US considering Preemptive Strike against North Korea.

stevedublin

BillyBobBS wrote: »

We'll see.

yes, we will.

murphthesmurf

end of the road wrote: »

kept the forces at home where they belong.
the falklands were not worth the bother. they contribute nothing to the british economy. those who died in that conflict died for nothing. poor sods.

Wow, we don't make any money off them so f**k em. Hope you never end up in office.
The people of the Falkland Islands wish to remain as a British colony, they were not freed by the Argentinians, they were invaded. The locals that weren't taken prisoner by the Argentinians fought with the British troops and helped them in any way they could. You do not abandom part of your country/colony/empire whatever you want to call it and its people to an aggressive invader as they cost you money. The soldiers did not die for nothing, what a horrible thing to say. Ask the Falklanders if they think they died for nothing, they will tell you they were heroes.
A majority of the countries on the planet are inhabited in some way by invaders/colinisers. The entire American continent was invaded, the Argentinians themselves are invaders. How else did Espanic people come to be there? And what happened to the locals? They butchered them, as happened accross the whole of the American continent. People only seem to have a problem with colonisation when it's done by the British.

end of the road

murphthesmurf wrote: »

Wow, we don't make any money off them so f**k em. Hope you never end up in office.
The people of the Falkland Islands wish to remain as a British colony, they were not freed by the Argentinians, they were invaded. The locals that weren't taken prisoner by the Argentinians fought with the British troops and helped them in any way they could. You do not abandom part of your country/colony/empire whatever you want to call it and its people to an aggressive invader as they cost you money. The soldiers did not die for nothing, what a horrible thing to say. Ask the Falklanders if they think they died for nothing, they will tell you they were heroes.
A majority of the countries on the planet are inhabited in some way by invaders/colinisers. The entire American continent was invaded, the Argentinians themselves are invaders. How else did Espanic people come to be there? And what happened to the locals? They butchered them, as happened accross the whole of the American continent. People only seem to have a problem with colonisation when it's done by the British.

doesn't matter, they are not british and never will be. argentina took back what was theirs to take. if they want to be british so badly, up and move there, give them safe passage.
most of the british empire was abandoned to all sorts so this particular colony isn't anything special, unless the government at the time were aware of the potential for oil deposits down there. it was ultimately an election ploy.

smurgen

for a country so technologically inferior as some here would have us believe they seen to be able to hack the crap out of the vastly more sophisticsted U.S and South Korean governments https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/10/north-korea-hacked-us-war-plans-south-korea-reports

end of the road

end of the road wrote: »

doesn't matter, they are not british and never will be. argentina took back what was theirs to take. if they want to be british so badly, up and move there, give them safe passage.
most of the british empire was abandoned to all sorts so this particular colony isn't anything special, unless the government at the time were aware of the potential for oil deposits down there. it was ultimately an election ploy.

Seriously, this is a thread about North Korea and Donald Trump.

How you are allowed to take over threads spouting your anti Britain anti thatcher spiel is beyond me.

I’m a Londoner and kinda p1ssed off that you’re always allowed to get away with it. I stay out of those type of threads. Now I can’t even read a thread on a completely different topic!

murphthesmurf

smurgen wrote: »

for a country so technologically inferior as some here would have us believe they seen to be able to hack the crap out of the vastly more sophisticsted U.S and South Korean governments https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/10/north-korea-hacked-us-war-plans-south-korea-reports

Some of the best hackers in the world are spotty teenagers sat behind a cheap pc in their stained 'y fronts'. No supercomputers needed, just brains and persistence.

murphthesmurf

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Seriously, this is a thread about North Korea and Donald Trump.

How you are allowed to take over threads spouting your anti Britain anti thatcher spiel is beyond me.

I’m a Londoner and kinda p1ssed off that you’re always allowed to get away with it. I stay out of those type of threads. Now I can’t even read a thread on a completely different topic!

