Explosion at Dortmund hotel when team bus was leaving

CoolHandBandit

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Fecking Schalke fans and their firecrakers...

Mentally ill firecrackers you mean surely.

jmayo

Armchair Andy wrote: »

Monaco supporters chanting Dortmund in the Westfallenstadion.

Actually this has endeared them to the locals so much so they were offering them places to stay.

elefant wrote: »

I was wondering about this...

How do these Monaco fans not have places to stay already? What were they planning to do if the game had gone ahead?

Because they were going home after the match.

Shenshen wrote: »

12 according to google. But from what's reported in Germany, many of the fans are not from Monaco itself but from France.

If AS Monaco FC were to rely on fans from Monaco itself there would be about 20 people and a few dogs at the home matches.
As it is they have quiet a small stadium holding only about 18,000.
Hell the team train in La Turbie in France.

The population is only 38,000 odd with only about 20% being actual natives.

The reason they have been so successful is they can offer big wages because of their tax free status.

That has been pi**ing off the other Ligue 1 teams because they have to pay twice as much just to match them.
And they are 2/3rds owned by Russian billionaire Dmitry Rybolovlev.
The Grimaldis own the other 1/3.

BTW the Monaco national team isn't member of FIFA or UEFA and are ranked 216th in the world.

jmayo

elefant wrote: »

That makes sense.

I can't imagine too many residents of Monaco kipping on random football fans' couches :pac:

What about Richard Dunne ?

ChikiChiki

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

Mentally ill firecrackers you mean surely.

Mentally ill Schalke fans throwing firecrackers is what I meant

A Little Pony

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Just reading back over the last couple of pages: are peopel seriously blaming the police here? Or is it just some low-level shoe-horning of an agenda?

Bombs go off, attacks happen (terrorist and otherwise) and suddenly it's the police's fault?

Or should I have gone a couple more pages back?

Seems its happening all the time now in Germany and across Europe. What is the reason for that? Why are terrorist attacks suddenly happening all over Europe from France to Germany to Sweden?

ricero

Merkel must feel like such a fool now. Her open boarder policy has brought a cancer to europe. Hope shes slaughtered in the german elections

Shenshen

A Little Pony wrote: »

Seems its happening all the time now in Germany and across Europe. What is the reason for that? Why are terrorist attacks suddenly happening all over Europe from France to Germany to Sweden?

I've lived in Europe over 40 years now, and I'm not sure what you mean by "suddenly"? I can't recall a time without some terrorist threats and attacks happening somewhere a few times a year?
The only new thing on the scene is Islamism as a reason being given.

Shenshen

ricero wrote: »

Merkel must feel like such a fool now. Her open boarder policy has brought a cancer to europe. Hope shes slaughtered in the german elections

I hear that a lot - you do realise that she's a conservative politician, and a defeat of the CDU in the elections will nearly inevitably mean a left-wing coalition will come into power? Most of those parties are condemning her not for opening the borders but for closing them again.

Red Kev

Shenshen wrote: »

I hear that a lot - you do realise that she's a conservative politician, and a defeat of the CDU in the elections will nearly inevitably mean a left-wing coalition will come into power? Most of those parties are condemning her not for opening the borders but for closing them again.

She's in a coalition with the Social Democrats which is the traditional left wing party in Germany. It's been like that since 2013. Most people seem to forget that.

The open borders policy was her idea and she pushed it through despite opposition on all sides.

Shenshen

Red Kev wrote: »

She's in a coalition with the Social Democrats which is the traditional left wing party in Germany. It's been like that since 2013. Most people seem to forget that.

The open borders policy was her idea and she pushed it through despite opposition on all sides.

According to the SPD's website, their policy on refugees is to find legal and safe ways for refugees, work on resolving the causes but first and foremost to help the countries and communes in accommodating and integrating asylum seekers and refugees.

Not exactly opposition as far as I can see....

Biggest lickspittle on boardz

An 'Islamist suspect' has been arrested by police investigating the bombing:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39580594

I'll be my left nut this was yet another 'known to authorities' type.

Danzy

There are so many that are known to authorities that they have no chance of even monitoring a fraction of them.

The inevitable question is why weren't they monitored, the authorities are refusing to be honest and that is for political and ideological reasons, it would take hundreds of thousands of staff to monitor them full time, that was for France and Germany is more tolerant of violent extremists.

A Little Pony

Shouldn't have opened the door to them then. I don't feel that sorry for them because it was such a stupid political decision. I don't know what planet Merkel was living on.

