Waterford GAA Discussion Thread - **MOD NOTE POST #1**

carq

danganabu wrote: »

And therein lies the problem with Waterford, please don't shoot the messenger, an over inflated perception of their teams ability and that is why McGrath gets do much crap from within, it has nothing to do with the tactics, which i admit I find tedious.

Where is the proof that Waterford are streets ahead of KK, is this based on an U21 team? Laughable to be honest.

ps I actually think Waterford will win on Saturday but some of the hyperbole over this teams talent is wearing a little thin.

Kilkenny poster wrote that i believe

PTH2009

carq wrote: »

Kilkenny poster wrote that i believe

they all know well that we cant get over them and there all going to be snickering at us saturday night

I knw some Kilkenny people who only talk about hurling when there winning and dismiss any talk of it when theyve been beaten

danganabu

carq wrote: »

Kilkenny poster wrote that i believe

My bad, still think the point is valid that many Waterford supporters were/are expecting too much too soon from this group of players

carq

danganabu wrote: »

My bad, still think the point is valid that many Waterford supporters were/are expecting too much too soon from this group of players

Biggest problem is that most of the players we expect much out of are not in the starting 15.
Cork beat us with 5 debutantes in their line up (Tipp game excluded)

sheepo

I think we are definitely capableof beating this KK team, who I think are at a previously unseen level of weakness (in my lifetime anyway). Will they actually do it is a whole other question and I do feel our biggest weakness is McGrath's dogged determination to stick to his game plan and defensive system.

We have the players there to beat KK, I have no doubt about that. I do doubt that they'll get enough game time to make a difference.

On balance though, I'm cautiously optimistic and really hoping we come out of Thurles with a win. I've braved the wrath of my OH and sold Coldplay tickets so I can go, so please don't let me down boys!!

PTH2009

Reading there in the Munster
'Waterford now have a new feature in there dressing room where the profile pick, pick of the player in action and the players name are placed above there seat'

Thoughts on this ???

deise_boi

Who gives a toss? I doubt the players do

PTH2009

http://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/last-weekend-was-the-time-to-draw-the-cats-john-mullane-on-waterfordkilkenny-clash-35893559.html?fgjghhghgf

I agree with mullane with what said about Kilkenny. Last week against Limerick they got over a few boundaries like bringing Fenneally back into the fold and guys like Hogan and TJ Reid are wounded and will be out too prove there not finished yet

This is Waterfords softest chance too beat the cats but a we have a few issues like how defensively will we line out, are some players past it etc.

Tramore84

PTH2009 wrote: »

Reading there in the Munster
'Waterford now have a new feature in there dressing room where the profile pick, pick of the player in action and the players name are placed above there seat'

Thoughts on this ???

This sounds like b**locks. Utter f*ckery of the highest order. People don't need to be reminded who they are before big games.

Take no prisoners

Anyone who genuinely thinks Waterford should win on Saturday have short memories. Yes Kk aren't the same team of recent years and some of them are misfiring but I saw enough from their backs in particular vs Limerick to worry, especially in the closing minutes. I think we'll struggle to break them down and fear our full back line could be exposed again, like they were in the replay last year. Hope I'm wrong but I fear we could be in for another close fought game which goes against us at the finish. And I'm basing a lot of this on the fact that the wrong team will be picked with damage done before the right players are eventually brought on.

danganabu

carq wrote: »

Biggest problem is that most of the players we expect much out of are not in the starting 15.
Cork beat us with 5 debutantes in their line up (Tipp game excluded)

So are you trying to tell me that there are more than 7 players not in the 15 that should be?? Please name the 15 you would start on Saturday, promise we wont laugh!

deise_boi

danganabu wrote: »

So are you trying to tell me that there are more than 7 players not in the 15 that should be?? Please name the 15 you would start on Saturday, promise we wont laugh!

Maybe I have it wrong, but did the poster not say we expect more from them? I don't think they were arguing that they should all be starting

Giveitfong

Watching last Sunday’s Leinster final, it occurred to me how similar Davy Fitzerald and Derek McGrath are in terms of their hurling philosophy, which in both cases is profoundly negative. It also occurred to me that this negativity probably arose from traumatic experiences both had with Waterford.

