US considering Preemptive Strike against North Korea.

aloyisious

I was wondering what NK would do in regard to its missile test flights if the US handed an open letter into the UN, on the floor, for the information of the other UN general assembly members [with the same open letter handed directly to the NK Govt Rep] reminding them that the US has an agreement with Japan regarding its defence and stating that any missile launch with A: an unknown payload from NK and B: with a trajectory and route across Japan would be seen as an unfriendly act resulting in said missile being shot at and destroyed.

Would anyone here think it acceptable for the NK Govt [given such a public reminder of US commitment to Japan] to carry out any "test-flights" across Japanese territory, given its own stance on defence of NK national territory?

Would anyone here accept any NK Govt protest about the destruction of its missile after it had, by and under NK Govt planning, been flown directly into and across a neighbour's national territory, and claim that such a missile launch was NOT invasive in nature, given how it's being very open about defending its own territory from alleged threats of "invasion"?

Does anyone here think that such NK tests are tests of other nations national defence stances and patience, and NOT tests of the missile capability?

Dohnjoe

aloyisious wrote: »

I was wondering what NK would do in regard to its missile test flights if the US handed an open letter into the UN, on the floor, for the information of the other UN general assembly members [with the same open letter handed directly to the NK Govt Rep] reminding them that the US has an agreement with Japan regarding its defence and stating that any missile launch with A: an unknown payload from NK and B: with a trajectory and route across Japan would be seen as an unfriendly act resulting in said missile being shot at and destroyed.

Would anyone here think it acceptable for the NK Govt [given such a public reminder of US commitment to Japan] to carry out any "test-flights" across Japanese territory, given its own stance on defence of NK national territory?

Would anyone here accept any NK Govt protest about the destruction of its missile after it had, by and under NK Govt planning, been flown directly into and across a neighbour's national territory, and claim that such a missile launch was NOT invasive in nature, given how it's being very open about defending its own territory from alleged threats of "invasion"?

Does anyone here think that such NK tests are tests of other nations national defence stances and patience, and NOT tests of the missile capability?

The launches and tests are more a form of communication

They ratchet up regional tensions - then deescalate for concessions

The last thing NK or SK or China or anyone with skin in the game wants is actual war.

BoatMad

Dohnjoe wrote: »

The launches and tests are more a form of communication

They ratchet up regional tensions - then deescalate for concessions

The last thing NK or SK or China or anyone with skin in the game wants is actual war.

+1.

bear1

If the missile they launch does cross into Japanese airspace again then I'd be very curious how the Japanese would react.
And if they shot it down how the north would react.

BoatMad

And if they shot it down how the north would react.

shrug, its not like it returns back to them anyway !

Gatling

bear1 wrote: »

If the missile they launch does cross into Japanese airspace again then I'd be very curious how the Japanese would react.
And if they shot it down how the north would react.

This is the thing nobody seems to know ,

Japan could say it's an act of war and they have the absolute right to defend their territory ,
Or NK could say it's an act of war and decide accidentally on purpose to launch multiple Missles directly targeting japan and claim it was an accidental and hide behind china .

Again is an unknown variable

BoatMad

Gatling wrote: »

This is the thing nobody seems to know ,

Japan could say it's an act of war and they have the absolute right to defend their territory ,
Or NK could say it's an act of war and decide accidentally on purpose to launch multiple Missles directly targeting japan and claim it was an accidental and hide behind china .

Again is an unknown variable

equally they could all go down to Taco Bells for a quesadilla

its all hypothetical

Stacksofwacks

Warning: nerdy song

Kermit.de.frog

BoatMad wrote: »

Of course it was the UN , all those Un troops , air bombardments , bombers etc. Of course the UN

Perhaps you've recently arrived from another planet ?

" barbaric rule " , hmmmm let's see how many " barbaric " rulers , US foreign policy and military activity has propped up , Assad, the shah, chile, Pakistan, turkeys junta , and that's what comes to mind immediately

Curly Judge

aloyisious wrote: »

I was wondering what NK would do in regard to its missile test flights if the US handed an open letter into the UN, on the floor, for the information of the other UN general assembly members [with the same open letter handed directly to the NK Govt Rep] reminding them that the US has an agreement with Japan regarding its defence and stating that any missile launch with A: an unknown payload from NK and B: with a trajectory and route across Japan would be seen as an unfriendly act resulting in said missile being shot at and destroyed.

Would anyone here think it acceptable for the NK Govt [given such a public reminder of US commitment to Japan] to carry out any "test-flights" across Japanese territory, given its own stance on defence of NK national territory?

Would anyone here accept any NK Govt protest about the destruction of its missile after it had, by and under NK Govt planning, been flown directly into and across a neighbour's national territory, and claim that such a missile launch was NOT invasive in nature, given how it's being very open about defending its own territory from alleged threats of "invasion"?

Does anyone here think that such NK tests are tests of other nations national defence stances and patience, and NOT tests of the missile capability?

Aw, now...you're being very hard on poor old NK.
If the US was to do that, the only window left open to them for testing their pea -shooters would be a narrow corridor southward between Taiwan and Okinawa.
Surely you don't expect them to fire their missiles over their friends to the northeast or their immediate west?

aloyisious

Curly Judge wrote: »

Aw, now...you're being very hard on poor old NK.
If the US was to do that, the only window left open to them for testing their pea -shooters would be a narrow corridor southward between Taiwan and Okinawa.
Surely you don't expect them to fire their missiles over their friends to the northeast or their immediate west?

Now that's something I hadn't considered. It might be a safe way of carrying out the tests, no shoot-downs. They are friends and know NK would not be bold enough to infringe on their sovereignty with animus or warlike intent and [probably] already know the missile capabilities.

