Country side alliance cover

Conchurl

Can anyone tell me what the differences in cover between the NARGC and country side alliance are. The gun club is currently with the NARGC but are thinking of changing to Country Side Alliance

Cass

There are differences alright, and while some are easy to find others are not.

The NARGC is not insurance as we know it. It's a compensation fund. Still cover, but not to be mistaken with insurance. They have higher payouts/amounts for claims, and cover some things other insurance (and yes i mean actual insurance companies) don't. However they also don't cover some aspects of shooting.

Competitions, and such can be a problem area.

Have a read of this thread to get some ideas and someone will be along with more details.

deeksofdoom

Conchurl wrote: »

Can anyone tell me what the differences in cover between the NARGC and country side alliance are. The gun club is currently with the NARGC but are thinking of changing to Country Side Alliance

Another club thinking of leaving Cork Federation?

Gravelly

Do you have to be a member of a gun club to get NARGC cover?

Conchurl

deeksofdoom wrote: »

Another club thinking of leaving Cork Federation?

Just trying to get as much info on the cover by countryside alliance

J.R.

Gravelly wrote: »

Do you have to be a member of a gun club to get NARGC cover?

Yes - only available to Gun Club members...........no cover available for individuals

grassroot1

Conchurl wrote: »

Can anyone tell me what the differences in cover between the NARGC and country side alliance are. The gun club is currently with the NARGC but are thinking of changing to Country Side Alliance

Why are you thinking of leaving the NARGC compensation fund if you dont mind me asking?

ldc

Hi,
I have several covers for many years and those have including both NARGC and CAI, both at the same time and at different stages. In my personal opinion for a Gun Club perspective there is at present no better cover than NARGC. Naturally from a Insurance company one can pay higher premiums and get additional cover so i can only assume that your members have told you what they want and what their budget is. Some additional cover is also available from the NARGC for a further cost. Your Club if in Cork has received details of NARGC cover and what it entails/covers.

Your club members do not only have to think of their personal cover but the cover the different options offer the land owners who are gracious enough to freely give you the shooting opportunity over their lands. With the foregoing in mind if i was in your club and was investigating a change from a clubs perspective i would arrange a night and invite both the NARGC fund administrator and CAI representative to give presentations and discuss their relevant policies etc. That way all of your club would be involved and you would have up to date info. You would not be potentially in the hot seat if anything went badly afterwards, it would have been a club informed decision. I do not know who your local CAI rep is but certainly you can ask the Cork Federation Secretary to give your club a presentation on what the NARGC offer at any stage.

I have several insurance covers still and will not be dropping the NARGC one personally. Some of the more unusual things i personally think i would consider if in your position are instances like: does cover apply if your members are technically unlawful for some reason. Not for a moment suggesting that that could be the case but for instance, your dog might be out of licence, or be off a lead in a public place etc etc. Are you covered within your own home? Are your members over a certain age? are there reduced rates for young and old?Are you covered for just shooting and does it apply only in Ireland? Who is indemnified if one of your members causes an accident? Should a farm animal be hurt by one of your members and the farmer has insurance will your insurance pay up? and i am sure a myriad more things have to be considered. Cover naturally for yourself needs to be considered also.

Hope this is of benefit to you in making your decision.

deeksofdoom

ldc wrote: »

Hi,
I have several covers for many years and those have including both NARGC and CAI, both at the same time and at different stages. In my personal opinion for a Gun Club perspective there is at present no better cover than NARGC. Naturally from a Insurance company one can pay higher premiums and get additional cover so i can only assume that your members have told you what they want and what their budget is. Some additional cover is also available from the NARGC for a further cost. Your Club if in Cork has received details of NARGC cover and what it entails/covers. Your club members do not only have to think of their personal cover but the cover the different options offer the land owners who are gracious enough to freely give you the shooting opportunity over their lands. With the foregoing in mind if i was in your club and was investigating a change from a clubs perspective i would arrange a night and invite both the NARGC fund administrator and CAI representative to give presentations and discuss their relevant policies etc. That way all of your club would be involved and you would have up to date info. You would not be potentially in the hot seat if anything went badly afterwards, it would have been a club informed decision. I do not know who your local CAI rep is but certainly you can ask the Cork Federation Secretary to give your club a presentation on what the NARGC offer at any stage. I have several insurance covers still and will not be dropping the NARGC one personally. Some of the more unusual things i personally think i would consider if in your position are instances like: does cover apply if your members are technically unlawful for some reason. Not for a moment suggesting that that could be the case but for instance, your dog might be out of licence, or be off a lead in a public place etc etc. Are you covered within your own home? Are your members over a certain age? are there reduced rates for young and old?Are you covered for just shooting and does it apply only in Ireland? Who is indemnified if one of your members causes an accident? Should a farm animal be hurt by one of your members and the farmer has insurance will your insurance pay up? and i am sure a myriad more things have to be considered. Cover naturally for yourself needs to be considered also.
Hope this is of benefit to you in making your decision.