In Davy’s case, the traumatic experience in question was the 2011 Munster final, in which Waterford shipped seven goals and a seven goal defeat against Tipperary. In the subsequent All-Ireland semi-final against Kilkenny, it seemed to me that Davy’s main concern was to avoid a further heavy defeat which might have undermined his intercounty managerial career.

With ten minutes to go in that game, Waterford were only five points behind and had nothing to lose by pushing forward and seeking the scores which might have rescued the game. However, Davy insisted on keeping four Waterford defenders close to goal in those closing stages, marking a single Kilkenny full forward while the the other two were out the field picking up clearances from the Kilkenny defence and driving balls downfield.

Last Sunday, Wexford were nine points down with ten minutes to go. Yet Shaun Murphy continued to play as a sweeper, even though Galway were only playing one forward up front at that stage. In previous games Murphy had operated as sweeper in front of the Wexford full back line, but no doubt conscious of the problems the Wexford full backs experienced against Kilkenny, Davy moved Murphy in behind the full backs. This helped ensure Galway got no goals, but did not prevent them shooting 29 points and 13 wides.

Also last Sunday, right to the very end Wexford kept trying to work the ball forward from the back, running at the Galway defence in the hope of creating goal chances, which is always very hard to do at this level. Wexford goalie Mark Fanning was quite capable of landing puckouts down on the edge of the square, and I thought nothing was to be lost in Wexford pushing all their big men in there and bombing a few balls down on them. It could at least have created a few moments of excitement for their wonderful supporters. Instead the game just petered out.

In the case of Derek McGrath, I reckon his negative mindset arose from two heavy beatings Waterford shipped in succession during the National Hurling League in McGrath’s first year in charge. Down in Ennis, Waterford found themselves 4-15 to 0-4 down at the interval after a first half horrow show. While Clare were very sharp that day, Waterford’s main problem was their very naïve setup playing against a strong wind.

When the teams changed around for the second half, Clare promptly placed a sweeper in front of their full back line to make sure Waterford didn’t get a couple of goals which might have sparked a revival. Waterford did manage to hit 16 points in the second half but never got a sniff of a goal, and ended up 13 points behind.

The following week Waterford shipped a 20-point beating against Kilkenny in Nowlan Park, with the Cats winning the second half 3-13 to 0-6 despite playing against the wind. Waterford conceded nine goals in these two games and Derek McGrath then devised his system based on a sweeper and crowding out midfield in order to minimise goal concession. Apart from last year’s Munster Final meltdown this objective has generally been met, but at the expense of greatly neutering Waterford as an attacking force. Waterford now have better forwards than they had three years ago and in my view they will never win an All-Ireland while sticking to a basically negative game plan.

danganabu

deise_boi wrote: »

Maybe I have it wrong, but did the poster not say we expect more from them? I don't think they were arguing that they should all be starting

I read it as that there were more of the players that great things were expected of not on the team that there was on it, I'm sure the op will clarify.

mickmackmcgoo

Giveitfong wrote:

The following week Waterford shipped a 20-point beating against Kilkenny in Nowlan Park, with the Cats winning the second half 3-13 to 0-6 despite playing against the wind. Waterford conceded nine goals in these two games and Derek McGrath then devised his system based on a sweeper and crowding out midfield in order to minimise goal concession. Apart from last year’s Munster Final meltdown this objective has generally been met, but at the expense of greatly neutering Waterford as an attacking force. Waterford now have better forwards than they had three years ago and in my view they will never win an All-Ireland while sticking to a basically negative game plan.

You're analysis there is spot on . Reduce the goal scoring threat of the opposition and hope you will outscore them points wise. We do have better forwards than then but it's how we set up is the thing. There would be no point playing say Dillon, Ryan and Curran in our line up and raining high balls down on them. Kilkenny defenders are always strong and good in the air , limerick won hardly any aerial ball against them last Saturday. I always think back to last year's league match between Clare and Kilkenny in which Clare showed the right way to beat Kilkenny.

