US considering Preemptive Strike against North Korea.

aloyisious

Looking at the issue of NK having N-tipped missiles from a different slant, if it's a fact that China supplied at least part of the NK system to the leadership there, is it possible that this is a regional power-grab or ploy by China using a puppet as a bargaining tool?

China is at present building an artificial island chain in the South China Sea, an area it sees as a strategic zone. Other large economic groups and states don't like the idea of the islands being built in international maritime waters as they see how the islands would be strategic control points around which national territorial water rights could be claimed in the future, denying freedom of maritime traffic.

Glance back to the 1962 Cuba affair, whereby a deal to resolve the "no missiles in our backyard" issue was reached between the US and Russia on pullback of missiles by both sides. China itself [in theory] shouldn't be too happy whereby NK [with a strange leadership] has the missiles and freedom to threaten to attack a state thousands of miles away with, given that NK is a neighbour not so far away. I'm wondering if this is another Chinese thirty-year plan, so to speak, whereby it may withdraw the NK missile system for a deal on the islands it's building, or a better trade deal? There's also the issue of the other "China".

I don't imagine that the other regional nations are happy with a loose-cannon leadership having long range N-tipped missiles locally given the local history of wars between neighbours; Vietnam V China for one, and would be happy for the status-quo ante be back in situ. I can't see the NK leadership putting up too much resistance to a missile pullback by China if China said we'll continue to feed and bankroll you if you play along, even try get UN sanctions lessened; but if you don't, then all deals are off, including our "respect your borders" deal.

Manic Moran

archer22 wrote: »

There is also the reality that the US General McArthur planned a nuclear attack on China in the 1950s...luckily he was removed from his position....why did he want to destroy the PRC ? for what possible advantage? getting rid of an obstacle and hindarence to America .

He did not want to destroy the PRC. In the 1950s, A-bombs were considered to be as much tactical and operational level weapons as strategic. It's part of the reason the US Army had drawn down so far: Why buy tanks and troops when you can just A-bomb the enemy's tanks and troops?

As a result, insofar as there was any serious planning done as to where to use them, the proposals were related only to the Chinese military capability in the Korean theater. They included military targets in the parts of China which could affect Korea, as well as military targets in Korea as part of the localised war, but there was never any intent to destroy the PRC as a nation.

Gatling

Russia drew up plans to nuke china ,

Odd but true ,

Russia's biggest fear is been over run not been nuked

Cheerful Spring

August 15th or 16th we may see another missile test? Unknown if they would risk firing at Guam. If they do we could be seeing a war in a couple of days?

4068ac1elhodqr

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

August 15th or 16th we may see another missile test? Unknown if they would risk firing at Guam. If they do we could be seeing a war in a couple of days?

Sorry to disappoint, but no chance of 'war'.

They do more than a dozen each year, so unless it's the actual 4 laden horsemen themselves prepared and fired directly towards the direction of Guam, any other test can be dismissed as a 'test'. The next (singular) one may well be sub-based, but unlikely to be any direct threat, other than to fish.

Stocks are up again, gold is down and one of the tabloids report it's still only Def' L4. The stalemate will continue until Kim eats one too many burgers.

In fact, there is more risk to civilisation from 'AI bots', according to the Facepage's boy. So too the threat posed from B' plague as recently discovered in burrows in Arizona.

Pelvis

Evie Big Troop wrote: »

Sorry to disappoint, but no chance of 'war'.

They do more than a dozen each year, so unless it's the actual 4 laden horsemen themselves prepared and fired directly towards the direction of Guam, any other test can be dismissed as a 'test'. The next (singular) one may well be sub-based, but unlikely to be any direct threat, other than to fish.

Stocks are up again, gold is down and one of the tabloids report it's still only Def' L4. The stalemate will continue until Kim eats one too many burgers.

In fact, there is more risk to civilisation from 'AI bots', according to the Facepage's boy. So too the threat posed from B' plague as recently discovered in burrows in Arizona.

Trump has backed himself into a corner. He's said he will retaliate if NK launch missiles towards Guam, if they do and he does nothing, he'll look extremely foolish and weak. I'm glad you're confident that he'll be happy with that result, I am not.

BillyBobBS

Trump has played this beautifully. NK haven't fired a missile or carried out any tests since the president warned them of the result of their actions. We needed that kind of strong leadership over the last 8 years and we got Barrack "talk show" Obama.

ArchXStanton

BillyBobBS wrote: »

Trump has played this beautifully. NK haven't fired a missile or carried out any tests since the president warned them of the result of their actions. We needed that kind of strong leadership over the last 8 years and we got Barrack "talk show" Obama.

