Waterford GAA Discussion Thread - **MOD NOTE POST #1**

Mulbert

hurler on de ditch wrote:

No,No, i worked it out ,it bull****

It's a point of view, that's all. Call it what u will!

Deise boii

Imagine what could possibly be achieved if the whole county rowed in together and supported the footballers properly. Not just the county board but clubs too. Currently we cannot get mentors for under 14 or 15 development squads and the tournament's are on in mid July. With the under 14 on in Dungarvan.

The u16 team trained this week and only 9 turned up. Clubs need to take a bit of responsibility too, to pass on information about training to encourage players to attend.

I know it's difficult to get involved as a selector or trainer as you get nothing except a training top not that people are looking for anything but it might encourage people to come on board if even they got an allowance for petrol or something. We need to do something to encourage people get involved because we have the footballers in the county it's just putting the structures in place to develop it.

PTH2009

On sunday 4th June it will be Clare vs Limerick in the semi final of the Munster Under 25 Hurling Championship at 2pm and the Winners will play the Waterford Under 25 team at 2pm on Sunday 18th June in the final in Thurles before our senior game vs Cork

Cork and Tipp decided not too play in the under 25 championship this year and i dont knw is there a Leinster Under 25 championship or if Galway and Antrim teams ???

robopaddy2

PTH2009 wrote: »

On sunday 4th June it will be Clare vs Limerick in the semi final of the Munster Under 25 Hurling Championship at 2pm and the Winners will play the Waterford Under 25 team at 2pm on Sunday 18th June in the final in Thurles before our senior game vs Cork

Cork and Tipp decided not too play in the under 25 championship this year and i dont knw is there a Leinster Under 25 championship or if Galway and Antrim teams ???

We should have a serious team at u25 if we were to put out our strongest side (even without the players involved in the senior setup). But just not sure how serious the competition will be taken

PTH2009

very quite here the last while

any news from the senior hurling camp ???

mickotallow

It's obvious Cork management and Waterford management are taking opposite approaches to the game. Waterford are on a training camp in Fota for the week while the Cork club championship has been run this weekend and last.
I know which approach I would prefer. You can't beat playing competitive games in my opinion .

Mulbert

mickotallow wrote:

It's obvious Cork management and Waterford management are taking opposite approaches to the game. Waterford are on a training camp in Fota for the week while the Cork club championship has been run this weekend and last. I know which approach I would prefer. You can't beat playing competitive games in my opinion .

Your right, they are taking opposite approaches but there are things for and against.

Cork have had a lead up to a game and won it, they now have to start a new cycle of preparation. It could be seen as a good idea for the players to a break from the county for a couple of weeks.

But Waterford are still preparing for a Munster semi. And the players focus should too.

I don't think club matches in Waterford would be a good idea presently.

hurler on de ditch

Mulbert wrote: »

Your right, they are taking opposite approaches but there are things for and against.

Cork have had a lead up to a game and won it, they now have to start a new cycle of preparation. It could be seen as a good idea for the players to a break from the county for a couple of weeks.

But Waterford are still preparing for a Munster semi. And the players focus should too.

I don't think club matches in Waterford would be a good idea presently.

well the wrap em up in cotton wool approach has done nothing for us so far .Mc Grath out

PTH2009

hurler on de ditch wrote: »

well the wrap em up in cotton wool approach has done nothing for us so far .Mc Grath out

We will all know the answer at about 5.30pm on the 18th June

Tbh there's no buzz around the county or on here about us this year. Cork have the advantage cause they played a full pace championship match

Gavlor

PTH2009 wrote: »

We will all know the answer at about 5.30pm on the 18th June

Tbh there's no buzz around the county or on here about us this year. Cork have the advantage cause they played a full pace championship match

I'm delighted that there's no buzz. Where has the buzz and expectations got us in the past?

Deisegodeo

I'd imagine the season has gone pretty much as planned for McGrath, apart from Tom Devine's departure from the panel and a few injuries. It was clear form early on that we weren't going for the league but we maintained Division 1 status so job done. Bowed out in quarter final with all focus on June 18th. Very little buzz around the place - no harm. Very little media focus - no harm either. Everyone talking about Cork and especially Galway.