Any chance you could fill us in on the going on in the Cork Federaton as of late?

richiedel123

Conchurl wrote: »

Can anyone tell me what the differences in cover between the NARGC and country side alliance are. The gun club is currently with the NARGC but are thinking of changing to Country Side Alliance

My county secretary got this information about 2 months ago. They got a letter done by nargc comp fund officer with a full comparison between all the cover available from different providers. Go to county secretary and look for it. From what I read on it nargc cover is far superior to any of the others

cavan shooter

deeksofdoom wrote:

Any chance you could fill us in on the going on in the Cork Federaton as of late?

I've a mate in Kilworth and the word is there ripping themselves apart. He is so posses about it he was on about insuring with our club as he has his own land and permission all over Cork another mate who works in Fota...(no jokes.) Reckons on a big shake up coming...

berettaman

Cork is a strong county. It is a shame that it is going the way it is going because of a few..
I will try to find the comparison sheet between cover providers but like the previous posters stated, every club got one.

cavan shooter

It might be a string county but the roman empire used to be strong.

Also any more truth that Sports Coalition is offering insurance from August.

berettaman

cavan shooter wrote: »

It might be a string county but the roman empire used to be strong.

Also any more truth that Sports Coalition is offering insurance from August.

SC offering insurance?
Are you serious?

Sparks

ldc wrote: »

arrange a night and invite both the NARGC fund administrator and CAI representative to give presentations and discuss their relevant policies

Best advice given so far. The NARGC compensation fund is not an insurance policy, but that's not a bad thing, it's just that they're two different ways to achieve the same end goal - for example, for years Telecom Eireann didn't have insurance on its vehicles, they ran a compensation fund to cover their liabilities in the event of an accident instead of having an insurance policy to do the same job.

But there are differences between the two and you have to decide yourself which fits your needs better.

Might also be a good idea to ask what happens if you have both - if you had two insurance policies, only one could legally pay out for a claim, but I'm not sure if that applies if you have both an insurance policy and membership in a compensation fund (things like that are why it's not a bad thing that the two aren't the same). There are also limits on both - a compensation fund can be drained (though you can insure against that) while insurance policies have state backing; but an insurance policy can't pay out if the damage occurred while something illegal was being done and with our firearms act being the mangled piece of garbage that it is, it's often damn near impossible to not be breaking some part of it, even if it's a technicality that exists only in one set of byelaws written in the 1800s.

Talk to every vendor available, read the fine print, consider what you need and then decide which is the best choice. And revisit that decision every so often as well - terms and conditions have a habit of changing...

cavan shooter

berettaman wrote:

SC offering insurance? Are you serious?

No I am making it up.............

Of course I'm serious this was doing the rounds around November time.. was a said to me by a few people. Tended to be followed with... Sports Coalition are aiming to be an Irish NRA.

