US considering Preemptive Strike against North Korea.

Gatling

nacho libre wrote: »

For you there will always be an extenuating circumstance/ context to cite when it comes to discussion of US war crimes- that is if you even admit they are.

Did I agree with the war in iraq -No have i stated it on Boards Yes ,
Do I agree with the atomic bombs on Japan yes ,
Do I agree America shouldn't bomb civilians No have I stated it on Boards Yes,

Should I have to repeat America did this and America did that No ,
Do others unfortunately yes sad but true

Time to move on

nacho libre

Gatling wrote: »

What exactly are you spouting about ,

Did I agree with the war in iraq -No have i stated it on Boards Yes ,
Do I agree with the atomic bombs on Japan yes ,
Do I agree America shouldn't bomb civilians No have I stated it on Boards Yes,

Should I have to repeat America did this and America did that No ,

Time to move on

So you therefore also agree then that America has no moral authority to act as the world's policeman give the amount of crimes against other nations they have committed over the last fifty years? Also if you acknowledge this you should be at least very skeptical of their foreign policy narrative on any given event. Otherwise it's akin to trusting in someone blindly you know to be a proven liar.

Gatling

nacho libre wrote: »

So you therefore also agree then that America has no moral authority to act as the world's policeman give the amount of crimes against other nations they have committed over the last fifty years? .

Where have I said other wise ,



Exactly.

PREG1967

Gatling wrote: »

Where have I said other wise ,



Exactly.

if not the US who will be the worlds policeman?

nacho libre

Gatling wrote: »

Where have I said other wise ,



Exactly.

How about almost every thread where you go out of your way to avoid acknowledging US war crimes.. So colour me surprised. :eek:
It seems you actually largely agree with your friends yourself isit and Zebra 3:D

Gatling

nacho libre wrote: »

How about almost every thread

Where someone​ goes on about murica did this and murica did that,
While been completely deaf and dumb about what russia, China, Iran , England, France and many other countries did over the last 50+ years​,


Do try harder much harder

Gatling

Meanwhile in North Korea .


"North Korea's vice-foreign minister told the BBC Pyongyang would continue to test missiles and would launch a pre-emptive nuclear strike if it thought the US was planning an attack.

Foreign ministry spokesman Lu Kang said China opposed words or actions that could further raise tension"

The sooner little kim is removed the better a unified Korea would benefit all involved with the exception of China,


*Mods can this thread be moved to international politics forum as it's clearly turned into discussion on Foreign politics* please

nacho libre

Gatling wrote: »

Where someone​ goes on about murica did this and murica did that,
While been completely deaf and dumb about what russia, China, Iran , England, France and many other countries did over the last 50+ years​,

I don't have to try Gatling.
That's what I've been saying all along, I don't try to minimize the crimes of one nation by pointing out what other nations did. There are no good guys, only powerful nations with interests, who seek to maximize their interest at the expense of the other.

nacho libre

Gatling wrote: »

Foreign ministry spokesman Lu Kang said China opposed words or actions that could further raise tension"

The sooner little kim is removed the better a unified Korea would benefit all involved with the exception of China,

I think the Americans and Chinese will eventually agree a plan to covertly get rid of Kim for this reason. The Chinese will see it as the least worst outcome

CoolHandBandit

Reading reports on Twitter that the Chinese are setting up massive temporary hospitals​ on their border with NK as well as amassing large numbers of troops.

PREG1967

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

Reading reports on Twitter that the Chinese are setting up massive temporary hospitals​ on their border with NK as well as amassing large numbers of troops.

link or no post?

Gatling

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

Reading reports on Twitter that the Chinese are setting up massive temporary hospitals​ on their border with NK as well as amassing large numbers of troops.

Unfortunately it's a very common situation Everytime north Korea does a weapon test china deploys troops to the border ,
There's been around 150,000 Chinese troops on the border since last week

CoolHandBandit

PREG1967 wrote: »

link or no post?

It's in various newspapers as well as Twitter. What do you mean by "no post"?

PREG1967

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

It's in various newspapers as well as Twitter. What do you mean by "no post"?

i mean its not valid unless backed up

CoolHandBandit

Anywho.....


I see South Korean presidential candidates clashed last night in a TV debate over the planned U.S.-supplied Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) anti-missile system, which has angered China. Can see why the Chinese are concerned but given the present situation surely it's only prudent.

PREG1967

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

Anywho.....


I see South Korean presidential candidates clashed last night in a TV debate over the planned U.S.-supplied Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) anti-missile system, which has angered China. Can see why the Chinese are concerned but given the present situation surely it's only prudent.

what with the SK premier in prison lock down anything could happen

Samaris

So, apparently the Carl Vinsen carrier group wasn't actually going to North Korea and the US..more or less lied to everyone about it for no really good reason that I can see.

Can anyone explain what on earth happened there in a way that makes some sort of sense? I mean, either send it and let it sit there looking threatening or say that it will be sent but first it will do whatever it's doing in Australia or don't say they're sending it at all. What is the advantage to saying you're sending it, then sending it off to Australia for its exercises and giving the rest of the world the apparently deliberate impression of doing the other thing, requiring McMaster and Mattis to lose credibility in all this as well? There's puffing up feathers and then there's proclaiming that your feathers are just so bigly but they're in your other coat.

Am I missing something here?

Edit: And judging by the Fox and Friends interview, he can't tell the difference between any of the Kims over the past seventy years (maybe he reckons he's a Highlander) and also reckons that Korea was China's. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/20/donald-trump-accused-shocking-ignorance-falls-chinese-claim/ and http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-north-korea-leader-kim-jong-un-not-know-name-suggest-fox-friends-a7691346.html

Where's that facepalm Picard meme...