So I think we are well placed heading into the championship. If the injuries clear up and we have a full panel for the summer I think we can go a long way. It is critical that the injuries clear up though, Coughlan, D.Fives and Barron are the spine of the defence/midfield and we badly need them at 100% for the summer.

From what I've heard training is going very well, cant wait for the Cork game now.

Deise_2012

Is Darragh Fives injured or what?

Gardner

Deisegodeo wrote: »

I'd imagine the season has gone pretty much as planned for McGrath, apart from Tom Devine's departure from the panel and a few injuries. It was clear form early on that we weren't going for the league but we maintained Division 1 status so job done. Bowed out in quarter final with all focus on June 18th. Very little buzz around the place - no harm. Very little media focus - no harm either. Everyone talking about Cork and especially Galway.

So I think we are well placed heading into the championship. If the injuries clear up and we have a full panel for the summer I think we can go a long way. It is critical that the injuries clear up though, Coughlan, D.Fives and Barron are the spine of the defence/midfield and we badly need them at 100% for the summer.

From what I've heard training is going very well, cant wait for the Cork game now.

spot on, too many clowns on this page. there will be a lot of humble pie eating on June 18th......

PTH2009

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1679224718784915&id=139214626119273

Good insight to Derek McGrath the person

hurler on de ditch

Gardner wrote: »

spot on, too many clowns on this page. there will be a lot of humble pie eating on June 18th......

their will be nothing won on June 18th only a match ,

DeiseDawg

Tickets for Waterford/Cork game on sale today.

PTH2009

DeiseDawg wrote: »

Tickets for Waterford/Cork game on sale today.

when will GAA season ticket holders be allocated tickets ???

this is my first year on the ST but do they normally give holders tickets in the new stand for games in Thurles ??. I much prefer the old stand

blue note

DeiseDawg wrote: »

Tickets for Waterford/Cork game on sale today.

I'm going to hold off and wait for the final I think.

PTH2009

blue note wrote: »

I'm going to hold off and wait for the final I think.

or the qualifer on the 1st July in Nowlan Park/ Wexford Park or Parnell Park or we might get a match up in Walsh Park

blue note

PTH2009 wrote: »

or the qualifer on the 1st July in Nowlan Park/ Wexford Park or Parnell Park or we might get a match up in Walsh Park

No, the AI final. I don't mind whether we go through the back door or through Munster.

Deisegodeo

Tickets secured... Covered stand... I'm optimistic about the result but not the weather!

taytobreath

wats the best stand to be in

chookieourlaw

Interesting piece here by Jackie Tyrell on why Clare should ditch sweeper
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/jackie-tyrrell-clare-need-to-ditch-the-sweeper-system-1.3104606?mode=amp

redlead

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Is Darragh Fives injured or what?

I was wondering this myself. Philip Mahony and Darragh Fives always seem to be injured so I guess I'm just presuming that they are. Not having those lads would have a big impact on the team. Does anyone know who we will be missing with injuries?

mountgomery burns

redlead wrote: »

I was wondering this myself. Philip Mahony and Darragh Fives always seem to be injured so I guess I'm just presuming that they are. Not having those lads would have a big impact on the team. Does anyone know who we will be missing with injuries?

Philip Mahony is fit, Shanahan is a doubt. Coughlan, C Gleeson and D Fives all out.

Deisegodeo

Darragh Fives played half of a recent challenge match, think it was against Limerick. I think he is expected to be available for June 18th

mountgomery burns

Deisegodeo wrote: »

Darragh Fives played half of a recent challenge match, think it was against Limerick. I think he is expected to be available for June 18th

Came off injured v Offaly is what I heard and to be honest given hes done so little I certainly don't seem him starting, if he plays at all. Would love to know more about Maurice fitness.

PTH2009

I think Connor Gleeson should be ok

Read in the n&s darragh fives played a full half in a behind closed doors challenge last week. On that subject we lost too both Clare (in thurles) and Limerick (in the Gaelic Grounds) last week but we were missing a lot through injury and exams. We're expected too play a full scale match against someone before the 18th. There was a deise race night last night In Tramore

Deisegodeo

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Came off injured v Offaly is what I heard and to be honest given hes done so little I certainly don't seem him starting, if he plays at all. Would love to know more about Maurice fitness.

