Pedigree Sheep

Sheep101

Hi I am thinking about starting to breed pedigree sheep. What are the essentials I need to know when caring for them. I have commercial sheep so I am not a total beginner. Any tips/advice on vaccinations etc would be appreciated

Cran

Sheep101 wrote: »

Hi I am thinking about starting to breed pedigree sheep. What are the essentials I need to know when caring for them. I have commercial sheep so I am not a total beginner. Any tips/advice on vaccinations etc would be appreciated

Just the same really no difference in terms of health plan. Feeding etc will depend on breed.

Buy the best foundation sheep you can and base the purchases on your own eye rather than judges or prices. When you want a ram buy the ram, can't go ram shopping based on prices you need to buy the ram you want.
Besides that enjoy

Sheep101

Thanks Cran. I'm going to look at a pedigree pet ram lamb his sire is 5star. I was thinking of hand raring him as he would be a cheap ram to get me started. I am already hand raring lambs from our commercial flock. Maybe its a stupid idea but if all came to all and he wasn't tupping well I could sell him and wouldn't be out of pocket too much. I know its a risk. But would there be a certain vitamin etc to give him. I want to make sure he is getting everything he needs. The breed is texel if that helps.

Cran

Sheep101 wrote: »

Thanks Cran. I'm going to look at a pedigree pet ram lamb his sire is 5star. I was thinking of hand raring him as he would be a cheap ram to get me started. I am already hand raring lambs from our commercial flock. Maybe its a stupid idea but if all came to all and he wasn't tupping well I could sell him and wouldn't be out of pocket too much. I know its a risk. But would there be a certain vitamin etc to give him. I want to make sure he is getting everything he needs. The breed is texel if that helps.

About 50% of male lambs born here make it to be sold as breeding rams, and small proportion of that again for pedigree breeding. Pet lambs imo is no way into pedigree breeding, and pedigree pet lamb worth no more than commercial pet lamb really. But as you said nothing to lose once not paying more than commercial pet lamb cost for the lamb.

I have actually reared two pets that ended up as stock Rams in pedigree flocks last few years, but coincidence I think tbh

rangler1

Sheep101 wrote: »

Thanks Cran. I'm going to look at a pedigree pet ram lamb his sire is 5star. I was thinking of hand raring him as he would be a cheap ram to get me started. I am already hand raring lambs from our commercial flock. Maybe its a stupid idea but if all came to all and he wasn't tupping well I could sell him and wouldn't be out of pocket too much. I know its a risk. But would there be a certain vitamin etc to give him. I want to make sure he is getting everything he needs. The breed is texel if that helps.

As Cran said, you should really be buying the best sheep if you're pedigree breeding, but he wouldn't be the first pet that grew into a champion, I had a few myself when I was pedigree breeding.
Make sure he's out of a 4 or 5 star ewe as well, there's no guarantee he'll be good enough for pedigree breeding even with that but as you say you've a commercial flock you can use him on.
If you're good at rearing lambs he should grow as well as one reared on a ewe, give them good quality lamb creep and grass when weaned and they should be fine.
A noted Texel breeder said at a meeting one night that breeding pedigree texels is not for the fainthearted and he'd have a vet from the family at the lambing

Siamsa Sessions

Sheep101 wrote: »

Hi I am thinking about starting to breed pedigree sheep. What are the essentials I need to know when caring for them. I have commercial sheep so I am not a total beginner. Any tips/advice on vaccinations etc would be appreciated

Thinking along the same lines myself. Here's a thread I've read through before: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057467377

Lots of opinions

connolly18

are pedigree texel ewes alot of work as in need alot of feed and stuff

ganmo

connolly18 wrote: »

are pedigree texel ewes alot of work as in need alot of feed and stuff

Big head, small hips

MD1983

Sorry to resurrect this thread but my queries are related.

I am considering a pedigree flock in a small way, more a hobby. I have good facilities, well fenced farm etc and keep store lambs over the winter. I dont have any ewes at this stage.