They don't give a fiddler's about the US,im actually expecting a new test in the coming days..

The_Valeyard

Pelvis wrote: »

Trump has backed himself into a corner. He's said he will retaliate if NK launch missiles towards Guam, if they do and he does nothing, he'll look extremely foolish and weak. I'm glad you're confident that he'll be happy with that result, I am not.

Could simply be shooting down a NK missile on a nearby trajectory towards Guam.

4068ac1elhodqr

Pelvis wrote: »

Trump has backed himself into a corner. He's said he will retaliate if NK launch missiles towards Guam, if they do and he does nothing, he'll look extremely foolish and weak. I'm glad you're confident that he'll be happy with that result, I am not.

There's two very, very, big 'if's' in there.

Obviously if they do send the four (any less will be removed) 2,000miles directly to Guam and they actually manage to land anywhere near, it's generally accepted that then Kim and his big hat friends will be 'no more' shortly after those 14 or so minutes. Even Kimmy isn't that stupid.

Avatar MIA

Pelvis wrote: »

Trump has backed himself into a corner. He's said he will retaliate if NK launch missiles towards Guam, if they do and he does nothing, he'll look extremely foolish and weak. I'm glad you're confident that he'll be happy with that result, I am not.

Trump and future tense look foolish? That ship has sailed.

archer22

BillyBobBS wrote: »

Trump has played this beautifully. NK haven't fired a missile or carried out any tests since the president warned them of the result of their actions. We needed that kind of strong leadership over the last 8 years and we got Barrack "talk show" Obama.

Amazing take on it

Most commenting online that I have seen seem to think Kim has won game set and match in this altercation.

The likely reason Trump and Kim have quietened down now is the pretty clear warning they both got from China a few days ago when they stated that if NK attacked first it would be on its own and that if America attacked first it would also have China to contend with.
Both seem to have shut up after that...In fact Trump seems to have done a Pivot to Venezuela now in frustration.

4068ac1elhodqr

Seems like a stalemate situation is likely now for the foreseeable future.
Yes the NK may well do further test, but as long as they don't target anyone/region 'directly' this is stalemate.

If anything, NK has got further harder sanctions against it now, from China.
Guam has increased as a tourism destination, and the US have increased their shield in Asia.

The only small risk is the symbolic eclipse date for possible 'over-testing'.

Correction on earlier, it wasn't facepage boy. It was (fellow bn'aire) Musk, that said 'AI' poses a greater threat than NK.

BillyBobBS

BillyBobBS wrote: »

Trump has played this beautifully. NK haven't fired a missile or carried out any tests since the president warned them of the result of their actions. We needed that kind of strong leadership over the last 8 years and we got Barrack "talk show" Obama.

It's all going spliffingly well alright.

Cheerful Spring

archer22 wrote: »

Amazing take on it

Most commenting online that I have seen seem to think Kim has won game set and match in this altercation.

The likely reason Trump and Kim have quietened down now is the pretty clear warning they both got from China a few days ago when they stated that if NK attacked first it would be on its own and that if America attacked first it would also have China to contend with.
Both seem to have shut up after that...In fact Trump seems to have done a Pivot to Venezuela now in frustration.

China will do nothing if the North attacks first, but then again does it matter if China does help? Like if the North fires nuclear weapons, America will send missiles of their own at them either way. Nuclear it's less predictable the outcome.

Cheerful Spring

Evie Big Troop wrote: »

Sorry to disappoint, but no chance of 'war'.

They do more than a dozen each year, so unless it's the actual 4 laden horsemen themselves prepared and fired directly towards the direction of Guam, any other test can be dismissed as a 'test'. The next (singular) one may well be sub-based, but unlikely to be any direct threat, other than to fish.

Stocks are up again, gold is down and one of the tabloids report it's still only Def' L4. The stalemate will continue until Kim eats one too many burgers.

In fact, there is more risk to civilisation from 'AI bots', according to the Facepage's boy. So too the threat posed from B' plague as recently discovered in burrows in Arizona.

North Korea has recalled it's foreign ambassadors come home, when war is close countries do this. We don't know what the purpose is behind this, but this is important. North Korea is not news anymore because of the far right/ KKK violent incidents that happened over the weekend

War is inevitable. Is America going to accept a North Korea that can fire nukes at America? When we hear Trump is willing to accept this only then will tensions ease off.

Cheerful Spring

ArchXStanton wrote: »

They don't give a fiddler's about the US,im actually expecting a new test in the coming days..

We find out in a few days if the North is making moves to reduce tensions or is going to meet Trump threats and fire another missile?