Amen to that

Zebra3

murphthesmurf wrote: »

Wow, we don't make any money off them so f**k em. Hope you never end up in office.
The people of the Falkland Islands wish to remain as a British colony, they were not freed by the Argentinians, they were invaded. The locals that weren't taken prisoner by the Argentinians fought with the British troops and helped them in any way they could. You do not abandom part of your country/colony/empire whatever you want to call it and its people to an aggressive invader as they cost you money. The soldiers did not die for nothing, what a horrible thing to say. Ask the Falklanders if they think they died for nothing, they will tell you they were heroes.
A majority of the countries on the planet are inhabited in some way by invaders/colinisers. The entire American continent was invaded, the Argentinians themselves are invaders. How else did Espanic people come to be there? And what happened to the locals? They butchered them, as happened accross the whole of the American continent. People only seem to have a problem with colonisation when it's done by the British.

And the British only seem to have a problem with it when it was done by the Germans.

Manic Moran

the ship wasn't in a state of conflict at the time.

Umm. The armed forces of one state invaded two territories controlled by another state, engaging the armed forces of that other state in conventional combat resulting in multiple deaths, destruction of aircraft and armored vehicles, and a warship so badly damaged she was knocked out of the rest of the war, whilst seizing control of those territories. I think that counts as creating a state of conflict. Certainly, the Argentinian military believed they were in one, and on this matter the British military seems to have been in agreement with their opposition.

Cheerful Spring

President Donald Trump said Wednesday that he and Secretary of State Rex Tillerson have "different" views on handling North Korea, but he emphasized that "ultimately, my attitude is the one that matters, isn't it?"

"I think, perhaps, I feel stronger and tougher on that subject than other people," President Trump said, "but I listen to everybody.

"Ultimately, I'll do what's right for the United States — and, really, what's right for the world.
Because that's really a world problem. That's beyond just the United States.

"That's a world problem — and it's a problem that has to be solved."

Rex is probably going to get the boot soon. Trump is going to surround himself with people who not stop him going to war.

Cheerful Spring

President Donald Trump wasn't happy with the steady decrease in the US stockpile of nuclear weapons since the 1960s.

So, over the summer, he asked instead for a tenfold increase in the US's nuclear weapons, NBC News reported on Wednesday, adding that the request startled his advisers and was followed soon after with Secretary of State Rex Tillerson calling him a "moron."

http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-tenfold-increase-us-nuclear-stockpile-tillerson-moron-2017-10?IR=T

Cheerful Spring

North Korea foreign minister: Trump has 'lit the wick' of war

US President Donald Trump has "lit the wick of the war" against North Korea, a Russian state news agency quoted North Korea's foreign minister as saying on Wednesday.

The statement follows weeks of escalating tensions between North Korea and the United States, fueled by Pyongyang's repeated nuclear tests and Trump's tough talk.
Speaking to Russia's state-run TASS news agency, North Korea's Foreign Minister Ri Yong Ho cited Trump's September speech to the United Nations General Assembly in New York as the tipping point.
http://us.cnn.com/2017/10/11/politics/north-korea-trump-lit-wick-of-war/index.html

Gatling

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

President Donald Trump wasn't happy with the steady decrease in the US stockpile of nuclear weapons since the 1960s.

So, over the summer, he asked instead for a tenfold increase in the US's nuclear weapons, NBC News reported on Wednesday

Debunked -


Mattis Rebukes report.


Defense Secretary Jim Mattis rebuked media reports that President Donald Trump wanted to increase the U.S. nuclear arsenal "tenfold" after a meeting with defense officials in July.

Mattis, who does not often comment on the president's statements, found it necessary to put out his own statement Wednesday, saying, "Recent reports that the president called for an increase in the U.S. nuclear arsenal are absolutely false."

"This kind of erroneous reporting is irresponsible," the former Marine general said"



So other than news dumps nothing new to add

MadYaker

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

President Donald Trump said Wednesday that he and Secretary of State Rex Tillerson have "different" views on handling North Korea, but he emphasized that "ultimately, my attitude is the one that matters, isn't it?"

"I think, perhaps, I feel stronger and tougher on that subject than other people," President Trump said, "but I listen to everybody.