CoolHandBandit

Only the beginning I'm afraid. Thousands of radicals according to European security forces are already here. Bleak future.

Depp

Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »

An 'Islamist suspect' has been arrested by police investigating the bombing:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39580594

I'll be my left nut this was yet another 'known to authorities' type.

Wouldn't be surprised if the supposed antifa link proved to be true either at this stage, antifa in germany are a far cry from the revolutionary larpers we see elsewhere.

CoolHandBandit

A Little Pony wrote: »

Shouldn't have opened the door to them then. I don't feel that sorry for them because it was such a stupid political decision. I don't know what planet Merkel was living on.

Planet PC.

Widdershins

Depp wrote: »

Wouldn't be surprised if the supposed antifa link proved to be true either at this stage, antifa in germany are a far cry from the revolutionary larpers we see elsewhere.

What's a larper? Is it like cosplay?

Collie D

A Little Pony wrote: »

Shouldn't have opened the door to them then. I don't feel that sorry for them because it was such a stupid political decision. I don't know what planet Merkel was living on.

You don't feel sorry for victims of terror because a politician made a decision you disagree with?

A Little Pony

Collie D wrote: »

A Little Pony wrote: »

Shouldn't have opened the door to them then. I don't feel that sorry for them because it was such a stupid political decision. I don't know what planet Merkel was living on.

You don't feel sorry for victims of terror because a politician made a decision you disagree with?

The authorities I don't feel sorry for, no. The families, yes but even the families know the government has forced this upon them by inviting in a barbaric culture which doesn't conform to Western values.

Depp

Widdershins wrote: »

What's a larper? Is it like cosplay?

that kindve idea alright. Live action role play which is what most antifa groups are at at the minute...german crowd seem to take it a bit further though

Collie D

A Little Pony wrote: »

The authorities I don't feel sorry for, no. The families, yes but even the families know the government has forced this upon them by inviting in a barbaric culture which doesn't conform to Western values.

And genuine refugees?

Zubeneschamali

A Little Pony wrote: »

even the families know the government has forced this upon them by inviting in a barbaric culture which doesn't conform to Western values.

What, cannibals or something?

A Little Pony

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

A Little Pony wrote: »

even the families know the government has forced this upon them by inviting in a barbaric culture which doesn't conform to Western values.

What, cannibals or something?

Think that post sums up the problem facing Europe. Staring you in the face.

RockSalto

Islamic suspect arrested.

Danzy

Depp wrote: »

that kindve idea alright. Live action role play which is what most antifa groups are at at the minute...german crowd seem to take it a bit further though

They also tend to be from well to do families or living in Squats.

So their relation to and understanding of the day to day life and struggles of the Working Class, tends to be next to Zero.

Activism as a lifestyle, a way to belong and have a purpose rather than anything to do with society.

The sort of tossers that have finished the left as a coherent force across much of Western Europe.

Luggnuts

A Little Pony wrote: »

The authorities I don't feel sorry for, no. The families, yes but even the families know the government has forced this upon them by inviting in a barbaric culture which doesn't conform to Western values.

I hear this phrase quite a bit and it always confuses me. Could you elaborate a bit on what you mean by barbaric culture and what exactly does it mean to "conform" to "Western values"?

Depp

Danzy wrote: »

They also tend to be from well to do families or living in Squats.

So their relation to and understanding of the day to day life and struggles of the Working Class, tends to be next to Zero.

Activism as a lifestyle, a way to belong and have a purpose rather than anything to do with society.

The sort of tossers that have finished the left as a coherent force across much of Western Europe.

Theyre just looneys that read marx and liked the sound of getting everything for free...cant stand how they parade the hammer and sickle either its disgusting to see...

Depp

Luggnuts wrote: »

I hear this phrase quite a bit and it always confuses me. Could you elaborate a bit on what you mean by barbaric culture and what exactly does it mean to "conform" to "Western values"?

Not stone gays or apostates is the big one for most people...but there are plenty more if you care to do a bit of research

Widdershins

Luggnuts wrote: »

I hear this phrase quite a bit and it always confuses me. Could you elaborate a bit on what you mean by barbaric culture and what exactly does it mean to "conform" to "Western values"?

Western values are reflected in Western law which tends to be similar throughout the West-rights for gay people, the disabled and women being a major aspect that is treated differently under the law in some ME countries, and the influence of religion on the law is a huge influence on the overall culture of any society.

This is not hard t find out about, as there are numerous ME campaigners highlighting the inequity and cruelty of some aspects of the cultures and laws of their home countries.