4068ac1elhodqr

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

North Korea has recalled it's foreign ambassadors come home, when war is close countries do this. We don't know what the purpose is behind this, but this is important. North Korea is not news anymore because of the far right/ KKK [ and counter demonstrations ] violent incidents that happened over the weekend

War is inevitable. Is America going to accept a North Korea that can fire nukes at America? When we hear Trump is willing to accept this only then will tensions ease off.

He'll probably accept having new defensive systems across SK, Jap and a few more boats sent into the area.

It wouldn't be a 'war' if nk tries anything. It would be an activated threat, threat elimination, then the elimination of a wayward state control and freedom it's remaining people there, who will be able to choose their own hairstyles for once.

josip

The US won't do diddly squat to NK without first of all getting the ok from China.
Kim knows that, so he'll be working out how far he can provoke the US without China ok-ing a US attack.
As long as US ships are conducting Freedom of Navigation exercises in the South China Sea, Kim will feel safe to lob whatever he wants to over Japan in the general direction of Guam.

archer22

If this was the other way around and lets pretend Kim was the leader of a little white nation that had been devastated and had millions of its citizens killed by an East Asian Superpower would we be regarding him as a threat to the world, a crazy guy who needs to assassinated and so on for now squaring up to that Superpower and saying touch us again and we will focking nuke you.

HELL NO!!....He would be a hero... a superhero...the greatest guy ever...News channels falling over themselves in praise and admiration of him...Hollywood already starting filming his life story .

Ipso

Cool story.

BillyBobBS

Evie Big Troop wrote: »

Seems like a stalemate situation is likely now for the foreseeable future.
Yes the NK may well do further test, but as long as they don't target anyone/region 'directly' this is stalemate.

If anything, NK has got further harder sanctions against it now, from China.
Guam has increased as a tourism destination, and the US have increased their shield in Asia.

The only small risk is the symbolic eclipse date for possible 'over-testing'.

Correction on earlier, it wasn't facepage boy. It was (fellow bn'aire) Musk, that said 'AI' poses a greater threat than NK.

If Fat Kim fires another missile he's going to have a lot of his military infrastructure taken out. Trump has backed the fat fool into a corner. Game set and match.

Zebra3

BillyBobBS wrote: »

If Fat Kim fires another missile he's going to have a lot of his military infrastructure taken out. Trump has backed the fat fool into a corner. Game set and match.

Yes, Trump the old military genius.... :rolleyes:

4068ac1elhodqr

BillyBobBS wrote: »

If Fat Kim fires another missile he's going to have a lot of his military infrastructure taken out. Trump has backed the fat fool into a corner. Game set and match.

Ah but that depends on where it goes, and what type, and what amount. If it's only a threat to fish, nothing will happen.

On the other hand, if it goes anywhere near Japanese territoriality, then perhaps it will be one of the many interceptors there that eliminate the threat.

archer22

It amazes me how those Asians are always such a threat to us that we are constantly in the air bombing their countries, our missiles flying into their cities and our warships sailing in their seas.And trying to forcefully change their governments.

But yet there has never been a single Asian warplane bombing our countries or a single Asian missile landing in our cities or not a single instance them trying to change our governments.

What I am beginning to think is maybe they are not the problem.
Maybe it's just that we are a bunch of cnuts ....and that's the real problem!.

Jelle1880

BillyBobBS wrote: »

If Fat Kim fires another missile he's going to have a lot of his military infrastructure taken out. Trump has backed the fat fool into a corner. Game set and match.

Good thing Kim seems a stable, reasonable person then.

Expect another test within a week. And Trump will talk big but ultimately do nothing.

I remember when people were complaining how Hillary would start a new war, Trump would focus on the US alone and not get them involved into useless wars.

Amirani

archer22 wrote: »

But yet there has never been a single Asian warplane bombing our countries or a single Asian missile landing in our cities or not a single instance them trying to change our governments.

There was this thing called Pearl Harbour...

Jelle1880

Amirani wrote: »

There was this thing called Pearl Harbour...

A tactically sound idea (if they had continued it) during a war, aimed at a military area. There's a difference.

Amirani

Jelle1880 wrote: »

A tactically sound idea (if they had continued it) during a war, aimed at a military area. There's a difference.

The US wasn't at war, it was an unprovoked attack for strategic reasons.

Still, I get your point and it's pointless to conflate the two, it just stood out as such an obviously incorrect statement for the previous poster to make.

archer22

Amirani wrote: »

There was this thing called Pearl Harbour...

A bit like saying the TET offensive was the reason America went into Vietnam.