Thats disappointing to hear, Darragh is a class act and would be a big loss if unavailable for the summer. I dont know what the state of play with Maurice is, I heard Connor Gleeson and Barry Coughlan may be fit the Cork game, but its not ideal preparation for the championship having these injury concerns.

PTH2009

Limerick beat Clare 4-18-0-17 in the Under 25/Intermediate Munster semi final so that means We will play them in the Munster Final as the curtain raiser to our senior semi final in 2 weeks in Thurles

More than likely the non senior panel members of the under 21 squad will line out in that match along with a few other under 25 players. The Munster under 21 championship itself will be very competitive with quality in all 5 teams, Cork in Walsh Park will not be an easy game. Be nice to do 2 in a row but it will be hard ask

PTH2009

Congrats to the ladies senior footballers who beat Cork 3-11-1-11 In round 2 of the Munster championship. They are now in the final on July 8th and will play the winners of Cork vs Kerry

Deisegodeo

From what I heard over the weekend both Darragh Fives and Barry Coughlan are in full training and will be available for the Cork game. I know Fives hasnt played a competitive game this year but he is top class and we need him back in the team. Coughlan is crucial too, we arent blessed with full backs in Waterford and would likely be playing a rookie in his place if he missed out.

PTH2009

Deisegodeo wrote: »

From what I heard over the weekend both Darragh Fives and Barry Coughlan are in full training and will be available for the Cork game. I know Fives hasnt played a competitive game this year but he is top class and we need him back in the team. Coughlan is crucial too, we arent blessed with full backs in Waterford and would likely be playing a rookie in his place if he missed out.

we need our strongest squad possible

Clare looked a lot better than last year yesterday, Limerick played good for periods but struggled for the rest of the game. Tipp will get better, Dublin seem to be all over the place but they can click when they want too, Galway, Cork and Wexford are flying and we will see at the weekend ow Kilkenny are doing. Offaly, Westmeath and Laois are improving but prob wont be a challenge but you never know

PTH2009

The footballers will know 2morrow morning who they will play on the 17th June in the 1st round of the qualifiers. We will play one of Laois, Louth,Wiclow,Longford,Sligo,Antrim or Derry. Very possible we will get a home draw but depends on our pairing

Very good chance if we draw Wiclow or Antrim, other teams maybe too strong for us

HillFarmer

Looking forward to the 18th, abroad the last few years and use boards to stay in touch.

Watched the Clare Limerick and game and I think whoever will come through our Cork match should have a great chance of a Munster title.
Anyone able to give an idea of a possible team? Would love to be home this time of year.

PTH2009

Tough draw for the footballers but we have home advantage

Derry in Fraher Field on the 17th June

deiseach

I think a home draw was more important for the footballers than an ostensibly easier game. The thought of welcoming Derry to Fraher is rather exciting. I might even go myself!

Fred C Dobbs

a

HillFarmer wrote: »

Looking forward to the 18th, abroad the last few years and use boards to stay in touch.

Watched the Clare Limerick and game and I think whoever will come through our Cork match should have a great chance of a Munster title.
Anyone able to give an idea of a possible team? Would love to be home this time of year.

A bit premature to be speculating on the team - assuming no injuries, would be good to see a few changes from AI semi final last year but not expecting that really. Whoever wins will be strong favourites to beat Clare who will relish being the underdogs - Clare weren't that impressive last Sunday but will still be hard to beat come July 9th.

PTH2009

deiseach wrote: »

I think a home draw was more important for the footballers than an ostensibly easier game. The thought of welcoming Derry to Fraher is rather exciting. I might even go myself!

Away that day but would love to go. Can't see us winning but you never knw. Derry prob not as strong as they once were but have a few good players. You might even catch a glimpse of Joe Brolly in the crowd

Hopefully a good crowd turns up but been on the day before the hurling may go agaisnt it a bit. Was it 2003 the last time we hosted an Ulster team in the championship and that was Armagh who were All Ireland champs at the time

Boom__Boom

PTH2009 wrote: »

Away that day but would love to go. Can't see us winning but you never knw. Derry prob not as strong as they once were but have a few good players. You might even catch a glimpse of Joe Brolly in the crowd

Hopefully a good crowd turns up but been on the day before the hurling may go agaisnt it a bit. Was it 2003 the last time we hosted an Ulster team in the championship and that was Armagh who were All Ireland champs at the time

Being at home is a massive factor.

