything about range except 400 Km Japanese cycle.

Nothing about Kwh.....

That's it ? seriously ? for Fu1K sake what a joke, I certainly won't be buying this pile of crap, not until at least until they have more Kwh.

More power and battery Kwh for 2018 ??? that's it ? Fuc!ers ! ! !

Seriously unimpressed with this presentation, Nissan you're a complete Joke !! F!ck off !!!

thierry14

[Deleted User] wrote: »

That's it ? seriously ? for Fu1K sake what a joke, I certainly won't be buying this pile of crap, not until at least until they have more Kwh.

More power and battery Kwh for 2018 ??? that's it ? Fuc!ers ! ! !

Top speed limited to 140kmh too, wtf like

Will be putting a deposit down for a Model 3

I can wait

cros13

Deleted User wrote: »

Still can't get the stream via the Nvidia shield TV, lucky to have it on the laptop.......

same journey I made myself... wouldn't stream on the shield for me either

unkel wrote: »

6kW charging is an optional extra? Surely not just 3.3kW charging as standard???

Those are details for the japanese market and don't apply to the european market.



Specs from insideevs:


150 mi according to google is 241.4km
motor power 30kW above the current leaf
torque (320Nm) increased by 26%
weight increases by 9kg
$690 cheaper base price in the US market
Propilot only offered for the top two trims as part of the "tech package"
Chademo rapid charging of the 40kWh to 80% in 40 mins ("up to 60kW" for the 40kWh)
0-100km/h in 9.8sec (down from 11.3 official, 15% improvement)
60-100km/h 30% faster
OTA updates "not yet" "being worked on"
35 millimeters longer, 10 mm higher, 20 mm wider, 5mm lower centre of gravity
front track the same, rear track gains 20mm
Cd 0.28
Somewhat better interior materials to give a more "premium feel"
65L bigger boot
as expected european leaf will use Type 2 for AC charging
battery thermal management system (cooling from the A/C during rapid charging like the eNV200)
CarPlay and Android Auto

InsideEVs confirms two variants, 40 & 60kWh with the 60kWh "e-Plus" providing over 350km on the EPA cycle and due for release second half of 2018.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAEBtzj093E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gn_EgM6Ed8U

I didn't get that the top speed is limited to 80 Mph.

But either way, Im not getting a updated leaf based on that seriously poor presentation, seriously , WTF ? I keep wondering if I'm dreaming or drank too much wine ?

Disappointing isn't the word, I'm gutted ! I foolishly had high hopes for this Leaf, now I have to keep my 24 Kwh for another year or 2 FU!K you Nissan !!!!!

Not even a hint of DC charging speed etc. Useless joke !

Time for bed.

thierry14

cros13 wrote: »

same journey I made myself... wouldn't;t stream on the shield



Those are details for the japanese market.



Specs from insideevs:


150 mi according to google is 241.4km
motor power 30kW above the current leaf
weight increases by 9kg
$690 cheaper base price in the US market
Propilot only offered for the top two trims as part of the "tech package"
Chademo rapid charging of the 40kWh to 80% in 40 mins

InsideEVs confirms two variants, 40 & 60kWh with the 60kWh "e-Plus" providing over 320km on the EPA cycle and due for release later in 2018.

Elon must be laughing

This doesn't have a hope in the US, its nearly the same price as the Model 3

I didnt fall for the Tesla hype before but i do now

They are so far ahead its crazy

Think they have to be taken very seriously now

That and the fact this Leaf still has 0 form of battery cooling for the hot climates of the U.S......

Yes, tesla much be having some party now !

cros13

thierry14 wrote: »

This doesn't have a hope in the US, its nearly the same price as the Model 3

$5k cheaper than the model 3. And with the federal tax credit being phased out for Tesla and not Nissan yet by March 2019 it could be $12.5k cheaper for many buyers.

Soarer

Nice looking car, but I don't think its enough for me to buy one.

I like the looks and I like the extra power/torque figures. But "only" an extra 40 miles range, 3.3kW charger, and I'll have to change my tethered home charge point? Will give it a skip I'd say.

Will probably use it as a stick to try get a (near) new 30kWh SVE/Tekna with 6.6kW charger for cheaper.

Soarer

Deleted User wrote: »

I didn't get that the top speed is limited to 80 Mph.

But either way, Im not getting a updated leaf based on that seriously poor presentation, seriously , WTF ? I keep wondering if I'm dreaming or drank too much wine ?

You're not buying a car based on a poor presentation?

That's either serious principles you have, or really good wine!

