US considering Preemptive Strike against North Korea.

stevedublin

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

You can tell the quality of a poster by their insightful rebuttals.

oh, the irony!

Cheerful Spring

Gatling wrote: »

No mention of millions you claimed odd but expected

6 -7 million you quoted that would have meant over two thirds of the population which was at 9 million in 1950 and about 8 .5 million in 1953.


Ooops

Either way wiping out 2 to 3 million citizens in just one war is a genocide. How many American civilians has the North killed?

Imagine America wiping out close to 70 per cent of the Irish population!

Gatling

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Either way wiping out 2 to 3 million citizens in just one war is a genocide

What 2-3 million are you claiming now

And what 70% of who's population

Dohnjoe

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

nobody has any idea what happened to him after he was arrested. he disappeared into a black hole until he reappeared in a vegetative state. almost like the norks have something to hide.

Indeed, he was sentenced to hard labour for stealing a sign - not surprising he was in an extremely bad state. N Korea is notorious for the severity of it's punishments and prison (gulag) conditions.

Cheerful Spring

Gatling wrote: »

What 2-3 million are you claiming now

And what 70% of who's population

Western statistics estimate 25 to 30 % of the north civilian population died due to
American air bombings, massacres and crossfire. That's 2 to 3 million innocent people that died. Our population is 4 million+ do the math.

ohnonotgmail

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Western statistics estimate 25 to 30 % of the north civilian population died due to
American air bombings, massacres and crossfire. That's 2 to 3 million innocent people that died. Our population is 4 million+ do the math.

that "statistic" in the article you linked to was 20% not 25 to 30. are you using other statistics?

Gatling

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Western statistics estimate 25 to 30 % of the north civilian population died due to
American air bombings, massacres and crossfire. That's 2 to 3 million innocent people that died. Our population is 4 million+ do the math.

Based off a single quote ,not fact ,

Less fiction and conspiracy

Gringo180

Apologies I was using a 5th of todays population in N.Korea. It was "only" 1.8 million civilians incinerated by saturation bombing or burned from the inside out by napalm attacks from the oh so brave B-29 bombers of the U.S airforce.

They also attacked civilian infastructure in bombing the dams which flooded farms and ruined crops. Thats a massive war crime but its okay because it was America doing the bombing.

Gatling

Gringo180 wrote: »

Apologies I was using a 5th of todays population in N.Korea. It was "only" 1.8 million

Still wrong it's not a difficult excerise

Cheerful Spring

Gatling wrote: »

Based off a single quote ,not fact ,

Less fiction and conspiracy

I not nutty like you guys 20 % 25% 30% why does it matter this still millions of civilians who died. But you guys support imperialism and do not care about numbers or people.

General Le May a top US general admitted to 20 per cent, if they said 20 per cent it was much higher.

Gringo180

Gatling wrote: »

Still wrong it's not a difficult excerise

1.8 million is a fifth of 9 million.

Infini

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Either way wiping out 2 to 3 million citizens in just one war is a genocide. How many American civilians has the North killed?

Imagine America wiping out close to 70 per cent of the Irish population!

Well lets see the first korean war took place in 1950 less than 5 years after the end of WW2 which ended with causalties exceeding 25MILLION not to mention Japan getting nuked to boot. Not only that but you forget it was NORTH KOREA that started it with China and Soviet Russia backing them covertly so they basically brought it on themselves the first time because they got too cocky and thought they could use force to take the south.

War is hell no matter what anyone says one things go hot all bets are off. While you can argue about genocide and other issues the fact is this: South Korea deserves to be defended at all costs, all the belligerence has been from the North lets not forget they shelled a south Korean town a few years back as well as sunk a south Korean vessel unprovoked as well. They've been the belligerent ones over and over and if they simply had listened to the Chinese when they told them years ago to keep their heads down they wouldn't be under any threat to begin with.

Gatling

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

I not nutty like you guys 20 % 25% 30% why does it matter this still millions of civilians who died.

Stop with the nonsense the figures topped at around 500,000 for a country who invaded their neighbour followed by the Chinese ,

Gatling

Gringo180 wrote: »

1.8 million is a fifth of 9 million.

Comedy central ,

Did you include the Chinese army in that

Gringo180

President Clinton got the North Koreans to sign up to the NPT in the mid 90s. They then pulled out of that in 2004 when that buffoon from Texas George W Bush named the North Koreans in the axis of evil. He also named Iraq, Syria, and Libya in this axis of evil and looked what happened there.

