Garda Commissioner Refuses to Go.

.........

melloa wrote: »

not being funny or anything but it's like an episode of police acadamy

If only it were.

Unfortunately, There's very little that's funny for ordinary citizens in a so called developed western country having a police force that cannot be trusted.

mattser

steddyeddy wrote: »

Yea I knew someone who left the gaurds like some sort of cultist. Hung around with gaurds only and kept to himself. And they wonder why people don't trust them?

You talk of one Garda you knew, and the way he chose to live his life thereafter. And then brush the rest of them as being the same.
Talk about generalising.
They'd have every reason to wonder about the public in your scenario.

Ulysses Gaze

melloa wrote: »

i had a nice task at the weekend convincing my nephew (10), that law enforcement is honest,

it's alright for old cynical ones like ourselves,

but we could have a disaster generation coming up if generation z don't respect the police

What have they done to earn the respect?

mikeoneilly

Fire his ass !

Atoms for Peace

snowflaker wrote: »

We need an external Commissioner from outside Ireland to come in and clean up the boys in blue

Michael Chiklis would be my pick for the position.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmY8h9Nrqfc

CoolHandBandit

Look we all know this is the result of cuts and politics. The government had to pay off a massive bank debt hence vital services in all parts of the civil service had to be slashed. The problem with doing this is political fallout when inevitably these cuts effect crime stats, the health service etc.. I have no doubt in my mind this directive to produce fake stats to make it look like everything was rosy came from the very top of government and the commissioner will be the fall guy/gal eventually.

Personally speaking i have zero trust in the Gardai after this and the whistle blower scandal and the worrying thing is this is more than likely all tip of the iceberg stuff.

ChikiChiki

Martin Callinan is still able to come and go as he pleases to Garda HQ. What a joke tbh.

mynamejeff

a lot of stupidity being talked here
lads who changed from soccer to gaa after they joined
lads who wanted to hand out with workmates afer they joined

ffs its easy to see its you not them who have the problem

as for norin , yes she should be long gone and its just arrogance that keeps here there . a very common feature of politically appointed garda management ( ranks above inspector )

as for getting rid of here well the minister for justice can sack here in the morning but wont . why is that i wonder ? doesnt want to sack the first female to get the job might be ?

A outside even non irish civilian commissioner would be the best option by far to replace her

Donal55

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

Look we all know this is the result of cuts and politics. The government had to pay off a massive bank debt hence vital services in all parts of the civil service had to be slashed. The problem with doing this is political fallout when inevitably these cuts effect crime stats, the health service etc.. I have no doubt in my mind this directive to produce fake stats to make it look like everything was rosy came from the very top of government and the commissioner will be the fall guy/gal eventually.

Personally speaking i have zero trust in the Gardai after this and the whistle blower scandal and the worrying thing is this is more than likely all tip of the iceberg stuff.

Nothing to do with cuts. They're going examining the accounts for 2002 to 2008 next when the country was awash with money and as one professor of business said on SOR this morning, could actually be worse.

As the same person alluded to this morning, 'it was just AGS trousering the money'.
And no one asked questions because as she also said, 'they're the guards, we're supposed to trust them'.

My paraphrasing said woman but podcast should be available.

Little CuChulainn

mynamejeff wrote: »

a lot of stupidity being talked here
lads who changed from soccer to gaa after they joined
lads who wanted to hand out with workmates afer they joined

ffs its easy to see its you not them who have the problem

as for norin , yes she should be long gone and its just arrogance that keeps here there . a very common feature of politically appointed garda management ( ranks above inspector )

as for getting rid of here well the minister for justice can sack here in the morning but wont . why is that i wonder ? doesnt want to sack the first female to get the job might be ?

A outside even non irish civilian commissioner would be the best option by far to replace her

You don't think it's believable that four Gardaí would stop watching the hurling final to come and stare daggers at someone at the public counter because they said they don't follow GAA?

mynamejeff

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

You don't think it's believable that four Gardaí would stop watching the hurling final to come and stare daggers at someone at the public counter because they said they don't follow GAA?

id say some people would complain about a garda's breath if they got cpr from the garda


but thats a side issue

pilly

I really felt strongly that NOS should go over the Maurice McCabe matter. Not so much on this one.

At the end of the day it's the ordinary Gardaí that were falsifying figures here. Happens in all big organisations. Doesn't necessarily mean he CEO is to blame.