"Ultimately, I'll do what's right for the United States — and, really, what's right for the world.
Because that's really a world problem. That's beyond just the United States.

"That's a world problem — and it's a problem that has to be solved."

Rex is probably going to get the boot soon. Trump is going to surround himself with people who not stop him going to war.

Jesus you're like a broken record. Trump can fire whoever he likes and surround himself with whoever he likes. Congress still won't give him the go ahead to start a war with NK that would result in the deaths of tens of thousands of people. NK must hit first, but they won't.

Also, I think if Tillerson had his way he would have resigned long ago. But every high profile departure does serious damage to the administration and so Trumps babysitters have managed to convince Tillerson to stay in the job, since Trump doesn't seem to care either way. Bob Corker's comments here give a good insight into what's going on in the white house. Basically a daily routine of trying to contain Trump and stop from doing too much damage.

flaneur

MadYaker:

The president has near absolute control of the nuclear response. It's nothing to do with congress. There are quite literally almost no checks and balances on this.

gitzy16v

flaneur wrote: »

:

The president has near absolute control of the nuclear response. .

I doubt it.

flaneur

I'd suggest you actually read the legal position and protocols in place. Because of the need for a 'hair trigger response' during the Cold War, the US President has absolutely enormous leeway over when to use a nuclear response.

Unless someone flatly refuses an order, he can have nuclear weapons launched within minutes and there is deliberately no way of cancelling the order once it's keyed into the system by the military, as effectively it's designed to assume that maybe the US Government is gone - knocked out by a nuclear strike.

He doesn't have to declare war, all he has to do is perceive a threat.

It's an incredibly dangerous system that never foresaw a president like this.

Congress has no role whatsoever in this and the whole process takes minutes from command codes being given to missiles being on their way.

I'm not saying this for the sake of having an argument on a thread. The American system around command of nuclear launches is highly reliant on the fact that the president is a sensible, stable person and puts huge amounts of authority in one person's hands. All of this was to do with Cold War madness and a need to ensure the USSR would never strike as they would be assured of mutual destruction if they did.

The system was never really updated for the modern era and the designers never, ever, ever contemplated anything like the Whitehouse we have today.

It is genuinely a dangerous and very stupid situation.

I didn't believe the system could be as badly designed as this, but I read into it and .. wow! It's just jaw dropping stuff.

The presidential codes don't even go in at top level in the military, they're communicated to a mid-level command/control centre in some secure location somewhere. The logic is that the decision has been made. It's not about a discussion with the joint chiefs or something. It's a literal direct order as Commander-in-Chief.

Let's just hope the US military is capable of second guessing a presidential order.

Kermit.de.frog

MadYaker

flaneur wrote: »

MadYaker:

The president has near absolute control of the nuclear response. It's nothing to do with congress. There are quite literally almost no checks and balances on this.

I'm not talking about a nuclear response. I'm talking about a declaration of war. If you think Trump is going to go on a solo run and launch nukes without NK doing it first you're dreaming.

Cheerful Spring

MadYaker wrote: »

I'm not talking about a nuclear response. I'm talking about a declaration of war. If you think Trump is going to go on a solo run and launch nukes without NK doing it first you're dreaming.

America is engaged in war against Yemen and Congress has not given it's approval. Trump also send troops to Syria and he did not seek Congress approval. Trump does not need congress to have a war. He can launch a preemptive strike if he desires. Trump will likely just inform politicians republicans and democrats he is about to do this and this will be enough for him to get away with it. I not saying he not ask for congress approval, but if he does this, the North Koreans will know his coming to attack them. What likely to happen Trump will try taking out NK missile tests in the near future, thus kick starting a war.

Cheerful Spring

Gatling wrote: »

Debunked -


Mattis Rebukes report.


Defense Secretary Jim Mattis rebuked media reports that President Donald Trump wanted to increase the U.S. nuclear arsenal "tenfold" after a meeting with defense officials in July.

Mattis, who does not often comment on the president's statements, found it necessary to put out his own statement Wednesday, saying, "Recent reports that the president called for an increase in the U.S. nuclear arsenal are absolutely false."