I am trying to determine the most favourable breed to keep, important factors for me would be:

1. a breed where ewes are easily lambed as i have an off farm full time job and cant be here all day long and have small experience lambing

2. A breed with some demand so i could sell the offspring

3. i am not fussy on whether it is a lowland or mountain breed, farm is lowland BTW in kildare, i would be planning on keeping the flock outdoors year round but could bring the ewe and lamb in if required

4. I can buy good stock for the foundation of the flock (i.e. while I am not looking to spend a lot I dont have to penny pinch either)

5. I would like to get started this year but realise its maybe getting late in the year for starting

Those things are foremost in my mind but I am sure there are somethings that are obvious to people with experience that may mean the above is not workable

thanks in advance lads

rangler1

MD1983 wrote: »

Sorry to resurrect this thread but my queries are related.

I am considering a pedigree flock in a small way, more a hobby. I have good facilities, well fenced farm etc and keep store lambs over the winter. I dont have any ewes at this stage.

I am trying to determine the most favourable breed to keep, important factors for me would be:

1. a breed where ewes are easily lambed as i have an off farm full time job and cant be here all day long and have small experience lambing

2. A breed with some demand so i could sell the offspring

3. i am not fussy on whether it is a lowland or mountain breed, farm is lowland BTW in kildare, i would be planning on keeping the flock outdoors year round but could bring the ewe and lamb in if required

4. I can buy good stock for the foundation of the flock (i.e. while I am not looking to spend a lot I dont have to penny pinch either)

5. I would like to get started this year but realise its maybe getting late in the year for starting

Those things are foremost in my mind but I am sure there are somethings that are obvious to people with experience that may mean the above is not workable

thanks in advance lads

Don't underestimate the work in breeding pedigree sheep, I can give two quotes, one is my own ''we have 500 crossbred ewes and 50 pedigree here and I'd far rather lamb the 500 than lamb the 50'' The other was texel breeder micheal Mc Hugh at a meeting ''lambing texel sheep is not for the faint hearted and my sons a vet and he's home for the week of the lambing''
As long as you're aware of that, the most popular breed is Charollais so if you want them easy sold I suppose they're the best.
You WILL be putting them in for the winter....waste of time otherwise and you WILL be feeding them well; I saw very well bred rams in the Charolais premier sale, but they weren't stuffed and they didn't go well at all in the sales so any farmer that critcises breeders for feeding well is talking male bovine excrement

ganmo

Low labour pedigree sheep is an oxy moron

In Kildare the only mountain pedigree breed that is in demand is cheviot and that's a closed shop pedigree breeder wise.

Cran

MD1983 wrote: »

Sorry to resurrect this thread but my queries are related.

I am considering a pedigree flock in a small way, more a hobby. I have good facilities, well fenced farm etc and keep store lambs over the winter. I dont have any ewes at this stage.

I am trying to determine the most favourable breed to keep, important factors for me would be:

1. a breed where ewes are easily lambed as i have an off farm full time job and cant be here all day long and have small experience lambing

2. A breed with some demand so i could sell the offspring

3. i am not fussy on whether it is a lowland or mountain breed, farm is lowland BTW in kildare, i would be planning on keeping the flock outdoors year round but could bring the ewe and lamb in if required

4. I can buy good stock for the foundation of the flock (i.e. while I am not looking to spend a lot I dont have to penny pinch either)

5. I would like to get started this year but realise its maybe getting late in the year for starting

Those things are foremost in my mind but I am sure there are somethings that are obvious to people with experience that may mean the above is not workable

thanks in advance lads

Number 1 would knock most breeds of the lost tbh. Even with repeats here & I m back at work have someone checking the pedigrees regularly. As Rangler said similar here as much work lambing 60 pedigrees as other 700 commercials

kk.man

You would need to sleep with them at lambing time and you would still need eyes in the back of your head. Best of luck.

MayoAreMagic

One option for pure bred animals that are easily lambed and live outdoors all year would be a gang of purebred lanark ewes. They are a good looking animal also, and if you bred a real good one, the prices can be massive.

adam14

Champion texel ram made 17000 in Blessington today !