Cheerful Spring

Infini wrote: »

Well lets see the first korean war took place in 1950 less than 5 years after the end of WW2 which ended with causalties exceeding 25MILLION not to mention Japan getting nuked to boot. Not only that but you forget it was NORTH KOREA that started it with China and Soviet Russia backing them covertly so they basically brought it on themselves the first time because they got too cocky and thought they could use force to take the south.

War is hell no matter what anyone says one things go hot all bets are off. While you can argue about genocide and other issues the fact is this: South Korea deserves to be defended at all costs, all the belligerence has been from the North lets not forget they shelled a south Korean town a few years back as well as sunk a south Korean vessel unprovoked as well. They've been the belligerent ones over and over and if they simply had listened to the Chinese when they told them years ago to keep their heads down they wouldn't be under any threat to begin with.

Nonsense. Korean war and it was America who put boots on the ground. China and Soviet Union did not attack South Korea and did not even do it during the Vietnam war. Less time watching Rambo, will do you good.

Dohnjoe

Infini wrote: »

Well lets see the first korean war took place in 1950 less than 5 years after the end of WW2 which ended with causalties exceeding 25MILLION not to mention Japan getting nuked to boot. Not only that but you forget it was NORTH KOREA that started it with China and Soviet Russia backing them covertly so they basically brought it on themselves the first time because they got too cocky and thought they could use force to take the south.

War is hell no matter what anyone says one things go hot all bets are off. While you can argue about genocide and other issues the fact is this: South Korea deserves to be defended at all costs, all the belligerence has been from the North lets not forget they shelled a south Korean town a few years back as well as sunk a south Korean vessel unprovoked as well. They've been the belligerent ones over and over and if they simply had listened to the Chinese when they told them years ago to keep their heads down they wouldn't be under any threat to begin with.

Indeed, the allies also inflicted an immense, horrendous amount of casualties on Germany and on Japan

The governments of those countries do not intern the populace in gulags using decades old wars as an excuse. Even if they did there would be no defense if they did

Irish Praetorian

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Nonsense. Korean war and it was America who put boots on the ground. China and Soviet Union did not attack South Korea and did not even do it during the Vietnam war. Less time watching Rambo, will do you good.

I'm a little confused about the point you are trying to make; are you angry that the US defended one of its allies, that they did it in a bloody way or that they managed to keep South Korea independent?

Gringo180

Gatling wrote: »

Comedy central ,

Did you include the Chinese army in that

You keep swallowing what western media tell you sheeple. I suppose they didnt blow the dams in N.Korea to smithereens or the Sinchon massacre was a myth where the South Koreans and U.S killed around 35 thousand civilians in a little over a month.

Cheerful Spring

Gatling wrote: »

Stop with the nonsense the figures topped at around 500,000 for a country who invaded their neighbour followed by the Chinese ,

20 per North death/ civilian stat was told to the press by General Le May a famous US general. It's not a conspiracy against America.

Infini

Irish Praetorian wrote: »

I'm a little confused about the point you are trying to make; are you angry that the US defended one of its allies, that they did it in a bloody way or that they managed to keep South Korea independent?

To be honest he sounds like a muppet who doesn't read history or historical facts and believes the tinfoil hat conspiracies. America was pulling out of South Korea until the North Attacked it was the Norths belligerence that caused the US to go back into Korea.

Gringo180 wrote: »

You keep swallowing what western media tell you sheeple. I suppose they didnt blow the dams in N.Korea to smithereens or the Sinchon massacre was a myth where the South Koreans and U.S killed around 35 thousand civilians in a little over a month.

Yeah noone likes these incidents when they happen but as I said before War is hell but BOTH sides would be at it's too easy to sit in the armchair and hold one side accountable for this stuff but not the other one. You highlight the dams being blown but those damns would have been powering miltary installations too which would make them targets. In fights for survival which the Korean was one of the ugliest after WW2 do you think the enemy wouldnt be doing the same thing if they could.

The North brought what happened on itself by being the instigator regardless of what happened thats a historical FACT not some tinfoil hat conspiracy.

Cheerful Spring

Irish Praetorian wrote: »

I'm a little confused about the point you are trying to make; are you angry that the US defended one of its allies, that they did it in a bloody way or that they managed to keep South Korea independent?

