Huge tree needs felling

mayoman1973

Short version of a Long story.  Decided last week with neighbour that we needed to fell a huge tree that stands on our boundary.  Got 3 quotes off tree surgeons to fell it.  Guy comes round to do the job and after a detailed look at tree ( which he didn't do the first day ) he says under no circumstances is he climbiing that tree.  Half rotten with some beech tree specific disease. Only solution is a crane.  Tree stats .... Between 90 and 100 ft high,  55ft from our house,  110 ft from neighbours house. Need a double extension ladder to reach the first branch. Guy said as it is highest tree for miles around that it prob got hit by lightening which allowed the rot to set in.  So got crane man out. Prob with this is a 4 wheeler crane is of no use but a bigger crane wouldn't be able to get close enough. By big crane I mean the monster 8 wheeler 70 tonne job you see on the roads. Either way a crane is not an option.  No can't sleep easy with a monster tree outside that could fall at next storm. So what options is there for a controlled felling? Tree surgeon says cause it is rotten in parts he couldn't be confident of felling it away from our house.  We can't get a rope or chain on cause would need some one to climb it.  Have even read of guy that had a controlled explosive device used to split a tree half way up which mad as it sounds is starting to seem like a viable option. Any other ideas or options?

Boardnashea

I'd recommend move this to Farming/Forestry. It's way beyond the realms of gardening

Macy0161

Try one of the other crowd that quoted? Did they look at the tree?

mayoman1973

Yea,  each guy took a quick gawk at it,  but not sure I'd want a dare devil climbing a tree that another guy has said is not safe.  Maybe first guy was just overly cautious.  PS , How do I move this thread to the reccomended section?

Lumen

I'm also guessing forestry forum would be best

Presumably going up removing branches in a cherry picker would be the safest approach, to reduce the mass of the tree. And then using same cherry picker to attach cables to secure it, or just lop off sections of trunk from the top down.

prinzeugen

OP try some other people.

Even to most rotten tree is safe to climb up to a point. We hit the branches with a hammer to see if it was safe to tie a rope round (branches were 8-12" diameter).

When I worked as a tree surgeon with the local council in Scotland and we had a similar tree.

Could only be climbed so far up but got the majority of the branches off and as it was in a public park we did not have to worry too much about where the rest landed when it hit the deck.

When we took it down the trunk spectacularly shattered into millions of bits of shrapnel when it hit the ground.

Bit by bit is the only option unless you want to risk damage to the houses.

Oldtree

From your story you are right to be very careful.

You need a qualified, insured and experienced arborist to assess the tree and be competent to do the necessary works. A good place to start is linked below, who will either help you or point you towards another appropriate arborist in your area.

http://www.goodwin-arborist.com

mayoman1973

Tree is fairly safe to climb.  Its not branches breaking is what the surgeons are afraid of.  Problem is taking any more than a few small branches off any side could destabilize the entrire tree cause of the weakened trunk.  Seems it will have to be a slow process of going around the tree a few times to keep nipping branches off each side. Bit like Jenga,  just with lot bigger peices.

Oldtree

mayoman1973 wrote: »

  Guy comes round to do the job and after a detailed look at tree ( which he didn't do the first day ) he says under no circumstances is he climbiing that tree. 

mayoman1973 wrote: »

Tree is fairly safe to climb.  Its not branches breaking is what the surgeons are afraid of.  Problem is taking any more than a few small branches off any side could destabilize the entrire tree cause of the weakened trunk.  Seems it will have to be a slow process of going around the tree a few times to keep nipping branches off each side. Bit like Jenga,  just with lot bigger peices.

Did your tree surgeon visitors do an internal investigation as well as a visual inspection of the tree to give you that advice?

"Fairly safe" is a very ambiguous statement, as is the destabilising statement.

If the tree is safe to climb then it is just a question of work time and the cost of that work time. And maby 2-3 climbers!!!

Situation as described Seems to be a bit odd really.

mayoman1973

second guy has done what I would call a core test.  Drilled the trunk about 1cm hole and took out a long dowel of timber which shows first 1ft is good,  the inner 1ft is rotten.  And as trunk is about 4ft across I assume its the same no matter which side you would drill from

mayoman1973

1st guy won't even answer my call now as I assume he doesn't want to be tied to the first estimate he gave of £500 to drop and chop it.

Oldtree

mayoman1973 wrote: »

second guy has done what I would call a core test.  Drilled the trunk about 1cm hole and took out a long dowel of timber which shows first 1ft is good,  the inner 1ft is rotten.  And as trunk is about 4ft across I assume its the same no matter which side you would drill from

Did he do more than 1 core test at various heights?