Little CuChulainn

pilly wrote: »

I really felt strongly that NOS should go over the Maurice McCabe matter. Not so much on this one.

At the end of the day it's the ordinary Gardaí that were falsifying figures here. Happens in all big organisations. Doesn't necessarily mean he CEO is to blame.

While individual Gardaí can take the blame for some of it there is definitely management fault also.

pilly

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

While individual Gardaí can take the blame for some of it there is definitely management fault also.

Yeah I agree, management certainly had to know this craic was going on but I'm just not convinced that getting rid of one person in this instance would solve all problems.

Over McCabe I felt she should step down whilst the investigation is going on because it's very difficult for your subordinates to be honest if you're still the boss. I still think she should step down for that reason.

suicide_circus

It's clear that gardai can no longer be trusted to govern themselves. Bring in an Outsider.

SEPT 23 1989

humberklog

pilly wrote: »

I really felt strongly that NOS should go over the Maurice McCabe matter. Not so much on this one.

At the end of the day it's the ordinary Gardaí that were falsifying figures here. Happens in all big organisations. Doesn't necessarily mean he CEO is to blame.

I think it was Jack Chamber's for the PAC this morning who lead a line of questioning with regards to senior Garai receiving bonus payments for better traffic policing figures.

N O'S said she had no info to hand to answer properly.

mikeoneilly

This is the mess and corruption you end up when the police regulate themselves

pilly

humberklog wrote: »

I think it was Jack Chamber's for the PAC this morning who lead a line of questioning with regards to senior Garai receiving bonus payments for better traffic policing figures.

N O'S said she had no info to hand to answer properly.

Bonuses for better figures is nothing new though in fairness. Neither is the fiddling of those same figures.

My point is that this is not necessarily down to NOS.

Little CuChulainn

pilly wrote: »

Bonuses for better figures is nothing new though in fairness. Neither is the fiddling of those same figures.

My point is that this is not necessarily down to NOS.

It's not the Gardaí or sergeants who get those bonuses. It's the Superintendenta and above that decide how figures should be recorded.

boombang

Just heard somebody from the Gardai on morning Ireland (Noel Cunningham I think) trotting out the line that the issues are related to a lack of resourcing, training and management. I'm amazed by this. You don't need additional training to know that the falsification of performance stats is totally wrong. The neck of the guards to put that line out. It's frankly stupid IMO and makes them look even worse. I'm a big fan of the guards, but when you seen practice and PR like this you really wonder about the mindset of some in the force.

Dravokivich

Seems to be soliciting sympathy. That's not good enough at all.

pilly

boombang wrote:

Just heard somebody from the Gardai on morning Ireland (Noel Cunningham I think) trotting out the line that the issues are related to a lack of resourcing, training and management. I'm amazed by this. You don't need additional training to know that the falsification of performance stats is totally wrong. The neck of the guards to put that line out. It's frankly stupid IMO and makes them look even worse. I'm a big fan of the guards, but when you seen practice and PR like this you really wonder about the mindset of some in the force.

Yeah heard him too. And he was more or less saying that it was never supposed to be about counting. Unreal.

Mr. Incognito

She must have files on everyone


http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/fitzgerald-stands-by-commissioner-after-garda-cover-up-claim-1.3077904?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fcrime-and-law%2Ffitzgerald-stands-by-commissioner-after-garda-cover-up-claim-1.3077904

Mr. Incognito

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/garda-commissioner-s-missing-mobile-is-strictly-for-inquiry-says-taoiseach-1.3102101

Garda Commissioner’s ‘missing mobile’ is strictly for inquiry, says Taoiseach
Enda Kenny rejects Solidarity call to ask N?ir?n O’Sullivan about phone himself
Tue, May 30, 2017, 19:57
Marie O'Halloran
Garda Commissioner N?ir?n O’Sullivan: “Are you going to continue to keep the commissioner in her place?” the Solidarity TD Mick Barry asked Taoiseach Enda Kenny. Photograph: Cyril Byrne

Garda Commissioner N?ir?n O’Sullivan: “Are you going to continue to keep the commissioner in her place?” the Solidarity TD Mick Barry asked Taoiseach Enda Kenny. Photograph: Cyril Byrne

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The Charleton inquiry is the place to deal with reports of missing phones and other Garda matters, Taoiseach Enda Kenny has said.

Mr Justice Peter Charleton, who is heading the Disclosures Tribunal, “is the very best person to deal with the matter”, he told the D?il on Tuesday.