ArtVandelay76

Giveitfong wrote: »

Watching last Sunday’s Leinster final, it occurred to me how similar Davy Fitzerald and Derek McGrath are in terms of their hurling philosophy, which in both cases is profoundly negative. It also occurred to me that this negativity probably arose from traumatic experiences both had with Waterford.

In Davy’s case, the traumatic experience in question was the 2011 Munster final, in which Waterford shipped seven goals and a seven goal defeat against Tipperary. In the subsequent All-Ireland semi-final against Kilkenny, it seemed to me that Davy’s main concern was to avoid a further heavy defeat which might have undermined his intercounty managerial career.

With ten minutes to go in that game, Waterford were only five points behind and had nothing to lose by pushing forward and seeking the scores which might have rescued the game. However, Davy insisted on keeping four Waterford defenders close to goal in those closing stages, marking a single Kilkenny full forward while the the other two were out the field picking up clearances from the Kilkenny defence and driving balls downfield.

Last Sunday, Wexford were nine points down with ten minutes to go. Yet Shaun Murphy continued to play as a sweeper, even though Galway were only playing one forward up front at that stage. In previous games Murphy had operated as sweeper in front of the Wexford full back line, but no doubt conscious of the problems the Wexford full backs experienced against Kilkenny, Davy moved Murphy in behind the full backs. This helped ensure Galway got no goals, but did not prevent them shooting 29 points and 13 wides.

Also last Sunday, right to the very end Wexford kept trying to work the ball forward from the back, running at the Galway defence in the hope of creating goal chances, which is always very hard to do at this level. Wexford goalie Mark Fanning was quite capable of landing puckouts down on the edge of the square, and I thought nothing was to be lost in Wexford pushing all their big men in there and bombing a few balls down on them. It could at least have created a few moments of excitement for their wonderful supporters. Instead the game just petered out.

In the case of Derek McGrath, I reckon his negative mindset arose from two heavy beatings Waterford shipped in succession during the National Hurling League in McGrath’s first year in charge. Down in Ennis, Waterford found themselves 4-15 to 0-4 down at the interval after a first half horrow show. While Clare were very sharp that day, Waterford’s main problem was their very naïve setup playing against a strong wind.

When the teams changed around for the second half, Clare promptly placed a sweeper in front of their full back line to make sure Waterford didn’t get a couple of goals which might have sparked a revival. Waterford did manage to hit 16 points in the second half but never got a sniff of a goal, and ended up 13 points behind.

The following week Waterford shipped a 20-point beating against Kilkenny in Nowlan Park, with the Cats winning the second half 3-13 to 0-6 despite playing against the wind. Waterford conceded nine goals in these two games and Derek McGrath then devised his system based on a sweeper and crowding out midfield in order to minimise goal concession. Apart from last year’s Munster Final meltdown this objective has generally been met, but at the expense of greatly neutering Waterford as an attacking force. Waterford now have better forwards than they had three years ago and in my view they will never win an All-Ireland while sticking to a basically negative game plan.

Agree with all this, especially that semi final in 2009 v KK remember being a few points down near the end and Mullane taking his point rather than trying to work the ball in and try and get a goal which we needed at that stage of the match to have any hope.

tomwaterford

Giveitfong wrote: »

Watching last Sunday’s Leinster final, it occurred to me how similar Davy Fitzerald and Derek McGrath are in terms of their hurling philosophy, which in both cases is profoundly negative. It also occurred to me that this negativity probably arose from traumatic experiences both had with Waterford.

In Davy’s case, the traumatic experience in question was the 2011 Munster final, in which Waterford shipped seven goals and a seven goal defeat against Tipperary. In the subsequent All-Ireland semi-final against Kilkenny, it seemed to me that Davy’s main concern was to avoid a further heavy defeat which might have undermined his intercounty managerial career.

With ten minutes to go in that game, Waterford were only five points behind and had nothing to lose by pushing forward and seeking the scores which might have rescued the game. However, Davy insisted on keeping four Waterford defenders close to goal in those closing stages, marking a single Kilkenny full forward while the the other two were out the field picking up clearances from the Kilkenny defence and driving balls downfield.