If Waterford can turn in a performance similar to the Cork game, they should have a real chance.

Teams who get relegated in the league tend to be vulnerable to an upset come championship time.

Derry were very poor against Tyrone, especially defensively. The Dont Foul blog had a stat that of Tyrone's 27 shooting chances 21 were under little to no pressure.

I think the attitude of the two teams could be key here - and I wouldn't be surprised if Derry's is poor - their heads definitely dropped at the end of the Tyrone game and Tyrone spent the last part of the match simply popping over points at their ease.

PTH2009

If the new hurling championship structure comes in next year and were guaranteed 2 home games surely the capacities of Walsh Park and Fraher Field are not big enough ???

We might look at using Thurles or PUC in Cork for our home games ???. Maybe Nowlan Park might be looked at

Cake Man

PTH2009 wrote: »

If the new hurling championship structure comes in next year and were guaranteed 2 home games surely the capacities of Walsh Park and Fraher Field are not big enough ???

We might look at using Thurles or PUC in Cork for our home games ???. Maybe Nowlan Park might be looked at

Ah come on, no way we'd have to go to those extremes. According to Wikipedia, Walsh Park and Fraher Field have capacities of 17,000 and 15,000 respectively. Not sure if they be that much in reality but let's assume 10-12,000 worst case. Given the dropping attendances in Championship the last few years, the capacity for each may not be too far off at least. Also given that the games played there won't be knock-out might reduce the numbers a bit as well. I dunno, just speculating.


Just woke up to the news of the proposed championship structure for next year, don't think it's a bad thing and will make it more interesting. It seems ridiculous that it's been a few months since we last had a competitive game. Cork's win over Tipp seems like years ago at this stage. Will be good to have a consistent fixture list with a game on more or less every week throughout the summer.

mickmackmcgoo

Cake Man wrote:

Just woke up to the news of the proposed championship structure for next year, don't think it's a bad thing and will make it more interesting. It seems ridiculous that it's been a few months since we last had a competitive game. Cork's win over Tipp seems like years ago at this stage. Will be good to have a consistent fixture list with a game on more or less every week throughout the summer.

If you finish 4th or 5th in the proposed group then you're summer is over the first week in June

Davys Fits

PTH2009 wrote: »

If the new hurling championship structure comes in next year and were guaranteed 2 home games surely the capacities of Walsh Park and Fraher Field are not big enough ???

We might look at using Thurles or PUC in Cork for our home games ???. Maybe Nowlan Park might be looked at

A packed Ennis instead of a half full Limerick would suit Clare perfectly. Im sure if the demand is very high then Limerick would oblige, except against Limerick.
The home and away thing might mean that fans wont travel in numbers to the away games and wait for the 2 home games instead, so attendances may not be that big.

Giveitfong

Last Sunday’s Independent, in its build-up to the Clare/Limerick game, included an interview with former Clare hurler Jim McInerney (father of current fullback David). McInerney was scathing of the defensive setup under Davy Fitzgerald:

“When you set your team up where you have only one in the full-forward line you are conceding that you are not going to score many goals…the last couple of years we were crowding our midfield. We had fantastic hurlers in that congested area who couldn’t play in it and nobody in the full-forward line to score. It made no sense to me. Clare didn’t win a single championship match playing this system, and failed to score a goal in three of their four championship games in 2016, the exception being the qualifier game against Laois.”

Sound familiar?

Looking forward to last Sunday’s game, McInerney went on:

“My one hope is that we will play our full-forward line close to the goal and get it in there fast and if they do I think we will get goals. Conor McGrath spent most of his time chasing lads around the middle of the field in the last two years, even though he is one of the best inside forwards in the game.”
Things worked out exactly as McInerney hoped. Not only did Clare get three goals, they got them all from breaks off long balls played into the Limerick goal area. And the reason they got them is that, for all three goals, Clare had three forwards inside the Limerick 20 metre line and in position to avail of the breaks that came their way.