I think America should mind it's own business. America should have let those people with the same culture and customs fight a war for unification. Instead we got war that lasted longer and wiped out more innocent people so America could have another puppet state in the 50's

Irish Praetorian

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

I think America should mind it's own business. America should have let those people with the same culture and customs fight a war for unification. Instead we got war that lasted longer and wiped out more innocent people so America could have another puppet state in the 50's

And what exactly constitutes 'minding it's own business'? Would for example a flow of money be considered meddling? Would a flow of weapons be meddling? Would it be meddling if America sent weapons but not meddling if the Soviet Union did so?

Cheerful Spring

Infini wrote: »

To be honest he sounds like a muppet who doesn't read history or historical facts and believes the tinfoil hat conspiracies. America was pulling out of South Korea until the North Attacked it was the Norths belligerence that caused the US to go back into Korea.

Who was America protecting, the North people are Korean just like the South. The only people the North was fighting was the leadership and the army not the majority of the civilians. American propaganda has brainwashed people.

allthedoyles

I wonder what Putin thinks of all this ?

Gringo180

Infini wrote: »

To be honest he sounds like a muppet who doesn't read history or historical facts and believes the tinfoil hat conspiracies. America was pulling out of South Korea until the North Attacked it was the Norths belligerence that caused the US to go back into Korea.



Yeah noone likes these incidents when they happen but as I said before War is hell but BOTH sides would be at it's too easy to sit in the armchair and hold one side accountable for this stuff but not the other one. You highlight the dams being blown but those damns would have been powering miltary installations too which would make them targets. In fights for survival which the Korean was one of the ugliest after WW2 do you think the enemy wouldnt be doing the same thing if they could.

The North brought what happened on itself by being the instigator regardless of what happened thats a historical FACT not some tinfoil hat conspiracy.

They were in no way powering any military installations. They were left until the very last to be hit because everything else was flattened. It was an attack against a civilian population a blatant war crime as was the use of napalm.

Infini

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Who was America protecting, the North people are Korean just like the South. The only people the North was fighting was the leadership and the army not the majority of the civilians. American propaganda has brainwashed people.

I don't read propaganda I read actual historical stuff and look at the patterns. North Korea is the kind of state that locks up entire families in prison camps for 3 generations and is basically the type of ****hole you wouldn't touch with a barge-pole.

allthedoyles wrote: »

I wonder what Putin thinks of all this ?

He's smart enough to keep out of it. He knows full well that NK is not worth protecting expecially since they're bringing it on themselves. One of the few things you dont mess around with or throw out stupid threats like NK do are Nukes and NK seems intent on threatening america with them.

Gringo180 wrote: »

They were in no way powering any military installations. They were left until the very last to be hit because everything else was flattened. It was an attack against civilian population a blatant war crime as was the use of napalm.

And yet NK lock their own dissenters up in camps in conditions comparable to Nazi Germany's concentration camps to this day. This is also back in a different time with different conditions. Lets not forget that this was more than 70 years ago nearly. Times have changed. People across the world have changed. NK is still the same as it was decades ago and is one of the last stalinist dicatorships on the planet that has a cult of personality that treats fatty the third like hes a god.

When it comes down to it the US isnt perfect but at least it can be held to account in this day and age if something is done intentionally malicious. NK has none of those compunctures. It treats its own people like slaves and lives in a time bubble only to prop up a small elite. Its is FAR worse and far more malicious than anything the US could ever do expecially since those in power there act with no interest for people at all.

Honestly get your head out of your hole on this your position is completely untenuable.

Hastentoadd

allthedoyles wrote: »

I wonder what Putin thinks of all this ?

I suggest he would be as bewildered as I am

Cheerful Spring

Infini wrote: »

I don't read propaganda I read actual historical stuff and look at the patterns. North Korea is the kind of state that locks up entire families in prison camps for 3 generations and is basically the type of ****hole you wouldn't touch with a barge-pole.
/QUOTE]

Historical stuff is not historical, if you only read and believe one side. I have looked at both sides over the years and what was said.

America also lists Iran, Syria, Russia and China as enemies too? Why is Saudi Arabia not on this list, Ukraine, Israel, Philippines, can list more they have wiped out their populations for control of land.

Gatling

Gringo180 wrote: »

You keep

Debunking wild claims repeatedly