Last Sunday, Wexford were nine points down with ten minutes to go. Yet Shaun Murphy continued to play as a sweeper, even though Galway were only playing one forward up front at that stage. In previous games Murphy had operated as sweeper in front of the Wexford full back line, but no doubt conscious of the problems the Wexford full backs experienced against Kilkenny, Davy moved Murphy in behind the full backs. This helped ensure Galway got no goals, but did not prevent them shooting 29 points and 13 wides.

Also last Sunday, right to the very end Wexford kept trying to work the ball forward from the back, running at the Galway defence in the hope of creating goal chances, which is always very hard to do at this level. Wexford goalie Mark Fanning was quite capable of landing puckouts down on the edge of the square, and I thought nothing was to be lost in Wexford pushing all their big men in there and bombing a few balls down on them. It could at least have created a few moments of excitement for their wonderful supporters. Instead the game just petered out.

In the case of Derek McGrath, I reckon his negative mindset arose from two heavy beatings Waterford shipped in succession during the National Hurling League in McGrath’s first year in charge. Down in Ennis, Waterford found themselves 4-15 to 0-4 down at the interval after a first half horrow show. While Clare were very sharp that day, Waterford’s main problem was their very naïve setup playing against a strong wind.

When the teams changed around for the second half, Clare promptly placed a sweeper in front of their full back line to make sure Waterford didn’t get a couple of goals which might have sparked a revival. Waterford did manage to hit 16 points in the second half but never got a sniff of a goal, and ended up 13 points behind.

The following week Waterford shipped a 20-point beating against Kilkenny in Nowlan Park, with the Cats winning the second half 3-13 to 0-6 despite playing against the wind. Waterford conceded nine goals in these two games and Derek McGrath then devised his system based on a sweeper and crowding out midfield in order to minimise goal concession. Apart from last year’s Munster Final meltdown this objective has generally been met, but at the expense of greatly neutering Waterford as an attacking force. Waterford now have better forwards than they had three years ago and in my view they will never win an All-Ireland while sticking to a basically negative game plan.

Id imagine the all ireland finel 08 probably had a lasting effevt on davy fitz aswel??

skaface

Fifty - Fifty for Saturday.. I give us a great chance if we get the match up's right and impose ourselves on Kilkenny from the first minute.. Ritchie Hogan has been poor last two games but always plays well against us.. This cannot be allowed to happen .. He can't be left drift out the field unmarked to pick off easy scores.. Also Barry Coughlan can't be left exposed one on one with Fennelly like last year's replay.. If we play low intelligent diagonal ball into our forwards and believe in ourselves, we have a great chance..

Up the Deise

mountgomery burns

Pretty confident we'll win.

spideyman92

Giveitfong wrote: »

Also last Sunday, right to the very end Wexford kept trying to work the ball forward from the back, running at the Galway defence in the hope of creating goal chances, which is always very hard to do at this level. Wexford goalie Mark Fanning was quite capable of landing puckouts down on the edge of the square, and I thought nothing was to be lost in Wexford pushing all their big men in there and bombing a few balls down on them. It could at least have created a few moments of excitement for their wonderful supporters. Instead the game just petered out.

Davy's ability to get players hyped up and working as hard as they do for so long is admirable but his love of short passing and building from the back is what annoys me about him most. Though it beats our latest tactic of throwing Brick up top and trying to land balls down on him that he hasn't a hope of winning. Would love to see Curran or someone start instead of him.

I always go into every match thinking we can win and feel optimistic about our chances on Saturday. Even though it was so long ago now I think beating KK in Nowlan park at the start of the league should stand to the Waterford players. There's that niggling feeling though that even though KK have been poor all year, they'll turn up against us.

Deskjockey

Will be good crowd I'd say.. both stands look to be sold out on tickets.ie and its only Tuesday.

Speckydodge

Anyone know of any busses with spaces going from the city?