Conor McGrath and Shane O’Donnell not only got the three goals between them, but they also added five points for a combined total from play of 3-5.

The Fitzgerald setup as described by McInerney is exactly the same as the way Waterford are set up under Derek McGrath. Gifted scoring machines Stephen Bennett and Patrick Curran spend much of their time out around the middle of the field and although one or other of them may be in near the goal at times you hardly ever see the two of them there together. In fact you frequently see just one forward (if even that) inside the 50 metre line (never mind the 20 metre line).

This is a terrible waste of scoring talent and will never win us an All-Ireland. But will Derek McGrath have learned anything from last Sunday? On the basis of past experience, you would have to say it is very unlikely.

deiseach

mickmackmcgoo wrote: »

If you finish 4th or 5th in the proposed group then you're summer is over the first week in June

You've had four games. Previously you were only guaranteed two, probably with a large gap between the games spent farting around in training.

Deise Vu

mickmackmcgoo wrote: »

If you finish 4th or 5th in the proposed group then you're summer is over the first week in June

Like Cakeman I am only copping on to the changed structure too. TBH I am a little bit uneasy about it. 5 teams means one team is done and dusted and possibly (inevitably at some stage) waiting on a result from the last set of fixtures. We will definitely end up with dead rubber fixtures where teams are already through or out and, much much worse, we will end up with situations where it might suit a team to be less than totally committed. EG if we were playing Limerick last and had won our first three fixtures but a Limerick win would put Tipperary out, how committed would we be? (You can swop the teams around if the scenario is too bizarre for you).

You just can't beat knockout games. A Munster Title already is not as important as years ago due to the back door. Now you can lose a game or possibly two and still win it. I fear we might be losing some of the magic of the Championship.

KevIRL

Add me to the unsure about it group. Munster will be Hella competitive with any of the teams possibly going out. Leinster on the other hand will have Offaly pretty much certain to come last and only one other time not qualifying. Galway and KK almost certain to make the AI series year on year..

blueflame

For me the new set up is all about "Money" - it will mean that it is going to be much harder for teams to make a break through - would Clare have won the All Ireland in 2013 if Tip and KK and Galway had so many chances.

With the number of games now involved why not just return the All Ireland to straight knock out and promote the league to a more serious competition by running it in tandem with the All Ireland series as it was. The league has constantly been undermined by the attitude that it is played in the mud, and teams are not bothered and they are only going through heavy training etc. On this basis winning a league will never gain the respect it should deserve.

If we moved to a situation where the league and All Ireland series started in April and finished in August with the All Ireland being knockout everyone would have to be up to speed for the start of the League, in the knowledge that if they loose in the first round of the All Ireland they will still have the league to play for. Those remaining in the All Ireland will stil want to take the league seriously because they could go out of the All Ireland next day out and even if they use panel players, these will be busting a gut to get into the next championship team.

Six Teams in Division 1 will give each teams 5 league games and possibly a league Final - a straight knock out All Ireland series will mean probably a max of 4/5 games to win an Ireland (setting aside replays) so you would be talking about a minimum of 6 highly competitive games and a maximum of 12 games. Two serious titles up for grabs, and relegation to Division 2 will be a serious issue because you can no longer win the league from Division 2 and there is no real benefit in having easier Division 2 Games with more shocks and surprises in the All Ireland Series giving underdogs a better chance of winning one.

I know some people will say too many games and Club players will suffer but seriously how many meaningless Tournament and Challenge games are inter-county teams trying to fit in during the same number of months in addition to League and Championship - under the proposed new structure unless they are going to change or dispense with the league format you could be talking about as many as possibly 8 league games and 7 Championship games

Interested to hear others opinions.

Cake Man

blueflame wrote: »

in the knowledge that if they loose in the first round of the All Ireland they will still have the league to play for.

Sorry bluflame but I could just never see any team ever having the motivation to get themselves up for a league after being knocked out of championship.
It's like going for a job interview for a management level position and them telling you "sorry you didn't get the job but look, there's currently an open position for someone to clean toilets and empty bins if you're interested..."