"This kind of erroneous reporting is irresponsible," the former Marine general said"



So other than news dumps nothing new to add

Trump stated in Twitter Tweets he wanted to boost the nuclear weapon stockpile. While NBC may have lost their minds or lied to sell a story Trump said tenfold, it not totally false.

Gatling

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

America is engaged in war against Yemen and Congress has not given it's approval. Trump also send troops to Syria and he did not seek Congress approval.

No troops were in Syria before trump came to power ,
And trump just can't wake up and say good morning folks I'm Bombing a random country today ,
If that was the case how come no other president of America had done it ,

Odd no

Cheerful Spring

MadYaker wrote: »

Also, I think if Tillerson had his way he would have resigned long ago. But every high profile departure does serious damage to the administration and so Trumps babysitters have managed to convince Tillerson to stay in the job, since Trump doesn't seem to care either way. Bob Corker's comments here give a good insight into what's going on in the white house. Basically a daily routine of trying to contain Trump and stop from doing too much damage.

Trump is President. He can do what he likes. The people working for him can give him advice, but he can just ignore this if he chooses Trump has told Tillerson he wasting his time talking to North Korea and only one thing will work to stop them. Anyone with a brain can see he is signalling a war is highly likely.

Cheerful Spring

Gatling wrote: »

No troops were in Syria before trump came to power ,
And trump just can't wake up and say good morning folks I'm Bombing a random country today ,
If that was the case how come no other president of America had done it ,

Odd no

American is bombing Houti rebels in Yemen from the air. Where is Congress authorization for this? American troops have set up makeshift bases in Syria and Congress never authorized this. Trump can go war to protect American interests. Did Obama ask Congress for approval when they decided to take out Osama bin laden in Pakistan?

cnocbui

Gatling wrote: »

No troops were in Syria before trump came to power ,
And trump just can't wake up and say good morning folks I'm Bombing a random country today ,
If that was the case how come no other president of America had done it ,

Odd no

From my time watching the Cold War transpire, It was always my understanding that the President of the US can act at will if he believes it in the national interest. With MAD and the possibility of a preemptive nuclear attack, a President would have mere minutes to make a decision and issue orders and certainly would never have time to consult with Congress. He just does not need any other bodies or persons approval to initiate military action, he/she only needs approval to sustain military action beyond an initial response.

The POTUS is Commander in Chief of all military forces, they do what he/she says, when it is said.

https://www.quora.com/Does-the-President-need-congressional-approval-to-take-military-action-Is-it-legal-for-the-President-to-fight-a-war-that-has-not-been-declared-by-Congress-Send-troops-to-a-foreign-country-without-Congressional-approval

4068ac1elhodqr

cnocbui wrote: »

...would have mere minutes to make a decision and issue orders and certainly would never have time to consult with Congress.

Between something lifting off in NK and arriving on Guam, read somewhere it's only about 14 minutes, certainly not a lot of time. Would also have to assess if was a dummy or not.

Zebra3

Gatling wrote: »

No troops were in Syria before trump came to power ,
And trump just can't wake up and say good morning folks I'm Bombing a random country today ,
If that was the case how come no other president of America had done it ,

Odd no

Give over with your lies, will you?

Have you no shame at all with your endless propaganda?


https://www.economist.com/news/books-and-arts/21714972-how-unremitting-decade-long-bombing-campaign-affected-small-southeast-asian

Gatling

Zebra3 wrote: »

endless propaganda

Totally agree your just a anti america propagandist


But hey

Gatling

Earth quake detected in NK close to a known nuclear test site .

4068ac1elhodqr

Gatling wrote: »

Earth quake detected in NK close to a known nuclear test site .

Only M 2.9 (e.g. Kim falling off his noodle bar stool), 23km NE of Sungjibaegam, 2017-10-12 16:41:08 (UTC) 41.379°N 129.012°E Depth 5.0 km.

Friday 13th tomorrow, and the 100th anniversary of the Fatima thingymajig.