DrPhilG

Ar$eholes

DrPhilG

https://www.slashgear.com/gv/2018-nissan-leaf-gallery/#jp-carousel-498471

Complete disappointment for me. Lazy redesign inside. 150 mile realistic range. Promises of more to come (whoop de do). 

Only plus points are that it looks a lot better outside and the price should stay around the same. 

It's Tesla and Hyundai's game to lose now. 

J.pilkington

Great looking car considering the restrictions electric cars are under for aero.

Trumps the icon by a country mile, every time I meet the icon on the road I am hugely disappointed, especially the front end, I really want to like it but its horrible.

DrPhilG

J.pilkington wrote: »

Great looking car considering the restrictions electric cars are under for aero.

Trumps the icon by a country mile, every time I meet the icon on the road I am hugely disappointed, especially the front end, I really want to like it but its horrible.

Presume you mean the Ioniq?

Exterior looks are the least important part of a car IMO.

Performance/range first, then interior functionality/comfort, then interior style and finally the outside.

Gumbo

They could have at least put a bit of thought into the wheels. Darker wheels like the current SVE would be better than those!

Spec doesn't sound great based on comments here
This should have been the car that converted many main steam people (if the ioniq hadn't already).

BoatMad

I'm impressed , car looks great , range is up nearly 50 % , and pricing is good

E-pedal is a great idea , this " coasting " nonsense is stupid for EVs.

Nissan generally make a better car then by Hyundai

I am told will have type 2 , 6kw/7kw ac with optional 3 phase , sorry to see type 1 go, but I can see why for European market ( I can change my thethered for 60 euros anyway )

Very impressed with weight. improved Cd , EPA at 250 is right on the button of expectation for 40 kWh

The one thing is people will probably hold off till the 60 kWh , I will

Definitely better then current Ioniq , certainly significantly better looking

Not bad Nissan

Soarer

Did I read/hear that the Cd is the same as the old model?

BoatMad

kceire wrote: »

They could have at least put a bit of thought into the wheels. Darker wheels like the current SVE would be better than those!

Spec doesn't sound great based on comments here
This should have been the car that converted many main steam people (if the ioniq hadn't already).

Dark wheels , uggg

Base spec is right on the numbers , improved aerodynamics cd 0.28 , improved power , aceleration,

EPA Range at 150 miles up from 107 , represents a significant improvement in efficiency given the battery is going from only 30 to 40 kWh

Weight gain is only minor

Good improvements in acceleration ( the current car is fast enough still )

Good looking car

Dc charging is rising to max Chademo ver 1 , so that's good ( few chargers here can do more anyway ) , actual charge profile will be interesting to see

nisssn are right to stay away from complex battery therms
Management , I am told the car will divert the AC to cool the pack while charging , while charging is all you want

Not bad at all really

jamesthepeach

Wake me up when they can do 300km.
I mean really do 300km.

Gumbo

jamesthepeach wrote: »

Wake me up when they can do 300km.
I mean really do 300km.

Then we will get people that say 'wake me up when they can do 400km'.

DesperateDan

I wouldn't say this car is built to make you upgrade your current leaf, it's natural we ain't there yet. But for prospective owners it's a great car.

BoatMad

Soarer wrote: »

Did I read/hear that the Cd is the same as the old model?

Think it's improved from 0.29 to 0.28

jamesthepeach

kceire wrote: »

Then we will get people that say 'wake me up when they can do 400km'.

300km Is the magic number. Always has been. But that at a reasonable price and the market will shift.

And I'm talking about a real 300km winter or summer, driving normally.

ELM327

So what is it, 3.3 AC still with optional 6.6??

You mean to tell me they went for type 2 but didnt increase the speed? Idiots. That is all.

Worse than my underwhelming estimates. Was never going to buy one anyway but this is really taking the cake, Nissan have written a blank cheque to Tesla for the model 3 to dominate in a years time, better (much better) EV with much better support

BoatMad

DesperateDan wrote: »

I wouldn't say this car is built to make you upgrade your current leaf, it's natural we ain't there yet. But for prospective owners it's a great car.

Given they have announced it will be available with a 60 kWh soon , I think that will be the real leaf 2

But right now you get an significantly improved car for a lower retail price ( us market )

EPA Mileage up nearly 50 %

Improved engine power , md range acceleration up 30 %

One pedal driving , ( including activating the friction brakes ) that's a great idea

AC will cool battery while charging , no complex thermsl management needed , that's good


Not a bad upgrade

NISMO version planned

Certainly if they boost the battery to 60 kWh , yet keep the adder price under control ( say similar to 24 to 30 jump price ) , the 60 kWh will be a killer car

BoatMad

ELM327 wrote: »

So what is it, 3.3 AC still with optional 6.6??