Luggnuts

Depp wrote: »

Not stone gays or apostates is the big one for most people...but there are plenty more if you care to do a bit of research

When was the last time a gay or apostate was stoned in the West by anybody? Aren't you exaggerating just a little bit. I don't need to research something that it seems you're making up. So tell me once again what do Muslims or anybody who lives in European countries do that doesn't in your opinion conform to Western values?
What are Western values?

Widdershins

Luggnuts wrote: »

When was the last time a gay or apostate was stoned in the West by anybody? Aren't you exaggerating just a little bit. I don't need to research something that it seems you're making up. So tell me once again what do Muslims or anybody who lives in European countries do that doesn't in your opinion conform to Western values?
What are Western values?

I think what was said was ''coming from a barbaric culture'' not ''will continue the barbaric practices here'', since the law doesn't allow it here. The issues tend to be around integration because of the difference in outlook of people from different cultures. There are documentaries about this. Plenty of people integrate absolutely brilliantly, but some do not.

ThisRegard

ricero wrote: »

Merkel must feel like such a fool now. Her open boarder policy has brought a cancer to europe. Hope shes slaughtered in the german elections

Open boarder is what we saw last night with random fans, from across the border, kipping on strangers couches. It's to be applauded.

Il Fascista

Luggnuts wrote: »

I hear this phrase quite a bit and it always confuses me. Could you elaborate a bit on what you mean by barbaric culture and what exactly does it mean to "conform" to "Western values"?

Honor killings deserve a mention. This story will always stick out to me when I think of the horrors of Islam
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/unclean-syrian-woman-who-escaped-to-germany-after-gang-rape-found-stabbed-to-death-in-suspected-a6685011.html

Depp

Luggnuts wrote: »

When was the last time a gay or apostate was stoned in the West by anybody? Aren't you exaggerating just a little bit. I don't need to research something that it seems you're making up. So tell me once again what do Muslims or anybody who lives in European countries do that doesn't in your opinion conform to Western values?
What are Western values?

Look it up, its happened, orlando shooting is a good example of it on a large scale...if you refuse to believe in the killings how do you feel about forced marriages up and down the uk and the difficulties they leave women with when they want to leave?

Widdershins

ThisRegard wrote: »

Open boarder is what we saw last night with random fans, from across the border, kipping on strangers couches. It's to be applauded.

Putting people up for a night after a bomb scare is nothing to do with open borders.

ceadaoin.

Luggnuts wrote: »

When was the last time a gay or apostate was stoned in the West by anybody? Aren't you exaggerating just a little bit. I don't need to research something that it seems you're making up.

Well there's this which happened last year in Germany


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12104304/Transgender-women-attacked-in-the-street-by-north-African-teenagers-in-Germany.html

There's also been some cases of women being stoned to death in Europe in the past decade and many more honour killings committed in other ways. I'd say they aren't part of western values wouldn't you?

C Montgomery Gurns II

Has there been any theories put out as to why ISIS media release's are nearly a thing of the past? Every few weeks it used to be slickly edited videos (some of dubious content as to whether the horrific acts alluded to had actually been committed) but in the last while there have barely been any. They even either take ages to claim their inspiring role in an attack or in some cases aren't even bothering (I don't think they claimed Stockholm yet). Is it that their media/ editing team have been killed?

Little CuChulainn

C Montgomery Gurns II wrote: »

Has there been any theories put out as to why ISIS media release's are nearly a thing of the past? Every few weeks it used to be slickly edited videos (some of dubious content as to whether the horrific acts alluded to had actually been committed) but in the last while there have barely been any. They even either take ages to claim their inspiring role in an attack or in some cases aren't even bothering (I don't think they claimed Stockholm yet). Is it that their media/ editing team have been killed?

Wasn't their main media guy killed? The English fella who was involved in the beheading videos.

ThisRegard

Widdershins wrote: »

Putting people up for a night after a bomb scare is nothing to do with open borders.

I never said anything about open borders

Luggnuts

Widdershins wrote: »

I think what was said was ''coming from a barbaric culture'' not ''will continue the barbaric practices here'', since the law doesn't allow it here. The issues tend to be around integration because of the difference in outlook of people from different cultures. There are documentaries about this. Plenty of people integrate absolutely brilliantly, but some do not.

Again, what do you mean by integrate? I can't for the life of me get anybody to give a rational definition for what this means. It seems like it's a phrase that is thrown out there but has no discernible meaning.
If a family moves to say, Ireland, from Vietnam what must they do to "integrate" and what carry-on would you say would characterise them as not "integrating"?