HatchetMan7

Kilkenny haven't been great this year but you just know they'll turn up against Waterford on Saturday. I'd expect Kilkennys form to improve considerably with each game. I don't know how any Waterford supporter would be confident of a win given our history in this fixture down through the years but if we can replicate last years semi final performance but do it for 70+ minutes we would be hard to beat for sure. For Waterford to win on Saturday we have to hit the ground running, we just can't allow Kilkenny to build any sort of lead and confidence with it.

McGrath and Co. will have to make changes early if needed and not be looking at a guy whose struggling to get into the game. Coughlan will need some protection from both corner backs and De Burca at centre back. Both Connors and Shane Fives must make sure they don't get dragged out the field following their men. If we have an intelligent puck out strategy and if we can at least break even in the air we'll certainly be there or thereabouts.

Deisedozzer

skaface wrote: »

If we play low intelligent diagonal ball into our forwards and believe in ourselves, we have a great chance..

This is without doubt the biggest issue with the current setup. I don't even necessarily mind us playing a sweeper once you then acknowledge that you will be outnumbered in the inside line and adjust distribution accordingly as opposed to lashing high ball aimlessly in to outnumbered forwards.

danganabu

Deskjockey wrote: »

Will be good crowd I'd say.. both stands look to be sold out on tickets.ie and its only Tuesday.

Can't see anything other than a complete sell-out tbh.

HillFarmer

Bookings have KK favorites.

KK 4/5 WD 13/10

Jesus I cant wait for this one, massive game in Waterford's development.

mountgomery burns

danganabu wrote: »

Can't see anything other than a complete sell-out tbh.

Yet they don't intend on opening the town end for some reason

danganabu

HillFarmer wrote: »

Bookings have KK favorites.

KK 4/5 WD 13/10

Jesus I cant wait for this one, massive game in Waterford's development.

Waterford draw no bet @6/5 or -1 @ 10/11 are the value for me, there won't be a lot in this - I have already given notice at home that it maybe after midnight when I get home!!

FWIW you can also dutch the Tipp full forward line @ 11/10 for first goal scorer, again huge value!

redlead

HillFarmer wrote: »

Bookings have KK favorites.

KK 4/5 WD 13/10

Jesus I cant wait for this one, massive game in Waterford's development.

There comes a time when we need to stop the "development" and just do it though. There's a lot on the line on Saturday.

danganabu

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Yet they don't intend on opening the town end for some reason

Really? wow that seems crazy.

JesusRef

Saturday will be a again close i think, but again travelling more in hope than expectation.

Unfortunately we dont seem to have moved on at all in the last few years, sure the performances last year againts Kilkenny seemed to mark of improvement, but in hindsight if we won that Tipp would have beaten us in an All Ireland by a point a man.

The same issues exist:
- We are lacking pace all over the field.
- Derek is too Conservative a manager and wont change the team even when subs that came in did well.
- too many of the backs cant fight their own corner, and now just play the man instead of the ball and wait for TDB to come to the rescue (they need to all sit down and watch a video of the westmeath full-back).
- we have too many poor decision makers in the team, and inculding our best player, it is something that is not improving under this management.

The whole set-up seems to be dominated by Fear, fear of attacking the ball, fear of opening up, fear of having a go...

jive

JesusRef wrote: »

The same issues exist:
- We are lacking pace all over the field.
- we have too many poor decision makers in the team, and inculding our best player, it is something that is not improving under this management.

Disagree on lacking pace, plenty of pace on the panel. Aussie, Dunford, O'Halloran, Barron, Bennett's and plenty of others have pace to burn.

The latter issue is more one to do with tactics (which you alluded to). Aussie gets singled out for taking hail Mary shots but let's be honest there's plenty of lads who are doing it and it's because there's nothing on inside due to the defensive set-up. Waterford consistently have a high wide count and I fully expect that to continue because they are forced to take low % shots.

If Waterford can limit Fennelly and an off-form Richie Hogan then they will win this. Easier said than done.

Kilkenny by 4 and a short summer for Waterford as I can see Fennelly doing a lot of damage. History has a habit of repeating itself unfortunately for Waterford.

cheater

jive wrote: »

JesusRef wrote: »

The same issues exist:
- We are lacking pace all over the field.
- we have too many poor decision makers in the team, and inculding our best player, it is something that is not improving under this management.

