eir WiFi surprise

cantalach

I got an email from you this morning to tell me about 'eir WiFi', as I imagine many others did. This appears to be a new facility whereby every eir customer's router becomes accessible to other eir customers who happen to be within Wi-Fi range.

I was extremely surprised to read in the email that this facility works on an op-out basis and that if I didn't want to participate, I had to sign in to My Eir, go into the Host WiFi page and disable the sharing there.

You basically took the liberty of sharing my broadband connection - in my home! - with randommers on the street without any heads-up or advance opportunity to opt-out. I think this is completely unacceptable.

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the VLAN to which randommers connect is completely isolated from the home network (though there probably isn't a router out there that doesn't have some vulnerabilities that can be exploited) but there are more issues than just the potential compromising of home network security.

If some randommer parks outside my house and illegally downloads movies and music over my broadband connection, will my router's external IP not be shown as the source IP for these downloads? What about cases where the content downloaded is itself highly illegal, e.g. child pornography? Would this possibility alone not constitute a very convenient alibi for somebody who wants to download illegal material from their home ("it wasn't me, judge, it was a guy parked outside my house.")? 

A further concern is around the impact on our bandwidth. We live very close to two sports grounds and often have large crowds on the street outside our house around match time. What happens to our bandwidth during this time? Is the bandwidth available to randommers throttled in some way? There will be lots of people in similar situations to us. Imagine the amount of bandwidth that's going to be taken from homes next to a busy school, or homes with a bus stop outside, etc., etc.

eir: Leanne

cantalach wrote: »

I got an email from you this morning to tell me about 'eir WiFi', as I imagine many others did. This appears to be a new facility whereby every eir customer's router becomes accessible to other eir customers who happen to be within Wi-Fi range.

I was extremely surprised to read in the email that this facility works on an op-out basis and that if I didn't want to participate, I had to sign in to My Eir, go into the Host WiFi page and disable the sharing there.

You basically took the liberty of sharing my broadband connection - in my home! - with randommers on the street without any heads-up or advance opportunity to opt-out. I think this is completely unacceptable.

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the VLAN to which randommers connect is completely isolated from the home network (though there probably isn't a router out there that doesn't have some vulnerabilities that can be exploited) but there are more issues than just the potential compromising of home network security.

If some randommer parks outside my house and illegally downloads movies and music over my broadband connection, will my router's external IP not be shown as the source IP for these downloads? What about cases where the content downloaded is itself highly illegal, e.g. child pornography? Would this possibility alone not constitute a very convenient alibi for somebody who wants to download illegal material from their home ("it wasn't me, judge, it was a guy parked outside my house.")? 

A further concern is around the impact on our bandwidth. We live very close to two sports grounds and often have large crowds on the street outside our house around match time. What happens to our bandwidth during this time? Is the bandwidth available to randommers throttled in some way? There will be lots of people in similar situations to us. Imagine the amount of bandwidth that's going to be taken from homes next to a busy school, or homes with a bus stop outside, etc., etc.

Hi cantalach,
 
Thank you for getting in touch with us today.
 
I understand your frustration and I am very sorry to hear that you feel this way.
 
If anyone try's to connect to your broadband router they have not logged into your guest WiFi they are logged into the eir host network. eir WiFi is completely self-service. You can manage (create/update/delete) your eir WiFi Guest and Host accounts via My eir portal. You can also choose to opt out of being a Host for this service at any time. You will be able to do this on My eir portal, APP or you may call into our customer care centre on freephone 1901 and ask to be opted out. Customer care agents can also help answer My eir portal queries. Please click on the following link https://www.eir.ie/eirwifi/ to see more information on eir WiFi.
 
 
I will also pass this feedback onto our technical team and I do apologise for any inconvenience. 
 
Thanks, 

Leanne. 

The eir_WiFI SSID is isolated from the main network so other users won't have access to your network (barring, as you say, any security issues). It's restricted to 3Mb of bandwidth.

cantalach

Thanks, Leanne and Karsini.