1 foot of solid beech is very strong.

Oldtree

mayoman1973 wrote: »

1st guy won't even answer my call now as I assume he doesn't want to be tied to the first estimate he gave of £500 to drop and chop it.

Sounds a bit cheap for a 100 foot high tree with a diameter of 4 foot that is close to dwellings and has issues, dosn't it?

mayoman1973

This was to leave it in manageable 5ft lengths.  I thought it was a good price though neighbours though it was dear.  If there was £500 sellotaped to the top branch I wouldn't have climbed up for it.  Current price is now £800 for crane hire and same again in labor.  The original price looks fair cheap now alright.

Oldtree

mayoman1973 wrote: »

This was to leave it in manageable 5ft lengths.  I thought it was a good price though neighbours though it was dear.  If there was £500 sellotaped to the top branch I wouldn't have climbed up for it.  Current price is now £800 for crane hire and same again in labor.  The original price looks fair cheap now alright.

Whatever you decide to do, make sure that your tree surgeon has done this kind of work before and has adequate insurance.

€800 seems a bit cheap too imo, there's a lot of work involved, but I havn't seen the tree or its situation.

Melodeon

That original €500 quote is broadly in the ballpark for that sort of tree, if it was sound and in an 'easy' situation, to straight fell and render into manageable pieces.
Your particular tree sounds like a much more complex operation, hence the original quoter going dark after they had a proper look.
Given the situation as described, I'd expect the cost to get into a low to medium 4 figure sum.

magicbastarder

mayoman1973 wrote: »

This was to leave it in manageable 5ft lengths.

if you go for that, be sure to contact your local woodturners guild, who may bite your arm off* for some.

*cheaper than paying for it.

Kevhog1988

I have an uncle that is very good at this sort of thing. Would a telehandler with a man basket be able to reach the top? it would be best to fell it in small sections i think.

I can ask him to take a look if you want??

looksee

theemigrant wrote: »

I have an uncle that is very good at this sort of thing. Would a telehandler with a man basket be able to reach the top? it would be best to fell it in small sections i think.

I can ask him to take a look if you want??

Does he have the proper personal and public liability insurance?

Lumen

It seems unlikely that removing one branch would destabilise the tree if it's strong enough to have withstood strong winds up to this point.

mayoman1973

highest reach for any cherry picker/small 17 tonne crane I enquired about is in region of 80ft.  So it's not high enough.

Calahonda52

OP: post a few pictures of this tree if you can please

recedite

mayoman1973 wrote: »

highest reach for any cherry picker/small 17 tonne crane I enquired about is in region of 80ft. So it's not high enough.

That's plenty high enough for a 90-100 foot tree. No point being above it.

pauldavis123

This:



and this:



150ft height, work from above.

Down on no time!

Calahonda52

recedite wrote: »

That's plenty high enough for a 90-100 foot tree. No point being above it.

so you can drop the first 20 feet into the cherry picker...wtf

recedite

Calahonda52 wrote: »

so you can drop the first 20 feet into the cherry picker...wtf

Well, no, onto the ground obviously.

Odelay

recedite wrote: »

Well, no, onto the ground obviously.

Any chance the cherry picker might be in the way of the tree top and the ground??

recedite

If you can't fell 10-20 feet of skinny treetop branches without them falling on your head, then you've no business having a chainsaw (or pole saw) in your hand.

Lumen

This is a great thread. Everyone's an armchair tree surgeon (I'm not being sarcastic, it's quite easy in theory after a couple of beers and a few Youtube videos).

The former owner of my house fell out of a tree whilst operating a chainsaw; the dude holding the ladder wasn't entirely paying attention. He was permanently crippled and eventually had to sell the house because he didn't have the mobility to maintain the garden.

Anyway, can we return to the controlled explosion idea? That had potential.

magicbastarder

Lumen wrote: »

The former owner of my house fell out of a tree whilst operating a chainsaw; the dude holding the ladder wasn't entirely paying attention.

[armchair tree surgeon]well that wasn't strictly a *tree surgery* accident, that was just come guy falling off a ladder[/armchair tree surgeon].

Kevhog1988

looksee wrote: »

Does he have the proper personal and public liability insurance?

Yeah, proper firm with public & employers liability etc. I know all to well how important that is. One of my mothers cousins a farmer borrowed a telehandler to a neighbour who was going cutting trees. the fellow fell out of the man basket, no harness etc on and somehow claimed off the insurance on the vehicle