Disagree on lacking pace, plenty of pace on the panel. Aussie, Dunford, O'Halloran, Barron, Bennett's and plenty of others have pace to burn.

The latter issue is more one to do with tactics (which you alluded to). Aussie gets singled out for taking hail Mary shots but let's be honest there's plenty of lads who are doing it and it's because there's nothing on inside due to the defensive set-up. Waterford consistently have a high wide count and I fully expect that to continue because they are forced to take low % shots.

If Waterford can limit Fennelly and an off-form Richie Hogan then they will win this. Easier said than done.

Kilkenny by 4 and a short summer for Waterford as I can see Fennelly doing a lot of damage. History has a habit of repeating itself unfortunately for Waterford.

TJ Reid?

greenspurs

Wow...
I came in for a quick nosey, expecting the Deise to be upbeat and confident...

Didnt expect such negative posts ! Jeez lads yere going to play the worst performing KK team in over a decade ! With very little to come from the bench.......

Honestly , if yee hurl like yee did last year in the 2 games, yee'l bate us by 4 or 5 points ...

We travel in hope...... thats a bad sign of the times........ Hon the Cats..

jive

cheater wrote: »

TJ Reid?

Plenty of danger men but TJ will be TJ, if Hogan can be kept as he is at the moment and Fennelly is stopped from ruling midfield Waterford should win it

Deisegodeo

Really big game for Waterford Saturday, time go up and do the business against Kilkenny. 4 years under Derek now, time to take the next step.

On the one hand we should be confident that we can beat them, given how they have performed so far and with big players looking so off form, and the apparent lack pf depth coming off the bench. All this indicates that Kilkenny are there for the taking.

But our form has been poor too, quiet league campaign and then a very poor Munster championship game against Cork means we are not sure exactly whether Waterford will perform on Saturday. The Offaly game, while possibly being good for confidence, really has no baring as they were so poor.

I too would like to see more pace in the forwards - any of Dunford, Curran, O'Halloran. Cant see McGrath changing it up now though, so we can expect high balls being rained down on Maurice and Brick.

I still think we can win, huge effort required and good use of the bench could be crucial. It going to be tight but reckon we will win by a point or 2.

robopaddy2

greenspurs wrote: »

Wow...
I came in for a quick nosey, expecting the Deise to be upbeat and confident...

Didnt expect such negative posts ! Jeez lads yere going to play the worst performing KK team in over a decade ! With very little to come from the bench.......

Honestly , if yee hurl like yee did last year in the 2 games, yee'l bate us by 4 or 5 points ...

We travel in hope...... thats a bad sign of the times........ Hon the Cats..

If we were confident yed be saying we've nothing to be cocky about'haven't beat Ye in 60 years bla bla blaa!?!

On a serious note Ye had some impressive performers for the u21s tonight. Any chance Cody will throw a couple of them in Saturday? He's never one to shy away from a few surprise selections....

mountgomery burns

I'm confident Waterford will win, am I mad?

Twiceasnice97

mountgomery burns wrote: »

I'm confident Waterford will win, am I mad?

no just unusual for a Waterford man

Waterford have better hurlers than kilkenny at the moment but I wouldn't give ye a hope in hell after the drawn match last year
kilkenny were on the edge of the cliff ready to go Waterford were hurling better than ye had played since the great team of the 2000s and ye wandered off without giving them the final push over the edge and paid the price.
It seems to have knocked the stuffing out of ye

tomwaterford

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Yet they don't intend on opening the town end for some reason

The town end is a much nicer terrace to view off though

Espially late in the evening...
Iirc sun deos be behind it/shining into kilian end in the evening?

robopaddy2

mountgomery burns wrote: »

I'm confident Waterford will win, am I mad?

On paper no, but in the larger scheme of things there's so much against us. Form isn't good. The Cork game was a shambles. The league was indifferent. Last years semi final was a real sucker punch for a lot of our young lads who would have been used to beating KK teams at underage level. People underestimating this KK team aswell, their not the KK of old but still a team full of players who have won a lot underage and at colleges level, similar if not more than our lads. We will need to play at a level far in excess of anything weve seen so far this year. Performances have been lethargic and we continue persist with a system that simply does not work. If we win on Saturday we will be All Ireland contenders. Lose and its back to the drawing board for next year.

