do you care much for manners/etiquette?

lawred2

Robsweezie wrote: »

Is it something you watch out for, and measure someone on?

I wouldn't care for the finer details like what way you hold your cutlery at the dinner table, but stuff like cleaning up after yourself, paying back what you owe, apologizing when you've done wrong, those things help me make an overall judgement on a person.

basic manners by whatever name is a simple measure of someone

lawred2

Shenshen wrote: »

My father once told me while we were eating out in a restaurant that the way I was using the cutlery was an insult to the chef who had prepared out meal. By using a knife to cut through some of my food I was sending the message that it was too hard to break open with my fork, and therefore hadn't been prepared properly.

I've taken that onboard and am very considerate about what cutlery I use now, and how I use it.

I don't really mind how people hold their cutlery - there are far too many regional variations to that, people here hold it very different from people in Germany, for example - but someone taking a steak knife to a bit of fish is sending out the message that the food they've been given is cooked wrong.
While someone trying to cut a steak with a fish knife might find himself unconsciously performing a bit of slapstick.

that's taking it too far really

razorblunt

Timely thread!

There's a guy that works up stairs from me, I've been unfortunate to walk in through doors behind him, he never holds it open.
Eventually I said something to him about it one day and he mumbled something about "being in his own little world", which is rubbish as he'd seen me.
Came back with this morning's breakfast tea and he did the same to a woman running in with 2 cups of tea in her hands.
I was about 20 feet behind them and by the time I'd gotten through she was absolutely reading him the riot act in the hallway.

lawred2

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I've been in the US for months on end - and I witnessed plenty of people eating in different ways..

fork in the left hand knife always in the right
picking up and putting the knife down as you mentioned
and others not using a knife at all

pretty much what you'd see here in any restaurant in town

I'm fine with whatever as long as someone isn't doing that ridiculous holding food down with the knife and pulling/tearing with the fork action.

My best mate has always done that - we've talked about it jovially. He said that's how his mother did it and he's not arsed enough to change now.

everlast75

I remember reading years ago, the three words that affect whether a relationship stands a better chance of survival or not are

1) Please
2) Thanks
3) Sorry.

If you can't bring yourself to say any of these three in everyday life, then there's a good chance I have zero time for you.

King George VI

Yes, quite. Manners maketh the man.

Shenshen

lawred2 wrote: »

that's taking it too far really

Why?

lawred2

Shenshen wrote: »

Why?

Table manners for me are for the comfort and enjoyment of those dining with you and around you..

Not supposing some offence for a chef who in most cases can't even see you..

I'd hazard a guess that most chefs would be more offended by plates being returned uneaten than whether you took a knife to a bit of fish. They wouldn't take solace in you using your fork to take the fish apart prior to you returning it uneaten now would they?

whoopsadoodles

I heard a story once, most likely urban myth, that a man in Shanahans on the green told the waiter to take back the steak knife because he expected that the meat be so tender it could be cut with a butter knife!

Shenshen

lawred2 wrote: »

Table manners for me are for the comfort and enjoyment of those dining with you and around you..

Not supposing some offence for a chef who in most cases can't even see you..

I'd hazard a guess that most chefs would be more offended by plates being returned uneaten than whether you took a knife to a bit of fish. They wouldn't take solace in you using your fork to take the fish apart prior to you returning it uneaten now would they?

Well, that was another thing not to be done, leave too much food on the plate. You leave 1 bite, to show that the size was just right for you, but no more.

And let's face it, most of us usually consume their meals together with the person who has prepared it most days of the week, and surely you'd want them to know that they're a good cook, too?
As I'm usually the one to cook the food, being able to eat it the way it's intended is something I aim for anyway

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Brendan Bendar

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

I wouldn't be watching anyone eat to notice such a thing, since staring at people eating is extremely rude.

Ok, I have you now, you eat with your eyes closed.

No, joking aside, we have these customs and standards for a reason.

Suggesting that one 'doesn't care' about culinary mores and customs suggests that if someone at your table say, at a wedding or party,picked up their main course in their hands and started gnawing at it wouldn't draw your attention?

Then put the plate up on their head and drained the gravy?

Extreme examples for sure, but to carry your argument to its logical conclusion you wouldn't notice or care?

No I'm afraid we have to have certain standards in most activities.

Will I Am Not

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Ok, I have you now, you eat with your eyes closed.

No, joking aside, we have these customs and standards for a reason.