Karsini's answer has addressed at least one of my concerns, i.e. the amount of bandwidth used is limited. But I'd still make two points regarding this borrowed bandwidth. Firstly, this 3Mbps limit should be called out prominently in the email sent out and in the part of My eir where hosting is enabled/disabled. Secondly, on a point of principle, even if the limit is only 256kbps, this should not be shared without explicit opt in by the customer.

My other concern - the bigger of the two really - has not been addressed. What external IP will eir WiFi users appear to have to the wider Internet?If it's mine, that's not good.

eir: Anna

You will need to give the details you have set up on your guest WiFi for someone to connect to it. This will the be remembered on the device the guest has connected with.

It would be the same external IP address, however, if you do not wish to have this setting you can Opt out at any time.

Thanks,
Anna.

davo2001

eir: Anna wrote: »

You will need to give the details you have set up on your guest WiFi for someone to connect to it.
Anna.

He's not talking about Guest wifi, please read the OP correctly!

cantalach

As davo2001 has said, Anna, you haven't read my post correctly. I'm not talking about the normal guest Wi-Fi on my router. I'm talking about the "unknown guest Wi-Fi" that eir enabled without my knowledge.
And just to reiterate, I am fully aware that I can disable it. I did so within half an hour of receiving the email. My point is that I shouldn't have had to do this. This should be an opt in service - not an opt out.

jd

cantalach wrote: »

My other concern - the bigger of the two really - has not been addressed. What external IP will eir WiFi users appear to have to the wider Internet?If it's mine, that's not good.

It's not same IP - I checked  access on a web site I have.

jca

I'm not an eir customer but I'm sure any other eir customer using someone elses free WiFi has to enter their account number or some kind of identifying details. I don't think it's a free for all. I just noticed there's an eir free WiFi nearby but it's asking for my identity.

cantalach

jca wrote: »

I'm not an eir customer but I'm sure any other eir customer using someone elses free WiFi has to enter their account number or some kind of identifying details. I don't think it's a free for all.

Yes, the facility is only available to other eir customers, bit there are hundreds of thousands of them. So it may as well be a free-for-all.

cantalach

jd wrote: »

It's not same IP - I checked  access on a web site I have.

That's good to know.

jca

cantalach wrote: »

Yes, the facility is only available to other eir customers, bit there are hundreds of thousands of them. So it may as well be a free-for-all.

Maybe so but anyone using the system needs to log on to the free network using their unique code/number etc.

cantalach

jca wrote: »

Maybe so but anyone using the system needs to log on to the free network using their unique code/number etc.

Yes but only once to access all eir WiFi routers. It's not as though people have to sign in to each and every router they connect to. It's automatic.

jca

cantalach wrote: »

jca wrote: »

Maybe so but anyone using the system needs to log on to the free network using their unique code/number etc.

Yes but only once to access all eir WiFi routers. It's not as though people have to sign in to each and every router they connect to. It's automatic.

I didn't know that, I wouldn't be a fan of that tbh. I'm with VM and I got them to disable the free wifi on my hub too.

ScouseMouse

I have this facility with Virgin Media.  I think its a great idea.  When I am in my local pub and the wifi is overloaded, I can get online from the apartments next door.

Its a seperate channel, does not effect the hosts connection and is free for all eir users.  I think opting out is short sighted.

jca

ScouseMouse wrote: »

I have this facility with Virgin Media.  I think its a great idea.  When I am in my local pub and the wifi is overloaded, I can get online from the apartments next door.

Its a seperate channel, does not effect the hosts connection and is free for all eir users.  I think opting out is short sighted.

I'm using a different router so to get the VM hub into modem mode I needed to get the free wifi disabled.