Cheerful Spring

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Provocation from NK possible this evening. ICBM said to be moved to launch site in west of country. USAF ballistic missile detection aircraft said to be in the air now (same last night apparently) and SK aircraft too.

After North Korea threatening to blow up a Nuke in the Pacific, all bets are off now. America and South Korea and Japan will be trying to gather intelligence the missile is not carrying a nuclear payload. You can't allow a nuclear weapon to fly over Japan. There could be a shootdown order from Trump.

MadYaker

His haircut is gaaaaas

Nettle Soup

This media "crisis" is tapering off now as many of us predicted.
It was a war of words and both children are getting bored of it.
China and Russia kept their dignity throughout.
Closed door diplomacy always works better Mr Trump.

Nettle Soup

Nettle Soup wrote: »

This media "crisis" is tapering off now as many of us predicted.
It was a war of words and both children are getting bored of it.
China and Russia kept their dignity throughout.
Closed door diplomacy always works better Mr Trump.

No different to any other news story really, just look at how the hurricane in the Caribbean and SE USA has quietly dropped out of the headlines, but whole communities are still in crisis without power and homeless.

MadYaker

BBC nwes reporting that NK and the US are in "direct contact" with eachother for the first time. Perhaps full diplomatic talks could be on the way? It's clearly the best way forward for all involved. It would be nice too see NK coming in from the dark and joining the rest of the world. But I don't think there is any way for that to happen under the current regime so I won't hold my breath.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41454007?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

BillyBobBS

Reports this evening of intermediate range and ICBM missiles being moved from facilities to launch sites.

Anyone thinking this is over or is a "war of words" hasn't a clue about what's about to occur.

Timberrrrrrrr

BillyBobBS wrote: »

Reports this evening of intermediate range and ICBM missiles being moved from facilities to launch sites.

Anyone thinking this is over or is a "war of words" hasn't a clue about what's about to occur.

Not seeing this anywhere, all news seems to be about the US/NK being in direct talks. Care to post links?

somefeen

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Not seeing this anywhere, all news seems to be about the US/NK being in direct talks. Care to post links?

I found this

http://m.timesofindia.com/world/rest-of-world/north-korea-seen-moving-missiles-from-development-centre-reports/articleshow/60893114.cms

somefeen

somefeen wrote: »

I found this

http://m.timesofindia.com/world/rest-of-world/north-korea-seen-moving-missiles-from-development-centre-reports/articleshow/60893114.cms

When I saw this, I decided that this is not really news.
The sun will be spotted rising in the morning.

The report did not say when or where they had been moved.

somefeen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When I saw this, I decided that this is not really news.
The sun will be spotted rising in the morning.

Its a woeful piece of news.

The South Korean news agency cited " an unnamed intelligence source" and the officials " can't deny or confirm the details"

Totally meaningless and unsubstantiated. Someone could be making it up.

Timberrrrrrrr

somefeen wrote: »

Its a woeful piece of news.

The South Korean news agency cited " an unnamed intelligence source" and the officials " can't deny or confirm the details"

Totally meaningless and unsubstantiated. Someone could be making it up.

I just thing BillyBobBS is feeling a little disappointed that the war he was so desperately looking forward to is slipping away and so grasping at straws is all he has left.

Kermit.de.frog

North Korean actions tend to happen between 10 pm and midnight Irish time - they prefer moving their missiles under cover of darkness with launches around first light.

Wouldn't be surprised to see another launch in coming days - a couple of big dates next week in the North Korean calendar too.

Kermit.de.frog

US State Dept has just undermined Tillerson's enthusiasm somewhat

State Dept. spokesperson: "No indication" North Korean officials "interested in or are ready for talks regarding denuclearization."

I guess Rex just wanted something positive to say in front of the hosts.

Morpork

All I could think of.

Cheerful Spring

MadYaker wrote: »

BBC nwes reporting that NK and the US are in "direct contact" with eachother for the first time. Perhaps full diplomatic talks could be on the way? It's clearly the best way forward for all involved. It would be nice too see NK coming in from the dark and joining the rest of the world. But I don't think there is any way for that to happen under the current regime so I won't hold my breath.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41454007?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

I doubt it. War is inevitable. What can the Americans offer them to stop?

Cheerful Spring

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

US State Dept has just undermined Tillerson's enthusiasm somewhat


I guess Rex just wanted something positive to say in front of the hosts.

Any clown can see North Korea will never hand over it's nuclear weapons. The Americans are looking for something they never get. The back channel talks are a dead end.

Cheerful Spring

somefeen wrote: »

Its a woeful piece of news.

The South Korean news agency cited " an unnamed intelligence source" and the officials " can't deny or confirm the details"

Totally meaningless and unsubstantiated. Someone could be making it up.

If the source is a South Korean news, it mostly likely legit don't you think.

Cheerful Spring

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

If the source is a South Korean news, it mostly likely legit don't you think.

South Korean news "sources" are about as accurate as Irish republican news sources when reporting news from Northern Ireland. In other words they are not unbiased.

somefeen

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

If the source is a South Korean news, it mostly likely legit don't you think.

No. Anytime I read a news report which got its information from an unnamed source I'm always skeptical. Doesn't matter what publication it is.
It always raises two similar questions for me.

1. Why would someone working in a South Korean intelligence agency go to the press and report something like that. What's their motivation to potentially risk their job so someone can print a short report that is then contradicted by official sources.

2. How can I trust that information when it is vauge, incomplete and can't be verified with any other supporting evidence. There's nothing else there to back it up.

Even if the source was real and authentic then all the story says is that they've moved some missiles and nothing about where they are going. They could be going to be stored somewhere out of the way, on their way to a scrap heap or to a launch site.

Given the alarmist atmosphere around this whole debacle I'm wary of stuff like this.