Gardai say cyclists must change attitude

buffalo

This infuriates me so much...

Cyclists need to undergo a change in “mindset and attitude” and always wear fluorescent clothing and helmets, the Association of Garda Sergeants and Inspectors (AGSI) believes.

The mid-ranking Garda members said the roads were so dangerous for cyclists that they needed to take action to protect themselves.

"What can we do, as Gardai­, to make the roads safer for cyclists? MAKE THEM WEAR HI-VIZ!"

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/garda%C3%AD-say-cyclists-must-change-attitude-and-wear-safety-gear-1.3046390

Tenzor07

"Ireland Says Gardai must change h'attitude"

Would be more like it!

buffalo

Sgt Gerry Moylan, Sligo, said when Garda members patrolled on mountain bikes they were dressed in hi-vis clothing and wore helmets.

He believed it "wasn't ludicrous to suggest" cyclists should follow their example for their own protection.

I'm going to take this as advice that I should dress like a Garda. I think that advice will indeed enhance my safety on the roads!

mr spuckler

“If you are cycling around the city centre . . . you see people daily stepping out and trucks taking corners short and so on. So you need to protect yourself – and fluorescent jackets and helmets are the way to go.â€

both issues mentioned are caused by other road users but it's the cyclists who need to change behaviour...

Weepsie

buffalo wrote: »

Sgt Gerry Moylan, Sligo, said when Garda members patrolled on mountain bikes they were dressed in hi-vis clothing and wore helmets.
!

They also cycle on footpaths with alarming frequency

mr spuckler

buffalo wrote: »

I'm going to take this as advice that I should dress like a Garda. I think that advice will indeed enhance my safety on the roads!

i'm heading straight out this evening to get my car painted accordingly!

Melodeon

mr spuckler wrote: »

i'm heading straight out this evening to get my car painted accordingly!

Don't forget the blue strobes and the siren!

07Lapierre

Would this be considered Hi-Viz?

Are the gardai now going to arrest people for wearing cycling clothing??

"Reflective imprints to keep you safe and visible at all times"

http://en.bicycle-line.com/catalogo/cycling-clothing/man/jerseys/insidia-short-sleeve-jersey.html

uphillonly

It's such a depressing response to the safety situation.

Google a few images of cycling cities like Amsterdam & Copenhagen. Few helmets & almost no hi-vis. They knew where the real priorities lay for creating safe cycling in cities.

We need to ensure this gets no traction, otherwise it could deter people from cycling:
- making it appear dangerous (why else do you have to wear all that protective gear...)
- added hassle to get out on your bike.

FWIW - I do wear a helmet most of the time & occasionally a high vis waterproof but I'm under no illusions that either protects me from a motorist driving into me whilst texting. There are good ads on TV at the moment for that issue but I haven't seen any policing of it.

ThisRegard

Similar, albeit from a somewhat ****tier paper

Mid-ranking gardaí have voted to make high-visibility clothing mandatory for all cyclists.

.......

“In 2016, 35 pedestrians were killed on Irish roads. 23 of these were in rural areas. That is why we think high-visibilty clothing can make a significant contribution to road safety in the future.”

2+2= ?

She said the law should not be extended to pedestrians.

Ok, so they start with telling us how dangerous it is to be a pedestrian, no mention of the stats for cyclists, how many have been killed at night without lights and high vis, but conclude that the new law is too hard to apply to pedestrians, but we'll apply it to cyclists instead. ffs.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/garda-want-law-making-highvis-clothing-and-helmets-mandatory-for-all-cyclists-35617043.html

mr spuckler

ThisRegard wrote: »

Mid-ranking gardaí have voted to make high-visibility clothing mandatory for all cyclists.

that line in itself is misleading...

i also like that the pedestrian idea was dismissed because it was deemed to be unenforceable, not because it was completely ludicrous!!

lissard

This from an organisation that fabricated at least 50% of their breathalyzer tests. I wish it weren't the case, but AGS has very low credibility in my eyes these days.

Eponymous

Luckily the AGSI members are only charged with enforcing the laws currently in place (however poorly they do so) and NOT for creating new legislation.

Any motions passed at such conferences result in press releases down the line which carry as much/little weight as those produced by the pro-cycling lobby calling for more safety measures or more cycle-friendly infrastructure.

ThisRegard

More quotes

“The amount of fatalities and serious injuries – even minor injuries in cyclists, especially in the DMR [Dublin Metropolitan Region] is huge so we’d just like shift the mentality and attitudes of cyclists to encompass their own safety and take that on board,” Sergeant Clare Healy said.

So what are the numbers if they're so huge?

I mean we’ve all walked around the city centre, cycled around the city centre, drove around, you see people stepping out, trucks taking corners short. So you need to protect yourself. And florescent jackets are helmets are absolutely the way to go in my personal opinion.

Nothing about the people stepping out or more importantly the trucks cutting corners in a city where there's a ban on certain trucks?!? And a highvis will protect you from a truck cutting corners?

And she's (Sergeant Clare Healy) proposing a law based on her own personal opinion, is that how things work now?

Alanstrainor

07Lapierre wrote: »

Would this be considered Hi-Viz?

Are the gardai now going to arrest people for wearing cycling clothing??