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

A Little Pony wrote: »

Shouldn't have opened the door to them then. I don't feel that sorry for them because it was such a stupid political decision. I don't know what planet Merkel was living on.

That's such an ignorant post to make, you don't have any compassion for the German people because of a decision their leader made? Then you elaborate and say the "authorities" who the fook is that then? It's an odd stance to take.

Luggnuts

Il Fascista wrote: »

Honor killings deserve a mention. This story will always stick out to me when I think of the horrors of Islam
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/unclean-syrian-woman-who-escaped-to-germany-after-gang-rape-found-stabbed-to-death-in-suspected-a6685011.html

Plenty oh honour killings and acid attacks and rapes occur all the time in India. Do they make you think about the "horrors" of hinduism ans sikhism?

Widdershins

Luggnuts wrote: »

Again, what do you mean by integrate? I can't for the life of me get anybody to give a rational definition for what this means. It seems like it's a phrase that is thrown out there but has no discernible meaning.
If a family moves to say, Ireland, from Vietnam what must they do to "integrate" and what carry-on would you say would characterise them as not "integrating"?

I'm sorry but are you going to continue changing the subject every time someone answers your question? You wanted ''barbaric culture'' explained a moment ago, and you wanted examples of how it can carry over to a new life in the West, and now you want ''integration'' defined, too. Obviously, it implies living in a manner consistent with the laws and culture of the new country, so the opposite of what was explained in response to your last comment.

Luggnuts

Depp wrote: »

Look it up, its happened, orlando shooting is a good example of it on a large scale...if you refuse to believe in the killings how do you feel about forced marriages up and down the uk and the difficulties they leave women with when they want to leave?

Forced/arranged marriages are predominantly a hindu/sikh phenomenon.

Widdershins

ThisRegard wrote: »

Open boarder is what we saw last night with random fans, from across the border, kipping on strangers couches. It's to be applauded.

ThisRegard wrote: »

I never said anything about open borders

??? What's an open boarder as you spoke of in those comments, then?

ceadaoin.

Luggnuts wrote: »

Again, what do you mean by integrate? I can't for the life of me get anybody to give a rational definition for what this means. It seems like it's a phrase that is thrown out there but has no discernible meaning.
If a family moves to say, Ireland, from Vietnam what must they do to "integrate" and what carry-on would you say would characterise them as not "integrating"?

Really? No one has ever given a rational definition of "integration"? I really find that hard to believe. You could use a dictionary

bring (people or groups with particular characteristics or needs) into equal participation in or membership of a social group or institution.
"integrating children with special needs into ordinary schools"
come into equal participation in or membership of a social group or institution.
"she was anxious to integrate well into her husband's family"
desegregate (a school, area, etc.), especially racially.

Depp

Luggnuts wrote: »

Forced/arranged marriages are predominantly a hindu/sikh phenomenon.

not really, huge issue in the muslim community in the uk at the minute, also if you want to talk about sikhs start a thread about them, the discussion we're having is about islamism. x other culture does y aswel is not a valid excuse

ThisRegard

Widdershins wrote: »

??? What's an open boarder as you spoke of in those comments, then?

Presumably the same type of boarder that the guy I quoted mentioned, those that came across the border and was boarded for the night, openly.

Luggnuts

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Well there's this which happened last year in Germany


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12104304/Transgender-women-attacked-in-the-street-by-north-African-teenagers-in-Germany.html

There's also been some cases of women being stoned to death in Europe in the past decade and many more honour killings committed in other ways. I'd say they aren't part of western values wouldn't you?

And the drunks who beat their wives or abuse their kids aren't adhering to "western values" either. Let the law deal with people who engage in this type of criminality.

And as for those transgender women being attacked by North African teenagers.....those women were just as like to be attacked by indigenous skinheads or other scumbags. That they were attacked my North African scumbags means such behaviour is endemic to that culture. Were they attacked by local scumbags then it would be just a case of random thuggery by bad apples.

I know lots of Muslims and I can guarantee you that if a total stranger who happened to be a homosexual or transgender person ran to their house seeking refuge from a mob of any hateful pursuasion, those Muslims would take that person in and would literally die defending them. You wouldn't often see that kind of charity displayed in "western values"

FrancieBrady

Depp wrote: »

not really, huge issue in the muslim community in the uk at the minute, also if you want to talk about sikhs start a thread about them, the discussion we're having is about islamism. x other culture does y aswel is not a valid excuse

Thread title review is appropriate before you start telling people what they can or cannot discuss.