GhostyMcGhost

Also worth a mention that it's polluting the airwaves by broadcasting a new network

jca

GhostyMcGhost wrote: »

Also worth a mention that it's polluting the airwaves by broadcasting a new network

Ahh will ya stop with that aul nonsense...

thegills

So I'm the only guy on my street with eir Broadband and now every random person is going to park outside my house availing of my hosted WiFi?

jca

thegills wrote: »

So I'm the only guy on my street with eir Broadband and now every random person is going to park outside my house availing of my hosted WiFi?

Yay!! Where do you live? Is it a good connection...

More Music

If you are an eir customer you just sign up once. You then have access to over 100,000 private WiFi access points around the country.

You don't need to know the persons WiFi access key to use it.

You can use up to 3MB down/1MB up of that persons home broadband connection without them ever knowing.  It's enabled on all eir routers by default. You need to notify eir to opt out. This cannot be done from the router by the home user. 

AFAIK the 3MB download is the maximum shared.  So if it's 1 user or 5 users, they are sharing the 3MB download.

Not sure if it's a good thing or not.

god's toy

More Music wrote: »

If you are an eir customer you just sign up once. You then have access to over 100,000 private WiFi access points around the country.

You don't need to know the persons WiFi access key to use it.

You can use up to 3MB down/1MB up of that persons home broadband connection without them ever knowing.  It's enabled on all eir routers by default. You need to notify eir to opt out. This cannot be done from the router by the home user. 

AFAIK the 3MB download is the maximum shared.  So if it's 1 user or 5 users, they are sharing the 3MB download.

Not sure if it's a good thing or not.

You can log into 'Myeir' and op out from there. 

uck51js9zml2yt

Why was this an opt out rather than opt in?
Some people wouldn't be aware of the implications or technically able to edit the option .

Why was it done before customers were informed?

I've reported this to comreg as an issue.

GhostyMcGhost

jca wrote: »

Ahh will ya stop with that aul nonsense...

It's not nonsense. It's another broadcast nobody asked for clogging up channels

eir: Anna

cantalach wrote: »

As davo2001 has said, Anna, you haven't read my post correctly. I'm not talking about the normal guest Wi-Fi on my router. I'm talking about the "unknown guest Wi-Fi" that eir enabled without my knowledge.
And just to reiterate, I am fully aware that I can disable it. I did so within half an hour of receiving the email. My point is that I shouldn't have had to do this. This should be an opt in service - not an opt out.

I do apologise and I have forwarded this feedback on to the relevant department.

In relation to the guest WiFi, for our customers safety, it is known from which user any usage is coming from.

If someone was to use your WiFi connection for anything illegal, we can see that this is not your private connection and you would not be affected by someone using the guest option.

Thanks,
Anna.

Red Alert

I've my modem set into Bridge mode (F2000).  Will this stop the network being created?

davo2001

Red Alert wrote: »

I've my modem set into Bridge mode (F2000).  Will this stop the network being created?

It should, bridge mode means it's not functioning as a router in the first place.

_Kaiser_

Just logged into My eir now and yes there's an option on the left to Disable it..




Click this link and disable on the next page





COMPLETELY agree however that this should be Opt-IN, not enabled by default!

oscarBravo

GhostyMcGhost wrote: »

jca wrote: »

Ahh will ya stop with that aul nonsense...

It's not nonsense. It's another broadcast nobody asked for clogging up channels

It's not "clogging up channels". Multiple SSIDs on the same radio all use the same channel.

cantalach

Braylon Inexpensive Manicurist wrote: »

Why was this an opt out rather than opt in?
Some people wouldn't be aware of the implications or technically able to edit the option .

Why was it done before customers were informed?

I've reported this to comreg as an issue.

Thanks. When I first kicked off this thread, I wasn't sure of my facts. I thought they can't possibly just enable this feature on my router with at least informing me in advance and giving me the opportunity to opt out before the service is launched. Seems that they have, and I agree that this is a comreg matter.

eir: Anna

I do apologise for any inconvenience caused to you cantalach.


-Anna