"Reflective imprints to keep you safe and visible at all times"

http://en.bicycle-line.com/catalogo/cycling-clothing/man/jerseys/insidia-short-sleeve-jersey.html

I bet it wouldn't you know. Unless it's fluorescent yellow or orange I'd say you'd be stuffed. I guess my €150 black Gabba is for the bin so...:mad:

Lumen

This is an attempt to distract attention from their own ineptitude and corruption.

Faked breathalyser stats, free passes for GAA players, endemic abuse of PULSE, paedo allegations for whistleblowers, LOOK OVER THERE AT THOSE STUPID CYCLISTS.

mr spuckler

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I guess my €150 black Gabba is for the bin so...:mad:

i'm sure a hi-viz armband would see you right!

amazing how this is being lapped up and reported without general mocking and ridiculing of the suggestion. i really hope someone in the media looks at this in a more critical way than is generally the case.

ThisRegard

Lumen wrote: »

This is an attempt to distract attention from their own ineptitude and corruption.

Faked breathalyser stats, free passes for GAA players, endemic abuse of PULSE, paedo allegations for whistleblowers, LOOK OVER THERE AT THOSE STUPID CYCLISTS.

And announced today, they're going to have to re-evaluate their stats on murder and domestic violence.

check_six

ThisRegard wrote: »

And announced today, they're going to have to re-evaluate their stats on murder and domestic violence.

The drink driving tests scandal is alarming for a number of reasons. One underexplored element is how the levels of detected drink driving are double the stated numbers. Double! As in, twice as bad!
Would anyone like to speculate which way the other stats will go?

whiskeyman

The mid-ranking Garda members said the roads were so dangerous for cyclists that they needed to take action to protect themselves.

I love this bit.

It's like an telling civilians in a warzone to wear better bullet proof clothes etc... instead of actually trying to resolve the conflict that exists which would be better for everyone!

It's victim shaming at it's best IMO.

They need to address why the roads are so dangerous in the first place.
Poor enforcement of current laws and blowing up enforcement stats help no one!!

check_six

One benefit of the media coverage of the proposed 1.5m minimum passing distance is that the unconcentrated listener would perhaps assume that the law had been already enacted.

A downside of the coverage of the truck drivers headphones proposal, and the agsi conference hiviz proposal is that the passing listener would think that they had been enacted as well.

Ya win some, ya lose some!

mr spuckler

check_six wrote: »

One benefit of the media coverage of the proposed 1.5m minimum passing distance is that the unconcentrated listener would perhaps assume that the law had been already enacted.

judging by my close pass by a squad car this morning they seem well aware that it's not yet been enacted

Special Circumstances

Could it be imaginary hi viz?
A compromise where everybody is happy?

AndrewJRenko

mr spuckler wrote: »

judging by my close pass by a squad car this morning they seem well aware that it's not yet been enacted

Do you live in London by chance?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gkk9J0ItZ0

tomasrojo

Roads in general (with some notable exceptions) aren't that dangerous (as in, likely to result in death or serious injury), at least for adults, though they could be a lot less stressful and a lot more navigable.

This "proposal" has less rigour than an after-dinner speech. And yet, AGS has a reputation for excellence in statistical analyses.

ednwireland

Our office looks out over the centre of a small town and the number of drivers with a phone to the side of there head is unbeleivable.
So have to agree with everyone else enforcement of current laws would go a fair way to making roads safer.

Unknown Soldier

While I understand that HIGH-VIZ is a bit of a misnomer with regards to cycling, I don't actually blame the ASG for their statement, or have a problem with it.

It's always about the lowest common denominator.

In drink driving terms they recommend you don't drink, and pointing out you CAN have a drink by law would be true, but kind of pointless.

It's a lot easier to get the message across by saying Don't drink and drive

They are just saying "be as visible" as you can or make some effort to be.

And if it means one dude or dude'ess gets a light or even a high-viz, rather than cycling around in dark work clothes during winter, then good.

They are not speaking to general "cyclists" imo, but those lunatics that I see some mornings.

magicbastarder

Unknown Soldier wrote: »

In drink driving terms they recommend you don't drink, and pointing out you CAN have a drink by law would be true, but kind of pointless.

It's a lot easier to get the message across by saying Don't drink and drive

i don't think the analogy holds; they didn't call for a complete ban on alcohol (well, a zero tolerance mg in the blood policy), but they have called for mandatory helmet laws. it's not adive they're dishing out, it's a call for a change in the law.

I live out in the country and am often horrified to round a bend and come upon either cyclists or walkers toddling along with no hi viz gear, no helmets on cyclists and often both cyclists and walkers listening to music and being totally oblivious to their surroundings. We may all poke fun at the Gardais suggestions, but people have to learn to take responsibility for themselves and make allowances for the eegits they share the road with, ie pedestrians walking out in front of them and truckers/other motorists taking corners too tight.

ThisRegard

But you still manage to see them. And no amount of high vis will help an oncoming vehicle see around a bend.

When I'm out running on such roads (edit: in the dark), which I do regularly, I have a high vis bib and carry a torch to wave at taffic.

But I don't during the day as my regular clothing stands out against the green and yellow hedging and fields better.

Weepsie

Unless HiViz can bend light and travel around corners, that's not going to change the amount of horror you're getting.

You should be anticipating that there could be something around a bend in the road. If it shocks you that much I'd suggest you shouldn't be driving.

It's not the pedestrians responsibility to ensure that a motorist doesn't hit them because a motorist might take a bend too tight. Motorists take some real effin responsibility and sop deflecting.