One ring to rule them sort of thing

Sparks

We have an Irish NRA. They're called the NRAI. Clue's in the name

cavan shooter

Sparks wrote:

We have an Irish NRA. They're called the NRAI. Clue's in the name

Que the life of Brian scene "are you the people's front of Judea "

berettaman

Public Liability: Protection


NARGC E10m Worldwide
CAI E11.25m Worldwide excluding USA/Canada
Countryside IFA E2.6m Republic of Ireland only
Countryside Sports Ireland E11.25 EU only

berettaman

Personal Accident Cover:

Death

NARGC E100K E10K u17
CAI E17K
IFA E30K
CSI E11K

Limb/eye loss/disability

NARGC E100K
CAI E34K
IFA E15K
CSI E11K

Temp Disability

NARGC E350/wk for max 52 weeks with doctors cert
CAI nil
IFA E600/wk while in hospital only excludes first 3 days x 4 weeks
CSI nil

Medical Fees

NARGC E2K
CAI 15% of Capital Benefit Max E5K
IFA nil
CSI 15% of Compensation paid

Permanent Disability

NARGC E100K
CAI E39K
IFA E20K
CSI E11K

Age Limits

NARGC None
CAI Under 79
IFA 18-74
CSI None

Membership

NARGC E50 E25 u19 and over 70
CAI E65 E30 u17 and E50 over 65s
IFA E70
CSI E40 E20 U17

cavan shooter

Can that be posted as a pdf or something

berettaman

cavan shooter wrote: »

Que the life of Brian scene "are you the people's front of Judea "

If the SC are hoping to provide insurance then the NARGC were will within their rights to pull away but the main reasons were more to do with the night time lamping and safe pass for shooting no?

berettaman

cavan shooter wrote: »

Can that be posted as a pdf or something

Can't seem to load it properly..:rolleyes:

cavan shooter

berettaman wrote:

NARGC E350/wk for max 52 weeks with doctors cert CAI nil IFA E600/wk while in hospital only excludes first 3 days x 4 weeks CSI nil

I can confirm this. One of our Club members broke his ankle and got 300 a week when he couldn't work and got a lump for the ankle...and physio

cavan shooter

berettaman wrote:

If the SC are hoping to provide insurance then the NARGC were will within their rights to pull away but the main reasons were more to do with the night time lamping and safe pass for shooting no?

Yes.
That aside it will be interesting to see if insurance is offered just asked a lad if he heard anything more on that and he says it's coming. Out of interest who is the ICPSA insurance.

brieny1000

Fortunately, for the first time in years there is going to be an election for the officers in Cork by all accounts, and not before time.
It needs total change.
Looks like we are getting involved in an other court case that has nothing to do with us but will cost us more hard earned cash that should have been going to shooting and not to solicitors

J.R.

cavan shooter wrote: »

Can that be posted as a pdf or something

berettaman wrote: »

Can't seem to load it properly..:rolleyes:

Here is Berettaman's summary of cover benefits in Word document & PDF document.

deeksofdoom

brieny1000 wrote: »

Fortunately, for the first time in years there is going to be an election for the officers in Cork by all accounts, and not before time.
It needs total change.
Looks like we are getting involved in an other court case that has nothing to do with us but will cost us more hard earned cash that should have been going to shooting and not to solicitors

What's the court case about?

Perfectstorm

try csi for a quote...my understanding is that csi is going to match the levels of cover offered by the nargc. the level of covered offered by cai,ifa etc and csi was previously not on a par with the nargc.

it seems that "competition" is about to enter the shooters insurance/compensation fund market for the first time.


the purchase of the insurance should be no different to car or house..ring up and inform the broker what you are looking for and they quote a price.


there is no case listed for the courts for cork. it is still at the bluffing huffing puffing stage.
the situation is something like - an attendee at a cork meeting goes back to the national with a report that the person x said whatever about person y. both x and y are chairmen. y takes offense at what x is reported to have said. y writes to x saying you need to withdraw that. x writes back i never said that and someone telling you i did does not make it true (or false in fairness). so then chairman y writes to all the clubs in cork saying that i am only suing x not the county or the clubs. but y sends it on headed paper so no one knows if y is paying his own way or.........

the end.

cavan shooter

Just thought of something....if your happy with NARGC but not the county situation, why join countryside alliance stick to NARGC....affiliate to a different county. There's no rule saying you can't and in fact there are clubs around in various counties that have done that.

grassroot1

cavan shooter wrote: »

Just thought of something....if your happy with NARGC but not the county situation, why join countryside alliance stick to NARGC....affiliate to a different county. There's no rule saying you can't and in fact there are clubs around in various counties that have done that.

Not telling anyone from Cork what to do but I don't think any club should be bullied out of their own county body because of a number of individuals
As the american's say stick and stay and make them pay. That is what elections are for!