Mr Kenny was responding to the Solidarity TD Mick Barry, who highlighted reports that the mobile phone of the Garda Commissioner, N?ir?n O’Sullivan, could not be located.

He said the former Garda press-office director Supt Dave Taylor claimed he had sent the commissioner a text telling her that a journalist had interviewed a person making allegations against the whistleblower Sgt Maurice McCabe. Mr Barry said Mr Taylor claims the commissioner sent a one-word reply: “Perfect”.

He said it was now reported that Ms O’Sullivan’s phone could not be provided to the Charleton inquiry.

Charleton tribunal cites ‘very disappointing’ response from witnesses
Jonathan Sugarman: Ireland has destroyed the lives of whistleblowers
Garda Commissioner holds ground amid fresh accusations

“David Taylor’s phone hasn’t been provided to the Charleton inquiry, either,” Mr Barry said. “It was taken from him as part of an internal Garda investigation led by N?ir?n O’Sullivan’s husband and has not been returned to him. So N?ir?n O’Sullivan’s husband has David Taylor’s phone and N?ir?n O’Sullivan can’t find her own phone. Perfect again.

“Was that phone officially reported missing? If so, when exactly,” he asked. “Was Martin Callinan’s phone officially reported missing? When exactly?” he said, referring to Ms O’Sullivan’s predecessor as Garda commissioner, whose Sim card also went missing.

Mr Barry said he understood Ms O’Sullivan used a second, personal mobile, known as the “off-site phone”, for some Garda business. “Has that been sought? Has she lost this phone, too?” he asked.

Mr Barry referred to the Irish Times/Ipsos MRBI opinion poll finding that 57 per cent of people believe the commissioner should resign. “The people who are policed by An Garda S?och?na, who pay garda?’s wages, have spoken – and spoken fairly decisively.”

Criticising the Taoiseach, Mr Barry claimed that “this is all part of your legacy, and it is far from perfect. Are you going to continue to keep the commissioner in her place and allow the further undermining of the Charleton tribunal?”

Mr Kenny rejected claims that the Government had failed to act. He said Mr Justice Charleton was the most appropriate person to carry out the investigation. “He has already adopted a no-nonsense approach to dealing with the business before him.”

Referring to the reports that the commissioner’s phone was missing, Mr Kenny said: “I don’t know whether or not it’s a true statement, whether it’s an allegation that stands up or not, but I expect Mr Justice Charleton will find out the truth of that.”

Mr Barry suggested the Taoiseach should “ask the Garda Commissioner about the phone, try to establish the position and then let the House know”. But Mr Kenny said the Charleton tribunal was “the place where the accuracy, the veracity and the truth will be established”.

Arra ffs, if the Gardai were prosecuting someone and their phone went missing they'd be all over it like a rash, and inviting the Court to draw inferences.

Nettle Soup

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/garda%C3%AD-exaggerated-number-of-breath-tests-by-1-45-million-1.3211152

The Gardaí falsify 1.44 million breath test and she still refuses to resign.

What exactly is a resignation offence in the Gardaí these days?

The force is rotten.

steddyeddy

Nettle Soup wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/garda%C3%AD-exaggerated-number-of-breath-tests-by-1-45-million-1.3211152

The Gardaí falsify 1.44 million breath test and she still refuses to resign.

What exactly is a resignation offence in the Gardaí these days?

The force is rotten.

Reluctantly agree with you. It's not full of bad apples but it certainly goes above and beyond sheltering them.

mynamejeff

she really does have the massive shiney brass balls required for politics


shame she is meant to be honest and non political

Mr.Micro

steddyeddy wrote: »

Reluctantly agree with you. It's not full of bad apples but it certainly goes above and beyond sheltering them.

That remains to be seen about the extent of bad apples.

BillyBobBS

steddyeddy wrote: »

Reluctantly agree with you. It's not full of bad apples but it certainly goes above and beyond sheltering them.

Maybe not full but it has it's fair share from the very top to the very bottom. I don't buy into this "it's only a tiny minority" thing at all. Let's not forget this is an organisation who's members where willing to break the law themselves to garner a pay rise.

BoatMad

Mr.Micro wrote: »

That remains to be seen about the extent of bad apples.

I think the culture in the guards is the bad apple, change the culture and a number if bad apples disappear

people do what they can get away with, tighten that regime and they dont act like that anymore