Captain Chaos

Samaris wrote: »

Am I missing something here?

Yes, the strike group is going to Korea but they have to finish their training obligations with Australia first. For some reasons those exercises could not be cancelled.

Discodog

Samaris wrote: »

So, apparently the Carl Vinsen carrier group wasn't actually going to North Korea and the US..more or less lied to everyone about it for no really good reason that I can see.

Can anyone explain what on earth happened there in a way that makes some sort of sense? I mean, either send it and let it sit there looking threatening or say that it will be sent but first it will do whatever it's doing in Australia or don't say they're sending it at all. What is the advantage to saying you're sending it, then sending it off to Australia for its exercises and giving the rest of the world the apparently deliberate impression of doing the other thing, requiring McMaster and Mattis to lose credibility in all this as well? There's puffing up feathers and then there's proclaiming that your feathers are just so bigly but they're in your other coat.

Am I missing something here?

Edit: And judging by the Fox and Friends interview, he can't tell the difference between any of the Kims over the past seventy years (maybe he reckons he's a Highlander) and also reckons that Korea was China's. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/20/donald-trump-accused-shocking-ignorance-falls-chinese-claim/ and http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-north-korea-leader-kim-jong-un-not-know-name-suggest-fox-friends-a7691346.html

Where's that facepalm Picard meme...

If you are being threatened with a pre-emptive strike or you may have to take sudden surprise action, you won't tell the enemy where & when you are deploying resources.

I am no fan of America but someone will have to stop NK. I don't think that the Chinese will. China could of stopped this years ago but happily sat by & let NK develop a Nuke. People are blaming Obama but this situation is totally the fault of China.

namloc1980

I see Tillerson was threatening Iran yesterday. The Trump administration seem desperate to start as many wars as they can. An aggressive and unchecked US is certainly a threat.

CoolHandBandit

Discodog wrote: »

If you are being threatened with a pre-emptive strike or you may have to take sudden surprise action, you won't tell the enemy where & when you are deploying resources.

I am no fan of America but someone will have to stop NK. I don't think that the Chinese will. China could of stopped this years ago but happily sat by & let NK develop a Nuke. People are blaming Obama but this situation is totally the fault of China.

I disagree with your point on China not wanting to stop NK. I think they can and they will. If they don't the US will deal with NK and China aren't going to stand for the US on their southern border.

Also i think Trump being the ultimate buffoon he is won't want to be seen as weak with that stupid false claim he made about the ships headed towards Korean waters and will possibly test NK resolve with something over the next few days.

Discodog

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

I disagree with your point on China not wanting to stop NK. I think they can and they will. If they don't the US will deal with NK and China aren't going to stand for the US on their southern border.

Also i think Trump being the ultimate buffoon he is won't want to be seen as weak with that stupid false claim he made about the ships headed towards Korean waters and will possibly test NK resolve with something over the next few days.

So why did they allow NK to develop a Nuke in the first place ? China were the country with influence & the ability to sanction NK but they happily sat back & allowed them to develop the Nuke. Now NK believe that they are in a position of strength & any negotiation will be much harder.

CoolHandBandit

Discodog wrote: »

So why did they allow NK to develop a Nuke in the first place ? China were the country with influence & the ability to sanction NK but they happily sat back & allowed them to develop the Nuke. Now NK believe that they are in a position of strength & any negotiation will be much harder.

Because the US had Barrack Obama as president and now they have Donald Trump and more note worthy mad dog Matterson in charge of the military. I honestly believe these guys are crazy enough to go all out and invade/nuke NK within Trumps term in office and the Chinese know it.

NK long term is going to be a valuable piece of real estate in the fight between China and the US. Frankly China has a choice, do nothing and eventually watch the US put military bases miles from their border or do something now and prevent that.

PREG1967

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

Because the US had Barrack Obama as president and now they have Donald Trump and more note worthy mad dog Matterson in charge of the military. I honestly believe these guys are crazy enough to go all out and invade/nuke NK within Trumps term in office and the Chinese know it.

NK long term is going to be a valuable piece of real estate in the fight between China and the US. Frankly China has a choice, do nothing and eventually watch the US put military bases miles from their border or do something now and prevent that.

They did their first nuke test when george bush was president

Zebra3

Gatling wrote: »

But it north Korea shoot first .


Let's Stick with the present ,

I assume you mean if.

If NK shoots first that's different, but the title of thread refers to the US committing a war crime.

And post-1945 history shows that US usually attacks other countries, not the other way around.

PREG1967

Zebra3 wrote: »

I assume you mean if.

If NK shoots first that's different, but the title of thread refers to the US committing a war crime.

And post-1945 history shows that US usually attacks other countries, not the other way around.

North koreans will rise up to take back their freedoms

nacho libre

namloc1980 wrote: »

I see Tillerson was threatening Iran yesterday. The Trump administration seem desperate to start as many wars as they can. An aggressive and unchecked US is certainly a threat.

Yet Iran has apparently met all it's obligations under the Nuclear agreement. I suppose what it's really about is Iran's involvement in Syria.

Zebra3

PREG1967 wrote: »

North koreans will rise up to take back their freedoms

Hopefully Americans do the same thing.

CoolHandBandit

PREG1967 wrote: »

North koreans will rise up to take back their freedoms

When?

PREG1967

CoolHandBandit wrote: »

When?

On the continuum that is human history 50 years is not much really, they will get there, the truth always comes out