Green farmer

adam14 wrote: »

Champion texel ram made 17000 in Blessington today !

That's Some money

Lambman

Yea €17000 he's a neighbour off mines has great texels for years starting a pedigree Suffolk flock last 2 years as well as a few purebred limousines...

MD1983

rangler1 wrote: »

Don't underestimate the work in breeding pedigree sheep, I can give two quotes, one is my own ''we have 500 crossbred ewes and 50 pedigree here and I'd far rather lamb the 500 than lamb the 50'' The other was texel breeder micheal Mc Hugh at a meeting ''lambing texel sheep is not for the faint hearted and my sons a vet and he's home for the week of the lambing''
As long as you're aware of that, the most popular breed is Charollais so if you want them easy sold I suppose they're the best.
You WILL be putting them in for the winter....waste of time otherwise and you WILL be feeding them well; I saw very well bred rams in the Charolais premier sale, but they weren't stuffed and they didn't go well at all in the sales so any farmer that critcises breeders for feeding well is talking male bovine excrement

@ rangler - appreciate the response. forgive my ignorance, why would they have to be in the shed at winter, i have 500 lambs outside all winter and dont lose any to the weather AFAIK. are the pedigree sheep not as hardy or is it more that they lose condition? i see commercial flocks around me being lambed outdoors too.

the feeding is not an issue i can manage that

MD1983

ganmo wrote: »

Low labour pedigree sheep is an oxy moron

In Kildare the only mountain pedigree breed that is in demand is cheviot and that's a closed shop pedigree breeder wise.

@ganmo - why is that? if i went along to the sales and bought a ram and a few ewes would i not be started or what am i missing? i have no familiarity with breed societies so again forgive the ignorance

rangler1

MD1983 wrote: »

@ rangler - appreciate the response. forgive my ignorance, why would they have to be in the shed at winter, i have 500 lambs outside all winter and dont lose any to the weather AFAIK. are the pedigree sheep not as hardy or is it more that they lose condition? i see commercial flocks around me being lambed outdoors too.

the feeding is not an issue i can manage that

If you have lambs born in January and you want them good enough to sell in August for breeding you will need to push them on,So you need them very well fed.
Lambing outdoors would be a night mare
Pedigree sheep just do not have the Hybrid vigour of crossbreds,
If they're a terminal breed bad weather will effect their milk supply and the lambs themselves won't handle bad weather well because they are purebred.
Even from the land aspect unless you own a ranch, you can't graze your land through the winter and expect grass in march for your real sheep.
Maybe if you breed a pedigree hill sheep breed you might be alright or have a few pedigrees on a farm that's extensively farmed.
Like everything I put up here, this is just my experience, Cran isn't many years breeding and he has the same conclusions

ganmo

MD1983 wrote: »

@ganmo - why is that? if i went along to the sales and bought a ram and a few ewes would i not be started or what am i missing? i have no familiarity with breed societies so again forgive the ignorance

I'm not too well up on it either, yes you can buy a pedigree sheep, but unless you meet the societies rules their lambs won't be pedigree.
And afaik Wicklow cheviot breeders have to be invited into the society, with the last one been brought in almost 10 years ago

Sheep breeder

ganmo wrote: »

I'm not too well up on it either, yes you can buy a pedigree sheep, but unless you meet the societies rules their lambs won't be pedigree.
And afaik Wicklow cheviot breeders have to be invited into the society, with the last one been brought in almost 10 years ago

Wicklow cheviot is a closed shop of 30 odd breeders and no new blood lines in and the last 10 years or so and when the couple of new breeders come in they went mad buying from them and only buying their own blood lines back and at this stage have to be inbred in such a closed gene pool.

ganmo

When it works it's called line breeding
Every now and then I hear rumours of the society headin over to England to bring over some new blood.

My biggest gripes with the breeders and society is the fact that none of them are involved with sheep Ireland

razor8

some interesting info on here for any pedigree breeders viewing on here of the ram compare project in the UK

http://www.signetfbc.co.uk/ramcompare/results/