JesusRef

jive wrote: »

Disagree on lacking pace, plenty of pace on the panel. Aussie, Dunford, O'Halloran, Barron, Bennett's and plenty of others have pace to .

Add in Tommy Ryan and we consistently have more pace on the bench than on the team - which is the point i was making

Cake Man

robopaddy2 wrote: »

If we win on Saturday we will be All Ireland contenders. Lose and its back to the drawing board for next year.

Yeah this. Win and the Cork game will be forgotten about. Lose though and it'll be more than a case of back to the drawing board as I think it would be a very long winter and coming back not really knowing where we stand (likely with a new management team). Big questions would be raised over many players.


Still finding it hard to convince myself we can do this. Think it's just the mentality of trying to beat KK in championship, something I've never experienced in my lifetime despite now being as good a time as any to finally do it. You just feel KK will be able to do enough to keep us at arms length (won't be helped by our set-up).

cul beag

This has probably been KIlkenny's weakest team in years. Their form to date hasn't been impressive and it's only going on past glories that people are fearful of. They are definitely there for the taking,they've no strength in dept either so wiith the right approach we can progress to the quarterfinals . I stress though,the right approach and team selection is key. Does he stay loyal to his lieutenants or does he bite the bullet and add pace to the team? Maybe he'll surprise us.

mountgomery burns

Naturally, the Cork game was very disappointing but I still think not playing for 12 weeks had a big bearing on it compared to a team that had momentum and confidence. Not convinced we've even declined in 12 months, Saturday will tell a lot of course. Kilkenny on the other hand definitely have.

The Tipp game last year is as bad a performance as has been put in under McGrath, and it was harder to see us beating Kilkenny last year than this year and we still nearly managed it (though I was optimistic the first day for some reason).

A lot more logic to say we will win on Saturday, factoring in the two performances last year, Hogans injury troubles, Kilkenny dip in form, another league win this time against them in their backyard, return of Darragh Fives and a couple of younger players with another year under their belt. Don't get the pessimism, and believe it or not I think we'll win by about 6 points.

DLS2THECORE

Team selection should be unveiled tonight, will it be unchanged or will Stephen Bennett get back in?
Nice problem for the management to have I suppose!

PTH2009

DLS2THECORE wrote: »

Team selection should be unveiled tonight, will it be unchanged or will Stephen Bennett get back in?
Nice problem for the management to have I suppose!

Prob the same 15 for the cork game

Under 21s playing this day week anyone knw how training is going ???. I expect Cork too 've strong

Gavlor

Not sure what where some people are getting the confidence from. I'm not so sure Waterford have better hurlers than Kilkenny. Take this season, we both had patchy league campaigns, we both shipped a heavy beating against unfancied sides in the championship and the main stars of both teams haven't clicked yet. There'll be a puck of a ball between the teams and unfortunately you'd have to fancy Kk to nick it in a tight game.

I'm sure Coady will use the Alex Ferguson "lads it's spurs ffs" team talk. We've an awful inferiority complex against that gammy wasp jersey

JesusRef

Twiceasnice97 wrote: »

no just unusual for a Waterford man

Waterford have better hurlers than kilkenny at the moment but I wouldn't give ye a hope in hell after the drawn match last year
kilkenny were on the edge of the cliff ready to go Waterford were hurling better than ye had played since the great team of the 2000s and ye wandered off without giving them the final push over the edge and paid the price.
It seems to have knocked the stuffing out of ye

We should have attacked Holden and Prendergast in the KK full back line that day, that would have been the winning of the match... but we gave them a free ride really

thesultan

DLS2THECORE wrote: »

Team selection should be unveiled tonight, will it be unchanged or will Stephen Bennett get back in?
Nice problem for the management to have I suppose!

Cody will play players in form, McGrath won't give a fella a chance who is. Richie leahy was impressive last night.