You mean to tell me they went for type 2 but didnt increase the speed? Idiots. That is all.

Worse than my underwhelming estimates. Was never going to buy one anyway but this is really taking the cake, Nissan have written a blank cheque to Tesla for the model 3 to dominate in a years time, better (much better) EV with much better support

THats the jap spec

The European car will be 7kw with optional 11 kw as I understand it.

Tesla is anything upwards of 10 k dearer

Don't be an [snip] , the 40 kWh leaf is an entry level car at entry level EV pricing , suggesting its a model 3 competitor is nonsense

In that it's quite good , the punter now gets a 40 kWh car for the same money

EPA of 150 miles is right on the button for a 40 kWh , improved acceleration , etc

At the end of the day battery size is irrelevant , what matter is $$/ range equation.

As for tesla , when you see the cost of its extras , you'll, see the base price fly utterly out the window, ( the full autopilot pricing for example )

And how you can make the claim " better support" when there's a single " dealer " in the whole country , and a yet completely unproven car ( and support ) is beyond me

MOD NOTE: No need to insult people

ELM327

BoatMad wrote: »

THats the jap spec

The European car will be 7kw with optional 11 kw as I understand it.

Tesla is anything upwards of 10 k dearer

Don't be an [snip] , the 40 kWh leaf is an entry level car at entry level EV pricing , suggesting its a model 3 competitor is nonsense

In that it's quite good

EPA of 150 miles is right on the button for a 40 kWh

At the end of the day battery size is irrelevant , what matter is $$/ range equation.

Little harsh there. And not needed.
Just because I'm not enamoured with the new leaf doesnt make me an [snip].

Obviously they are in the same field. They are aiming for the first mass market EV. And this leaf is not going to be that car.

BoatMad

jamesthepeach wrote: »

300km Is the magic number. Always has been. But that at a reasonable price and the market will shift.

And I'm talking about a real 300km winter or summer, driving normally.

The 60 kWh leaf will easily deliver that and based on the way Nissan are maintaining the price point , should be price competitive

60 kWh is expected in 2018, and we'll see that before we see RHD Teslas

BoatMad

ELM327 wrote: »

Little harsh there. And not needed.
Just because I'm not enamoured with the new leaf doesnt make me an [snip].

Obviously they are in the same field. They are aiming for the first mass market EV. And this leaf is not going to be that car.

Sorry , how can a car priced nearly 10K dollars apart be regarded as competitors

That's why I made the comment

The tesla is only mass market compared to tesla , it's not mass market compared to ice

Based on sales to date the Nissan is a mass market leader

Personally I think the announcement is exactly as expected , Nissan is a conservative auto maker , and this follows that pattern

Range is consistent with battery , with 60 kWh announced as well
Little weight gain , so more efficient battery and motor ( as power is up early 50 % )
Price point is maintained
Styling looks good ( for a Nissan )
A few extra bells and whistles as usual

unkel

Really lads, what were you expecting? I really feel this is not a bad effort at all from Nissan. Everything is significantly better in every way than Leaf 1 and the price has gone down. Still $30k dollars though, so no way that will be €25k here on the road. That is disappointing. And I fear the ProPilot will not be standard here in Ireland, which makes it (again) very expensive compared to Ioniq.

A $30k Leaf is not good value compared to a $35k Model 3

cros13

I think the wrong tone was set here.

What we've got is basically what was expected with a few bonuses.

A 40kWh Leaf better in range, power, charging, handling, looks, boot space and with plenty of new toys for less money.

A 60kWh Leaf coming in a year based on this new one with more range (350km+) and more power.

And for the last time, the new Leaf in europe will not have 3.3kW charging. This event was a reveal for japanese dealers, they will get a type 1 equipped car with a different onboard charger.

unkel

What's your thoughts, cros13 on ProPilot being standard or optional extra here in Ireland? And what's your guess of the base model (with metallic paint) on the road price here? Available for 181 reg?

liamog

Definitely looks a lot nicer than the current gen car.

I remain to be convinced by the ProPilot features, I think Nissan are over-hyping a lot of relatively standard features to compete with Tesla.

The range increase of 40k over the Ioniq and 70k over the current gen will be seen as disappointing as some.
I think it's a little more subtle than that, in my opinion range is as much a function as the days between required charges for the expanded market.

I use the formula 365/averageDrivingDistance*range with 16,000km as the average Irish driving distance per year, then round it down because we're trying to work out the minimum number of days between charges.