Suggesting that one 'doesn't care' about culinary mores and customs suggests that if someone at your table say, at a wedding or party,picked up their main course in their hands and started gnawing at it wouldn't draw your attention?

Then put the plate up on their head and drained the gravy?

Extreme examples for sure, but to carry your argument to its logical conclusion you wouldn't notice or care?

No I'm afraid we have to have certain standards in most activities.

Yeah. Don't be mental and put plates on your head and other ridiculous things. How someone else holds their fork shouldn't be an issue for any normal person.

threetrees

Deliberate rudeness bothers me more than a lack of etiquette.

TerrorFirmer

I can't believe some people base their opinion or perception of 'good manners' right down to fine details like how someone's holding a fork. I think Everlast75 has the gist of it above for most people - it's just common courtesy and common sense.

I mean, I dislike, say, people who chew with their mouth open and do consider it rude but it's not a red line issue. But someone who doesn't know how to, or doesn't want to say please and thank you, is a very ugly thing.

Another one is people belching. I have a friend who thinks little of letting out a thunderous, dramatic belch after eating a meal in a restaurant. Not a little burp as humans unavoidably do as a basic biological function but something closer to an actual foghorn.

He argues "but it's natural" and genuinely can't see how it's rude at all. I say, well, I could pull down my pants right now and take a big steaming dump on the floor with the same argument but it's not really showing much courtesy to other diners...

So Miles can we take it that dining out with someone who holds their knife and fork like 'a dagger' and attacks their meal in stabbing actions would not register with you at all ?.

That's a bit of an extreme, ridiculous hypothetical situation. I've seen people use their knife and fork in subtle ways too various to mention but never have I seen an adult take that approach.

I think everyone would be a little put out if anyone other than a small child welcomed their meal and proceeded to attack the plate in the feral like stabbing motion you've suggesting.

Your Face

I think there should be etiquette courses done like the safepass courses.

Robsweezie

i think etiquette is important for handling yourself in certain settings eg. gym etiquette, cinema etiquette, at the shops, in queues. As others have said, it's based on the principle that there are other people to consider, and its not all about you.

Im all for the concept of ''give and take''. you pay for my coffee, i get you one next time, and so on. I have known of people who will shy away from the queue when it's time to pay for a round of coffees, either through tightness or whatever.

i dont always expect it but it is nice to get something back now and again, just the thought. Paying it forward, and giving back. Its a nice way to be.

Brendan Bendar

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

I can't believe some people base their opinion or perception of 'good manners' right down to fine details like how someone's holding a fork. I think Everlast75 has the gist of it above for most people - it's just common courtesy and common sense.

I mean, I dislike, say, people who chew with their mouth open and do consider it rude but it's not a red line issue. But someone who doesn't know how to, or doesn't want to say please and thank you, is a very ugly thing.

Another one is people belching. I have a friend who thinks little of letting out a thunderous, dramatic belch after eating a meal in a restaurant. Not a little burp as humans unavoidably do as a basic biological function but something closer to an actual foghorn.

He argues "but it's natural" and genuinely can't see how it's rude at all. I say, well, I could pull down my pants right now and take a big steaming dump on the floor with the same argument but it's not really showing much courtesy to other diners...



That's a bit of an extreme, ridiculous hypothetical situation. I've seen people use their knife and fork in subtle ways too various to mention but never have I seen an adult take that approach.

I think everyone would be a little put out if anyone other than a small child welcomed their meal and proceeded to attack the plate in the feral like stabbing motion you've suggesting.

Well I did suggest it was extreme, but my point was that without any accepted etiquette,where do you stop?

For instance many golf clubs are pilloried for having 'dress codes' but without having these how do you prevent the lad who has the ' non conformist agenda' turning up in a string vest and filthy jeans from teeing it up?

Again extreme cases but anyone who has studied the Irish psyche will agree that whatever Paddy thinks he/she can get away with they will try, and there will always be someone who pushes everything to the limit.

That's why it's important to have etiquette and respect and while some might laugh and try to belittle those who support this concept, these things are there for a reason.

Rakish Paddy

A basic grasp of table manners is essential. Anyone who chews with their mouth open, talks with their mouth full, or makes any kind of slurping-type noises belongs in a farmyard and not at a dinner table.

Fart

Toots wrote: »

Hold your knife and fork in the correct hand and for the love of God, don't chew with your mouth open and we should get along just fine.

Why does your avatar have his knob out?

Mister Vain

People who are rude to deli workers. They're the worst.