Social Mobility in the Housing Market

myshirt

Your post don't seem to understand how wealth is generated.

LirW

myshirt wrote: »

Your post don't seem to understand how wealth is generated.

He has a point though. Where do you draw the line? The CAT already has a threshold.

Yourself isit

Alec Damaged Gourmet wrote: »

Raise CAT? It should be abolished. Dirty tax punishing successful people who try to make the lives of their kids better etc. Money a family earns should be theirs and the future generations to benefit it most certainly should it be taken and handed to others, if they can't buy themselves or their parents can't help them buy then they have no entitlement to another families money to help them.

Higher earners are already supporting a vast amount of thouse on lower incomes and the dole the last thing they should be faced with is more tax on top of the already crazy amount of taxation they are already burdened with.

There will never be a "level playing field" why should there? There will always be people with different levels of wealth that's the natural cycle of things.

The natural cycle of things is a very dubious phrase with a very dubious history.

Bushmanpm

Bushmanpm wrote:

Three things I've learned about life: 1, Life's not fair, deal with that and you'll go a lot further 2, "The State" is not your friend, you are merely there to fund their vanity projects, index linked pensions and the overall gravy train 3, You are entitled to nothing. If you want something, attain it through your own efforts, not the efforts of others. "How can we assist the kids?" is the wailing of a champagne socialist who in the next breath demands MOAR taxes, usually from other (read 'only richer than me') people. There will always people richer than you but remember, there will always be people poorer than you.

I refer to my original post.
You pay tax on your earnings, tax when you sell your home, tax on your vehicle that takes you to work, tax on most items you buy:
TAX TAX TAX!
Rely on no-one, expect no-one else to subsidise you and just be damn grateful you're still doing a lot better than most of the rest of the bloody world and drop the
"Wah wah wah, I'm entitled" BS!

Yourself isit

Bushmanpm wrote: »

I refer to my original post.
You pay tax on your earnings, tax when you sell your home, tax on your vehicle that takes you to work, tax on most items you buy:
TAX TAX TAX!
Rely on no-one, expect no-one else to subsidise you and just be damn grateful you're still doing a lot better than most of the rest of the bloody world and drop the
"Wah wah wah, I'm entitled" BS!

I know you were impressed with your sub daily express rant but the rest of us weren't. Otherwise we would have quoted it.

wordofwarning

catrionanic wrote: »

The LTV restrictions do make it impossible if you're living in Dublin and earning close to minimum wage, though.

I am sorry, but IMO no one close to marginal living should be getting a mortgage. There is this belief in English speaking countries that I should be entitled to own a home and I should have to put down very little to own. Who cares if I barely have enough at the end of the month, I need to own a home

You don't need to own a home and really you should not own a home. The whole problem with the housing bubble in the US was giving mortgages to people who should not get a mortgage ie low income and/or low credit rating. The same happened here. Giving mortgages with no deposit or homes that were 10/15 times someones income

The LTV requirements are much needed. The Central Bank knows from research that people on low income should not/can't afford to own a home.

People should be demanding the Government gives them an affordable home to live in ie rent it. Rather than demanding a cheap house that they can't afford and should not own. The American Dream of owning a home is not for everyone. The tens of thousands of Irish people 3/4 years in arrears with no sign of getting out of the hole they dug themselves into should be a remainder of that. But no lets all buy houses we can't afford, sure what can go wrong?

Mrs OBumble

catrionanic wrote: »

The LTV restrictions do make it impossible if you're living in Dublin and earning close to minimum wage, though.

If you're in Dublin on close to the minimum wage, you'll be eligible for social housing - or you'll be getting an education so you can get a better paying job.

myshirt wrote: »

We have to give these kids a fair shake at home ownership and not lock them out by perpetuating the issue with the passing on of family wealth and giving of deposits etc.

Why do we have to?

If they're bright, they'll work out a way onto the property ladder (if that's what they want to do).

If they're unlucky (sick / disabled), not overly bright (so cannot get a well paying job) or lazy, they'll get social housing.

If they're in the middle, what exactly is wrong with them using private sector rental long term? Social mobility should be based on ability, not existence.

Samuel T. Cogley

Yourself isit wrote: »

Well 35k is low for IT - seniors get 60+. The question is though - where is the "middle class". Is it all inherited wealth? The fact that you think IT is working class proves the point - it is without parental intervention.

At least in terms of where you live (which affects the school your kids go to and their accent etc - which is how class is often signaled on this country). .

Without going off on the tangent we have in some other threads suffice it to say the old three tier system is effectively dead with a new system with about three different working class types and three middle class types and the landed gentry effectively gone. In Ireland we still have them, but they've never really been gentry - sorry farmers :pac:

That aside middle class to me is effectively left to work on your own where as working class be it traditional trades, manufacturing or more modern working class of lower end IT workers (effectively intellectual labourers) we really need to get it into our heads that the average wage is about 35-40K and that is going to land you in Donaghmede assuming the partner earns less or kids are into the mix - and there is nothing wrong with that.

Far too many people (IMHO) won't buy anything without rock or knock in the title and I'm convinced this is a large part of the problem. Obviously I relaise that there is a huge supply shortage but people need to give up on the notion that they can get a 150Sqm detached house in the leafy suburbs for less then 500K.