Leaf 24 is a charge every 2nd day car
Leaf 30 is a charge every 3rd day car
Ioniq is a charge every 4th day car.

Leaf II 40 is a charge every 5th day car.
Leaf II 60 becomes a charge every 8th day car.

For an average person driving here, charging the car every 5th day is quite desirable and should suit a lot of needs.
I think there is a psychological barrier that will be broke by the Leaf II 60, having to charge your car an average of once a week will foster mass market adoption.

Soarer

Soarer wrote: »

You're not buying a car based on a poor presentation?

That's either serious principles you have, or really good wine!

The wine was good, I needed it to sit through that presentation !

After "sleeping on it" I've decided this updated Leaf isn't for me, not based on the presentation but on the specs. I think the deciding factor will be the EPA test whenever that happens.

A lot nicer car to look at though much better than the existing one.

More power and updated interior are all positives and also more range will make it appeal to many more people.

cros13

unkel wrote: »

What's your thoughts, cros13 on ProPilot being standard or optional extra here in Ireland? And what's your guess of the base model (with metallic paint) on the road price here? Available for 181 reg?

Propilot probably an option on SV and SVE. Some chance it may get bundled with SVE... at least at some point.

XE from €23.5-24.5k OTR including dealer charges. SV and SVE €26k and €30k OTR respectively. Tech pack adding maybe €1.5-2k on to that.

liamog

liamog wrote: »

Definitely looks a lot nicer than the current gen car.

I remain to be convinced by the ProPilot features, I think Nissan are over-hyping a lot of relatively standard features to compete with Tesla.

The range increase of 40k over the Ioniq and 70k over the current gen will be seen as disappointing as some.
I think it's a little more subtle than that, in my opinion range is as much a function as the days between required charges for the expanded market.

I use the formula 365/averageDrivingDistance*range with 16,000km as the average Irish driving distance per year, then round it down because we're trying to work out the minimum number of days between charges.

Leaf 24 is a charge every 2nd day car
Leaf 30 is a charge every 3rd day car
Ioniq is a charge every 4th day car.

Leaf II 40 is a charge every 5th day car.
Leaf II 60 becomes a charge every 8th day car.

For an average person driving here, charging the car every 5th day is quite desirable and should suit a lot of needs.
I think there is a psychological barrier that will be broke by the Leaf II 60, having to charge your car an average of once a week will foster mass market adoption.

I seriously doubt plugging in a car every day or two will deter most people especially when they realise their home is their "fuel station".

jamesthepeach

BoatMad wrote: »

The 60 kWh leaf will easily deliver that and based on the way Nissan are maintaining the price point , should be price competitive

60 kWh is expected in 2018, and we'll see that before we see RHD Teslas

I'll have a look then.
Bit underwhelmed by this one.
We have a 30kw one at the moment which really drives me mad when I pull into an fcp and there is a queue.

liamog

Deleted User wrote: »

I seriously doubt plugging in a car every day or two will deter most people especially when they realise their home is their "fuel station".

Like I said it's a psychological barrier, having to plug in, and wanting to plug in are two very different impressions.

As an EV driver, you know it's not an issue, for an ICE driver, being told you need to plug in every night to go about your business can be off putting. Being told you "only" need to plug in one night a week makes it a different ball game.

Also, people without home chargers etc... stuff we've discussed in many different threads. It means 1 in 7 apartment parking spaces need a charger instead of 1 in 2.

Where are the specs to say it comes with 3.3 Kw charger only ? that's just ridiculous if true.

What about DC charging specs ?

bk

A much nicer looking car then the old Leaf.

But definitely not for me, looks very disappointing. Less range then the current Zoe and only slightly more then the current Ioniq. Not even enough range to make Dublin to Cork without stopping!

Certainly very evolutionary and conservative upgrade.

I don't think this will sell at all in the US, Model 3 will destroy it.

Personally I'll be waiting for upgraded Ioniq, Kona or maybe 60kwh Leaf. And of course keeping an eye on the pricing of a model 3.

cros13

Deleted User wrote: »

Where are the specs to say it comes with 3.3 Kw charger only ? that's just ridiculous if true.

It is coming with a 3.3kW for the Japanese model. The european model will have three-phase 11kW support, at least as an option.

Deleted User wrote: »

What about DC charging specs ?

Up to 60kW

DrPhilG

cros13 wrote: »

I think the wrong tone was set here.

What we've got is basically what was expected with a few bonuses.

Really? What bonuses?

The reason we got what we expected is because most had set their expectations very low.